In his work on static electricity, Faraday's ice pail experiment demonstrated that the charge resided only on the exterior of a charged conductor, and exterior charge had no influence on anything enclosed within a conductor. This is because the exterior charges redistribute such that the interior fields emanating from them cancel one another. This shielding effect is used in what is now known as a Faraday cage.
If I was rude to you Sir I apologize, it's been a very busy week/weekend for me. From provided link. https://security.stackexchange...
If you have a phone with a removable main battery, you can try this:
Disable the cellular network, GPS, WiFi, Bluetooth etc on your phone by turning them off manually and then putting the phone into flight mode.
Make a note of the current time shown on the phone and on your PC by writing it down on paper.
Shut down the phone, remove the main battery and the SIM card. Now wait 5 minutes.
Put the main battery back in, but not the SIM card and then turn the phone on again. The phone should still be in flight mode.
Note the current time on the phone again and the current time from your PC.
Remember when in Flight Mode and without the SIM card, the phone cannot get a time update from the cell tower. If a phone just stored the current time in flash memory before shutting down, then on powering on the phone it would be 5 minutes behind and match the time you wrote down on paper. This is because it would not know how much time had elapsed from when the phone had shut off and when it was turned on again. However that is not what happened, it kept up with the current time even when shut off and the battery was removed. That is because of the second battery on the phone.
mobile phone circuit board
This HowStuffWorks article looks into the inside of a digital mobile phone. Quoting from the article: "As you can see in the picture above, the speaker is about the size of a dime and the microphone is no larger than the watch battery beside it. Speaking of the watch battery, this is used by the mobile phone's internal clock chip." This would be similar to the function of a CMOS battery in every PC/laptop. There is also a February 2010 patent mentioning a primary and secondary battery of different size and capacity: "The first battery may discharge during use of the mobile phone without simultaneous discharge of the second battery. Upon discharge of the first battery, the second battery may not be automatically activated."
A standard silver cell watch battery has a capacity of 200 mAh, a Zinc-air battery has a capacity of 620 mAh. From personal experience, my battery in my wristwatch has lasted for over a decade as it was just keeping the time, running alarms and the odd stopwatch. I am not certain which capacity the secondary battery is which is installed on most mobile phones but it could contain a newer, powerful one installed by the manufacturers. The design of mobile phones is typically a closed design. There is a new micro-battery that could fit in and power a credit-card-thin device and be charged 1,000 times faster than regular batteries. Therefore every time you charged your phone, it would charge the secondary battery as well.
When the phone is turned off and the main battery is removed, the secondary battery could do more than just keep track of the time. It is all connected to the same circuitry so it could leave certain chips powered on in a low power state, for example the GPS, the microphone, the camera, or the closed baseband processor on every mobile phone.
Now, hypothetically the secondary battery could be remotely activated and periodically do a burst transmission every x minutes and send GPS coordinates or microphone recordings back to your favourite 3 letter agency. If the chips were just passively transmitting, perhaps they need a StingRay or Reaper drone in the area to boost the signal. The cell tower itself may be powerful enough to pick up the signal.
This article states that the NSA can technically listen in to the microphone of an iPhone even if it is switched off. In Edward Snowden's conversations with Laura Poitras he advised her to put her mobile in the freezer. In Snowden's NBC interview he mentions "They can absolutely turn them on w
I just got done moving refrigerators, hooking up the ice cube/water line and I want the rest of my weekend for myself. Don't beleive me, we'll leave it at that. Have a good day.:)
Strange. Here I was, expecting a thinking man to provide references, resources and evidence that he wasn't a paranoid fool.
You failed.
Good morning "Cederic" I apologize for not providing references, resources and evidence. I do not personally know Edward Snowden. If you know his phone number give him a shout. He'll be able to provide all citations. Regards to you, iwastheone (aka on/. sternishefan, an older account here).
Even when turned off, if you have a sealed battery it still pings cell towers while "off".
I don't believe you.
Don't believe me, I'm cool with that. You have your opinion. I have my 'experience'. You think you're right, I 'know' that I'm right. I have relatives who work for the government in jobs that they cannot talk about. Years before Microsoft bought Skype, I bought a wifi tablet and said, "Now we can Skype to each other!" That relative instantly said back to me, "Oh no, Skype is not secure." Today we know that Skype is not secure, back then no one knew that. I'm a thinking man. So believe whatever makes you feel happy and safe. I know different. Cheers to you, sleep well in your ignorance. Ignorance is bliss.;)
The official position of the US Federal government is that the use of Stingrays does not require a probable cause warrant, because they claim Stingrays are a kind of pen register tap, which do not require a warrant, as decided in Smith v. Maryland. The government notes that they do not intercept the actual conversation, only tracking identity of the phone and its location. The devices do have the technical capability to record the content of calls and modify them, so the government requires these content-intercepting functions to be disabled in normal use. In September 2015, the US Justice Department issued new guidelines requiring federal agents to obtain warrants before using stingray devices, except in exigent circumstances. In 2015, the state of Virginia passed a law requiring the use of a warrant when using a stingray, and Washington state proposed a similar law. In addition, California, Minnesota and Utah have also passed laws requiring warrants for stingray use.
I doubt if flight mode will protect you. While you're in flight mode your phone is still active. Even when turned off, if you have a sealed battery it still pings cell towers while "off". Only if you can remove the battery then it is not able to send anything. A "faraday' bag will prevent signals from being sent, but your phone won't be able to function. Your phone when on in a "faraday cage" bag will drain battery faster since it's trying harder to connect to a cellphone tower.
"Flight mode" is a 'soft button', so you must assume that your phone is still able to communicate to cell towers/wifi/bluetooth hacks. If it's not a real hard wired "On/Off" switch, do not trust.
P.S. If your phone has an un-removable, "sealed" battery and it is powered off, it still 'pings' cell phone towers. Learn the rules of modern life then act accordingly. If you don't, and commit an illegal crime, then you need to get used to a jail cell. Straight talk here.
It's an android phone and gps confirmed off. Ever hear of stingray devices that police use but cannot admit to in court since..., 4th amendment? Cell phone tower triangulation? A laptop, a $35 darkweb program and about $50 if Radio Shack parts? Do nothing on any device whether it's a text/email/phone call that you would not want to be heard back in a courtroom. Do not commit a crime if you have your cellphone with you, even if it's off. If you cannot pull out the battery, it can be turned on remotely even though it is "off".
I did also suggest a Faraday bag to her. Told her that's not an ideal solution and will drain her battery faster as the phone will try harder to locate cell phone towers. She has a good man as her SO, they are getting the SMS Backup+ app by Jan Berkel for her android phone. Then she can easily print out the texts for a judge to read. https://play.google.com/store/...
I know an adult woman, her dad is 'stalking' her via her cellphone, he's a cop. Constantly texts her how he knows exactly where she is and she is paranoid about it. I explained to her how yes, he can tap into her cellphone unless she pulls out her battery. Advised her to change her cellphone number and take screenshots of all texts he's sent to her. Smartphones are spy devices with antennas, anyone can stalk someones location. Now she knows to get an order of protection against him.
We, the human race, are just learning how to take the necessary 'baby steps' in our colonizing the Moon, Mars and beyond. This mission failed. Okay, we are learning what was not done right, it's new territory for us humans. The only way to get 'experience' is by trying and making mistakes. As long as we learn not to repeat our mistake do we get 'experience'. The only way to get 'wisdom' is from 'experience'. In other words, it's a process, and we are learning what does work and also what does not work. We are learning, that's what matters. Star Trek is one day going to be our reality, just not going to happen as soon as we'd want it to. What is important that we all keep talking and trying. There is hope for the future, and that makes me stay hopeful for the future of humanity.
Tort law, lawyers make most of the money from class action lawsuits. The Bonfire of the Vanities was a book, later a movie. Basically the lawyers make the bulk of the money, any litigants who join in get milli-pennies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
All I want is a computer that can securely have a browser, run emulators for my old school video game roms, play my mp3 collection and play all my movies ripped from DVDs. Can Linux handle all these basic tasks? If so I'll gladly say goodbye to Windows.
Will these alcohol detectors self-calibate themselves? Will it detect that the driver is high on opiates? What if you need to quickly drive away from a dangerous situation? So sorry you got shot/stabbed to death by a deranged maniac, but since you did drink 2 beers two hours ago the car will decide that you must die.
If there's a camera in some place that I'm renting, that'd be when duct tape is my friend. There currently a device on kickstarter that can be used to detect working camera lenses. Below is from https://www.kickstarter.com/pr...
How Does It Work? When the power button is “pressed” on side of unit, and you look through the viewfinder, it activates six special bright-red LED strobe lights designed to bounce off the smallest of camera lenses. The tiny camera lens will appear to blink back at you as a reflection off camera lens itself , instantly giving away its location as you scan the area around you. It doesn’t matter if the camera is turned on or off, recording or not...even if its a non-working camera, the blinking effect will clearly show you the presence of a camera lens which is almost impossible to detect with the naked eye. Knowing where the camera is located will allow you to take immediate action to prevent unauthorized recording of activity. In addition, there are 3 LED intensity levels which helps hone in on camera lenses which could be hidden behind different surfaces. A flat wall 30 feet away could use the highest LED intensity, while a semi reflective shiny surface 5 feet away would use the lowest intensity. This prevents false reflections, maximizing the ability to find a hidden camera lens in any room environment.
That's easy to say but unless you live your life as a true computer/tech person, real people who have regular jobs do not have the time to learn all that needs to be learned in order to keep up with computer advances.
In between the 2 Boeing crashes, another crash was avoided only because there just happened to be another pilot who was in the extra cockpit seat. He knew and understood this flaw, and was able to instruct the 'real' pilots on how to keep the plane from nosediving into the ground like the other 2 did. If not for this, random informed off-duty pilot being in that cockpit, we would have had a third tragedy.
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In his work on static electricity, Faraday's ice pail experiment demonstrated that the charge resided only on the exterior of a charged conductor, and exterior charge had no influence on anything enclosed within a conductor. This is because the exterior charges redistribute such that the interior fields emanating from them cancel one another. This shielding effect is used in what is now known as a Faraday cage.
If you have a phone with a removable main battery, you can try this: Disable the cellular network, GPS, WiFi, Bluetooth etc on your phone by turning them off manually and then putting the phone into flight mode.
Make a note of the current time shown on the phone and on your PC by writing it down on paper.
Shut down the phone, remove the main battery and the SIM card. Now wait 5 minutes.
Put the main battery back in, but not the SIM card and then turn the phone on again. The phone should still be in flight mode.
Note the current time on the phone again and the current time from your PC.
Remember when in Flight Mode and without the SIM card, the phone cannot get a time update from the cell tower. If a phone just stored the current time in flash memory before shutting down, then on powering on the phone it would be 5 minutes behind and match the time you wrote down on paper. This is because it would not know how much time had elapsed from when the phone had shut off and when it was turned on again. However that is not what happened, it kept up with the current time even when shut off and the battery was removed. That is because of the second battery on the phone.
mobile phone circuit board
This HowStuffWorks article looks into the inside of a digital mobile phone. Quoting from the article: "As you can see in the picture above, the speaker is about the size of a dime and the microphone is no larger than the watch battery beside it. Speaking of the watch battery, this is used by the mobile phone's internal clock chip." This would be similar to the function of a CMOS battery in every PC/laptop. There is also a February 2010 patent mentioning a primary and secondary battery of different size and capacity: "The first battery may discharge during use of the mobile phone without simultaneous discharge of the second battery. Upon discharge of the first battery, the second battery may not be automatically activated."
A standard silver cell watch battery has a capacity of 200 mAh, a Zinc-air battery has a capacity of 620 mAh. From personal experience, my battery in my wristwatch has lasted for over a decade as it was just keeping the time, running alarms and the odd stopwatch. I am not certain which capacity the secondary battery is which is installed on most mobile phones but it could contain a newer, powerful one installed by the manufacturers. The design of mobile phones is typically a closed design. There is a new micro-battery that could fit in and power a credit-card-thin device and be charged 1,000 times faster than regular batteries. Therefore every time you charged your phone, it would charge the secondary battery as well.
When the phone is turned off and the main battery is removed, the secondary battery could do more than just keep track of the time. It is all connected to the same circuitry so it could leave certain chips powered on in a low power state, for example the GPS, the microphone, the camera, or the closed baseband processor on every mobile phone.
Now, hypothetically the secondary battery could be remotely activated and periodically do a burst transmission every x minutes and send GPS coordinates or microphone recordings back to your favourite 3 letter agency. If the chips were just passively transmitting, perhaps they need a StingRay or Reaper drone in the area to boost the signal. The cell tower itself may be powerful enough to pick up the signal.
This article states that the NSA can technically listen in to the microphone of an iPhone even if it is switched off. In Edward Snowden's conversations with Laura Poitras he advised her to put her mobile in the freezer. In Snowden's NBC interview he mentions "They can absolutely turn them on w
https://security.stackexchange...
I just got done moving refrigerators, hooking up the ice cube/water line and I want the rest of my weekend for myself. Don't beleive me, we'll leave it at that. Have a good day. :)
Strange. Here I was, expecting a thinking man to provide references, resources and evidence that he wasn't a paranoid fool.
You failed.
Good morning "Cederic" I apologize for not providing references, resources and evidence. I do not personally know Edward Snowden. If you know his phone number give him a shout. He'll be able to provide all citations. Regards to you, iwastheone (aka on /. sternishefan, an older account here).
Even when turned off, if you have a sealed battery it still pings cell towers while "off".
I don't believe you.
Don't believe me, I'm cool with that. You have your opinion. I have my 'experience'. You think you're right, I 'know' that I'm right. I have relatives who work for the government in jobs that they cannot talk about. Years before Microsoft bought Skype, I bought a wifi tablet and said, "Now we can Skype to each other!" That relative instantly said back to me, "Oh no, Skype is not secure." Today we know that Skype is not secure, back then no one knew that. I'm a thinking man. So believe whatever makes you feel happy and safe. I know different. Cheers to you, sleep well in your ignorance. Ignorance is bliss. ;)
The official position of the US Federal government is that the use of Stingrays does not require a probable cause warrant, because they claim Stingrays are a kind of pen register tap, which do not require a warrant, as decided in Smith v. Maryland. The government notes that they do not intercept the actual conversation, only tracking identity of the phone and its location. The devices do have the technical capability to record the content of calls and modify them, so the government requires these content-intercepting functions to be disabled in normal use. In September 2015, the US Justice Department issued new guidelines requiring federal agents to obtain warrants before using stingray devices, except in exigent circumstances. In 2015, the state of Virginia passed a law requiring the use of a warrant when using a stingray, and Washington state proposed a similar law. In addition, California, Minnesota and Utah have also passed laws requiring warrants for stingray use.
Replying since you posted AC, mod up insightful.
"Flight mode" is a 'soft button', so you must assume that your phone is still able to communicate to cell towers/wifi/bluetooth hacks. If it's not a real hard wired "On/Off" switch, do not trust.
P.S. If your phone has an un-removable, "sealed" battery and it is powered off, it still 'pings' cell phone towers. Learn the rules of modern life then act accordingly. If you don't, and commit an illegal crime, then you need to get used to a jail cell. Straight talk here.
No, a Faraday bag blocks all signals.
Well said! Wish I had mod points for you. ;/
It's an android phone and gps confirmed off. Ever hear of stingray devices that police use but cannot admit to in court since..., 4th amendment? Cell phone tower triangulation? A laptop, a $35 darkweb program and about $50 if Radio Shack parts? Do nothing on any device whether it's a text/email/phone call that you would not want to be heard back in a courtroom. Do not commit a crime if you have your cellphone with you, even if it's off. If you cannot pull out the battery, it can be turned on remotely even though it is "off".
I did also suggest a Faraday bag to her. Told her that's not an ideal solution and will drain her battery faster as the phone will try harder to locate cell phone towers. She has a good man as her SO, they are getting the SMS Backup+ app by Jan Berkel for her android phone. Then she can easily print out the texts for a judge to read. https://play.google.com/store/...
I know an adult woman, her dad is 'stalking' her via her cellphone, he's a cop. Constantly texts her how he knows exactly where she is and she is paranoid about it. I explained to her how yes, he can tap into her cellphone unless she pulls out her battery. Advised her to change her cellphone number and take screenshots of all texts he's sent to her. Smartphones are spy devices with antennas, anyone can stalk someones location. Now she knows to get an order of protection against him.
We, the human race, are just learning how to take the necessary 'baby steps' in our colonizing the Moon, Mars and beyond. This mission failed. Okay, we are learning what was not done right, it's new territory for us humans. The only way to get 'experience' is by trying and making mistakes. As long as we learn not to repeat our mistake do we get 'experience'. The only way to get 'wisdom' is from 'experience'. In other words, it's a process, and we are learning what does work and also what does not work. We are learning, that's what matters. Star Trek is one day going to be our reality, just not going to happen as soon as we'd want it to. What is important that we all keep talking and trying. There is hope for the future, and that makes me stay hopeful for the future of humanity.
Tort law, lawyers make most of the money from class action lawsuits. The Bonfire of the Vanities was a book, later a movie. Basically the lawyers make the bulk of the money, any litigants who join in get milli-pennies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
Sounds very interesting thank you for the information.
Thank you for that, now I've got another project to do next weekend.
All I want is a computer that can securely have a browser, run emulators for my old school video game roms, play my mp3 collection and play all my movies ripped from DVDs. Can Linux handle all these basic tasks? If so I'll gladly say goodbye to Windows.
Unless a judge mandates it, do not want.
How Does It Work? When the power button is “pressed” on side of unit, and you look through the viewfinder, it activates six special bright-red LED strobe lights designed to bounce off the smallest of camera lenses. The tiny camera lens will appear to blink back at you as a reflection off camera lens itself , instantly giving away its location as you scan the area around you. It doesn’t matter if the camera is turned on or off, recording or not...even if its a non-working camera, the blinking effect will clearly show you the presence of a camera lens which is almost impossible to detect with the naked eye. Knowing where the camera is located will allow you to take immediate action to prevent unauthorized recording of activity. In addition, there are 3 LED intensity levels which helps hone in on camera lenses which could be hidden behind different surfaces. A flat wall 30 feet away could use the highest LED intensity, while a semi reflective shiny surface 5 feet away would use the lowest intensity. This prevents false reflections, maximizing the ability to find a hidden camera lens in any room environment.
That's easy to say but unless you live your life as a true computer/tech person, real people who have regular jobs do not have the time to learn all that needs to be learned in order to keep up with computer advances.
In between the 2 Boeing crashes, another crash was avoided only because there just happened to be another pilot who was in the extra cockpit seat. He knew and understood this flaw, and was able to instruct the 'real' pilots on how to keep the plane from nosediving into the ground like the other 2 did. If not for this, random informed off-duty pilot being in that cockpit, we would have had a third tragedy.
Boeing is about to learn how the cheap becomes the expensive.
Wish we could downmod the article as Troll.
Early /. editors April Fools day joke?