"The article says that the FBI is asking people to watch out for certain behaviors. Who is less free because of that? What are they less free to do? What freedom has been taken away?"
The FBI is asking students, teachers and researchers to spy on their fellow colleagues and report anything they may consider suspect.
Tell the FBI the KGB is calling. They want their old manuals back.
Well. I saw the trailer and, as much as I liked B5, I am not very optimistic.
B5 has a very rich universe and there is absolutely no need to keep rehashing those same old (some of them I really like) characters over and over again like they could create a story by themselves.
While JMS is no Tolkien (even with his own LOTR), he proved once he could write a very good story. Maybe he can do it again.
They merely said something on the lines of "Take a step by step approach and focus on the task at hand". Something like:
1- First we need to find a better way - than the shuttle: it's not hard - to put people in orbit. 2- Then they must be able to stay alive long enough for a trip to Mars without any Progress cargo ship in sight. 3- Then NASA should focus on the vehicle that can really take them to Mars orbit 4- Then they should develop the vehicle that would land on Mars and be able to stay a couple months there 5- Then they should figure out how the astronauts get back to mothership and bring it safely back to Earth
The only steps this cut affect are on item 4. Each and every other item is a lot more useful than just Mars and, frankly, if NASA develops something that has no other use than to put people on Mars, it really deserves the cut.
My carrier will do OMA, but it is a paid-for service. What we are doing now is to use an e-mail address that the phone company makes available that will redirect itself to an SMS. When some e-mail rules are triggered (like messages comming from one of our Nagios), they will be automagically forwarded to our phones. That's quite cool.
Yes, I know about both Push IMAP and IDLE, but neither of them solves this specific problem.
What the RIM thing does is to use more or less the same channel a cell phone already uses for stand-by operation to receive mail notifications, then starting a bi-directional data connection to retrieve it. Both Push IMAP and the IDLE command apparently suppose you have a live, bi-directional data connection available at all times, which incurs in a battery life-time penalty.
I never did set up an IMAP server to do it. Do you know of any how-tos about it?
There should be no non-security related updates on a stable OS (like Debian/stable), so, yum update or apt-get upgrade should never, ever hose the machine unless you are running a beta release. Servers should also have the least software possible installed on them (this includes unneeded compilers) so that less is exposed. While binary updates are nice, they are not essential. What is essential is proper configuration file change management. Most APT software updates nicely step around local configuration files and try not to overwrite what I may have changed, but provide nice starting points so I don't have to figure out how to do it from scratch.
Of course, I never used BSD very much, so, I may be in for a nice surprise.
Are there any BSD tutorials for those familiar with Linux and package management?
IIRC WinMe was rushed out when it became painfully obvious 2000 wouldn't be the GameOS of choice the way 98 was at that time. The NT codebase was not new at all at that time - they had one minor (3.5) and two major (NT4, W2K) overhauls on the original (NT3.1) one.
And Vista is not a clean re-write of the NT family. It more or less is the same old NT kernel with lots of stuff added layer-style to it for security and a huge cosmetic change in the matched userland.
It sort of runs well on new hardware. My notebook came with it but, since I prefer Linux, Vista survived for about 10 minutes.
While Vista won't fly off the shelves like some previous versions (3, 95, 98?) did, it will certainly survive. Next year's computers will be able to run it and it will most probably fly on the über-fast octa-core with embedded GPUs and prescient memory by the time we start seeing betas of Vista+1.
"If a problem is detected, it's usually just a matter of portsnapping up a new ports tree and "make install"ing the port"
It must be bad not to have something as convenient as "yum update" or "apt-get update && apt-get upgrade" available. I have several servers doing things like that on cron and mailing me if they need further attention. It seems PC-BSD has something similar that is worth a look.
ZFS (the major reason I would consider for going BSD) rocks, but APT does rock too and I have managed to live without ZFS until now.;-)
One of the key functions of RIM-style e-mail is that the server tells the phone that it has to download something instead of the phone polling the server if there is something to do. It is useful if you need to be informed of something immediately after the e-mail arrives instead of waiting until the next scheduled contact.
With reduced cost per megabyte, higher data rates and increased battery life, this is becoming less and less relevant. I am completely happy with my IMAP, mainly because, when I really need to know, my server sends me an SMS that arrives in less than 10 seconds.
"Are BSD's tools in the same degree of usability as APT/Synaptic? No. Can I get what I need within a short amount of time? Undoubtedly."
The key thing in package management is not getting stuff. It is certainly convenient to be able to get stuff and install it easily, but it is not as easy to keep it up to date. If a gaping security hole is discovered in the program you installed yesterday, will it auto-update as soon as a new version is released? I am not sure and being unsure about it is a big reason why I don't run BSD as my main OS. The "-h human readable" options being the other good ones.;-)
Sounds extremely worth a try. Thank you very much.
Heck... A BSD kernel with BSD-ish tools and APT coming from the usual *BSD players would sure be very interesting. The key to a decent package manager like APT is not installing stuff. Anyone can get a tarbal and do the "./configure-make-make install" dance. The trick is to do it and still keep your box up-to-date with the latest and greatest (and safest) stuff.
"With the BSD's these components are compiled and installed as a whole."
You could simply have a large "bsd-base" package (that depended on a specific version of a "bsd-kernel") with all the base system in it and still have package management (even buildable and depending on source packages) for all user applications (like Firefox, Thunderbird, Emacs and so on). When you upgrade it, you are effectively, upgrading the whole OS.
My problems with package management on Ubuntu are very rare (and mind you I am running Feisty on a Gutsy kernel). I had some with Debian, but I was running a box pegged on testing with parts from unstable, experimental and several external non-kosher package sources, so, I suppose, I deserved what I got.
Well... His phone is certainly not my perfect phone.
My Sony Ericsson P-800 came close to it but lacked a decent QWERTY keyboard and the camera was really bad. The 910 QWERTY keyboard was bad and I did not try hard enough to like the 990. My Nokia E62 has a decent keyboard, combined with a screen big-enough for doing SSH (saved my day a couple weeks ago when I could log-on and fix a problem on a server while my laptop batteries were dead), but no camera and no WiFi. It is also a little bit too large.
My perfect phone would sport an iPhone style touchscreen with tactile feedback and a cleverly overlaid semi-transparent QWERTY keyboard that could be drawn on the touchscreen surface when needed (say - when I touch the screen while using SSH or when I am writing something in a text field). A two-card hot-swap GSM system and, when connected via USB to my laptop, it would look like a standard USB hub connected to a mass storage device (with all files, including ROM-based ones, exposed), as many network interfaces as there are data networks available on the phone, a USB handset for VoIP, a webcam and a PostScript printer (so I could "print" things to read later on its large enough screen). It would retain every function while connected via Bluetooth or WiFi (except, perhaps, the storage thing, for security reasons).
It would also have a very modular software architecture and allow additional functionality to be installed drag-and-drop style.
Is there a BSD "distro" that uses APT for package management (or something as good as)? I would love to have ZFS, but not at the expense of sane package management.
"Thus, while I do not agree with Bush's USA PATRIOT act, or his handling of the war in Iraq, the application of the Wilsonian idea to bring freedom to the world is a damned good one."
I really do prefer democracy and the rule of law over any of the various alternatives, but shoveling a democracy down someone's throat right after bombing them back to stone age and invading their country is not my idea if a good way to do it. The very ideals the "liberators" propose risk becoming just as much unpopular as their use of force.
You can't "give" freedom. Unless people really understand it and want it, they won't keep it. Real freedom must come from a long process that may - or may not (we don't know enough) - start with education and a really good, borderline paranoid (against the government), constitution.
How many point releases have there been to OS X for sale since Microsoft stopped doing this? 4? A bit less than 1 per year? So, OS X costs $649.95 to stay current since its release in March 2001.
Yes. Pretty much yes. But take into account many users are perfectly happy without the latest and greatest MacOS because it still is more user friendly and reliable than Windows and gets the job done. I have a Mac that had its last OS install three years ago
During the time from the first to last OS X point update, having Microsoft's latest consumer operating system would have cost you, at absolute most, $199.99 for Windows ME and another $249.99 for windows XP professional. That's $449.98 *TOPS*. Honestly, anyone here would tell you paying that much is absolute insanity because Windows ME OEM would have cost about $49.99 with the purchase of a computer, and XP Professional upgrade sells at a street price of $199.99. But I'm trying to help you out here.
So, your proposal is to get Windows OEM pricing by buying a computer with 2000 technology and then upgrading it with Windows XP. While there are a lot of happy Apple users with computers dating back to 2000 (G4s) running the latest OSX (10.4), I cannot say the same about Windows users. All the anti-malware really sucks the life out of a 2000's machine (was it P3, P4?) and they mostly crawl. If you want a happy Windows user in 2007, you must have bought a new computer around 2002, so, please, factor that in. Apple users don't need as frequent hardware upgrades because their software doesn't degrade so fast.
And you'd have to be insane to think much of Windows ME survived in Windows XP. You weren't just buying "improvements" and security patches. You really were buying a new OS.
Maybe there is very little Me in XP, but there is a bit of NT 4 and a whole lot of 2000 (a.k.a. NT 5.0) in Windows XP (a.k.a. NT 5.1).
So, again, the mantra that Apple costs more remains the truth. You can't deny it. The numbers are right there. Unless you think I'm misquoting on the Windows pricing. The OS X pricing is well known.
Actually, the cost difference you mention is quickly offset by the time you spend troubleshooting, installing and re-installing (my longest XP install lived 2 years before going fubar) and wondering where are your e-mails stored. Windows boxes die every year or so (they last more if you know what you are doing) and it takes a lot of time to install the OS, install anti-malware, service packs/updates and everything you need to start using your computer and allowing it a chance to resist more than 1 minute connected to a broadband link (so you can download the remaining updates, that will take forever to install).
But that's ok. Stay with your black hole of wallet deflating goodness. I don't care. I have enough money left over from using windows to afford to do what I like to do, without having to do it on my computer.:)
Actually, my main computer runs Linux. I admit it is less well rounded up as OSX, but it gets my job done in ways OSX won't (and Windows can't even start). I also like being able to use commodity hardware (an HP notebook, currently) and absolutely love how it keeps itself up-to-date (I use Ubuntu). The fact that it has superior eye-candy to Windows Vista on hardware Windows Vista would barely crawl doesn't hurt either. And the license cost is just perfect.
And before you tell me that there's no difference between windows ME and windows XP, I'm suggesting you smash *that* delusion right now, because there's a hoard of slashdotters that agree with me: There's as different as apples and oranges.
There is not nearly as much difference between Me and XP than between OSX 10.0 and 10.4. And, mind you, despite lack of native applications, missing pieces and other stuff, 10.0 still kicked ass when compared to any Windows of that time. It more or less kicks ass compared to XP (which is, essentially, 2000 with a less ugly face)...
I am sorry to break your apple-bashing delusion but there are a lot of upgrades between those so called point-releases. 10.4 is great and 10.5 seems to be a major overhaul.
But that's OK. Stay with your Windows box. I don't care.
I saw that documentary at least once, but I fail to see its value. It's a pro-Chávez documentary. The guys who made it liked Chávez. That's quite common.
As for the broadcast-rights you are right. Unfortunately, in all aspects, they were closed, since they were limited to a very small market they did not cater for previously. A change like this requires some major programming restructuring and it's very unlikely that they would even survive.
And you are right all Chávez did was absolutely legal. He was elected and re-elected, much like many dictators of the past. Unfortunately, their new constitution does not restrain him nearly enough and being elected may end up as a mere formality.
"The radio station which was "shut down" actually did not get its license renewed primarily because the owners were involved in the 2002 coup attempt where the democratically elected government was briefly overthrown by a corporate-led and US-backed junta."
First, it's a TV station who got its license pulled - it was not shut down, but forbidden to use radio waves for transmission. And second, being opposition (as in being involved in a coup) is hardly grounds for punishing an organization. If such act is defined in Venezuelan law (and Chávez was, himself, in a coup back in 1992), then the _individuals_ involved should be brought to justice - like he was - he went to jail until being pardoned by then president in 1994.
Forgive me, but his intolerance to opposition - culminating with the closure of a very vocal opposition TV station - and his rule by decree status acquired by tampering with the constitution thanks to a legislative majority acquired in, to say the least, unusual circumstances, make him quite bad enough for me.
He is not acting on Venezuelan people's interests. He is acting on his and his minion's interests, but, since his minions more or less control all of Venezuela, the line gets blurry.
"The article says that the FBI is asking people to watch out for certain behaviors. Who is less free because of that? What are they less free to do? What freedom has been taken away?"
The FBI is asking students, teachers and researchers to spy on their fellow colleagues and report anything they may consider suspect.
Tell the FBI the KGB is calling. They want their old manuals back.
+1 funny
I want to believe he would like it
Well. I saw the trailer and, as much as I liked B5, I am not very optimistic.
B5 has a very rich universe and there is absolutely no need to keep rehashing those same old (some of them I really like) characters over and over again like they could create a story by themselves.
While JMS is no Tolkien (even with his own LOTR), he proved once he could write a very good story. Maybe he can do it again.
Of course this is nothing new, but we have seen this movie and we all knows the ending sucks badly.
All this "reporting suitability issues and potential espionage indicators that may surface in a colleague's behavior." seems eerily familiar.
They merely said something on the lines of "Take a step by step approach and focus on the task at hand". Something like:
1- First we need to find a better way - than the shuttle: it's not hard - to put people in orbit.
2- Then they must be able to stay alive long enough for a trip to Mars without any Progress cargo ship in sight.
3- Then NASA should focus on the vehicle that can really take them to Mars orbit
4- Then they should develop the vehicle that would land on Mars and be able to stay a couple months there
5- Then they should figure out how the astronauts get back to mothership and bring it safely back to Earth
The only steps this cut affect are on item 4. Each and every other item is a lot more useful than just Mars and, frankly, if NASA develops something that has no other use than to put people on Mars, it really deserves the cut.
My carrier will do OMA, but it is a paid-for service. What we are doing now is to use an e-mail address that the phone company makes available that will redirect itself to an SMS. When some e-mail rules are triggered (like messages comming from one of our Nagios), they will be automagically forwarded to our phones. That's quite cool.
Yes, I know about both Push IMAP and IDLE, but neither of them solves this specific problem.
What the RIM thing does is to use more or less the same channel a cell phone already uses for stand-by operation to receive mail notifications, then starting a bi-directional data connection to retrieve it. Both Push IMAP and the IDLE command apparently suppose you have a live, bi-directional data connection available at all times, which incurs in a battery life-time penalty.
I never did set up an IMAP server to do it. Do you know of any how-tos about it?
There should be no non-security related updates on a stable OS (like Debian/stable), so, yum update or apt-get upgrade should never, ever hose the machine unless you are running a beta release. Servers should also have the least software possible installed on them (this includes unneeded compilers) so that less is exposed. While binary updates are nice, they are not essential. What is essential is proper configuration file change management. Most APT software updates nicely step around local configuration files and try not to overwrite what I may have changed, but provide nice starting points so I don't have to figure out how to do it from scratch.
Of course, I never used BSD very much, so, I may be in for a nice surprise.
Are there any BSD tutorials for those familiar with Linux and package management?
IIRC WinMe was rushed out when it became painfully obvious 2000 wouldn't be the GameOS of choice the way 98 was at that time. The NT codebase was not new at all at that time - they had one minor (3.5) and two major (NT4, W2K) overhauls on the original (NT3.1) one.
And Vista is not a clean re-write of the NT family. It more or less is the same old NT kernel with lots of stuff added layer-style to it for security and a huge cosmetic change in the matched userland.
It sort of runs well on new hardware. My notebook came with it but, since I prefer Linux, Vista survived for about 10 minutes.
While Vista won't fly off the shelves like some previous versions (3, 95, 98?) did, it will certainly survive. Next year's computers will be able to run it and it will most probably fly on the über-fast octa-core with embedded GPUs and prescient memory by the time we start seeing betas of Vista+1.
"If a problem is detected, it's usually just a matter of portsnapping up a new ports tree and "make install"ing the port"
;-)
It must be bad not to have something as convenient as "yum update" or "apt-get update && apt-get upgrade" available. I have several servers doing things like that on cron and mailing me if they need further attention. It seems PC-BSD has something similar that is worth a look.
ZFS (the major reason I would consider for going BSD) rocks, but APT does rock too and I have managed to live without ZFS until now.
I can wait.
One of the key functions of RIM-style e-mail is that the server tells the phone that it has to download something instead of the phone polling the server if there is something to do. It is useful if you need to be informed of something immediately after the e-mail arrives instead of waiting until the next scheduled contact.
With reduced cost per megabyte, higher data rates and increased battery life, this is becoming less and less relevant. I am completely happy with my IMAP, mainly because, when I really need to know, my server sends me an SMS that arrives in less than 10 seconds.
"Are BSD's tools in the same degree of usability as APT/Synaptic? No. Can I get what I need within a short amount of time? Undoubtedly."
;-)
The key thing in package management is not getting stuff. It is certainly convenient to be able to get stuff and install it easily, but it is not as easy to keep it up to date. If a gaping security hole is discovered in the program you installed yesterday, will it auto-update as soon as a new version is released? I am not sure and being unsure about it is a big reason why I don't run BSD as my main OS. The "-h human readable" options being the other good ones.
Sounds extremely worth a try. Thank you very much.
Heck... A BSD kernel with BSD-ish tools and APT coming from the usual *BSD players would sure be very interesting. The key to a decent package manager like APT is not installing stuff. Anyone can get a tarbal and do the "./configure-make-make install" dance. The trick is to do it and still keep your box up-to-date with the latest and greatest (and safest) stuff.
"With the BSD's these components are compiled and installed as a whole."
You could simply have a large "bsd-base" package (that depended on a specific version of a "bsd-kernel") with all the base system in it and still have package management (even buildable and depending on source packages) for all user applications (like Firefox, Thunderbird, Emacs and so on). When you upgrade it, you are effectively, upgrading the whole OS.
My problems with package management on Ubuntu are very rare (and mind you I am running Feisty on a Gutsy kernel). I had some with Debian, but I was running a box pegged on testing with parts from unstable, experimental and several external non-kosher package sources, so, I suppose, I deserved what I got.
Well... His phone is certainly not my perfect phone.
My Sony Ericsson P-800 came close to it but lacked a decent QWERTY keyboard and the camera was really bad. The 910 QWERTY keyboard was bad and I did not try hard enough to like the 990. My Nokia E62 has a decent keyboard, combined with a screen big-enough for doing SSH (saved my day a couple weeks ago when I could log-on and fix a problem on a server while my laptop batteries were dead), but no camera and no WiFi. It is also a little bit too large.
My perfect phone would sport an iPhone style touchscreen with tactile feedback and a cleverly overlaid semi-transparent QWERTY keyboard that could be drawn on the touchscreen surface when needed (say - when I touch the screen while using SSH or when I am writing something in a text field). A two-card hot-swap GSM system and, when connected via USB to my laptop, it would look like a standard USB hub connected to a mass storage device (with all files, including ROM-based ones, exposed), as many network interfaces as there are data networks available on the phone, a USB handset for VoIP, a webcam and a PostScript printer (so I could "print" things to read later on its large enough screen). It would retain every function while connected via Bluetooth or WiFi (except, perhaps, the storage thing, for security reasons).
It would also have a very modular software architecture and allow additional functionality to be installed drag-and-drop style.
Is there a BSD "distro" that uses APT for package management (or something as good as)? I would love to have ZFS, but not at the expense of sane package management.
+1 sarcastic for you.
"Thus, while I do not agree with Bush's USA PATRIOT act, or his handling of the war in Iraq, the application of the Wilsonian idea to bring freedom to the world is a damned good one."
I really do prefer democracy and the rule of law over any of the various alternatives, but shoveling a democracy down someone's throat right after bombing them back to stone age and invading their country is not my idea if a good way to do it. The very ideals the "liberators" propose risk becoming just as much unpopular as their use of force.
You can't "give" freedom. Unless people really understand it and want it, they won't keep it. Real freedom must come from a long process that may - or may not (we don't know enough) - start with education and a really good, borderline paranoid (against the government), constitution.
Yes. Pretty much yes. But take into account many users are perfectly happy without the latest and greatest MacOS because it still is more user friendly and reliable than Windows and gets the job done. I have a Mac that had its last OS install three years ago
During the time from the first to last OS X point update, having Microsoft's latest consumer operating system would have cost you, at absolute most, $199.99 for Windows ME and another $249.99 for windows XP professional. That's $449.98 *TOPS*. Honestly, anyone here would tell you paying that much is absolute insanity because Windows ME OEM would have cost about $49.99 with the purchase of a computer, and XP Professional upgrade sells at a street price of $199.99. But I'm trying to help you out here.So, your proposal is to get Windows OEM pricing by buying a computer with 2000 technology and then upgrading it with Windows XP. While there are a lot of happy Apple users with computers dating back to 2000 (G4s) running the latest OSX (10.4), I cannot say the same about Windows users. All the anti-malware really sucks the life out of a 2000's machine (was it P3, P4?) and they mostly crawl. If you want a happy Windows user in 2007, you must have bought a new computer around 2002, so, please, factor that in. Apple users don't need as frequent hardware upgrades because their software doesn't degrade so fast.
And you'd have to be insane to think much of Windows ME survived in Windows XP. You weren't just buying "improvements" and security patches. You really were buying a new OS.Maybe there is very little Me in XP, but there is a bit of NT 4 and a whole lot of 2000 (a.k.a. NT 5.0) in Windows XP (a.k.a. NT 5.1).
So, again, the mantra that Apple costs more remains the truth. You can't deny it. The numbers are right there. Unless you think I'm misquoting on the Windows pricing. The OS X pricing is well known.Actually, the cost difference you mention is quickly offset by the time you spend troubleshooting, installing and re-installing (my longest XP install lived 2 years before going fubar) and wondering where are your e-mails stored. Windows boxes die every year or so (they last more if you know what you are doing) and it takes a lot of time to install the OS, install anti-malware, service packs/updates and everything you need to start using your computer and allowing it a chance to resist more than 1 minute connected to a broadband link (so you can download the remaining updates, that will take forever to install).
But that's ok. Stay with your black hole of wallet deflating goodness. I don't care. I have enough money left over from using windows to afford to do what I like to do, without having to do it on my computer.Actually, my main computer runs Linux. I admit it is less well rounded up as OSX, but it gets my job done in ways OSX won't (and Windows can't even start). I also like being able to use commodity hardware (an HP notebook, currently) and absolutely love how it keeps itself up-to-date (I use Ubuntu). The fact that it has superior eye-candy to Windows Vista on hardware Windows Vista would barely crawl doesn't hurt either. And the license cost is just perfect.
And before you tell me that there's no difference between windows ME and windows XP, I'm suggesting you smash *that* delusion right now, because there's a hoard of slashdotters that agree with me: There's as different as apples and oranges.There is not nearly as much difference between Me and XP than between OSX 10.0 and 10.4. And, mind you, despite lack of native applications, missing pieces and other stuff, 10.0 still kicked ass when compared to any Windows of that time. It more or less kicks ass compared to XP (which is, essentially, 2000 with a less ugly face)...
I am sorry to break your apple-bashing delusion but there are a lot of upgrades between those so called point-releases. 10.4 is great and 10.5 seems to be a major overhaul.
But that's OK. Stay with your Windows box. I don't care.
I saw that documentary at least once, but I fail to see its value. It's a pro-Chávez documentary. The guys who made it liked Chávez. That's quite common.
As for the broadcast-rights you are right. Unfortunately, in all aspects, they were closed, since they were limited to a very small market they did not cater for previously. A change like this requires some major programming restructuring and it's very unlikely that they would even survive.
And you are right all Chávez did was absolutely legal. He was elected and re-elected, much like many dictators of the past. Unfortunately, their new constitution does not restrain him nearly enough and being elected may end up as a mere formality.
I am not optimistic.
"The radio station which was "shut down" actually did not get its license renewed primarily because the owners were involved in the 2002 coup attempt where the democratically elected government was briefly overthrown by a corporate-led and US-backed junta."
First, it's a TV station who got its license pulled - it was not shut down, but forbidden to use radio waves for transmission. And second, being opposition (as in being involved in a coup) is hardly grounds for punishing an organization. If such act is defined in Venezuelan law (and Chávez was, himself, in a coup back in 1992), then the _individuals_ involved should be brought to justice - like he was - he went to jail until being pardoned by then president in 1994.
I wonder why so many Chávez supporters are ACs...
Either Intel or AMD (and, most probably, both) are quite happy.
So, in the end, he IS paying US companies.
Forgive me, but his intolerance to opposition - culminating with the closure of a very vocal opposition TV station - and his rule by decree status acquired by tampering with the constitution thanks to a legislative majority acquired in, to say the least, unusual circumstances, make him quite bad enough for me.
He is not acting on Venezuelan people's interests. He is acting on his and his minion's interests, but, since his minions more or less control all of Venezuela, the line gets blurry.
No. That would be in China. In Japan it would be Jujutsu, Judo, Sumo or something like that.