Ever see any red and white cans of soda at the store that just say "cola"? Pretty obvious those are a knock off of cocacola, yet they are out there. Similar but not exact product, similar colored can, not the exact swirl but similar, similar size, shape, weight,etc. I wonder if this will come into "play"?
1-9 millibars, depending on altitude; average 7 mb
A little shy on the O2 department without a lot of terraforming action, pressure pretty low too, in short, no walking around without a spacesuit of some kind. It would seem possible though, given a large enough power source, you could run oxygen accumulators for inside use in your structures, etc..
taken from http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/M/Marsat mos.html
I've seen several dealers here in the US selling still pretty new but used Japanese vehicle engines, I think because in Japan they have a mileage limit to what can still be used legally on the road. Someone may correct me on that if not true about the Japanese laws. Seems like with those phones maybe you can set up an assembly line of sorts, unlock them, then ship them and sell them for cheap in the US or elsewheres? I don't know the applicable laws or anything on that though, or what the differences in frequencies are etc. Seems though if it's still a good working electronic do-dad,and still fairly new feature wise, there's some sort of a market for do-dads at discounted prices. But the displays, the OS and apps inside, does it default to japanese language with no changing it, or can it be modified easily or what? That's a concern as well. It might be more trouble and hassle than it's worth in that regard.
you are basing that assumption on two things, that the entire government list of people who could get their hands on the patches (authorised or not) are all whitehats, or that the government in general is "whitehat" in nature.
modded back up, because this is a very legitimate point and it's not flamebait. You would think the spooks would want first crack at any newly discovered exploitability. It's not like they ignore them or anything.
good idea. There's a lot more users than devs, this is a true data point. People can buy a per seat license, limited to one per person (how? not sure..somehow). That gets one vote. Stuff gets voted on, features, bugs, enhancements, directions, whatever.. No scams like releasing 10 times a year to charge more either, make it once a year *major release*, tops, and initial cost be much cheaper than windows or mac osx, say 20 clams or something, not 79.95$ or worse than that. Then as a real user, you really get an input, whether you are a dev contributing patches or not. If you are just a casual user with the free version, sure, maybe there's a que, but not enough interest to help fund, then tough luck, no vote. Something like that might work.
same site, lowend mac, after googling and getting turned onto the name from an old slashdot reference thread from years ago, oddly enough.
Daystar Genesis 2 or 4 processor, supposedly some upgrade cards made for them as well. Probably still an interesting machine in 4 processor maxed out memory mode. They claim 12 grand for the 4 processor model when it came out.
Me, still in the inventory here, a 512k, an LC, quadra (600? dang if I can remember now a nice one though, was GFs), (2) IIci, PB280, PB1400. All stick work fine, although the batts on the PBs are more or less totally gone. I keep the 1400 right here next to me in fact, rock solid get on the intarweb if needed, *securely* too. Beats the pants off of everyone else in that regard, heh.. Still can surf with iCab and listen to mp3 net streams with soundjam perfectly. 166 with 64 ram.
time period of legal mac clones, there was a 4 processor machine out there, I remember reading about it and how nutso expensive it was, but still wanting it of course. I don't recall which processor it used though, 601 maybe? If I could remember I'd go look on ebay see if any are still around. Maybe someone here remembers that machine. IIRC it was around 15 grand or so.
...MS realises they are pretty vulnerable to getting charged with violations. At least that's how I am parsing his statements. "First to file" sounds like they want to be able to legally trump prior art, and "leverage" their obvious financial advantage in filing.
I think they are running scared now. I bet they have a ton of violations inside their "licensed" code base.
Anyway, the software industry got what it lobbied for, patents. It sure wasn't the vast majority of end users out there lobbying for it.
Next step is going to be them (and a ton of other places) defending against "no warranties" so called licenses with their "valuable intellectual property" software patents. I think that's really the next big shoe to drop, even if it's off most radar screens right now. the obvious absurdity of having multi hundreds of billions a year industry with zero consumer warranties is starting to become quite a problem --and also an opportunity that some lawyers will notice, and quite a few CFOs in NON software corporations are noticing. People who get stuck with having to payout zillions, and then have to repay over and over again to "insure" it might be half way functional or secure.
And charities wouldn't be near as required as they are now if across the board people were given livable wages and benefits. You have to remember, there is no "right" to incorporation, it is a government granted privelege that at least in the original days had as part of the deal that the corporations efforts had to serve the public benefit as well as make profit (had the opportunity I mean) for the corporations owners.
Once that first part-be of public benefit- gets ignored, then they become burdensome to the population, even if they have a useful product or service.
Here's a large obvious example. Is walmart useful to a community when they can offer cheaper wares, with the tradeoff of whenever they become established someplace, better paying jobs with benefits disapper, and then the state or charity has to step in to take up the newly created slack? Like, how useful is a walmart to a person who's factory job evaporated offshore and they lost a decent middle class job with some benefits? So they can go work at the walmart instead, yep, what they can buy is cheaper, but now they make 1/2 what they were making before and have no real benefits. Is just having the cheaper stuff available all that valuable to that person then? Has the corporation actually fulfilled their incorporation obligation to be of mass public benefit, or has it merely gone to make the corporation profits?
Just using walmart as an example because they are so big and a lot of studies and anecdotals, etc, are out there now.
So far MAD has worked. but just "so far". As soon as a credible anti missile defense gets close to operational, the other parties without that tech would realise there's no "mutual" left in that equation, all they will see is "assured destruction", and will be sorely tempted to launch an all out first strike.
Why is this not used? Seems valuable for all those beta releases out there that non devs run, to help in development. If it was easier to get back *useful* information to the devs side, fixes would be faster and just perhaps we could start to see true extremely stable and clean releases.
And how does this compare to suns dtrace?
forgive my ignorance if this is apples and oranges, I'm not a coder
...a fun subthread, hope you are monitoring it being AC and all. Do you want to limit it to cellphones, or is anything fairgame? BTW, all hail fellow neogeezer! Kinda neat how you can learn to spot patterns and trends, isn't it?
Anyway, Cellphones are the real PDAs, this should be obvious by now, they are winning the portable do-dad wars handily. Small do everything combo communications devices and more, tiny full function computers basically. Most anything you can do on a desktop or laptop you can at least get close enough for govt work on the cellpda convegence device. This is the more or less the now and the close to now immediate future.
The big problems with them are tiny screens, and inputing, all the options we have now still suck, and badly, they are kludges on top of compromises.
Keypads of whatever congfig out there now are just too freaking small, onscreen touch or offscreen mash a button. They sucketh large.(and as the population ages, this will become more consumer apparent) So, the next big thing is going to have to be advanced speech recognition to control the phone, even beyond what they have now. It has to be able to run all the apps, including web browsers, etc. Opera is well ahead in this regard (as it has been with browsing in general for quite a long time and it "gets it" with cellphone browsers). It will also be predictive, have some sort of AI that learns your habits and will automagically "do stuff" that you normally do, especially if you are organized and a "sequencer". After you "train" your phone speaking to it should be minimal.
Next is the display, this is obviously harder. sound input is easy size wise,mic->in jack is pretty small or a pinhole mic, etc, no probs for speech recognition and control there. But visual display is a bother. You can't have small in physical size and big in physical screen, so-o-o-o, the screen will *have* to extend outside the physical size of the device, s-o-o, that means holographic display or something pretty darn close to that. Short of retinal implants or those dorky glasses they have now with the screen off to the side that forces you to be blind as you walk around, that's about it for doing a large enough display. It will have to expand and fill a space in front of you, and be quite large enough to be fully functional and *nice*.
Your turn (or anyone's, I love futurist projections)
Well, I am one of the people who didn't get dragged kicking and screaming into osx, because I had just bought an expensive(to me) PB and it wouldn't run (I found out later) osx. At that time I switched to linux. They lost a customer they had since the 80's.
I have thought often the past few years it would be a nice gesture of Apple to just give up and open source classic OS. I always enjoyed using it, even with some quirks to it, same as any other OS has odd quirks. It's like, what are they going to do with it? I know it would partially cut into sales of new machines and osx, but I don't think enough to matter. Would be nice to have another alternative OS out there.
I agree terchnically, that's all data and I accept it. Just would like to just say "Linux" and be done with it though, for normal day to day conversations without being contantly reminded of the finer points of nomenclature. When/if hurd is here for the masses, swell, we can call it --uh--"hurd". Just like MS products, no one really drags it out in conversational casual speech, we don't say "microsoft windows xpsp2 operating system" every time referring to it.
This is correct, it's my main point really. That's why I think just a ton of distros should cease and desist independent overlapping redundant development and just come up with a large standized layout, package management, desktop environment, etc thing, then get some action going with the large hardware vendors. They can say "look here, we *now* got a serious large mainstream product now, you might be interested to offer it preinstalled" and etc. And I don't really mean just pick one single distro out now, I mean several of the larger ones to go back to their community roots and really work as a big team. massive merging, consolidation, whatever you want to call it.
It would take quite a lot of community and established software "business" cooperation, something I don't see happening very soon, if ever.
The point might be moot anyway, what with software patents going global pretty soon. The world big bucks biz community really like their IP ownership angles to everything.
ya, I know the analogy wasn't perfect, just shooting for close enough is all. It's hard to keep your data private and not get abused. You have to stand in front of some poor clerk just following orders and say NO I'm not giving you my SS, etc. I've done it a bunch, sometimes it works and sometimes they just say tough noogies, no SS, no service.And it's because I had some bozo long time ago use my name and SS (I think they snagged it some place I worked at, never did find out) to turn some utilities on then skip out. Months later MY gas utility got threatened with turn off, and try as I might I couldn't convince them that it wasn't me lived at such and such an address, that I never contracted for their service, etc. Had proof up the ying yang too, didn't matter to them. They just kept rote repeating "it's on de computar, you musta done did it". It was winter and I got down to one day (or so) away from having my natgas shutoff, and not wanting to freeze out I just paid that bill that wasn't mine. Still fries my grits. (Atlanta Gaslight, looking at YOU, thanks for nuthin)
This data crap snagging peoples info or peoples info being mal-used is going to result in some pretty weird governmental laws. Not sure if they will be good or bad, just see it coming now, Senator Leahy in particular got a serious woody over it now. And because it hit those lawyers at lexis nexus, after already hitting all those dot gov types at choicepoint,well, I bet they lobby heavy for it.
tinfoil hat---maybe it was the plan all along, a heglian dialectic deal to get some draconian laws passed---/tinfoil hat
...people willingly give away their personal property, their data, their "IP", then these other companies own it. If people just insisted that THEIR data was THEIR property and took care of it with that sort of mindset backed op with some rational laws, then this wouldn't happen, and these companies with the data warehouses wouldn't even exist like they do now.
Most people don't think that way, but people who start corporations DO think that way, they recognize valuable property when they see it, and make billions off of millions of people voluntarily giving away their property to them.
If it wasn't stolen from you directly, it's sure not your property anymore. If you donate your old TV to the thriftstore and they get broken into and that TV is stolen, well, "your" TV didn't get stolen, their TV got stolen. If you want to own and keep possession of your TV, well, don't give it away in the first place then. Simple concept, just apply it to your data. It's similar enough for conversational purposes anyway. "IP" ownership is bigtime in business, there's zero reason everyone's personal data "IP" shouldn't be theirs in total.
So people can't really say "their" stuff got stolen, some big companies stuff got stolen, they gave up their rights to full and complete ownership a long time ago. they already got "social engineered" out of ownership, just they don't realise it, or just don't care enough to think it through. Now that same data property down the pike got social engineered again, oh well, guess the original owner didn't care enough to hang on to it.
but, but..we can't live in society without giving our property away! Yep, that's the point, much less than.0001% people ever even tried one time to keep their data to themselves and to insist to government that this should be so. They never gave a care, to busy with entertainments or whatever to even lift a phone to make a call to a congress critter, or to say NO to some company "asking" for data they don't need really for a business transaction. Mass conditioning that it's socially cool to get ripped off. Shazzam, the world is full of thieves, maybe more people will stop and think about who they give their property to and why they give it away for what purposes now. Maybe it's a better idea to just retain ownership? One law would do it, too, your data is yours, it shouldn't be necessary to transfer ownership of your data just to do business someplace.
I have no doubt it will get there-and in some form. Those are the two critical questions and what the timeline of my mini combo rant and beg session is about. When and in what form, and tangentially, who will actually control it and what level of acceptance will actually arise? What's the goal, what is really the target?
The 'community", the people like you and me all all the others who really *care* about it, can present a more unified front to offer the hardware guys and the business guys and this "the masses" guy to work with, or, we will dither and procrastinate and fragment even more, and one morning wake up and these decision and designs and forms will have been made for us-by the big guys, the hardware vendors and the small handful of big companies seriously working on linux now, and, sad to say, by legislative action as well. It's just reality or as the old expression goes "nothing personal, it's just business".
I just see it as a critical crossroads at this time frame. I didn't see it two years ago or even last year,(the quality wasn't there but it is right now) but I see this timeline critical peak happening now. I so much see it it's simply overwhelming.
It's my hobby, I don't software code but I read and analyse all the micro events that add up to the macro overview, and do projections, extrapolations, and I've been pretty good at it over the years with the subjects I have picked. Not perfect but good if I can toot my own horn just a little. It's make it or break it time for all the thousands of dedicated devs and enthusiasts out there, near as I can read the economic and legal and political tea leaves.
Slashdot Mirror
Ever see any red and white cans of soda at the store that just say "cola"? Pretty obvious those are a knock off of cocacola, yet they are out there. Similar but not exact product, similar colored can, not the exact swirl but similar, similar size, shape, weight,etc. I wonder if this will come into "play"?
that's another good point, and probably more true than not most of the time with various exploits.
95.3% carbon dioxide (CO2),
2.7% nitrogen (N2),
1.6% argon (Ar),
0.15% oxygen (O2),
0.03% water vapor (H2O)
pressure
1-9 millibars, depending on altitude; average 7 mb
A little shy on the O2 department without a lot of terraforming action, pressure pretty low too, in short, no walking around without a spacesuit of some kind. It would seem possible though, given a large enough power source, you could run oxygen accumulators for inside use in your structures, etc..
taken from http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/M/Marsa
I've seen several dealers here in the US selling still pretty new but used Japanese vehicle engines, I think because in Japan they have a mileage limit to what can still be used legally on the road. Someone may correct me on that if not true about the Japanese laws. Seems like with those phones maybe you can set up an assembly line of sorts, unlock them, then ship them and sell them for cheap in the US or elsewheres? I don't know the applicable laws or anything on that though, or what the differences in frequencies are etc. Seems though if it's still a good working electronic do-dad,and still fairly new feature wise, there's some sort of a market for do-dads at discounted prices. But the displays, the OS and apps inside, does it default to japanese language with no changing it, or can it be modified easily or what? That's a concern as well. It might be more trouble and hassle than it's worth in that regard.
you are basing that assumption on two things, that the entire government list of people who could get their hands on the patches (authorised or not) are all whitehats, or that the government in general is "whitehat" in nature.
modded back up, because this is a very legitimate point and it's not flamebait. You would think the spooks would want first crack at any newly discovered exploitability. It's not like they ignore them or anything.
good idea. There's a lot more users than devs, this is a true data point. People can buy a per seat license, limited to one per person (how? not sure..somehow). That gets one vote. Stuff gets voted on, features, bugs, enhancements, directions, whatever.. No scams like releasing 10 times a year to charge more either, make it once a year *major release*, tops, and initial cost be much cheaper than windows or mac osx, say 20 clams or something, not 79.95$ or worse than that. Then as a real user, you really get an input, whether you are a dev contributing patches or not. If you are just a casual user with the free version, sure, maybe there's a que, but not enough interest to help fund, then tough luck, no vote. Something like that might work.
same site, lowend mac, after googling and getting turned onto the name from an old slashdot reference thread from years ago, oddly enough.
Daystar Genesis 2 or 4 processor, supposedly some upgrade cards made for them as well. Probably still an interesting machine in 4 processor maxed out memory mode. They claim 12 grand for the 4 processor model when it came out.
Me, still in the inventory here, a 512k, an LC, quadra (600? dang if I can remember now a nice one though, was GFs), (2) IIci, PB280, PB1400. All stick work fine, although the batts on the PBs are more or less totally gone. I keep the 1400 right here next to me in fact, rock solid get on the intarweb if needed, *securely* too. Beats the pants off of everyone else in that regard, heh.. Still can surf with iCab and listen to mp3 net streams with soundjam perfectly. 166 with 64 ram.
time period of legal mac clones, there was a 4 processor machine out there, I remember reading about it and how nutso expensive it was, but still wanting it of course. I don't recall which processor it used though, 601 maybe? If I could remember I'd go look on ebay see if any are still around. Maybe someone here remembers that machine. IIRC it was around 15 grand or so.
They have a cooler name, easier to say and remember for consumers. The consumer market is weird that way.
that's my SWAG on it
...MS realises they are pretty vulnerable to getting charged with violations. At least that's how I am parsing his statements. "First to file" sounds like they want to be able to legally trump prior art, and "leverage" their obvious financial advantage in filing.
I think they are running scared now. I bet they have a ton of violations inside their "licensed" code base.
Anyway, the software industry got what it lobbied for, patents. It sure wasn't the vast majority of end users out there lobbying for it.
Next step is going to be them (and a ton of other places) defending against "no warranties" so called licenses with their "valuable intellectual property" software patents. I think that's really the next big shoe to drop, even if it's off most radar screens right now. the obvious absurdity of having multi hundreds of billions a year industry with zero consumer warranties is starting to become quite a problem --and also an opportunity that some lawyers will notice, and quite a few CFOs in NON software corporations are noticing. People who get stuck with having to payout zillions, and then have to repay over and over again to "insure" it might be half way functional or secure.
And charities wouldn't be near as required as they are now if across the board people were given livable wages and benefits. You have to remember, there is no "right" to incorporation, it is a government granted privelege that at least in the original days had as part of the deal that the corporations efforts had to serve the public benefit as well as make profit (had the opportunity I mean) for the corporations owners.
Once that first part-be of public benefit- gets ignored, then they become burdensome to the population, even if they have a useful product or service.
Here's a large obvious example. Is walmart useful to a community when they can offer cheaper wares, with the tradeoff of whenever they become established someplace, better paying jobs with benefits disapper, and then the state or charity has to step in to take up the newly created slack? Like, how useful is a walmart to a person who's factory job evaporated offshore and they lost a decent middle class job with some benefits? So they can go work at the walmart instead, yep, what they can buy is cheaper, but now they make 1/2 what they were making before and have no real benefits. Is just having the cheaper stuff available all that valuable to that person then? Has the corporation actually fulfilled their incorporation obligation to be of mass public benefit, or has it merely gone to make the corporation profits?
Just using walmart as an example because they are so big and a lot of studies and anecdotals, etc, are out there now.
So far MAD has worked. but just "so far". As soon as a credible anti missile defense gets close to operational, the other parties without that tech would realise there's no "mutual" left in that equation, all they will see is "assured destruction", and will be sorely tempted to launch an all out first strike.
Why is this not used? Seems valuable for all those beta releases out there that non devs run, to help in development. If it was easier to get back *useful* information to the devs side, fixes would be faster and just perhaps we could start to see true extremely stable and clean releases.
And how does this compare to suns dtrace?
forgive my ignorance if this is apples and oranges, I'm not a coder
...a fun subthread, hope you are monitoring it being AC and all. Do you want to limit it to cellphones, or is anything fairgame? BTW, all hail fellow neogeezer! Kinda neat how you can learn to spot patterns and trends, isn't it?
Anyway, Cellphones are the real PDAs, this should be obvious by now, they are winning the portable do-dad wars handily. Small do everything combo communications devices and more, tiny full function computers basically. Most anything you can do on a desktop or laptop you can at least get close enough for govt work on the cellpda convegence device. This is the more or less the now and the close to now immediate future.
The big problems with them are tiny screens, and inputing, all the options we have now still suck, and badly, they are kludges on top of compromises.
Keypads of whatever congfig out there now are just too freaking small, onscreen touch or offscreen mash a button. They sucketh large.(and as the population ages, this will become more consumer apparent) So, the next big thing is going to have to be advanced speech recognition to control the phone, even beyond what they have now. It has to be able to run all the apps, including web browsers, etc. Opera is well ahead in this regard (as it has been with browsing in general for quite a long time and it "gets it" with cellphone browsers). It will also be predictive, have some sort of AI that learns your habits and will automagically "do stuff" that you normally do, especially if you are organized and a "sequencer". After you "train" your phone speaking to it should be minimal.
Next is the display, this is obviously harder. sound input is easy size wise,mic->in jack is pretty small or a pinhole mic, etc, no probs for speech recognition and control there. But visual display is a bother. You can't have small in physical size and big in physical screen, so-o-o-o, the screen will *have* to extend outside the physical size of the device, s-o-o, that means holographic display or something pretty darn close to that. Short of retinal implants or those dorky glasses they have now with the screen off to the side that forces you to be blind as you walk around, that's about it for doing a large enough display. It will have to expand and fill a space in front of you, and be quite large enough to be fully functional and *nice*.
Your turn (or anyone's, I love futurist projections)
think again
Well, I am one of the people who didn't get dragged kicking and screaming into osx, because I had just bought an expensive(to me) PB and it wouldn't run (I found out later) osx. At that time I switched to linux. They lost a customer they had since the 80's.
I have thought often the past few years it would be a nice gesture of Apple to just give up and open source classic OS. I always enjoyed using it, even with some quirks to it, same as any other OS has odd quirks. It's like, what are they going to do with it? I know it would partially cut into sales of new machines and osx, but I don't think enough to matter. Would be nice to have another alternative OS out there.
I agree terchnically, that's all data and I accept it. Just would like to just say "Linux" and be done with it though, for normal day to day conversations without being contantly reminded of the finer points of nomenclature. When/if hurd is here for the masses, swell, we can call it --uh--"hurd". Just like MS products, no one really drags it out in conversational casual speech, we don't say "microsoft windows xpsp2 operating system" every time referring to it.
This is correct, it's my main point really. That's why I think just a ton of distros should cease and desist independent overlapping redundant development and just come up with a large standized layout, package management, desktop environment, etc thing, then get some action going with the large hardware vendors. They can say "look here, we *now* got a serious large mainstream product now, you might be interested to offer it preinstalled" and etc. And I don't really mean just pick one single distro out now, I mean several of the larger ones to go back to their community roots and really work as a big team. massive merging, consolidation, whatever you want to call it.
It would take quite a lot of community and established software "business" cooperation, something I don't see happening very soon, if ever.
The point might be moot anyway, what with software patents going global pretty soon. The world big bucks biz community really like their IP ownership angles to everything.
ya, I know the analogy wasn't perfect, just shooting for close enough is all. It's hard to keep your data private and not get abused. You have to stand in front of some poor clerk just following orders and say NO I'm not giving you my SS, etc. I've done it a bunch, sometimes it works and sometimes they just say tough noogies, no SS, no service.And it's because I had some bozo long time ago use my name and SS (I think they snagged it some place I worked at, never did find out) to turn some utilities on then skip out. Months later MY gas utility got threatened with turn off, and try as I might I couldn't convince them that it wasn't me lived at such and such an address, that I never contracted for their service, etc. Had proof up the ying yang too, didn't matter to them. They just kept rote repeating "it's on de computar, you musta done did it". It was winter and I got down to one day (or so) away from having my natgas shutoff, and not wanting to freeze out I just paid that bill that wasn't mine. Still fries my grits. (Atlanta Gaslight, looking at YOU, thanks for nuthin)
This data crap snagging peoples info or peoples info being mal-used is going to result in some pretty weird governmental laws. Not sure if they will be good or bad, just see it coming now, Senator Leahy in particular got a serious woody over it now. And because it hit those lawyers at lexis nexus, after already hitting all those dot gov types at choicepoint,well, I bet they lobby heavy for it.
tinfoil hat---maybe it was the plan all along, a heglian dialectic deal to get some draconian laws passed---/tinfoil hat
the iCab guy isn't doing a classic OS version anymore?
...google "amdocs", the company. Pretty interesting stuff really.
...people willingly give away their personal property, their data, their "IP", then these other companies own it. If people just insisted that THEIR data was THEIR property and took care of it with that sort of mindset backed op with some rational laws, then this wouldn't happen, and these companies with the data warehouses wouldn't even exist like they do now.
.0001% people ever even tried one time to keep their data to themselves and to insist to government that this should be so. They never gave a care, to busy with entertainments or whatever to even lift a phone to make a call to a congress critter, or to say NO to some company "asking" for data they don't need really for a business transaction. Mass conditioning that it's socially cool to get ripped off. Shazzam, the world is full of thieves, maybe more people will stop and think about who they give their property to and why they give it away for what purposes now. Maybe it's a better idea to just retain ownership? One law would do it, too, your data is yours, it shouldn't be necessary to transfer ownership of your data just to do business someplace.
Most people don't think that way, but people who start corporations DO think that way, they recognize valuable property when they see it, and make billions off of millions of people voluntarily giving away their property to them.
If it wasn't stolen from you directly, it's sure not your property anymore. If you donate your old TV to the thriftstore and they get broken into and that TV is stolen, well, "your" TV didn't get stolen, their TV got stolen. If you want to own and keep possession of your TV, well, don't give it away in the first place then. Simple concept, just apply it to your data. It's similar enough for conversational purposes anyway. "IP" ownership is bigtime in business, there's zero reason everyone's personal data "IP" shouldn't be theirs in total.
So people can't really say "their" stuff got stolen, some big companies stuff got stolen, they gave up their rights to full and complete ownership a long time ago. they already got "social engineered" out of ownership, just they don't realise it, or just don't care enough to think it through. Now that same data property down the pike got social engineered again, oh well, guess the original owner didn't care enough to hang on to it.
but, but..we can't live in society without giving our property away! Yep, that's the point, much less than
I have no doubt it will get there-and in some form. Those are the two critical questions and what the timeline of my mini combo rant and beg session is about. When and in what form, and tangentially, who will actually control it and what level of acceptance will actually arise? What's the goal, what is really the target?
The 'community", the people like you and me all all the others who really *care* about it, can present a more unified front to offer the hardware guys and the business guys and this "the masses" guy to work with, or, we will dither and procrastinate and fragment even more, and one morning wake up and these decision and designs and forms will have been made for us-by the big guys, the hardware vendors and the small handful of big companies seriously working on linux now, and, sad to say, by legislative action as well. It's just reality or as the old expression goes "nothing personal, it's just business".
I just see it as a critical crossroads at this time frame. I didn't see it two years ago or even last year,(the quality wasn't there but it is right now) but I see this timeline critical peak happening now. I so much see it it's simply overwhelming.
It's my hobby, I don't software code but I read and analyse all the micro events that add up to the macro overview, and do projections, extrapolations, and I've been pretty good at it over the years with the subjects I have picked. Not perfect but good if I can toot my own horn just a little. It's make it or break it time for all the thousands of dedicated devs and enthusiasts out there, near as I can read the economic and legal and political tea leaves.