Go ahead & disclose it, you're corporations, you're above the law. The govt can't tell you what to do.
Nothing will happen, I promise you. Union carbide killed 8000 people and.... nothing. nada. zip. Same goes for the Exxon Valdez & BP.
Those corps harmed and killed average people. If you so much as sneeze in the direction of DC though, they'll fuck you every which they can because our Federal politians and appointed officials are far more valuable than anyone else on the planet. If you got a problem with that presumption, they'll find a way to stick you in PMITA Federal prison, Gitmo, or just kill you.
Maybe if they put some weight behind real change it would be worth it. I think they can see that most of their future revenue is going to come from services where they host user data. But if people understand that the Third Party Doctrine, or Business Records Exemption mean that that "their" data is totally and utterly insecure, then the market for those services will be severely damaged. America doesn't have much going for it businesswise any more -- we have a weapons industry and flush government contractors -- but if the government is broke because nobody has anything but a Walmart job, those industries are dead. Technology is the government's biggest potential cash cow -- it should probably NOT shoot it in the head.
I think the tech companies might actually have "good luck with that" perspective. But they have to be willing to make the point. And then support at minimum, legislative limitations on the both Third Party Doctrine and Business Records Exception. Even more preferable, would be a Constitutional amendment defining digital content (including metadata) whereever stored (drives, wire, airwaves) as "papers" and that government access to such data is not affected by where it is stored, i.e., it remains a person's private stuff and unreachable without a warrant supported by probable cause, even if stored offsite so to speak.
P.S. At the time that was true in the United States. It was a less dangerous time. The biggest problem we faced was nuclear annihilation in less time than it takes to eat dinner. Now we face guys who put black powder in pressure cookers.
This has got to be in the running for the most insightful quip of the year. Says it all.
We don't even need an AMF anymore, not since Obama waged war in Libya without authorization from Congress. Next time a Dick Cheney type is in office, remember to send a thank you card to Obama.
Because if you don't expressly state it, they will consider it to be something different. That's exactly how we got here -- the third party doctrine from the 70s says you have no expectation of privacy in who you dial -- to overcome that, we have to expressly overcome that or nothing changes.
As to #3, if it is made a crime, punishable by a min. 10yrs in PMITA Federal prison plus forfeiture of pension etc., to introduce or vote in favor of, an unconstitutional law, I think we'd get some more well thought out laws.
Total agreement. Although I think I'd start with criminal prosecution of Clapper for perjury. It's such a slam-dunk case that if we can't even do that, nothing is possible.
As long as we're wishing, I'd like to see three constitutional amendments:
1) clarifies that "papers" as used in the 4th amendment includes digital content of any type, including metadata relating to that content.
2) eliminates the business records exception and recognizes that in the modern world of digital communications, people's private "papers" remain the property of the person who generated them no matter where they are stored or temporarily exist (they're yours whether on someone else's HD, on the wire, in the air), and that the government may acquire such information only on a showing of probable cause.
3) establishes an independent prosecutorial body whose sole focus is to root out and prosecute federal employees and elected officials who commit crimes, and in particular, crimes against the constitution. Maybe a 5 member board, 1 appointed by pres, 1 elected by congress, 1 elected by all Fed. judges (not just picked by Supreme Court), 2 elected by citizens.
To be fair, I think it was actually because he isn't Bush.
assume: make an ASS out U and ME
Nobel committe should have paid attention to one of the oldest jokes in the world before laying that peace prize on Obama by assuming he wouldn't be GWB the Second.
The only people who hate America, are those who would destroy the values outlined in the Bill of Rights. People like Snowden who act to protect the Bill of Rights, are patriots and heros. People who support the US no matter what it does, wrong or right, are mere amoral sociopathic nationalists.
The problem here is that we are wiretapping everybody to attempt to find evidence.
Honestly, I think the Feds know that collecting huge amounts of random data makes the job of finding bad people harder, not easier. But the point of the program isn't about finding bad guys, it is mainly to create a repository of information that can be accessed whenever they want to silence critics.
They don't care if they send you to prison because of your activism itself, they just want you in prison. This data collection coupled with a Federal code base so vast and vague as to be unknowable, basically ensures that everyone is a criminal and makes it trivial to suppress dissent simply by rummaging through the data store, finding some random bit of nonsense, and charging that person with 50 years worth of bullshit. Or as Snowden would say, it's "turnkey tyranny."
Juries can be very fickle. Anyone who has done enough trials warns their clients that there is an element of pure unpredictable chance in every trial, and while the odds might be good (or bad), you can always still lose (or win). Eventually, every attorney is going to win a case they should by all rights lose, and lose a case they really ought to win, based on nothing but getting really lucky, or really unlucky.
What you are talking about is the amoral sociopathic tendancies of politicians and tycoons. You can have sociopaths in any economic system, and our brand of government supported corporatism has its share, probably a generous share.
Fortunately for American, In the early 1900s the labor movement (damn commies, wobblies and all that) made some real strides -- 40 hour work week, minimum wage, overtime pay, child labor laws, etc. etc. All the things that took us from being the China of the 1800s labor wise, to being an industrial heavyweight, a burgeoning economic power, and a vision of middle class prosperity to the rest of the world in the post war years, were built on these improving work conditions. America really should have been a lot more thankful to those damn commies -- they helped make capitalism work, at least for a time. Now that they've lost any sway, and most workers want to avoid unions, and everyone supports globalization to the max, we'll soon be back into the age of robber barons.
I'm trying to understand PFS having not heard of it before -- If I understand correctly, it is a system wherein a unique public/private key pair is generated on demand using a long term key. Or to put it more simply -- a system that gives every session a new and unique set of encryption keys, thus making compromise of the private key hugely less of a bonanza. If that's the case, that sounds like a great system.
Reading your linked article demonstrates that some sites already do this... how do I make sure I'm taking advantage of it?
Concerning your sig, I think you have the wrong Superpower.
But whatever, soon Nixon's healthcare plan (AKA obamacare) will be in full swing and with everything digitized and flying around the net, the NSA will have it too. I imagine Nixon hard on just bursting through his coffin by now. Thanks Obama.
Yeah, but for the scanners we wasted money on, that was revenue and probably a lot of profit for the manufacturers. You do realize that the entire sole purpose of the Federal government, is to subsidize a select few friendly mega-corps at our expense (monetary expense, freedom expense). Napolitano did that job perfectly.
Add to that that the whole problem with gangs will be never ending so long as there is this prohibition on some drugs. Take out the profit and most gangs would dissipate. Worked for Portugal.
Legalization eliminates the need to go full on KGB, Stasi, Pol Pot, or what have you, and besides, bringing in military solutions will not solve anything. It will just exacerbate the arms race and make the violence worse. Plus, every encroachment on civil liberties we're experiencing, has its roots in the drug war. Prohibition is destroying America.
Might also want to point this article out when they says they have nothing to hide and don't care:
http://www.salon.com/writer/radley_balko/ then click on the link to his article: âoeWhy did you shoot me? I was reading a bookâ: The new warrior cop is out of control (for some reason, salon put a " in the URL which makes linking to the article directly really hard).
Sending in the SWAT team to break up home poker games for example.
More ominous, using the SWAT team to conduct warrantless searches of businesses and every customer on the property as part of "administrative searches" related to the business license. You literally can be totally innocent and get shot to death just by being in a business somebody in government has hard-on for.
People need to know that the 4th Amendment matters, and even the innocent can die from its abuse.
Slashdot Mirror
Your meme is broken.
Those corps harmed and killed average people. If you so much as sneeze in the direction of DC though, they'll fuck you every which they can because our Federal politians and appointed officials are far more valuable than anyone else on the planet. If you got a problem with that presumption, they'll find a way to stick you in PMITA Federal prison, Gitmo, or just kill you.
Maybe if they put some weight behind real change it would be worth it. I think they can see that most of their future revenue is going to come from services where they host user data. But if people understand that the Third Party Doctrine, or Business Records Exemption mean that that "their" data is totally and utterly insecure, then the market for those services will be severely damaged. America doesn't have much going for it businesswise any more -- we have a weapons industry and flush government contractors -- but if the government is broke because nobody has anything but a Walmart job, those industries are dead. Technology is the government's biggest potential cash cow -- it should probably NOT shoot it in the head.
I think the tech companies might actually have "good luck with that" perspective. But they have to be willing to make the point. And then support at minimum, legislative limitations on the both Third Party Doctrine and Business Records Exception. Even more preferable, would be a Constitutional amendment defining digital content (including metadata) whereever stored (drives, wire, airwaves) as "papers" and that government access to such data is not affected by where it is stored, i.e., it remains a person's private stuff and unreachable without a warrant supported by probable cause, even if stored offsite so to speak.
mod parent "neo-con shit-for-brains"
This has got to be in the running for the most insightful quip of the year. Says it all.
We don't even need an AMF anymore, not since Obama waged war in Libya without authorization from Congress. Next time a Dick Cheney type is in office, remember to send a thank you card to Obama.
Because if you don't expressly state it, they will consider it to be something different. That's exactly how we got here -- the third party doctrine from the 70s says you have no expectation of privacy in who you dial -- to overcome that, we have to expressly overcome that or nothing changes.
As to #3, if it is made a crime, punishable by a min. 10yrs in PMITA Federal prison plus forfeiture of pension etc., to introduce or vote in favor of, an unconstitutional law, I think we'd get some more well thought out laws.
Total agreement. Although I think I'd start with criminal prosecution of Clapper for perjury. It's such a slam-dunk case that if we can't even do that, nothing is possible.
As long as we're wishing, I'd like to see three constitutional amendments:
1) clarifies that "papers" as used in the 4th amendment includes digital content of any type, including metadata relating to that content.
2) eliminates the business records exception and recognizes that in the modern world of digital communications, people's private "papers" remain the property of the person who generated them no matter where they are stored or temporarily exist (they're yours whether on someone else's HD, on the wire, in the air), and that the government may acquire such information only on a showing of probable cause.
3) establishes an independent prosecutorial body whose sole focus is to root out and prosecute federal employees and elected officials who commit crimes, and in particular, crimes against the constitution. Maybe a 5 member board, 1 appointed by pres, 1 elected by congress, 1 elected by all Fed. judges (not just picked by Supreme Court), 2 elected by citizens.
assume: make an ASS out U and ME
Nobel committe should have paid attention to one of the oldest jokes in the world before laying that peace prize on Obama by assuming he wouldn't be GWB the Second.
The only people who hate America, are those who would destroy the values outlined in the Bill of Rights. People like Snowden who act to protect the Bill of Rights, are patriots and heros. People who support the US no matter what it does, wrong or right, are mere amoral sociopathic nationalists.
Honestly, I think the Feds know that collecting huge amounts of random data makes the job of finding bad people harder, not easier. But the point of the program isn't about finding bad guys, it is mainly to create a repository of information that can be accessed whenever they want to silence critics.
They don't care if they send you to prison because of your activism itself, they just want you in prison. This data collection coupled with a Federal code base so vast and vague as to be unknowable, basically ensures that everyone is a criminal and makes it trivial to suppress dissent simply by rummaging through the data store, finding some random bit of nonsense, and charging that person with 50 years worth of bullshit. Or as Snowden would say, it's "turnkey tyranny."
Maybe it should be "+1 conspiracy theorist"
I've had my fun at the expense of foil hatters in my day, but recently I kinda wonder.
Juries can be very fickle. Anyone who has done enough trials warns their clients that there is an element of pure unpredictable chance in every trial, and while the odds might be good (or bad), you can always still lose (or win). Eventually, every attorney is going to win a case they should by all rights lose, and lose a case they really ought to win, based on nothing but getting really lucky, or really unlucky.
Socialism is an economic system.
What you are talking about is the amoral sociopathic tendancies of politicians and tycoons. You can have sociopaths in any economic system, and our brand of government supported corporatism has its share, probably a generous share.
Fortunately for American, In the early 1900s the labor movement (damn commies, wobblies and all that) made some real strides -- 40 hour work week, minimum wage, overtime pay, child labor laws, etc. etc. All the things that took us from being the China of the 1800s labor wise, to being an industrial heavyweight, a burgeoning economic power, and a vision of middle class prosperity to the rest of the world in the post war years, were built on these improving work conditions. America really should have been a lot more thankful to those damn commies -- they helped make capitalism work, at least for a time. Now that they've lost any sway, and most workers want to avoid unions, and everyone supports globalization to the max, we'll soon be back into the age of robber barons.
I'm trying to understand PFS having not heard of it before -- If I understand correctly, it is a system wherein a unique public/private key pair is generated on demand using a long term key. Or to put it more simply -- a system that gives every session a new and unique set of encryption keys, thus making compromise of the private key hugely less of a bonanza. If that's the case, that sounds like a great system.
Reading your linked article demonstrates that some sites already do this ... how do I make sure I'm taking advantage of it?
Concerning your sig, I think you have the wrong Superpower.
But whatever, soon Nixon's healthcare plan (AKA obamacare) will be in full swing and with everything digitized and flying around the net, the NSA will have it too. I imagine Nixon hard on just bursting through his coffin by now. Thanks Obama.
Yeah, but for the scanners we wasted money on, that was revenue and probably a lot of profit for the manufacturers. You do realize that the entire sole purpose of the Federal government, is to subsidize a select few friendly mega-corps at our expense (monetary expense, freedom expense). Napolitano did that job perfectly.
The Feds probably paid for the backdoor.
Add to that that the whole problem with gangs will be never ending so long as there is this prohibition on some drugs. Take out the profit and most gangs would dissipate. Worked for Portugal.
http://vimeo.com/32110912
Legalization eliminates the need to go full on KGB, Stasi, Pol Pot, or what have you, and besides, bringing in military solutions will not solve anything. It will just exacerbate the arms race and make the violence worse. Plus, every encroachment on civil liberties we're experiencing, has its roots in the drug war. Prohibition is destroying America.
Ummm ... second link in TFS. This one here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23233573
Look at the caption under the "Post Office" picture. It reads:
also this from the body:
I suggest you try ctrl-f or cmd-f (looks like a clover on a mac keyboard) before doing the citation rant.
Tuttle or Buttle?
Why worry about bugs? The government will give you a refund!
That is exactly what they want me to think. If I succumb, they definitely win.
Might also want to point this article out when they says they have nothing to hide and don't care:
http://www.salon.com/writer/radley_balko/ then click on the link to his article: âoeWhy did you shoot me? I was reading a bookâ: The new warrior cop is out of control
(for some reason, salon put a " in the URL which makes linking to the article directly really hard).
Sending in the SWAT team to break up home poker games for example.
More ominous, using the SWAT team to conduct warrantless searches of businesses and every customer on the property as part of "administrative searches" related to the business license. You literally can be totally innocent and get shot to death just by being in a business somebody in government has hard-on for.
People need to know that the 4th Amendment matters, and even the innocent can die from its abuse.
That's exactly why I've been thinking about BSD. But then, didn't the NSA also fund Theo, and isn't his supposed to be the securest flavor?