The OpenBSD Project, admittedly, made a mistake by including IPF initially. The fact that Daren Reed did NOT change the license, he clarified it. Any copyright lawyer would tell you that OpenBSD could NOT have continued using IPF (and really, should not have to begin with).
If I may, this was the original statement:
* Redistribution and use in source and binary forms are permitted
* provided that this notice is preserved and due credit is given
* to the original author and the contributors.
Notice the lack of "with or without modification", as is standard in a BSD style license. This DOES INDEED mean that modification is not permitted (wihtout prior approval of course)
I am sick and tired of the FUD that is being spread that just because "Theo didn't like it" IPF was removed, this is not the case.
OpenBSD is used by several commercial organizations who also modify it. OpenBSD has a responsibility to those organizations, and if they must get Daren's permission before they change anything that OpenBSD distributes, it is not in the best interest of those organizations or of OpenBSD.
OpenBSD has taken the high road by avoiding issues later by removing it to prevent any confusion for it's users.
First off, the m505 looks quite nice, color display, and all, but there are a couple of reasons I just got a Visor Plantium rather than a Palm.
First let me say that I had a Palm IIIx (I broke the display badly on) and I liked it. PalmOS is, IMHO, much better than WinCE/PocketPC/whatever it will be tomorrow. I needed a replacement for my Palm, and started looking around.
I want a Personal Digital Assistant, not a handheld desktop as many CE devices try to be. The only CE device that really stands out is the iPaq.
I looked hard at the Palm Vx. Its sleek, looks good, and all that asthetic nonesense:). Its got 8MB of memory and all that. Overall a very nice PDA that I would buy in a second.
I also looked at the Sony CLIE. Its a very nice little device also, but compared to Palm and Handspring's offerings, its a little too expensive for what it offers.
The Visor has the lure of the Springboard. A lot of people will argue that (1) Springboard modules are too expensive, (2) There aren't enough out there to justify the Visor over anything else, and (3) The OS isn't upgradable. The Platinum is about the size of the Palm III, is comparable to the Vx only with a little more horsepower (33Mhz Dragonball). The Visor Prism would be nice, but I just don't have a need for color right now.
The Platinum being almost identical to the Palm III* and Vx (physical dimensions aside, Im not picky there), there are only a few things that do stand out: (1) Springboard: I like the idea and I like a couple of the modules, (2) Datebook+: Anyone whos used it or seen it used would agree, it is a bit nicer than Datebook, (3) USB Cradle: Anyone whos had a Palm knows how slow serial is, (4) Faster Processor: It may not sound much to have a faster processor in a PDA, but it really makes a world of difference.
I chose a Visor Platinum because it seems to offer a bit more for me than the Palm III* and V*, even though the V* does have a better asthetic feel. I don't really mind not being able to upgrade the OS, especially since 4.0 doesn't seem to offer much more to me.
No flame war intended, just my US$0.02 on why I got a Plantium.
You seem to fail to understand that it doesn't only have to do with planets, but the way we understand physics.
It amazes me how most slashdot readers react to things without even thinking about it. The point is we DON'T know a lot about the universe, but if we assume we know a little more than we can prove, then we can put that knowledge to work and actually test it.
It amazes me how most slashdot readers react to things without even thinking about it. The point is we DON'T know a lot about the universe, but if we assume we know a little more than we can prove, then we can put that knowledge to work and actually test it.
6) Security? Well, shit, I haven't lost anything due to my browser. I turn off all the stupid stuff for public browsing. You're more likely to end up at goatse.cx by mistake than get hacked via your browser.
You really dont have a clue about security, do you?
What market is that? Sure, you Linux zealots (Read: Slashdot Audience) won't use BeOS just because you cant recompile the kernel because you, in your infinite wisdom, think that it would be better with|without a specific option.
Does this mean there is no market for BeOS? Hardly. I hate to break it to you, Linux is far from ready for the desktop. BeOS isn't a server OS (Hell, if you want a server OS, use a BSD), and it isn't meant to be. The market for BeOS is currently those who want an alternative to Windows on their home/desktop system, but can see that Linux isn't quite there yet. Small market, yes. Good market? well, thats something I can't comment on.
Be has a solid OS, and just because its not Open Source doesn't mean it sucks and that Be should drop into the infernal abyss.
Linux is a decent OS, it has a few things to learn (Which is why I use BSD:), but the thing that bugs me most about Linux are the claims by its users that it can cure (insert "world hunger", "war", "disease", whatever else here.).
I grow so tired of people like that. I'v probably started a flame war here, but I'll be gone for a week so whats it matter:)
This is yet another Netscape branded catastrophy. Remember Netscape 6 != Mozilla!!!
However, Mozilla has gotten better and better, I have been using it as my primary browser for nearly 4 months now, and Linux, Mac, Windows, and on OpenBSD.
IMHO, Konqueror has nothing on Mozilla (I was never fond of the particular style of most KDE applications anyway, so I may be biased). If you want to compare something to something, compare the latest nightly to it.
The most recent nightlys have been rock stable, they render fast, the UI problems have been cleaned up (Classic being the default theme, with Modern/2 availible and a lot better than Modern.)
Mozilla has infinite potential, and has been slowly realizing it.
Linux is not the answer to life, the universe, and everything. 42 is.
I really, really hate to see this kind of thing happen--and its happening a helluvalot more lately.
Linux zealots (and I'll call them zealots, because I know there are far more sane people in the Linux world) are always "Linux can do this, Linux can do that. I want Linux to run my toaster and my supercomputer".
I love Linux, I think it makes a great workstation OS, and low-end server OS (I'm also a BSD guy:), but I dont want to run Linux on everything that anyone ever made that was electronic.
Mac OS does a lot of things really well, graphically, as well as in the UI (the UI has good ideas, you decide about the implementation). Mac OS 9 basically sucks, yes. Mac OS X kicks outright ass, albeit thats probably the NeXT in it.
Point is, we, the Linux community, alienate ourselves from other communities by simple acts of stupidity such as this: claiming the Mac a dead platform and saying we will overtake you. Its different when its a drunk guy in an IRC channel, and a promenent open source figure on slashdot. Yes, Linux is a great platform, but I think the community needs to pinch itself and check out the real world again.
About 5 years ago, Theo left (to be nice) the NetBSD project to form OpenBSD. All of the BSDs borrow code from each other, but all also develop a lot of code themselves.
OpenBSD has more NetBSD code in it than FreeBSD, it anything, and all of that code undergoes a code -level audit before an OpenBSD release ships. This helps security and it helps stability (what better way to find bugs?)
The free software community has a lot of competition, holy wars, and other such nonsense. The best example, I think, to apply to this would be KDE and Gnome. Both are quality projects (no, I won't start a flame war here:), and both have similar goals.
There are a lot of community holy wars between the two, but I think what makes the free software community different from most commercial software interests, is that there is acctually intelligence here, because the projects are being managed by the people that understand them, not by the guy the company hired in marketing that just happens to have taken one class in high school in pascal which makes him smarter than you.
Of course, its possible I'm totally off base considering the caffiene content of my blood right now:)
This comes as no major surprise, Intel announced not too long ago that it would include support for
SDRAM with the Pentium 4 (where as the article stated, was originally going to only support Rambus). Considering AMD's push with DDR SDRAM with the Athlon, which is considerably cheaper than Rambus (duh:), and the fact that the Tbird Athlon is already, IMHO, a better processor than the Pentium 3, Intel really needs to get rid of some of it's crazy ideas and get back down to business. Comparing the Sledgehammer with the Itainium, it doesnt look all that great for Intel either (of course, Itainium has been hyped forever already, and were just now starting to learn about Hammer, so who knows).
IIRC, Rambus is still going to be used solely for Itainium--of course in 20 years when Itainium is finally ready to ship (but only to Intel's bedbuddies like Dell for the first 6 months), maybe Rambus will finally be affordable.
I really don't understand what everyone has against Mozilla. Its quite obvious that no one has bothered to try any of the nightlies since M12.
The M17 nightlies are quick, fairly stable (haven't had a crash yet on last nights), and with the Classic chrome (which is now bundled WITH it), even the UI is responsive.
Before any of you criticize Mozilla again, try the thing. It just might surprise a lot of you.
(And yes, Iv used last night's nightly on Windows, Mac, and Linux, as well as OpenBSD and Solaris.) The/. community seems to have the bad habit of jumping to conclusion without checking the facts first. M12 was buggy, yes, but don't base your opinion of the upcoming M17 on a 6 month old build.
It is well known that the license used for Apache was modeled after the BSD license, because the ASF saw the GPL as "too restrictive". In arguments between the BSD license and GPL, the Apache license is often brought to bear as a prime example of BSD-esq licensing.
What the author is saying is that the majority of successful Open Source software in the business world is under a BSD-style license, not the GPL.
(This being/., Im going to get flamed for saying I like the BSD license better, so I guess I won't;)
The/. community is mostly Linux-centric, the BSD section doesnt get a lot of readers (as opposed to other sections).
A lot of people seem to have some misconceptions about OpenBSD vs. FreeBSD vs. Linux Distros. (I don't have a lot of experience with NetBSD)
OpenBSD's primary purpose in life is to provide the most secure operating system availible. I personally think it has succeeded very well in this respect. Its the only operating system I would ever let touch my servers. OpenBSD works alright as a workstation OS, but IMHO there are better choices, depending on your needs. It works great as a router or firewall, and with the inclusion of RTMX O/S it is sure to only get better.
FreeBSD is meant to be, much like most Linux distros, an all purpose OS, which works well on workstations, as well as servers, and in many ways is, along with OpenBSD, superior to most Linux distros.
Linux distros are unique. I personally wouldn't run anything but Debian, which is partially an exception to the point Im about to make. Most Linux distros (ala RedHat) are geared more to try to be everything to everyone. This often times leaves a Linux distro very, very open by default (ala RedHat). Linux works decently as a server OS, lacking some more advanced crypto support (by default, these things can always be installed manually, or packaged), and works extremely well as a workstation OS.
OpenBSD isn't designed to be a workstation OS, as RedHat and others seem to be geared (You really shouldn't need a server running X by default). OpenBSD is designed to be secure, and -- as Theo claims -- hasn't had a remote root exploit in the DEFAULT install in three years. THATS why I choose OpenBSD for my servers. Ports really don't matter as much to me in OpenBSD as in FreeBSD, et al, because I simply don't need them. I really don't use anything other than xntp (which is now packaged) that isn't installed by default, or that I don't compile from source myself (i.e. not from a port).
The right tool for the right job, Linux doesn't need to be everything to everyone.
(I am not responsible for my bad spelling and grammer:)
Has anyone used any of the pre-4.0 snapshots on an SGI 1600SW w/ the Number Nine TTR IV? Im considering buying one, and was wondering if anyone had had any problems with it?
I have to agree that the Logitech Trackman Marble+ is an excellent replacement for the mouse. I was having wrist pains in my right wrist from the mouse, and that hasn't happened with the Marble trackball. I also have a much stronger right thumb now =]
This sounds like something that the Microsoft Merketing department wrote without looking deeply into the facts.
This kind of thing just irks me... Linux does have its problems, yes, but what I really don't like about Microsoft, is that where the Linux community is trying to fix those problems, Microsoft treats any bug or security hole as "bad PR" rather than assuring customers that it will be fixed.
I will be alright in a little while, but geeze these kinds of things irritate me.
Slashdot Mirror
No, it was not overblown.
The OpenBSD Project, admittedly, made a mistake by including IPF initially. The fact that Daren Reed did NOT change the license, he clarified it. Any copyright lawyer would tell you that OpenBSD could NOT have continued using IPF (and really, should not have to begin with).
If I may, this was the original statement:
* Redistribution and use in source and binary forms are permitted
* provided that this notice is preserved and due credit is given
* to the original author and the contributors.
Notice the lack of "with or without modification", as is standard in a BSD style license. This DOES INDEED mean that modification is not permitted (wihtout prior approval of course)
I am sick and tired of the FUD that is being spread that just because "Theo didn't like it" IPF was removed, this is not the case.
OpenBSD is used by several commercial organizations who also modify it. OpenBSD has a responsibility to those organizations, and if they must get Daren's permission before they change anything that OpenBSD distributes, it is not in the best interest of those organizations or of OpenBSD.
OpenBSD has taken the high road by avoiding issues later by removing it to prevent any confusion for it's users.
To clarify some people's missinformation...
IPF was removed from 2.9-CURRENT. This DOES NOT effect 2.9-RELEASE, from which CDs were mastered a month ago.
First off, the m505 looks quite nice, color display, and all, but there are a couple of reasons I just got a Visor Plantium rather than a Palm.
:). Its got 8MB of memory and all that. Overall a very nice PDA that I would buy in a second.
First let me say that I had a Palm IIIx (I broke the display badly on) and I liked it. PalmOS is, IMHO, much better than WinCE/PocketPC/whatever it will be tomorrow. I needed a replacement for my Palm, and started looking around.
I want a Personal Digital Assistant, not a handheld desktop as many CE devices try to be. The only CE device that really stands out is the iPaq.
I looked hard at the Palm Vx. Its sleek, looks good, and all that asthetic nonesense
I also looked at the Sony CLIE. Its a very nice little device also, but compared to Palm and Handspring's offerings, its a little too expensive for what it offers.
The Visor has the lure of the Springboard. A lot of people will argue that (1) Springboard modules are too expensive, (2) There aren't enough out there to justify the Visor over anything else, and (3) The OS isn't upgradable. The Platinum is about the size of the Palm III, is comparable to the Vx only with a little more horsepower (33Mhz Dragonball). The Visor Prism would be nice, but I just don't have a need for color right now.
The Platinum being almost identical to the Palm III* and Vx (physical dimensions aside, Im not picky there), there are only a few things that do stand out: (1) Springboard: I like the idea and I like a couple of the modules, (2) Datebook+: Anyone whos used it or seen it used would agree, it is a bit nicer than Datebook, (3) USB Cradle: Anyone whos had a Palm knows how slow serial is, (4) Faster Processor: It may not sound much to have a faster processor in a PDA, but it really makes a world of difference.
I chose a Visor Platinum because it seems to offer a bit more for me than the Palm III* and V*, even though the V* does have a better asthetic feel. I don't really mind not being able to upgrade the OS, especially since 4.0 doesn't seem to offer much more to me.
No flame war intended, just my US$0.02 on why I got a Plantium.
You seem to fail to understand that it doesn't only have to do with planets, but the way we understand physics.
It amazes me how most slashdot readers react to things without even thinking about it. The point is we DON'T know a lot about the universe, but if we assume we know a little more than we can prove, then we can put that knowledge to work and actually test it.
It amazes me how most slashdot readers react to things without even thinking about it. The point is we DON'T know a lot about the universe, but if we assume we know a little more than we can prove, then we can put that knowledge to work and actually test it.
Solaris IS NOT availible for free download. It is availible on media, at the cost of the media.
... see the box at the top?)
Get it right. Besides, BSD is just more fun than solaris.
(refrence: http://www.sun.com/solaris/downloads.html
6) Security? Well, shit, I haven't lost anything due to my browser. I turn off all the stupid stuff for public browsing. You're more likely to end up at goatse.cx by mistake than get hacked via your browser.
You really dont have a clue about security, do you?
ssshhhhhhhh.... You'll wake the zealots.
What market is that? Sure, you Linux zealots (Read: Slashdot Audience) won't use BeOS just because you cant recompile the kernel because you, in your infinite wisdom, think that it would be better with|without a specific option.
:), but the thing that bugs me most about Linux are the claims by its users that it can cure (insert "world hunger", "war", "disease", whatever else here.).
:)
Does this mean there is no market for BeOS? Hardly. I hate to break it to you, Linux is far from ready for the desktop. BeOS isn't a server OS (Hell, if you want a server OS, use a BSD), and it isn't meant to be. The market for BeOS is currently those who want an alternative to Windows on their home/desktop system, but can see that Linux isn't quite there yet. Small market, yes. Good market? well, thats something I can't comment on.
Be has a solid OS, and just because its not Open Source doesn't mean it sucks and that Be should drop into the infernal abyss.
Linux is a decent OS, it has a few things to learn (Which is why I use BSD
I grow so tired of people like that. I'v probably started a flame war here, but I'll be gone for a week so whats it matter
This is yet another Netscape branded catastrophy. Remember Netscape 6 != Mozilla!!!
However, Mozilla has gotten better and better, I have been using it as my primary browser for nearly 4 months now, and Linux, Mac, Windows, and on OpenBSD.
IMHO, Konqueror has nothing on Mozilla (I was never fond of the particular style of most KDE applications anyway, so I may be biased). If you want to compare something to something, compare the latest nightly to it.
The most recent nightlys have been rock stable, they render fast, the UI problems have been cleaned up (Classic being the default theme, with Modern/2 availible and a lot better than Modern.)
Mozilla has infinite potential, and has been slowly realizing it.
(1) RedHat isnt the only Linux based OS on the market that has/does support Sparc.
(2) Linux isnt the only kernel on the market that supports Sparc.
What about Debian? What about all the other Linux distros that run on sparc?
Both the NetBSD and OpenBSD ports to the Sparc architecture are quite good.
If you have a sparc, I would think you would be running something other than RedHat anyway.
Just my 2 cents.
Difference is that the 500Mhz G4 processor is a completely different architecture.
Are you going to tell me a 1Ghz x86 is faster than a 750Mhz Alpha?
Clock speed doesn't matter near as much when comparing architectures. You can't say "This is faster cause its 1Ghz"
Linux is not the answer to life, the universe, and everything. 42 is.
:), but I dont want to run Linux on everything that anyone ever made that was electronic.
I really, really hate to see this kind of thing happen--and its happening a helluvalot more lately.
Linux zealots (and I'll call them zealots, because I know there are far more sane people in the Linux world) are always "Linux can do this, Linux can do that. I want Linux to run my toaster and my supercomputer".
I love Linux, I think it makes a great workstation OS, and low-end server OS (I'm also a BSD guy
Mac OS does a lot of things really well, graphically, as well as in the UI (the UI has good ideas, you decide about the implementation). Mac OS 9 basically sucks, yes. Mac OS X kicks outright ass, albeit thats probably the NeXT in it.
Point is, we, the Linux community, alienate ourselves from other communities by simple acts of stupidity such as this: claiming the Mac a dead platform and saying we will overtake you. Its different when its a drunk guy in an IRC channel, and a promenent open source figure on slashdot. Yes, Linux is a great platform, but I think the community needs to pinch itself and check out the real world again.
You have your stories a bit wrong.
About 5 years ago, Theo left (to be nice) the NetBSD project to form OpenBSD. All of the BSDs borrow code from each other, but all also develop a lot of code themselves.
OpenBSD has more NetBSD code in it than FreeBSD, it anything, and all of that code undergoes a code -level audit before an OpenBSD release ships. This helps security and it helps stability (what better way to find bugs?)
The free software community has a lot of competition, holy wars, and other such nonsense. The best example, I think, to apply to this would be KDE and Gnome. Both are quality projects (no, I won't start a flame war here :), and both have similar goals.
:)
There are a lot of community holy wars between the two, but I think what makes the free software community different from most commercial software interests, is that there is acctually intelligence here, because the projects are being managed by the people that understand them, not by the guy the company hired in marketing that just happens to have taken one class in high school in pascal which makes him smarter than you.
Of course, its possible I'm totally off base considering the caffiene content of my blood right now
This comes as no major surprise, Intel announced not too long ago that it would include support for :), and the fact that the Tbird Athlon is already, IMHO, a better processor than the Pentium 3, Intel really needs to get rid of some of it's crazy ideas and get back down to business. Comparing the Sledgehammer with the Itainium, it doesnt look all that great for Intel either (of course, Itainium has been hyped forever already, and were just now starting to learn about Hammer, so who knows).
SDRAM with the Pentium 4 (where as the article stated, was originally going to only support Rambus). Considering AMD's push with DDR SDRAM with the Athlon, which is considerably cheaper than Rambus (duh
IIRC, Rambus is still going to be used solely for Itainium--of course in 20 years when Itainium is finally ready to ship (but only to Intel's bedbuddies like Dell for the first 6 months), maybe Rambus will finally be affordable.
I really don't understand what everyone has against Mozilla. Its quite obvious that no one has bothered to try any of the nightlies since M12.
/. community seems to have the bad habit of jumping to conclusion without checking the facts first. M12 was buggy, yes, but don't base your opinion of the upcoming M17 on a 6 month old build.
The M17 nightlies are quick, fairly stable (haven't had a crash yet on last nights), and with the Classic chrome (which is now bundled WITH it), even the UI is responsive.
Before any of you criticize Mozilla again, try the thing. It just might surprise a lot of you.
(And yes, Iv used last night's nightly on Windows, Mac, and Linux, as well as OpenBSD and Solaris.)
The
It is well known that the license used for Apache was modeled after the BSD license, because the ASF saw the GPL as "too restrictive". In arguments between the BSD license and GPL, the Apache license is often brought to bear as a prime example of BSD-esq licensing.
/., Im going to get flamed for saying I like the BSD license better, so I guess I won't ;)
What the author is saying is that the majority of successful Open Source software in the business world is under a BSD-style license, not the GPL.
(This being
The /. community is mostly Linux-centric, the BSD section doesnt get a lot of readers (as opposed to other sections).
:)
A lot of people seem to have some misconceptions about OpenBSD vs. FreeBSD vs. Linux Distros. (I don't have a lot of experience with NetBSD)
OpenBSD's primary purpose in life is to provide the most secure operating system availible. I personally think it has succeeded very well in this respect. Its the only operating system I would ever let touch my servers. OpenBSD works alright as a workstation OS, but IMHO there are better choices, depending on your needs. It works great as a router or firewall, and with the inclusion of RTMX O/S it is sure to only get better.
FreeBSD is meant to be, much like most Linux distros, an all purpose OS, which works well on workstations, as well as servers, and in many ways is, along with OpenBSD, superior to most Linux distros.
Linux distros are unique. I personally wouldn't run anything but Debian, which is partially an exception to the point Im about to make. Most Linux distros (ala RedHat) are geared more to try to be everything to everyone. This often times leaves a Linux distro very, very open by default (ala RedHat). Linux works decently as a server OS, lacking some more advanced crypto support (by default, these things can always be installed manually, or packaged), and works extremely well as a workstation OS.
OpenBSD isn't designed to be a workstation OS, as RedHat and others seem to be geared (You really shouldn't need a server running X by default). OpenBSD is designed to be secure, and -- as Theo claims -- hasn't had a remote root exploit in the DEFAULT install in three years. THATS why I choose OpenBSD for my servers. Ports really don't matter as much to me in OpenBSD as in FreeBSD, et al, because I simply don't need them. I really don't use anything other than xntp (which is now packaged) that isn't installed by default, or that I don't compile from source myself (i.e. not from a port).
The right tool for the right job, Linux doesn't need to be everything to everyone.
(I am not responsible for my bad spelling and grammer
Congrats to the XF86 Team for getting 4.0 out.
Has anyone used any of the pre-4.0 snapshots on an SGI 1600SW w/ the Number Nine TTR IV? Im considering buying one, and was wondering if anyone had had any problems with it?
I have to agree that the Logitech Trackman Marble+ is an excellent replacement for the mouse. I was having wrist pains in my right wrist from the mouse, and that hasn't happened with the Marble trackball. I also have a much stronger right thumb now =]
Do you see the market for Linux as a gaming platform growing substantially over the next one to two years?
What would you say to a Linux programmer who wants to help the Linux gaming situation?
This sounds like something that the Microsoft Merketing department wrote without looking deeply into the facts.
This kind of thing just irks me... Linux does have its problems, yes, but what I really don't like about Microsoft, is that where the Linux community is trying to fix those problems, Microsoft treats any bug or security hole as "bad PR" rather than assuring customers that it will be fixed.
I will be alright in a little while, but geeze these kinds of things irritate me.
Should we give them numbers to prove reliability?