Maybe I'm the only one, but I found myself drawing more pictures than purely writing when I was in school, or writing down page after page after page of equations. With such mixed content, I found a pencil and paper to be infinitely superior to the PC for taking notes.
Through all my hundreds and hundreds of pages of notes, it's all block text. Why wouldn't it be? Every other piece of text I look at in my life is in block text.
(As part of writing this post I opened up one of my old textbooks, and it's a great trip. I love the drawings I absent-mindedly drew in the margins. On one page, I'm writing about why industrial transmitters are sealed, drip proof, explosion proof, and RF proof with shielded twisted pair. Next to all this, I have a little picture of a beautiful meadow with an apple tree and a stream, with an arrow saying 'THE FIELD: (Hostile place!)' -- It's great to know I was funnier 5 years ago than I am today)
We don't know a lot about historical figures from this century, because they learned from those now-gone historic figures whose secrets were plastered all over history books, and started shredding their mail, decades before the personal computer.
It's beatnik bastards like you who got rid of latin!
Now I might be trapped in an ancient tomb and and an old timey cleric will show up and force me to read from an untranslated bible to prove I'm educated and therefore upper-class, and I WON'T BE ABLE TO DO IT.
A)Oh sorry, you tried to clean that coffee stain off of your computer. Too bad. Well, enjoy your new case!
B)Did you know that you can get PAID to recycle steel? Lots of people DO know that, and if you throw out that computer, they actually pick them up at the dump and collect the check.
C)Steel is going to be produced either way. Once it exists, it exists, and it can(and will) be recycled. Unlike cardboard, whose fibre is degraded after each use, the steel can be recycled indefinitely. At the kraft paper mill I work at, you couldn't sell us this shitty degraded pulp for pennies on the dollar, because we simply won't use it.
Computers are re-usable, and people DO do that. I built a new computer, so my brother got my old one. My dad bought a new computer, he gave my sister his old one. That's sort of how it works. I don't know of many people who are quick to throw a computer out. (besides, if there are, I also know of people who roam the dump hoping for such finds, because they get cash for recycling computers)
Look on the bright side! Now all we need to do is figure out how to make monitors out of cheese, and we'll never have to worry about pesky reusable components ever again! YAY!
Most people who upgrade with a new PC don't tend to just throw out old computers, either. Nobody I know throws away old computers. They'll give them to their kids, or their neighbours, or their grandkids, or anything other than throwing them away!
I replaced a Dell 2400 I used through college with a new Athlon 64(which has since been upgraded to a Pentium whatever -- Without replacing the case!), and I didn't throw the old machine away, I gave it to my brother, who has been using it for years.
Why not get a front bezel piece with the ports you want? My case didn't come with front ports, but now I've got 4 card readers and a USB port. Much better than the cheap crap they'll put on the front of a case.
Not all cases are created equal. My favourite old case was a desktop case with a pair of buttons to open the case up like a hood. More recently, I worked as a computer tech in a school where the sides of the AT cases came off independently.
a)It's made of cardboard. I'd be shocked if it lasted the life of ONE computer, let alone 10 years.
b)The same people who don't reuse or recycle a steel or aluminium case won't recycle a cardboard case.
c)You don't know this, but fibre-making is one of the most energy intensive processes in existence. Most paper mills have multiple boilers producing steam as well as multiple turbines for generating electricity, and STILL pull as much power as a small city. All for a case that's now a possible wear item, rather than being a permenant fixture that'll last far longer than the electronics it houses.
Recently I've worked on a lot of Dell Optiplexes, and a couple years ago I owned a Dell Dimension 2400. I recently got my hands on my brother's old HP desktop after he killed it through neglect (the CPU fan was filled with so much dust and crap not even convection currents were cooling it at that point).
As far as I can remember, the cases were pretty close to bone stock. I gave away the Dell because it was a perfectly good machine but I wanted to build an Athlon 64 so I got a new case and build the computer from scratch and gave the computer to my brother, who uses it to this day. The HP was so stock that I threw an old Athlon motherboard into it and now it's in the guest room. I never bothered to check out the Dell power supply, but the HP was definitely a stock power supply.
I guess back in 1998 they still put things in odd places, but for the past decade or so they've been using ATX, since it's cheap.
Yes, but simple market dynamics proves it should remain viable.
It's a negative feedback system: If the price for scrap plastic gets too high, nobody will buy scrap plastic, and the price will drop to a point where people buy. It's not a magic bullet, this industry isn't going to see such huge profit margins forever, but it's certainly going to remain viable.
In electrical engineering, grounding is used for two purposes:
First, it is used as a safety feature. All electrical code regarding grounding is meant to protect a human from electrical shock in the event of a short. In this event, you're correct that 5v or 12v with relatively low current potential aren't enough to justify grounding. I don't think either voltage would require grounding by electrical code.
Second, it is used as a shield drain. In industrial applications, a separate shield ground is used for this purpose, but in PC applications, it's pretty routine for shielding to be connected to hydro ground. USB, Serial, and Parallel ports all use the chassis for their shield grounding (so in industrial applications an isolated ground is used).
So to answer your basic question, yes, every computer case currently has a conductive path to hydro ground, it's neccessary, but I'm not sure what effect losing it would have on components. Obviously laptops exist so it may be trivial, but I'm not sure it's non-zero.
Not to mention much more reusable. I used the case from my first PC, an XT, for over a decade. There's no reason to believe my current case won't last me at least another decade. This cardboard case looks like it might even be a wear item you'd have to replace a few times over the life of a PC.
I don't think so. Recycling is the LAST of the three. Reduce, Reuse, Recycle. This will result in MORE resources being spent and LESS reuse of components.
Computer cases are one of the most re-usable elements in a system. My first PC, an 8088 PC, used a Cosmol XT case made of steel, and that case and power supply was the centerpiece of my computer from my XT all the way until my K6-2. Along that time, processor speeds increased by a factor of 100 (4.77MHz to 550MHz), memory size increased by a factor of 50 (256kb to 128MB), storage space increased by a factor of 2000(5MB to 10GB). The important standards for case design didn't change over that period, so there was no good reason to change. Also, the case was totally bad-ass. The computer I built to finally replace the aging beast used a new case, and the standards haven't changed since. I've built Athlon 64s with cases from old Pentium IIs or Athlons.
Making the case of a PC disposable crap is going to result in more waste, not less. Suddenly I won't be able to have the same case for 20 years, I'll have to replace it with every new computer(or more!). Also, it'll lead to less reuse of components. I've built 6 computers this year from parts scavenged from here and there. All of them have found homes. The parts simply wouldn't be able to be scavenged if the machines were made of cardboard. To clean the outsides of the cases, we had to use soap and water that these cases wouldn't stand up to. Some of them were left in the rain and mud for short periods fo time, and wouldn't be functional if not for the fact that they had cases that could withstand the elements.
My current case could last me another 10-20 years easily, depending on what standards do (a PC case you bought in 1999 would have an ATX form factor and could be reused today. I could see power supply standards but not case standards changing again in that time). Under this regimen, I could end up with a new case every 1-2 years or more. As others have pointed out, there will also be greater stress on components from EMI and RFI. Making less durable paper cases may be slightly easier for recycling, but it's stupid from the perspective of reducing waste.
I think you need to reconsider the point of my post.
You're just reiterating what I said, with an added bias of "we should be doing this".
The point of my post is that it's not magic, you're not violating the law of conservation of energy, and there's no reason in the world for the process not to be energy positive.
I mean, refineries are energy positive, and the reason is simple: They process crude oil, and crude oil has a crazy amount of energy in it. Calling it 'too good to be true' is silly.
Slashdot Mirror
Because they're lying.
Hollywood accounting is well-documented.
You program by eating various breads. Hardest language to program in EVER. Don't ask what you need to do if you need to backspace...
Maybe I'm the only one, but I found myself drawing more pictures than purely writing when I was in school, or writing down page after page after page of equations. With such mixed content, I found a pencil and paper to be infinitely superior to the PC for taking notes.
Through all my hundreds and hundreds of pages of notes, it's all block text. Why wouldn't it be? Every other piece of text I look at in my life is in block text.
(As part of writing this post I opened up one of my old textbooks, and it's a great trip. I love the drawings I absent-mindedly drew in the margins. On one page, I'm writing about why industrial transmitters are sealed, drip proof, explosion proof, and RF proof with shielded twisted pair. Next to all this, I have a little picture of a beautiful meadow with an apple tree and a stream, with an arrow saying 'THE FIELD: (Hostile place!)' -- It's great to know I was funnier 5 years ago than I am today)
Ironic, since few of them would want to live in Palestine, either in the past or today. Not enough tech.
We don't know a lot about historical figures from this century, because they learned from those now-gone historic figures whose secrets were plastered all over history books, and started shredding their mail, decades before the personal computer.
It's beatnik bastards like you who got rid of latin!
Now I might be trapped in an ancient tomb and and an old timey cleric will show up and force me to read from an untranslated bible to prove I'm educated and therefore upper-class, and I WON'T BE ABLE TO DO IT.
Don't be an ass. I know they're doing a lot of outsourcing in IT, but the majority of Slashdot is NOT from Palestine.
A)Oh sorry, you tried to clean that coffee stain off of your computer. Too bad. Well, enjoy your new case!
B)Did you know that you can get PAID to recycle steel? Lots of people DO know that, and if you throw out that computer, they actually pick them up at the dump and collect the check.
C)Steel is going to be produced either way. Once it exists, it exists, and it can(and will) be recycled. Unlike cardboard, whose fibre is degraded after each use, the steel can be recycled indefinitely. At the kraft paper mill I work at, you couldn't sell us this shitty degraded pulp for pennies on the dollar, because we simply won't use it.
I've got two CRTs, so no.
Computers are re-usable, and people DO do that. I built a new computer, so my brother got my old one. My dad bought a new computer, he gave my sister his old one. That's sort of how it works. I don't know of many people who are quick to throw a computer out. (besides, if there are, I also know of people who roam the dump hoping for such finds, because they get cash for recycling computers)
Look on the bright side! Now all we need to do is figure out how to make monitors out of cheese, and we'll never have to worry about pesky reusable components ever again! YAY!
Most people who upgrade with a new PC don't tend to just throw out old computers, either. Nobody I know throws away old computers. They'll give them to their kids, or their neighbours, or their grandkids, or anything other than throwing them away!
I replaced a Dell 2400 I used through college with a new Athlon 64(which has since been upgraded to a Pentium whatever -- Without replacing the case!), and I didn't throw the old machine away, I gave it to my brother, who has been using it for years.
Why not get a front bezel piece with the ports you want? My case didn't come with front ports, but now I've got 4 card readers and a USB port. Much better than the cheap crap they'll put on the front of a case.
Not all cases are created equal. My favourite old case was a desktop case with a pair of buttons to open the case up like a hood. More recently, I worked as a computer tech in a school where the sides of the AT cases came off independently.
That's also true. Unlike fibre, which degrades, steel and aluminium are just as good recycled as not.
a)It's made of cardboard. I'd be shocked if it lasted the life of ONE computer, let alone 10 years.
b)The same people who don't reuse or recycle a steel or aluminium case won't recycle a cardboard case.
c)You don't know this, but fibre-making is one of the most energy intensive processes in existence. Most paper mills have multiple boilers producing steam as well as multiple turbines for generating electricity, and STILL pull as much power as a small city. All for a case that's now a possible wear item, rather than being a permenant fixture that'll last far longer than the electronics it houses.
I don't really see how your hatred of cases is relevant to whether you can reuse the parts or not.
I'm utterly confused by this discussion.
Recently I've worked on a lot of Dell Optiplexes, and a couple years ago I owned a Dell Dimension 2400. I recently got my hands on my brother's old HP desktop after he killed it through neglect (the CPU fan was filled with so much dust and crap not even convection currents were cooling it at that point).
As far as I can remember, the cases were pretty close to bone stock. I gave away the Dell because it was a perfectly good machine but I wanted to build an Athlon 64 so I got a new case and build the computer from scratch and gave the computer to my brother, who uses it to this day. The HP was so stock that I threw an old Athlon motherboard into it and now it's in the guest room. I never bothered to check out the Dell power supply, but the HP was definitely a stock power supply.
I guess back in 1998 they still put things in odd places, but for the past decade or so they've been using ATX, since it's cheap.
Isn't that the exact same for these cases? Instead of metal cases, it'll be cardboard ones.
Usually not even that. The faceplate on most cases are plastic, but the body of the case is obviously aluminium or tin or steel.
Yes, but simple market dynamics proves it should remain viable.
It's a negative feedback system: If the price for scrap plastic gets too high, nobody will buy scrap plastic, and the price will drop to a point where people buy. It's not a magic bullet, this industry isn't going to see such huge profit margins forever, but it's certainly going to remain viable.
In electrical engineering, grounding is used for two purposes:
First, it is used as a safety feature. All electrical code regarding grounding is meant to protect a human from electrical shock in the event of a short. In this event, you're correct that 5v or 12v with relatively low current potential aren't enough to justify grounding. I don't think either voltage would require grounding by electrical code.
Second, it is used as a shield drain. In industrial applications, a separate shield ground is used for this purpose, but in PC applications, it's pretty routine for shielding to be connected to hydro ground. USB, Serial, and Parallel ports all use the chassis for their shield grounding (so in industrial applications an isolated ground is used).
So to answer your basic question, yes, every computer case currently has a conductive path to hydro ground, it's neccessary, but I'm not sure what effect losing it would have on components. Obviously laptops exist so it may be trivial, but I'm not sure it's non-zero.
Not to mention much more reusable. I used the case from my first PC, an XT, for over a decade. There's no reason to believe my current case won't last me at least another decade. This cardboard case looks like it might even be a wear item you'd have to replace a few times over the life of a PC.
I don't think so. Recycling is the LAST of the three. Reduce, Reuse, Recycle. This will result in MORE resources being spent and LESS reuse of components.
Computer cases are one of the most re-usable elements in a system. My first PC, an 8088 PC, used a Cosmol XT case made of steel, and that case and power supply was the centerpiece of my computer from my XT all the way until my K6-2. Along that time, processor speeds increased by a factor of 100 (4.77MHz to 550MHz), memory size increased by a factor of 50 (256kb to 128MB), storage space increased by a factor of 2000(5MB to 10GB). The important standards for case design didn't change over that period, so there was no good reason to change. Also, the case was totally bad-ass. The computer I built to finally replace the aging beast used a new case, and the standards haven't changed since. I've built Athlon 64s with cases from old Pentium IIs or Athlons.
Making the case of a PC disposable crap is going to result in more waste, not less. Suddenly I won't be able to have the same case for 20 years, I'll have to replace it with every new computer(or more!). Also, it'll lead to less reuse of components. I've built 6 computers this year from parts scavenged from here and there. All of them have found homes. The parts simply wouldn't be able to be scavenged if the machines were made of cardboard. To clean the outsides of the cases, we had to use soap and water that these cases wouldn't stand up to. Some of them were left in the rain and mud for short periods fo time, and wouldn't be functional if not for the fact that they had cases that could withstand the elements.
My current case could last me another 10-20 years easily, depending on what standards do (a PC case you bought in 1999 would have an ATX form factor and could be reused today. I could see power supply standards but not case standards changing again in that time). Under this regimen, I could end up with a new case every 1-2 years or more. As others have pointed out, there will also be greater stress on components from EMI and RFI. Making less durable paper cases may be slightly easier for recycling, but it's stupid from the perspective of reducing waste.
I think you need to reconsider the point of my post.
You're just reiterating what I said, with an added bias of "we should be doing this".
The point of my post is that it's not magic, you're not violating the law of conservation of energy, and there's no reason in the world for the process not to be energy positive.
I mean, refineries are energy positive, and the reason is simple: They process crude oil, and crude oil has a crazy amount of energy in it. Calling it 'too good to be true' is silly.