This is an ever present, uninformed ( even if he was just trying to help out his "chap" of a pal ), example of a person that has TOTALLY missed the point.
The point is that fine, so you friend has a "right" to have a job. Well, according to Carly Fiorina, no American has a God-Given right to have any particular job. Well, then, neither should your friend. Just because he CAN be paid lower, doesn't mean that it is ethically his right to have it. Just the same it is also not unjust that the company be penalized for doing what is ethically incorrect for the country in which it operates and provides it it's laws to protect it's interests. If that were the case, let HP move it's World Headquarters to Bangalore, and establish itself as an Indian corporation.
Do you KNOW why Microsoft, who has threatened COUNTLESS times to move either to Canada or elsewhere if it doesn't get the number of H1B's it wants, hasn't ? It's because Bill's not STUPID. He knows that if he actually were to pull such a bone-headed move, he'd lose SO much business credibility in this country that Microsoft would suffer irreparable damage. Not just in the US, but around the world. What ? You don't think that would happen ? Just ask the EU, they're already ticked off at Microsoft's tactics.
My advice to jotaelemeese....Learn English. Learn it's proper spelling ( UK or American, what you wrote adhered to neither standard ), and learn it's grammar. THEN, go ahead and formulate an argument, albeit a poor one. But then, you can be judged on solely the merit of your argument ( or lack thereof ), and not your poor communication skills as well.
Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean for that set of 20 carts to get away from me. Did that little hybrid electric car cost you that much anyway ?
Smiling that K-Mart smile.
Sorry rimby...but he's right...it's you who's "missing the point". As for reading "Atlas Shrugged", why don't you have all those copies of "The Death March" shipped off to India, so they can familiarize themselves with the sort of mentality they have to deal with in regards to American Management. That should put them in the proper frame of mind.
"Also,people will learn - in general, and long-term - to be happy with somewhat more limited material horizons (and probably enjoy life more). This is as plain as day, and already in the cards."
Get that quote from Michael Moore, did you ? Well, you can feel happy being satisfied with less than your due. Enjoy being happy with being deemed less than you merit, because this mentality assumes COMMUNISTICALLY, that while you will be receiving less, you are truly receiving an equality amount, according to what SOMEONE ELSE has decided you are worth. Get in touch with reality, communism doesn't work. It's there in China ( and Cuba ) now because the people either are too repressed to do something about it, are too uneducated to do something about it, or just don't KNOW any better ( highly unlikely in this day and age ). So...while you're happy receiving your clump of cheese from the master, most of us will be out for more than that. That doesn't make us any less happy with our lives, that doesn't make us any more harrowed, than you. Hey, as a matter of fact, we probably will have LESS to worry about, because we won't have to ever wonder if we're getting our fair share or not. We will be making SURE we are.
Sorry guy...but even some of Degreed, Certificated ( MCSD ) folks felt the pinch ( especially after 9/11 ). So think a little more about those generalizations...I've been working in the industry a lot longer than most folks posting to this thread, and when a bad economy gets ya, it gets ya.
Be glad I didn't have mod on for this....where do you get this clearly stupid idea ?
"this allows their employers to use that money elsewhere. "
What sort of corporate crack were you smoking when you thought up this brilliant neo-sophomoric drivel ?
"But for the most part Indians need these jobs much worse than we do."
That's right, and most of the countries most of our forefathers came from were in poorer shape that this country is (was) when they decided to come HERE. And work HERE, and pay taxes HERE, and consume goods HERE. Starting to "HERE" a pattern ? I don't wish anyone ill will, and I'm not disconcerned with other people's plights, but the fact is that the concept of taking from Peter to pay Paul is flawed. Paul never really got anywhere near the praise that Peter did, so exactly how is that being considerate to either? It was the broker in that transaction who truly made anything out of it.
"I'm willing to bet that as far as possessions go, the average unemployed computer geek is significanlty better off than the Indian worker who "stole" his job."
Yeah, and my parents struggled, and they had just as few possessions as I'm sure of them do/did. But you see it as a Robin Hood tactic on the part of outsourcers. As though American workers are somehow Sheriff's of Nottingham with all this wealth. Get with the program, just because the country is rich, doesn't necessarily mean that the general populace is as rich. So fine, the company wants to outsource, so just like any goods that are imported....tariff it. Hey...so fine...so they saved all this much on salaries, well...someone's got to pay. If they aren't going to pay the salaries for U.S. workers who will pay US taxes, then takes away the tax incentives that they get. Hey...the incentives are to spur enterprise WITHIN the U.S. not outside of it.
You mean like Howard Dean was doing by shouting out the names of all those states ( but can he name all the capitals ? ), and then doing his best CowBoy imi-tation ? You mean passionate like that ?
Sure...go ahead, off-topic the comment, it'll still be just as funny.
What country are you from, A$$ clown ? It won't go out of fashion until CEO's stop giving themselves the types of bonuses they are, and then crying to stockholders that the ills of the company's inability to make them MORE money than they already are, is the fault of their workforce. Never mind you that most of the bonehead moves generally dribble down from the chins of the board of directors, are shoveled by middle managers who just want to make the higher ups happy into the laps of the engineers who actually have to "make it work". That's why "work for yourself" is always going to be the bottom line answer that suits me best.
Sure that was a long run on sentence. Try saying that all in one breath and keep your blood pressure down thinking about some A$$ clown thinks that it's just a "fad"...Silly clown...."fads and fashions" are for kids.
Wrong...he did say, it was quoted on Today, and many other TV shows..and it stopped being funny about the same day we discovered "hanging chads" was just as funny... get your facts straight....
Mindless maybe for you. In which case, stick to your little script kiddie producing behaviors. It has to do with a concept in economics called "General Dynamics", which obviously has escaped your "VB is a programming language" mind. Good for you I don't have Mod points today...or you'd be sub-trolled. It never ceases to amaze me when people make statements like yours...
And for your information, the reason for most "poor quality software" doesn't come from such poor "mindless occupationed" programmers, but from the minds of blowhard architects who think of ways of selling management that 10 lbs of manure can be loaded into a 5 lb. All that, while being loaded in less time than it took to load the 10lb bag in the first place.
As for non-open source code quality.....send you questions to : beelgotz@microsoft.com
He might have some insight on that...though I doubt it very highly.
You are to be congratulated...you're probably the first. Every project I've ever heard of that was scattered like that, neither completed on time nor on budget, and with a reasonably maintainable modicum of defects to address. You must have UBER-Porkject ( spelled that way intentionally ) Mangler running your development organization.
Having purchased a Dell Laptop back in April, and going through tech support for a rickety keyboard was HORRENDOUS...I can safely say I only spoke to ONE English speaking person, and that was the salesperson.
So, sure...go ahead and troll this...just the same, you KNOW I'm right.
Exactly ! Everyone here is missing the point that LG is ONLY releasing this phone in Korea, and nowhere else. No indication that this phone will even make it to Europe or the rest of Asia( it's next likely migration area ), is even HINTED AT.
You're right....they've got to be kidding...if you look at the crop of current J2ME-based games and compare them to the C++ apps that are out there, and there's simply no comparison for speed.
Of the few ( XForge, Xen ) 3D engines out there, they're being written in ARM ( for those phones which are based on such ) assembly.
Mobile Phones ( perhaps Wireless Internet connected PDA's ) are nowhere near powered enough to handle the majority of the aspirations most J2ME game developers would "LIKE" to place upon it.
I think the problem is more financials based, than technically based. Certainly, faster processors are available in a form factor that can deployed on a cell phone. But, then you have to consider things like the extra cost of the processors, and re-engineering, heat issues ( OS CODE Issues ! ), etc, etc.
Smartphones are FAST approaching the realm where they may be viable in the respects that the article ( and some of the posters here say ) says, but we're still a fair bit a ways away from that.
Look at that...self-modifying moderation. Even if the technical content of a post is SPOT-ON, leave it to the moderation crew to always oblige someone just "bucking" for "Troll".
I hope whomever actually moderated my post took the time to READ the whole post, and glean something from it, before sliding that scroll bar down to the troll setting.
What kind of "by the side of road growth" are you smoking ? "but does make sense only for Java" ? What kind of statement is that ?
There have been naming schemes for EVERY programming language at one time or another. Obviously you've never programming in COBOL, or such, where variables and constructs are "NAMED" down to the Nth degree. Learn a little bit about what naming schemes are all about before you go sprouting whatever little quote your college professor told you "back in the day".
I've been in the business for a tad longer than you ( but not by much ), just the same, I have the impression ( not delusion ) that that sort of impression about COM is held by those who're "thrown into the fire" of using without being given adequate time to understand the technology itself, and WHY they're using it.
I commend you on implementing your own RPC, because I wouldn't wish CORBA on my enemies, much less colleagues.
You're also right, there is no "SIMPLE" RPC mechanism. And let's not get started on SOAP or XML as RPC mechanisms......
Obviously you have no business coding in C++ if you can't understand how to put together a program. Each IDE has it's own way of separating the main() and the rest of the application. If you wanted to create a hello.c to printf("Hello World\n" );, then you should've had the IDE create a console application....putz.
Slashdot Mirror
This is an ever present, uninformed ( even if he was just trying to help out his "chap" of a pal ), example of a person that has TOTALLY missed the point.
The point is that fine, so you friend has a "right" to have a job. Well, according to Carly Fiorina, no American has a God-Given right to have any particular job. Well, then, neither should your friend. Just because he CAN be paid lower, doesn't mean that it is ethically his right to have it. Just the same it is also not unjust that the company be penalized for doing what is ethically incorrect for the country in which it operates and provides it it's laws to protect it's interests. If that were the case, let HP move it's World Headquarters to Bangalore, and establish itself as an Indian corporation.
Do you KNOW why Microsoft, who has threatened COUNTLESS times to move either to Canada or elsewhere if it doesn't get the number of H1B's it wants, hasn't ? It's because Bill's not STUPID. He knows that if he actually were to pull such a bone-headed move, he'd lose SO much business credibility in this country that Microsoft would suffer irreparable damage. Not just in the US, but around the world. What ? You don't think that would happen ? Just ask the EU, they're already ticked off at Microsoft's tactics.
My advice to jotaelemeese....Learn English. Learn it's proper spelling ( UK or American, what you wrote adhered to neither standard ), and learn it's grammar. THEN, go ahead and formulate an argument, albeit a poor one. But then, you can be judged on solely the merit of your argument ( or lack thereof ), and not your poor communication skills as well.
Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean for that set of 20 carts to get away from me. Did that little hybrid electric car cost you that much anyway ? Smiling that K-Mart smile.
Sorry rimby...but he's right...it's you who's "missing the point". As for reading "Atlas Shrugged", why don't you have all those copies of "The Death March" shipped off to India, so they can familiarize themselves with the sort of mentality they have to deal with in regards to American Management. That should put them in the proper frame of mind.
"Also,people will learn - in general, and long-term - to be happy with somewhat
more limited material horizons (and probably enjoy life more). This is as
plain as day, and already in the cards."
Get that quote from Michael Moore, did you ? Well, you can feel happy being satisfied with less than your due. Enjoy being happy with being deemed less than you merit, because this mentality assumes COMMUNISTICALLY, that while you will be receiving less, you are truly receiving an equality amount, according to what SOMEONE ELSE has decided you are worth. Get in touch with reality, communism doesn't work. It's there in China ( and Cuba ) now because the people either are too repressed to do something about it, are too uneducated to do something about it, or just don't KNOW any better ( highly unlikely in this day and age ). So...while you're happy receiving your clump of cheese from the master, most of us will be out for more than that. That doesn't make us any less happy with our lives, that doesn't make us any more harrowed, than you. Hey, as a matter of fact, we probably will have LESS to worry about, because we won't have to ever wonder if we're getting our fair share or not. We will be making SURE we are.
Sorry guy...but even some of Degreed, Certificated ( MCSD ) folks felt the pinch ( especially after 9/11 ). So think a little more about those generalizations...I've been working in the industry a lot longer than most folks posting to this thread, and when a bad economy gets ya, it gets ya.
Fine...so stop buying HP products....Carly doesn't think there's a "God given right" for an American to have a Job...fine....
Then don't buy HP. Don't buy Compaq.
Be glad I didn't have mod on for this....where do you get this clearly stupid idea ?
"this allows their employers to use that money elsewhere. "
What sort of corporate crack were you smoking when you thought up this brilliant neo-sophomoric drivel ?
"But for the most part Indians need these jobs much worse than we do."
That's right, and most of the countries most of our forefathers came from were in poorer shape that this country is (was) when they decided to come HERE. And work HERE, and pay taxes HERE, and consume goods HERE. Starting to
"HERE" a pattern ? I don't wish anyone ill will, and I'm not disconcerned with other people's plights, but the fact is that the concept of taking from Peter to pay Paul is flawed. Paul never really got anywhere near the praise that Peter did, so exactly how is that being considerate to either? It was the broker in that transaction who truly made anything out of it.
"I'm willing to bet that as far as possessions go, the average unemployed computer geek is significanlty better off than the Indian worker who "stole" his job."
Yeah, and my parents struggled, and they had just as few possessions as I'm sure of them do/did. But you see it as a Robin Hood tactic on the part of outsourcers. As though American workers are somehow Sheriff's of Nottingham with all this wealth. Get with the program, just because the country is rich, doesn't necessarily mean that the general populace is as rich. So fine, the company wants to outsource, so just like any goods that are imported....tariff it. Hey...so fine...so they saved all this much on salaries, well...someone's got to pay. If they aren't going to pay the salaries for U.S. workers who will pay US taxes, then takes away the tax incentives that they get. Hey...the incentives are to spur enterprise WITHIN the U.S. not outside of it.
You mean like Howard Dean was doing by shouting out the names of all those states ( but can he name all the capitals ? ), and then doing his best CowBoy imi-tation ? You mean passionate like that ?
Sure...go ahead, off-topic the comment, it'll still be just as funny.
Where do I enlist ?!
What country are you from, A$$ clown ? It won't go out of fashion until CEO's stop giving themselves the types of bonuses they are, and then crying to stockholders that the ills of the company's inability to make them MORE money than they already are, is the fault of their workforce. Never mind you that most of the bonehead moves generally dribble down from the chins of the board of directors, are shoveled by middle managers who just want to make the higher ups happy into the laps of the engineers who actually have to "make it work". That's why "work for yourself" is always going to be the bottom line answer that suits me best. Sure that was a long run on sentence. Try saying that all in one breath and keep your blood pressure down thinking about some A$$ clown thinks that it's just a "fad"...Silly clown...."fads and fashions" are for kids.
yeah...like Salon is the bastion of informative reporting. Get real.
Anonymous Coward is a nice way of saying..Ass Clown
That's his revised statement. Don't be a moron. If he'd been THAT misquoted, then he might've sued someone.
Wrong...he did say, it was quoted on Today, and many other TV shows..and it stopped being funny about the same day we discovered "hanging chads" was just as funny... get your facts straight....
I invented the Internet......Al Gore !
Mindless maybe for you. In which case, stick to your little script kiddie producing behaviors. It has to do with a concept in economics called "General Dynamics", which obviously has escaped your "VB is a programming language" mind. Good for you I don't have Mod points today...or you'd be sub-trolled. It never ceases to amaze me when people make statements like yours...
And for your information, the reason for most "poor quality software" doesn't come from such poor "mindless occupationed" programmers, but from the minds of blowhard architects who think of ways of selling management that 10 lbs of manure can be loaded into a 5 lb. All that, while being loaded in less time than it took to load the 10lb bag in the first place.
As for non-open source code quality.....send you questions to : beelgotz@microsoft.com
He might have some insight on that...though I doubt it very highly.
You're not the first...and I'm not last who has or will.
You are to be congratulated...you're probably the first. Every project I've ever heard of that was scattered like that, neither completed on time nor on budget, and with a reasonably maintainable modicum of defects to address. You must have UBER-Porkject ( spelled that way intentionally ) Mangler running your development organization.
Having purchased a Dell Laptop back in April, and going through tech support for a rickety keyboard was HORRENDOUS...I can safely say I only spoke to ONE English speaking person, and that was the salesperson.
So, sure...go ahead and troll this...just the same, you KNOW I'm right.
Exactly ! Everyone here is missing the point that LG is ONLY releasing this phone in Korea, and nowhere else. No indication that this phone will even make it to Europe or the rest of Asia( it's next likely migration area ), is even HINTED AT.
> No drooling this time...
Grow up, and get a grip.
You're right....they've got to be kidding...if you look at the crop of current J2ME-based games and compare them to the C++ apps that are out there, and there's simply no comparison for speed.
Of the few ( XForge, Xen ) 3D engines out there, they're being written in ARM ( for those phones which are based on such ) assembly.
Mobile Phones ( perhaps Wireless Internet connected PDA's ) are nowhere near powered enough to handle the majority of the aspirations most J2ME game developers would "LIKE" to place upon it.
I think the problem is more financials based, than technically based. Certainly, faster processors are available in a form factor that can deployed on a cell phone. But, then you have to consider things like the extra cost of the processors, and re-engineering, heat issues ( OS CODE Issues ! ), etc, etc.
Smartphones are FAST approaching the realm where they may be viable in the respects that the article ( and some of the posters here say ) says, but we're still a fair bit a ways away from that.
Look at that...self-modifying moderation. Even if the technical content of a post is SPOT-ON, leave it to the moderation crew to always oblige someone just "bucking" for "Troll".
I hope whomever actually moderated my post took the time to READ the whole post, and glean something from it, before sliding that scroll bar down to the troll setting.
What kind of "by the side of road growth" are you smoking ? "but does make sense only for Java" ? What kind of statement is that ?
There have been naming schemes for EVERY programming language at one time or another. Obviously you've never programming in COBOL, or such, where variables and constructs are "NAMED" down to the Nth degree. Learn a little bit about what naming schemes are all about before you go sprouting whatever little quote your college professor told you "back in the day".
"what IDE I should've used ?" .....to build what ?
I've been in the business for a tad longer than you ( but not by much ), just the same, I have the impression ( not delusion ) that that sort of impression about COM is held by those who're "thrown into the fire" of using without being given adequate time to understand the technology itself, and WHY they're using it.
I commend you on implementing your own RPC, because I wouldn't wish CORBA on my enemies, much less colleagues.
You're also right, there is no "SIMPLE" RPC mechanism. And let's not get started on SOAP or XML as RPC mechanisms......
Obviously you have no business coding in C++ if you can't understand how to put together a program. Each IDE has it's own way of separating the main() and the rest of the application. If you wanted to create a hello.c to printf("Hello World\n" );, then you should've had the IDE create a console application....putz.