"With a logon system as simple as this, one has to question the security and privacy of the students."
As far as security, you have a good point. While the school is obligated to make their system secure, I doubt that anyone in their right minds (i.e., on Slashdot, not in the administration) believes that this system cant' be cracked. I just hope the people who run the school office aren't in charge of online security. I can't imagine they're up to speed on anti-social engineering techniques, let alone anti-script kittie tools.
As for your privacy, where your parents/guardians are concerned, you have none! You're a legal minor getting darn near free room & board. You're also a lot more niave than you can imagine, so stop whining and get over it. You'll get to pay taxes, pay rent, pay utilities, vote, buy groceries, keep a budget, and worry about your own kids' safety soon enough.
"This has been making my life a living hell for the past 2 months, every night my parents go on and check to see if i have any homework and won't let me do anything till it's done"
Just as it should be. Of course, if I had my way, students could drop out at age 12, would graduate at 16, and spend the remaining two years of their adolescence in the military or civil service. That would reduce a lot of the BS that schools cram down students' throats. (And before you gripe, remember that Linus Torvalds spent 11 mandated months in the Finnish military. It didn't hurt his career, did it?)
Your post is so clueless that it's almost not worth replying to. It's not that you're ignorant; it's that you're pretending to be well-informed when you're not even close. And why some gimp who should have known better modded your post as Interesting is beyond me.
Money has always been a key to what's now considered OSI compliant software. Always. You don't think Berkeley operated all that time without a budget, do you? Free Software isn't tainted by money, and OS's released under the BSD license are no exception. The only grey area that could exist would be if the presence of investors alters the license. And there's no evidence that DARPA money is causing or will cause a deviation from their current license. None. (Read this for the data.)
And as for the assertion that OpenBSD falls under the GNU General Public License... Oy!
Considering your worries about money, I suspect you don't know what it's like to have any. Try to live without it (either yours or your parents') before you gripe about its effects.
"I think that worries me."
Next time, decide whether it does or not before you post.
"I haven't seen a way to provide Reasoning's shareholders with an equivalent (much less superior) return by making our source code Open. I think this is one of the most significant challenges that advocates of Open Source have yet to successfully address."
Sell your binaries and give away the source. That's how easy it is.
Free Software/Open Source does not equal no-cost binaries. It
never has, and it never will. If a company offers a binary, it's a gift.
If the company feels obliged to give away a binary, they've misunderstood
FS/OS. If a hacker feels that the company is obliged to provide binaries,
he's less of a hacker and more of a slacker. All a hacker has a right to is
unrestricted access to and use of the source code. Binaries are not a right;
they are a privilege.
Linux distros lose money because they give away binaries to everything,
pure and simple. Why they give them away, I don't know. I suspect it's part
ignorance, part hope that a 'free' product will find an audience that will
get hooked now and pay for support later. I suspect that RedHat has taken
this a step further -- release a basic distro that's buggy enough to
encourage users to upgrade to RHAS. SUSE has a better solution: binaries
are available four weeks after the product goes on sale. Who can't wait four
weeks for free binaries, if you can't afford the boxed set?
To be blunt, companies that are serious about turning a real profit from FS/OS
products must put their source code on their FTP server and charge for about everything else except basic documentation. If a hacker can compile OpenWhazzit all by his lonesome, let him.
He poses no threat to the profit margin. If he posts a HOWTO on the subject,
there's still no problem. He and everyone else who reads it will probably
document and/or fix the bugs they find in the same way. He may even give
away or sell binaries of FreeOpenWhazzit, but should that really matter to the bottom line? Do they think Boeing or Pepsico or Mitsubishi would pass up 1,000
copies of BlueGlove Advanced Server or in favor of Joe's Blue Garage Linux?
Odds are, even if Joe's distro represents a siginificant increase in quality,
they would still buy the name brand. And so will the average home user who
wants to use a real, inexpensive OS. That is, unless BlueGlove Advanced
Server is so bad that Joe's distro finds a niche in the marketplace, in which
case, shame on BlueGlove for selling a bad product.
That means, in the end, more people are using your product, so more people are buying your product, and more people are fixing your product at not cost to you. I'd say that's what you want your investors to hear.
And before the flames arrive, understand this: I have nothing against giving away binaries, as long as it's
understood by everyone that they are gifts, not obligations. And if
businesses want to survive, they're going to have to learn this lesson
quickly. That will mean that hackers will either have to get used to
compiling or switch to Debian.
I have the desire (but not the skill) to port as many security features from OpenBSD to Debian as possible without massive license violation. Anyone know if such a project is in the works? (And if not, why not?)
I agree with you for the most part, but the Mac solution will be painfully expensive. How hard is it to slap on your Linux of choice (say, CollegeLinux), onto a $200 workstation that's already been purchased compared to buying a new Mac for four times that?
Now, for a power-workstation, say the administrative assistant to the president, or the president him/herself, I can see that. But Macs, from the POV of cost, should relatively rare.
That's not to say that a student couldn't or shouldn't buy their own Mac. It's just that if the institution is footing the bill, they will not be able to afford the cost of replacing hardware associated with a Mac vs. a nice but cheap x86.
And don't forget: the CS majors will be zorching the native OS anyway, so you might as make it easy on everyone from the start.
Check out the March 1, 2003, news from GPF Comics: http://www.gpf-comics.com/news.html
Really short summary: either a Linux OS or a filesystem crashed. Their solution: go to FreeBSD. So, for those of us who want Linux to rule the world (for all the right reasons, of course), there's an issue here. Linux can't even compete with FreeBSD for stability in some cases, let alone the high end server market where mistakes are not allowed...
Not saying Linux can't be fixed, not saying FreeBSD is a bad thing (the only thing I don't like about them is the license). But I *am* saying that serious Linux people have to make the distinction between the Linux kernel and the many Linux-based OS's. The kernel may be the best kernel in the world, but if the OS can't deliver the performance, you have a flaky system. And as evinced by the above, people will switch, or hypothetically continue to go with Solaris, rather than watch a flaky system wreck their data.
BOB: Hi, I'm the guy who called about fixing your network for $20/hour. FRED: What's your certifications? BOB: I built my family's network, my mom's computer, my dad's -- FRED: No, no, your technical certifications. BOB: I don't have any. FRED: Why not? BOB: Well, they're a good thing to have, but I'd rather have some work experience first. FRED: Then I can't hire you. BOB: You can't hire me because I don't have work experience? FRED: No, I can't hire you because you don't have technical certifications. BOB: How do I get those? FRED: You get work experience and -- BOB: But you won't hire me so I can get work experience! FRED: Don't get angry. Holding technical certifications is the LAW. BOB: The LAW? FRED: Yes, in capital letters too. BOB: I noticed. So, I have to get techincal certification without experience? FRED: Yes, but it's easy. You take a few weeks' worth courses and pass some multiple choice tests. BOB: That's it? FRED: Yeah. BOB: So even if I'm under-qualified to work on your computers, you'll hire me as long as I'm good at passing multiple choice tests. FRED: You got it. That's how I hired my whole team. BOB: What are they like? FRED: I don't know. I keep having to send them back for more classes because they can't keep my system up. BOB: What are you running? FRED: Windows. BOB: Why Windows? Why not BSD or Linux? FRED: They don't have certifications that go with them, do they? BOB: Well, not all of them do but -- FRED: Then why should I? I've got great tech support from Microsoft, certified people -- BOB: And a crappy network. FRED: Don't get angry. Just run along and go pass a test. Then come back. BOB: I'll charge more if I have certifications, you know. FRED: Well, you get what you pay for! BOB: So, you're saying that you'd rather I come back knowing pretty much what I know now and charging you more because I have a few letters after my name? FRED: Yes. That way, when you screw up, I can cover my *ss by proving that you were certified to begin with. BOB: I get it now. Part of that LAW thing. FRED: Yes. With capitals. BOB: Right. By the way, your servers are running NetBIOS, right? FRED: Probably, why? BOB: If I have insomnia tonight, I might want to play with some old junk. Be seeing you.
Speaking as a Gen-X'er, burdened with debt from college, yadda yadda yadda...
I feel lucky to live in an era that produced and uses Apache, BIND, gcc, Linux, mySQL, PHP, sendmail, etc. When in American history has there been so many free inventions to use and be thankful for?
This is to say nothing CreativeCommons.org, Project Gutenberg, etc.
And if that doesn't convince you, look at the history of any country under the Soviet heel. We got it made here, folks.
Slashdot Mirror
As far as security, you have a good point. While the school is obligated to make their system secure, I doubt that anyone in their right minds (i.e., on Slashdot, not in the administration) believes that this system cant' be cracked. I just hope the people who run the school office aren't in charge of online security. I can't imagine they're up to speed on anti-social engineering techniques, let alone anti-script kittie tools.
As for your privacy, where your parents/guardians are concerned, you have none! You're a legal minor getting darn near free room & board. You're also a lot more niave than you can imagine, so stop whining and get over it. You'll get to pay taxes, pay rent, pay utilities, vote, buy groceries, keep a budget, and worry about your own kids' safety soon enough.
"This has been making my life a living hell for the past 2 months, every night my parents go on and check to see if i have any homework and won't let me do anything till it's done"
Just as it should be. Of course, if I had my way, students could drop out at age 12, would graduate at 16, and spend the remaining two years of their adolescence in the military or civil service. That would reduce a lot of the BS that schools cram down students' throats. (And before you gripe, remember that Linus Torvalds spent 11 mandated months in the Finnish military. It didn't hurt his career, did it?)
Money has always been a key to what's now considered OSI compliant software. Always. You don't think Berkeley operated all that time without a budget, do you? Free Software isn't tainted by money, and OS's released under the BSD license are no exception. The only grey area that could exist would be if the presence of investors alters the license. And there's no evidence that DARPA money is causing or will cause a deviation from their current license. None. (Read this for the data.)
And as for the assertion that OpenBSD falls under the GNU General Public License... Oy!
Considering your worries about money, I suspect you don't know what it's like to have any. Try to live without it (either yours or your parents') before you gripe about its effects.
"I think that worries me."
Next time, decide whether it does or not before you post.
Daniel.
Sell your binaries and give away the source. That's how easy it is.
Free Software/Open Source does not equal no-cost binaries. It never has, and it never will. If a company offers a binary, it's a gift. If the company feels obliged to give away a binary, they've misunderstood FS/OS. If a hacker feels that the company is obliged to provide binaries, he's less of a hacker and more of a slacker. All a hacker has a right to is unrestricted access to and use of the source code. Binaries are not a right; they are a privilege.
Linux distros lose money because they give away binaries to everything, pure and simple. Why they give them away, I don't know. I suspect it's part ignorance, part hope that a 'free' product will find an audience that will get hooked now and pay for support later. I suspect that RedHat has taken this a step further -- release a basic distro that's buggy enough to encourage users to upgrade to RHAS. SUSE has a better solution: binaries are available four weeks after the product goes on sale. Who can't wait four weeks for free binaries, if you can't afford the boxed set?
To be blunt, companies that are serious about turning a real profit from FS/OS products must put their source code on their FTP server and charge for about everything else except basic documentation. If a hacker can compile OpenWhazzit all by his lonesome, let him. He poses no threat to the profit margin. If he posts a HOWTO on the subject, there's still no problem. He and everyone else who reads it will probably document and/or fix the bugs they find in the same way. He may even give away or sell binaries of FreeOpenWhazzit, but should that really matter to the bottom line? Do they think Boeing or Pepsico or Mitsubishi would pass up 1,000 copies of BlueGlove Advanced Server or in favor of Joe's Blue Garage Linux? Odds are, even if Joe's distro represents a siginificant increase in quality, they would still buy the name brand. And so will the average home user who wants to use a real, inexpensive OS. That is, unless BlueGlove Advanced Server is so bad that Joe's distro finds a niche in the marketplace, in which case, shame on BlueGlove for selling a bad product.
That means, in the end, more people are using your product, so more people are buying your product, and more people are fixing your product at not cost to you. I'd say that's what you want your investors to hear.
And before the flames arrive, understand this: I have nothing against giving away binaries, as long as it's understood by everyone that they are gifts, not obligations. And if businesses want to survive, they're going to have to learn this lesson quickly. That will mean that hackers will either have to get used to compiling or switch to Debian.
Daniel.
I have the desire (but not the skill) to port as many security features from OpenBSD to Debian as possible without massive license violation. Anyone know if such a project is in the works? (And if not, why not?)
Daniel.
Daniel.
Now, for a power-workstation, say the administrative assistant to the president, or the president him/herself, I can see that. But Macs, from the POV of cost, should relatively rare.
That's not to say that a student couldn't or shouldn't buy their own Mac. It's just that if the institution is footing the bill, they will not be able to afford the cost of replacing hardware associated with a Mac vs. a nice but cheap x86.
And don't forget: the CS majors will be zorching the native OS anyway, so you might as make it easy on everyone from the start.
Daniel.
Check out the March 1, 2003, news from GPF Comics:
http://www.gpf-comics.com/news.html
Really short summary: either a Linux OS or a filesystem crashed. Their solution: go to FreeBSD. So, for those of us who want Linux to rule the world (for all the right reasons, of course), there's an issue here. Linux can't even compete with FreeBSD for stability in some cases, let alone the high end server market where mistakes are not allowed...
Not saying Linux can't be fixed, not saying FreeBSD is a bad thing (the only thing I don't like about them is the license). But I *am* saying that serious Linux people have to make the distinction between the Linux kernel and the many Linux-based OS's. The kernel may be the best kernel in the world, but if the OS can't deliver the performance, you have a flaky system. And as evinced by the above, people will switch, or hypothetically continue to go with Solaris, rather than watch a flaky system wreck their data.
Daniel.
Certification classes:
Orc = MCSE
Half-Orc = Completing MCSE
Halfling = A+ only
Human = A+, studying for RHCE
Half-Elf = A+, RHCE
Elf = Massive UN*X experience, doesn't need any stinking credentials
BOB: Hi, I'm the guy who called about fixing your network for $20/hour.
FRED: What's your certifications?
BOB: I built my family's network, my mom's computer, my dad's --
FRED: No, no, your technical certifications.
BOB: I don't have any.
FRED: Why not?
BOB: Well, they're a good thing to have, but I'd rather have some work experience first.
FRED: Then I can't hire you.
BOB: You can't hire me because I don't have work experience?
FRED: No, I can't hire you because you don't have technical certifications.
BOB: How do I get those?
FRED: You get work experience and --
BOB: But you won't hire me so I can get work experience!
FRED: Don't get angry. Holding technical certifications is the LAW.
BOB: The LAW?
FRED: Yes, in capital letters too.
BOB: I noticed. So, I have to get techincal certification without experience?
FRED: Yes, but it's easy. You take a few weeks' worth courses and pass some multiple choice tests.
BOB: That's it?
FRED: Yeah.
BOB: So even if I'm under-qualified to work on your computers, you'll hire me as long as I'm good at passing multiple choice tests.
FRED: You got it. That's how I hired my whole team.
BOB: What are they like?
FRED: I don't know. I keep having to send them back for more classes because they can't keep my system up.
BOB: What are you running?
FRED: Windows.
BOB: Why Windows? Why not BSD or Linux?
FRED: They don't have certifications that go with them, do they?
BOB: Well, not all of them do but --
FRED: Then why should I? I've got great tech support from Microsoft, certified people --
BOB: And a crappy network.
FRED: Don't get angry. Just run along and go pass a test. Then come back.
BOB: I'll charge more if I have certifications, you know.
FRED: Well, you get what you pay for!
BOB: So, you're saying that you'd rather I come back knowing pretty much what I know now and charging you more because I have a few letters after my name?
FRED: Yes. That way, when you screw up, I can cover my *ss by proving that you were certified to begin with.
BOB: I get it now. Part of that LAW thing.
FRED: Yes. With capitals.
BOB: Right. By the way, your servers are running NetBIOS, right?
FRED: Probably, why?
BOB: If I have insomnia tonight, I might want to play with some old junk. Be seeing you.
sung to the tune of "Spam":
...ad nauseum.
FUD, FUD, FUD, FUD,
FUD, FUD, FUD, FUD,
Lovely FUD, wonderful FUD!
Lovely FUD, wonderful FUD!
Daniel.
I feel lucky to live in an era that produced and uses Apache, BIND, gcc, Linux, mySQL, PHP, sendmail, etc. When in American history has there been so many free inventions to use and be thankful for?
This is to say nothing CreativeCommons.org, Project Gutenberg, etc.
And if that doesn't convince you, look at the history of any country under the Soviet heel. We got it made here, folks.
Daniel.