People. The users. The project owners. Us. Other web developers on e-maillists.
We aren't currently using an automated tool to test the front-end flow, because we haven't found any good, easy-to-use, and cheap tools that support a modern version of DOM/JavaScript usage. If you know of something that you like and works, I'd love to know about it. I've tried httpUnit, but had trouble setting it up and it didn't support all the DOM methods we were using at the time.
I thought FUD you referred to was the worry that IronPort would corrupt Spamcop. I haven't see any sign that other people found the quote confusing, but clearly you did, so there must be others.
This is slashdot, you should know this happens. A lot of people don't read articles. A lot of people don't read official newsgroup postings. A lot of people just read the blurb and think they get it. I would think the moderation on the posts might be one key sign that I'm not the only one who thinks there might be more clarifying details to add to the submitter's post.
With all due respect, if you get it, great, move on. If it happens to add clarity for someone else, let it be.
I did and I have to stop doing that.
That would definitely be more civil and appreciated, but again, this is slashdot, so unfortunately expected.
Your first post was so short on details that it was easy for someone like me to read lots more into it than you intended.
My exact reasoning for my original post in this thread. Ironic you don't see that. But again, this is slashdot; Short posts are common, as is irony.
Too me, this is a flamewar..
That's too bad, I see no reason for it. If it is, then I'm done.
I still don't see how you found the quote so confusing you had to argue against it.
I wasn't arguing for or against the submitter's post or the quote, either way. I was just trying to bring a little clarity to the submitter's comments in that particular aspect so a whole bunch of FUD didn't spring up that 'Julian Haight has made negative remarks against SpamCop!!!!'
I still think it was very clear that his comment refered to the company that bought spamcop.
Well, a comment against the whole company would mean he made the comment against his own devices (SpamCop). Rather, I think the article plainly says it was attributed to the Bonded Sender product/concept. That's only what I was trying to point out, not nullify the whole post..
Regardless, in response to:
I had no trouble understanding that two conflicting products were owned by the same company. A company and it's products are one entity. If you don't see a problem, I'm sorry, because I do.
That I do find interesting, and am watching carefully. I think you are more concerned than I am at the moment - which is fine, nothing wrong with that, but I have some concern too. If Mr Haight wasn't there still keeping watch over SpamCop and making himself available for direct communication, I would be a lot more concerned and might consider canceling my subscription. My post was not to cancel out all concern, just to help clarify one tiny portion of the submitter's post.
You could be the story poster for all I know.:-) It's not like ACs are the only ones who hide. I'm just too lazy to use multiple accounts.
Yeah, it's possible. *g* Basically you came on pretty strong in your first post, so I was just pointing out if we want to get all Conspiracy Theory we could find them in a lot of places.;) Which could of course mean I'm actually the AC as well, replying to my posts to make it appear I'm socially interacting on./ so I can brag to friends and family..
I think in the big picture you and I are more on the same page.. I still have concern about the long-term aspects of IronPort/SpamCop, same as you. So I think we're on the same side of this discussion..
Glad this didn't turn into a flame war. Best regards!
P.S. My apologies if there are errors in this post, I'm having a heck of a time rendering a preview in Mozilla..
IronPort isn't "buying", they bought SpamCop back in June.
Bonded Sender is a product totally distinct from SpamCop.
The poster's comments (which could be you AC), doesn't make it clear that Mr. Haight's comments are specifically and only about the separate Bonded Sender concept/product. The comment was not about SpamCop.
That's why I posted. The comment isn't directed towards SpamCop. Julian Haight still runs it. The registry is still fed by regular users. I'm try to help clear up the FUD towards SpamCop being lumped in with Bonded Sender, like you're trying to do in your reply to my post.
But Haight, who will stay with company, says he is concerned that the Bonded Sender program is too lenient. "I am not sure all its standards are tough enough," he said.
Makes sense to me. Kind of like playing paintpall to release some adrenaline, then having everyone afterwards getting in an angry, shouting cussing match, or chilling - with friendly laughing about the good time they had and eating some good grub.
Makes a difference to me as to how much time I would spend in a place if it had one of those two types of atmosphere.
Committee On Ethical Business Practice - oops! 404
Ethical Business Practice Guidelines - oops! 404
Mailing List Practices - oops! 404
Online Marketing Privacy Principles - oops! 404
DMA Health Data Marketing Guidelines - oops! 404
FAQ on DMA Health Data Marketing Guidelines - oops! 404
Screening Advertisements: A Guide for the Media - oops! 404
Wow, as much as they are concerned with the privacy of the general public and practicing ethical business, those links *must* have become 404 just as I went to go look at them - cause surely they would have noticed earlier..
Ha! Great - now schools need to be paying attention for those At Risk (tm) kids who don't fit in and show signs of wearing lighter colored clothing, jackets only when they're cold, making pleasent eye contact, and prone to random outbursts of "Thank you.."
Of course someone will probably try to hit up some grant money for this..
In fact, the original text of the Bible was not written in Latin. The New Testament was written in Koine Greek, which was the language of the common people during that period and place in time.
The Dark Ages were a very bad thing.. but it was the antithesis of the spirit in which the original text was created, and a huge perversion of the teachings of the New Testament.
Your suspicion is right - usually the components are as follows:
DHTML = (XHTML || HTML) + (DOM || JS) + CSS
Then the newb goes out looking for a DHTML language reference but guess what: The language doesn't exist.
An excellent point, which shows the problem in not only trying to learn 'DHTML', but dismissing learning other basic concepts (such as DOM) thinking it's something other than DHTML.
Judging by the very general definition at Webopedia, for one to say "I'm learning DHTML" doesn't mean very much..
Slashdot Mirror
We test using the following on web apps:
We aren't currently using an automated tool to test the front-end flow, because we haven't found any good, easy-to-use, and cheap tools that support a modern version of DOM/JavaScript usage. If you know of something that you like and works, I'd love to know about it. I've tried httpUnit, but had trouble setting it up and it didn't support all the DOM methods we were using at the time.
Cool - I am too.. :)
I wasn't arguing for or against the submitter's post or the quote, either way. I was just trying to bring a little clarity to the submitter's comments in that particular aspect so a whole bunch of FUD didn't spring up that 'Julian Haight has made negative remarks against SpamCop!!!!'
Well, a comment against the whole company would mean he made the comment against his own devices (SpamCop). Rather, I think the article plainly says it was attributed to the Bonded Sender product/concept. That's only what I was trying to point out, not nullify the whole post..
Regardless, in response to:
That I do find interesting, and am watching carefully. I think you are more concerned than I am at the moment - which is fine, nothing wrong with that, but I have some concern too. If Mr Haight wasn't there still keeping watch over SpamCop and making himself available for direct communication, I would be a lot more concerned and might consider canceling my subscription. My post was not to cancel out all concern, just to help clarify one tiny portion of the submitter's post.
Yeah, it's possible. *g* Basically you came on pretty strong in your first post, so I was just pointing out if we want to get all Conspiracy Theory we could find them in a lot of places. ;) Which could of course mean I'm actually the AC as well, replying to my posts to make it appear I'm socially interacting on ./ so I can brag to friends and family..
I think in the big picture you and I are more on the same page.. I still have concern about the long-term aspects of IronPort/SpamCop, same as you. So I think we're on the same side of this discussion..
Glad this didn't turn into a flame war. Best regards!
P.S. My apologies if there are errors in this post, I'm having a heck of a time rendering a preview in Mozilla..IronPort isn't "buying", they bought SpamCop back in June.
Bonded Sender is a product totally distinct from SpamCop.
The poster's comments (which could be you AC), doesn't make it clear that Mr. Haight's comments are specifically and only about the separate Bonded Sender concept/product. The comment was not about SpamCop.
That's why I posted. The comment isn't directed towards SpamCop. Julian Haight still runs it. The registry is still fed by regular users. I'm try to help clear up the FUD towards SpamCop being lumped in with Bonded Sender, like you're trying to do in your reply to my post.
His comment was about Bonded Sender, not SpamCop.
Makes sense to me. Kind of like playing paintpall to release some adrenaline, then having everyone afterwards getting in an angry, shouting cussing match, or chilling - with friendly laughing about the good time they had and eating some good grub.
Makes a difference to me as to how much time I would spend in a place if it had one of those two types of atmosphere.
Irregardless of my personal opinion on the issue, doesn't this have a *little* bias in it?
The guy makes money off of violent games - why would he cast his business in a negative light?
This is like asking Microsoft/RedHat/Whomever PR if computers are generally bad for people.
Well, lets look at their web site, specifically the DMA Guidlines on business ethics:
Wow, as much as they are concerned with the privacy of the general public and practicing ethical business, those links *must* have become 404 just as I went to go look at them - cause surely they would have noticed earlier..
Ha! Great - now schools need to be paying attention for those At Risk (tm) kids who don't fit in and show signs of wearing lighter colored clothing, jackets only when they're cold, making pleasent eye contact, and prone to random outbursts of "Thank you.."
Of course someone will probably try to hit up some grant money for this..
In fact, the original text of the Bible was not written in Latin. The New Testament was written in Koine Greek, which was the language of the common people during that period and place in time.
The Dark Ages were a very bad thing.. but it was the antithesis of the spirit in which the original text was created, and a huge perversion of the teachings of the New Testament.
Your suspicion is right - usually the components are as follows:
DHTML = (XHTML || HTML) + (DOM || JS) + CSS
An excellent point, which shows the problem in not only trying to learn 'DHTML', but dismissing learning other basic concepts (such as DOM) thinking it's something other than DHTML.
Judging by the very general definition at Webopedia, for one to say "I'm learning DHTML" doesn't mean very much..