The point I was making is that road-warriors don't care to wait for data that is always remote, especially when the network connection is poor. And while using 'cloud services' isn't the same as a terminal to some people, it is giving you the same disadvantages - namely, total reliance on the network to do anything. For a lot of people, that just won't cut it. Even if the program is running locally, you're still hamstrung by the data you need being remote.
I never said my systems go down. This is a false panacea promoted by cloud vendors anyway. What my users are interested in getting their data without having to wait an hour for a file to copy over. Time = money.
I believe I have very picky users. But then again, a lot of people paid a lot of money to buy a lot of equipment so a lot of people can do sales calls and do the road-warrior thingy and work from remote offices. It's how our company makes its money. So I expect to be able to buy equipment that gets me as close to the ideal as possible. Cloud computing makes no sense in our environment, and probably wouldn't for a very, very long time. I have seen these articles a lot over the years.... and it's just same ole, same ole.
Yes, I am an old, grumpy Unix admin. It is totally normal to keep a shotgun beyond your desk, right?
Half of my users have trouble getting vpn protocols to work reliably over their isp links. ALL of my users complain loudly when things aren't fast and snappy. I would NEVER put any of these people 'on the cloud', considering one lost packet is enough to get them riled up. It's bad enough that they will complain about new emails not coming in....it would be worse if they can't get to ANY of them when their connection is down.
You can get a lot of power into very small notebooks now.....why go backwards back to a dumb terminal that is dependent upon overloaded Starbucks wifi in order to get ANY program to work?
Desktops may be dying out....but we're not switching the entire world to the cloud anytime soon.
I wonder, if net neutrality falls apart, and we end up with people charging more for high-speed pipes to certain places, will that generate a big boom in building VPN/GRE/IP tunnels to attempt to work around it? If so, that could become a very lucrative business for Cisco or any other tunnel-equipment maker/provider. Hmmm..makes me wonder if there is a new conspiracy about to brew....
- E
Put your data in a RAID-5. If a drive dies, they won't get enough data back to reconstruct anything. That's what we do in corporate environments when a drive dies and we don't feel like throwing away $1000 for enterprise-class fibre-channel drives but have confidential data on them:)
-E
Utube is in no hurry to get rid of the copyrighted stuff because it's all they have. Once that stuff is gone, they will go the way of Napster and Scour. The world only needs so many videos of some dad getting racked in the balls with a baseball bat.
So long, Utube....you were great while we had ye.
-E
I'd also like to add that this is the company that injects fake files into p2p networks, and they are also responsible for plenty of astroturfing, but their biggest projects as of late, are in DRM.
After having dealt with some of these people, I'd say the next wave is coming from a little company called SparkArt. They also get into 'Viral Marketing'. SA deals with Sony as well, so this little company would be one to keep an eye on in the future......
Maybe you have had better experiences than me.....but I have really tried. I have a bad attitude for sure, but only from years and years of putting up with same old shit. That, and I have plenty of social interaction outside work, and prefer to keep work and everything else separated. But of course, YMMV.
Yay.. Another opportunity to have the athletic drag the non-athletic of us into 'competitions'. I'm not even fat or out of shape....just tired of Little Leagues that extend into your golden years...
- E
As a small-business owner who spends all day just configuring/fixing/testing/developing/working, I can tell you right now.....This would pound the last nail into the coffin for using MS products for me. MS obviously doesn't care about people that have to make things WORK and have little time to do so. After I have spend a few hundred hours tweaking a mail server that will have to deliver 100,000 messages per day, or a web farm that has to work FLAWLESSLY and serve hundreds of millions of hits per month, this one thing that I would not want to have to deal with, especially when I have to add/change a network interface to accomodate a SAN development or some other change where we don't have time to worry about such nonsensical shit as "Will the OS allow us to do this"
Screw that. My shop will stay Linux anyway, but that is just BS!
- Eric
No kidding. So they find a way to put less-used data on slower disks, that still COST NEARLY AS MUCH. The entry price is still listed as $50,000. Big fuckin' deal. Let me know when you take a bunch of garden-variety servers, and do this, with the super cheap clone raid server with 40 terabytes of SATA as the 'last tier' for slowest files, where I can build 100 terabytes for $50,000.
And yet, managers will get a woody over this buzzword compliance and want to give these guys millions to have the 'latest and greatest'.
And have it still work with tape, too, and not tied up in some cumbersome, proprietary protocol owned by one little company that could go out business.
Agreed. It's foolish to try to run a shop without spare parts on hand, especially for anything remotely critical. Time and experience has taught me over and over, that if you are not prepared, it will be made known to those who you'd rather it not be made known to.
What that overnight shipping costs on some parts would pay for the part itself. Keep spares on hand.
And why should anyone be surprised? In this age of "I read a book on VB last week and now I'm a software engineer!" type environment?
I am not surprised that simple things like this are rehashed over and over. This is more suited to the programmer group of people who will sort data based on string comparisons, instead of learning how to use a real algorithm to do it, or keep writing static forms, instead of learning how to use a loop with a db backend - because they don't understand true programming concepts. In other words, about 80% of the current crop of overpaid, undereducated programmers that built corporate apps.
Okay, you want 320 gig in a space smaller than a hard drive? Look up AIT-4. AIT-3 is already on the market and pushes 100 gig uncompressed and is half the size of a hard drive. At compressed levels, AIT-3 pushes 240-250 gig, and the tape is still less than half the size of a hard drive. The tape throughputs over a gig a minute with a fast scsi bus.
Please quit with the "Drives are more durable than tapes" bs. It's obvious that you have never worked in a real data center.
That's right. For people that think that IDE drives, (which last 3 years at most) is going to outlast tapes, are going to find themselves unemployed at some point in the future. Tapes are not that difficult to use. Maybe if people had training in using tape equipment, they would see that it's not that difficult. Or if they had their facts straight - some people here think it takes all day to seek through 40 gig? Maybe in 1990 it did. Get up with the times people.
Tapes are still here, and will be here for archival purposes for a long time to come. No enterprise class business or Data Center is going to back up to ATA-only.
still only works if people actually respond and buy your stuff that you're spamming for. You can come up with a wonderful way to market cow shit, that doesn't mean people will just buy it..
For being about 14 years old already...after sitting in a basement or shoebox for 14 years, most paper doesn't look new anymore...especially notebook paper..
Slashdot Mirror
The point I was making is that road-warriors don't care to wait for data that is always remote, especially when the network connection is poor. And while using 'cloud services' isn't the same as a terminal to some people, it is giving you the same disadvantages - namely, total reliance on the network to do anything. For a lot of people, that just won't cut it. Even if the program is running locally, you're still hamstrung by the data you need being remote.
I never said my systems go down. This is a false panacea promoted by cloud vendors anyway. What my users are interested in getting their data without having to wait an hour for a file to copy over. Time = money.
- Eric
I believe I have very picky users. But then again, a lot of people paid a lot of money to buy a lot of equipment so a lot of people can do sales calls and do the road-warrior thingy and work from remote offices. It's how our company makes its money. So I expect to be able to buy equipment that gets me as close to the ideal as possible. Cloud computing makes no sense in our environment, and probably wouldn't for a very, very long time. I have seen these articles a lot over the years.... and it's just same ole, same ole.
Yes, I am an old, grumpy Unix admin. It is totally normal to keep a shotgun beyond your desk, right?
- Eric
Half of my users have trouble getting vpn protocols to work reliably over their isp links. ALL of my users complain loudly when things aren't fast and snappy. I would NEVER put any of these people 'on the cloud', considering one lost packet is enough to get them riled up. It's bad enough that they will complain about new emails not coming in....it would be worse if they can't get to ANY of them when their connection is down.
You can get a lot of power into very small notebooks now.....why go backwards back to a dumb terminal that is dependent upon overloaded Starbucks wifi in order to get ANY program to work?
Desktops may be dying out....but we're not switching the entire world to the cloud anytime soon.
- Eric
I wonder, if net neutrality falls apart, and we end up with people charging more for high-speed pipes to certain places, will that generate a big boom in building VPN/GRE/IP tunnels to attempt to work around it? If so, that could become a very lucrative business for Cisco or any other tunnel-equipment maker/provider. Hmmm..makes me wonder if there is a new conspiracy about to brew....
- E
Put your data in a RAID-5. If a drive dies, they won't get enough data back to reconstruct anything. That's what we do in corporate environments when a drive dies and we don't feel like throwing away $1000 for enterprise-class fibre-channel drives but have confidential data on them :)
-E
Utube is in no hurry to get rid of the copyrighted stuff because it's all they have. Once that stuff is gone, they will go the way of Napster and Scour. The world only needs so many videos of some dad getting racked in the balls with a baseball bat.
So long, Utube....you were great while we had ye.
-E
I'd also like to add that this is the company that injects fake files into p2p networks, and they are also responsible for plenty of astroturfing, but their biggest projects as of late, are in DRM.
After having dealt with some of these people, I'd say the next wave is coming from a little company called SparkArt. They also get into 'Viral Marketing'. SA deals with Sony as well, so this little company would be one to keep an eye on in the future......
Maybe you have had better experiences than me.....but I have really tried. I have a bad attitude for sure, but only from years and years of putting up with same old shit. That, and I have plenty of social interaction outside work, and prefer to keep work and everything else separated. But of course, YMMV.
Yay.. Another opportunity to have the athletic drag the non-athletic of us into 'competitions'. I'm not even fat or out of shape....just tired of Little Leagues that extend into your golden years...
- E
As a small-business owner who spends all day just configuring/fixing/testing/developing/working, I can tell you right now.....This would pound the last nail into the coffin for using MS products for me. MS obviously doesn't care about people that have to make things WORK and have little time to do so. After I have spend a few hundred hours tweaking a mail server that will have to deliver 100,000 messages per day, or a web farm that has to work FLAWLESSLY and serve hundreds of millions of hits per month, this one thing that I would not want to have to deal with, especially when I have to add/change a network interface to accomodate a SAN development or some other change where we don't have time to worry about such nonsensical shit as "Will the OS allow us to do this"
Screw that. My shop will stay Linux anyway, but that is just BS!
- Eric
No kidding. So they find a way to put less-used data on slower disks, that still COST NEARLY AS MUCH. The entry price is still listed as $50,000. Big fuckin' deal. Let me know when you take a bunch of garden-variety servers, and do this, with the super cheap clone raid server with 40 terabytes of SATA as the 'last tier' for slowest files, where I can build 100 terabytes for $50,000.
And yet, managers will get a woody over this buzzword compliance and want to give these guys millions to have the 'latest and greatest'.
And have it still work with tape, too, and not tied up in some cumbersome, proprietary protocol owned by one little company that could go out business.
Agreed. It's foolish to try to run a shop without spare parts on hand, especially for anything remotely critical. Time and experience has taught me over and over, that if you are not prepared, it will be made known to those who you'd rather it not be made known to.
What that overnight shipping costs on some parts would pay for the part itself. Keep spares on hand.
- Eric
I don't think you have to be a professed Catholic just to meet the pope do you? Or profess undying allegiance? How is BillG different?
Bill Gates is still a mortal like everyone else.
- E
Wisdom is rarely found on the best-seller list...
- E
And why should anyone be surprised? In this age of "I read a book on VB last week and now I'm a software engineer!" type environment?
I am not surprised that simple things like this are rehashed over and over. This is more suited to the programmer group of people who will sort data based on string comparisons, instead of learning how to use a real algorithm to do it, or keep writing static forms, instead of learning how to use a loop with a db backend - because they don't understand true programming concepts. In other words, about 80% of the current crop of overpaid, undereducated programmers that built corporate apps.
- Eric
Okay, you want 320 gig in a space smaller than a hard drive? Look up AIT-4. AIT-3 is already on the market and pushes 100 gig uncompressed and is half the size of a hard drive. At compressed levels, AIT-3 pushes 240-250 gig, and the tape is still less than half the size of a hard drive. The tape throughputs over a gig a minute with a fast scsi bus.
Please quit with the "Drives are more durable than tapes" bs. It's obvious that you have never worked in a real data center.
That's right. For people that think that IDE drives, (which last 3 years at most) is going to outlast tapes, are going to find themselves unemployed at some point in the future. Tapes are not that difficult to use. Maybe if people had training in using tape equipment, they would see that it's not that difficult. Or if they had their facts straight - some people here think it takes all day to seek through 40 gig? Maybe in 1990 it did. Get up with the times people.
Tapes are still here, and will be here for archival purposes for a long time to come. No enterprise class business or Data Center is going to back up to ATA-only.
still only works if people actually respond and buy your stuff that you're spamming for. You can come up with a wonderful way to market cow shit, that doesn't mean people will just buy it..
Oh wait....
For being about 14 years old already...after sitting in a basement or shoebox for 14 years, most paper doesn't look new anymore...especially notebook paper..
If the states get the source code, we'll find out that Windows was actually written in java, and that would cause an anti-trust dispute....
-E