Two words: Avie Tevanian. He's the man behind Mach - the microkernel at the heart of OS/X. Mach has had good clustering and distributed computing support from day zero.
Think about it. With relatively little effort, Apple could build a 64-cpu rack-mounted Mac. Any app that uses Mach threads - that is, any multi-threaded, native (Cocoa or Carbon) OS/X app - would be able to take advantage of them.
P2p technology can be used for piracy, and that is frankly the most common use for it, but it's not the only possible use for it. That's why it should be legal, just as VHS tape is legal - there are substantial non-infringing uses.
My suggestion was totally a joke - yes, it would be far too much work to do, just for a few grins. I would hardly know where to begin. I haven't written anything in BASIC since, let me see, '94, when I was part of the team that wrote Internet Creator for Windows 3.1, in VB. (Yes, I've actually had VB code published - now my secret is out.)
One question for you... are you the Apple engineer that was working on this for the OS X build system, or is this a completely independent project?
No, that's not me. I heard about that project about a year ago, but I hadn't seen any signs of it being released or supported outside of Apple, so about two months ago, I decided to have a go at it myself. I downloaded the Python/ObjC bridge to study the technique they're using, studied the perlguts and perlapi man pages, and well, here we are.
We have talked before, though, on MacSlash. I use the handle "sherm" over there.
Damn, a bit too quick on the trigger there... what I meant to say was...
Why create Cocoa bindings for REALbasic? What would that accomplish?
After the public flogging that the makers of REALBasic gave Cocoa, it would very nearly be worth the effort just to tweak their noses and be entertained by their reaction.:-)
If there are additional libraries that app requires, but aren't generally applicable, they can just be thrown in the Resources subfolder, along with the main.pl script. This isn't quite as big of a deal in perl, because of CPAN,
I was actually thinking that was a big deal, because of CPAN. For all but a few developer's machines, it's pretty safe to assume a bone-stock Perl configuration, with no CPAN modules installed. You can package CPAN modules with your app, so that the end user doesn't have to install them.
Strictly speaking, Project Builder is only needed the first time you build your project. After that, you can use BBEdit's "Open Hidden" function to edit your Perl code, which is stored in the Resource folder.
I was with a friend one night when he was turned away from a club in Boston. He had no driver's license - but he *did* have a valid Mass. state ID. I guess only drivers are allowed to drink.
Are you stoned? It's based on BSD. Who gives a damn about trademarks? If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
Grandparent meant that Macromedia Flash has not been ported to any Linux, *BSD, HP/UX, or Solaris operating environment, or any other environment that uses X11 as its graphics layer.
OS/X runx X11 just fine, thank you. Even GNOME has been ported.
Many web developers like to develop on a system known to share some behavior with the production server.
That's precisely why I use OS/X. It can perfectly mirror my production environment - Apache with mod_perl - and run Photoshop and Flash, on one machine, at the same time.
I'll give them a break only by admitting that it's not just AOL users. Seriously - how many times have you heard some clueless newbie say "I didn't do anything, I swear! The computer just did that for no reason!"
they insist on using an installer that requires things to be where the installer thinks they should be. My computer is MINE.
Yeah, that pisses me off about automobiles, too. You see, my car requires gasoline. WHY? My car is MINE! It should be able to run on whatever liquid I pour down the pipe, but no, those damn idiot Nazis at Honda think they know everything.
Damn, but that's funny! You obviously have no idea who Pudge is. He's definitely a Mac Guy. He wrote the only book I know of on MacPerl, and is the current maintainer of MacPerl. I'd be willing to bet that there's an Apple section here, and that Apple stories get posted here because of Pudge, not in spite of him.
In fact, I suspect that's Slashdot's Dirty Little Secret - it may be served on Linux, but the developers all use OS/X to maintain it. C'mon, Pudge, admit it... you know you'd never give up BBEdit...;-)
It sounds like what you want is OpenSTEP, the predecessor to Cocoa. Before NeXT bought Apple for -$200m, OpenSTEP was available on NT and a variety of UNIXes.
You can still see the signs of it, too - just take a look through the Foundation and AppKit header files. They're filled with platform specific definitions wrapped in #ifdefs.
Re:The submitter made a misleading quote...
on
Linux and Mac OS X
·
· Score: 1
Finder is not a part of the OS, it's just a file manager application. Many classic applications, installers and games especially, kill every other application, including the finder, and take the machine over entirely.
It's really just a matter of semantics. The whole idea of the "Macintosh Experience" can be a little vague, and may not make a lot of sense for someone who hasn't spent a lot of time among "old school" Mac users.
Basically, anything that isn't consistent with the look and feel of OS/X - that is, any command line or X11 application - is not considered a "true" Mac application by many of the Mac faithful. In their minds, there is a distinct difference between Mac applications, and applications that happen to run on a Mac. So, while Darwin applications will run under OS/X, they're not OS/X applications.
What Apple is trying to promote with this Open Source category, I think, is the porting of OSS code into "true" OS/X applications that will appeal to the "old school" Mac users as well as recent UNIX converts. It's not really a matter of how much effort is involved; it's more a matter of how well the final result is integrated into the "Macintosh Experience."
So, while the MySQL team has spent countless hours tracking down some obscure threading and signal handling bugs in MySQL on Darwin, they're less likely to win this award than someone who's spent a day or two knocking together a friendly Aqua client app for MySQL. It doesn't seem fair, if you consider only the amount of work involved, but if you think about Apple's goals, it makes a kind of sense.
It's a contest for OS/X ports, not Darwin ports. The fact that command-line applications compiled for Darwin can also run on OS/X does not make them OS/X applications.
Ummm... Apple ported GCC and friends themselves. They're even working with the GCC team to get their PPC optimization code into the main branch. It's certainly an accomplishment, but I doubt that even Steve Jobs has the bawls to give the award to himself.:-)
by use it, I mean have it ported to work well w/ Aqua and install easily
You've hit the nail on the head here. Simply compiling and packaging standard command line or X software is not the same as porting it to OS/X. Don't get me wrong - I have a huge amount of respect for the people porting XFree, the people behind fink, and all the others who are supporting Darwin. It's a huge amount of work, for which they deserve proper credit and kudos. But let's call a spade a spade - what they're producing are Darwin apps, not OS/X apps.
These awards will go to the handful of folks who have taken the extra step of doing a real OS/X port - with an Aqua interface that's compliant with Apple's Human Interface Guidelines, support for Services, hassle-free installs, etc.
Slashdot Mirror
Two words: Avie Tevanian. He's the man behind Mach - the microkernel at the heart of OS/X. Mach has had good clustering and distributed computing support from day zero.
Think about it. With relatively little effort, Apple could build a 64-cpu rack-mounted Mac. Any app that uses Mach threads - that is, any multi-threaded, native (Cocoa or Carbon) OS/X app - would be able to take advantage of them.
P2P is piracy
P2p technology can be used for piracy, and that is frankly the most common use for it, but it's not the only possible use for it. That's why it should be legal, just as VHS tape is legal - there are substantial non-infringing uses.
you going to ban everyone's isp out there?
No - just the one that's not getting attacked. That will be the one the script kiddie is using, because he won't want to bring down his own access.
My suggestion was totally a joke - yes, it would be far too much work to do, just for a few grins. I would hardly know where to begin. I haven't written anything in BASIC since, let me see, '94, when I was part of the team that wrote Internet Creator for Windows 3.1, in VB. (Yes, I've actually had VB code published - now my secret is out.)
One question for you... are you the Apple engineer that was working on this for the OS X build system, or is this a completely independent project?
No, that's not me. I heard about that project about a year ago, but I hadn't seen any signs of it being released or supported outside of Apple, so about two months ago, I decided to have a go at it myself. I downloaded the Python/ObjC bridge to study the technique they're using, studied the perlguts and perlapi man pages, and well, here we are.
We have talked before, though, on MacSlash. I use the handle "sherm" over there.
Damn, a bit too quick on the trigger there... what I meant to say was...
:-)
Why create Cocoa bindings for REALbasic? What would that accomplish?
After the public flogging that the makers of REALBasic gave Cocoa, it would very nearly be worth the effort just to tweak their noses and be entertained by their reaction.
Why create Cocoa bindings for REALbasic? What would that accomplish?
:-)
After the public flogging that the makers of REALBasic gave Cocoa, it would very nearly be worth the effort just to tweak their noses and be enter.
If there are additional libraries that app requires, but aren't generally applicable, they can just be thrown in the Resources subfolder, along with the main.pl script. This isn't quite as big of a deal in perl, because of CPAN,
I was actually thinking that was a big deal, because of CPAN. For all but a few developer's machines, it's pretty safe to assume a bone-stock Perl configuration, with no CPAN modules installed. You can package CPAN modules with your app, so that the end user doesn't have to install them.
Calling Perl from Objective-C works now, although I haven't yet written any documentation for doing that.
Strictly speaking, Project Builder is only needed the first time you build your project. After that, you can use BBEdit's "Open Hidden" function to edit your Perl code, which is stored in the Resource folder.
As far as a boycott goes, I've been doing that ever since the day I saw how corn flakes were actually made ...
C'mon, you can't just say something like that and leave us hanging... tell us how they're made.
I was with a friend one night when he was turned away from a club in Boston. He had no driver's license - but he *did* have a valid Mass. state ID. I guess only drivers are allowed to drink.
Mac OS X is not a UNIX® brand system
Are you stoned? It's based on BSD. Who gives a damn about trademarks? If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
Grandparent meant that Macromedia Flash has not been ported to any Linux, *BSD, HP/UX, or Solaris operating environment, or any other environment that uses X11 as its graphics layer.
OS/X runx X11 just fine, thank you. Even GNOME has been ported.
Many web developers like to develop on a system known to share some behavior with the production server.
That's precisely why I use OS/X. It can perfectly mirror my production environment - Apache with mod_perl - and run Photoshop and Flash, on one machine, at the same time.
Can't we give their users a break?
I'll give them a break only by admitting that it's not just AOL users. Seriously - how many times have you heard some clueless newbie say "I didn't do anything, I swear! The computer just did that for no reason!"
they insist on using an installer that requires things to be where the installer thinks they should be. My computer is MINE.
Yeah, that pisses me off about automobiles, too. You see, my car requires gasoline. WHY? My car is MINE! It should be able to run on whatever liquid I pour down the pipe, but no, those damn idiot Nazis at Honda think they know everything.
I spose youre one of those people who says 'GIF' as 'Jif'
Actually, according to Compuserve, who created the GIF format, "Choosy users choose GIF."
And yes, I am one of those people who insists on pronouncing things correctly. It's "ten" not "exx." Get over it already.
It seems obvious that "pudge" hates Macs
;-)
Damn, but that's funny! You obviously have no idea who Pudge is. He's definitely a Mac Guy. He wrote the only book I know of on MacPerl, and is the current maintainer of MacPerl. I'd be willing to bet that there's an Apple section here, and that Apple stories get posted here because of Pudge, not in spite of him.
In fact, I suspect that's Slashdot's Dirty Little Secret - it may be served on Linux, but the developers all use OS/X to maintain it. C'mon, Pudge, admit it... you know you'd never give up BBEdit...
Every computer program should have access to spell checking.
:-)
Every native OS/X program does have access to the system-wide spell checking service.
It sounds like what you want is OpenSTEP, the predecessor to Cocoa. Before NeXT bought Apple for -$200m, OpenSTEP was available on NT and a variety of UNIXes.
You can still see the signs of it, too - just take a look through the Foundation and AppKit header files. They're filled with platform specific definitions wrapped in #ifdefs.
Finder is not a part of the OS, it's just a file manager application. Many classic applications, installers and games especially, kill every other application, including the finder, and take the machine over entirely.
It's really just a matter of semantics. The whole idea of the "Macintosh Experience" can be a little vague, and may not make a lot of sense for someone who hasn't spent a lot of time among "old school" Mac users.
Basically, anything that isn't consistent with the look and feel of OS/X - that is, any command line or X11 application - is not considered a "true" Mac application by many of the Mac faithful. In their minds, there is a distinct difference between Mac applications, and applications that happen to run on a Mac. So, while Darwin applications will run under OS/X, they're not OS/X applications.
What Apple is trying to promote with this Open Source category, I think, is the porting of OSS code into "true" OS/X applications that will appeal to the "old school" Mac users as well as recent UNIX converts. It's not really a matter of how much effort is involved; it's more a matter of how well the final result is integrated into the "Macintosh Experience."
So, while the MySQL team has spent countless hours tracking down some obscure threading and signal handling bugs in MySQL on Darwin, they're less likely to win this award than someone who's spent a day or two knocking together a friendly Aqua client app for MySQL. It doesn't seem fair, if you consider only the amount of work involved, but if you think about Apple's goals, it makes a kind of sense.
It's not just you - I tried AbiWord and several other X apps. The font rendering was so horrible it made my eyes bleed.
It's a contest for OS/X ports, not Darwin ports. The fact that command-line applications compiled for Darwin can also run on OS/X does not make them OS/X applications.
MacGIMP is not an OS/X port. It's an X application that's been compiled on OS/X, that's all.
When the MacGIMP team produces an Aqua version - that will be an OS/X port, and worthy of an award.
Ummm... Apple ported GCC and friends themselves. They're even working with the GCC team to get their PPC optimization code into the main branch. It's certainly an accomplishment, but I doubt that even Steve Jobs has the bawls to give the award to himself. :-)
by use it, I mean have it ported to work well w/ Aqua and install easily
You've hit the nail on the head here. Simply compiling and packaging standard command line or X software is not the same as porting it to OS/X. Don't get me wrong - I have a huge amount of respect for the people porting XFree, the people behind fink, and all the others who are supporting Darwin. It's a huge amount of work, for which they deserve proper credit and kudos. But let's call a spade a spade - what they're producing are Darwin apps, not OS/X apps.
These awards will go to the handful of folks who have taken the extra step of doing a real OS/X port - with an Aqua interface that's compliant with Apple's Human Interface Guidelines, support for Services, hassle-free installs, etc.