> Our secretaries learnt it in a week. Wow, that's a fuckload of wasted time. Why would any business ever want to use Windows 8, knowing it will cost them so much?
Exactly. I've seen people go for 3 hour courses on Win 2000 and XP, starting with "this is a mouse". Obviously Windows 8 is much more difficult/confusing to use than previous versions if your secretaries needed a week.
Mate and XFCE on Linux both look so similar to Win XP and 7 that someone used to Windows (Such as my father, in his 70's) can get used to either of them in minutes. Not even a few hours. So for a normal Windows user Linux is much easier to convert to than Windows 8. Admins have some learning to do though:-).
lol.. why the fuck would anyone copy an OS that nobody uses?
ROLFMHO You're showing your ignorance. Lots of people use desktop Linux, including development teams where I work, which has MS Gold Partner banners draped around. They only had to get one copy of Linux of course, so as usual lots of people are counted as one. In mobile, guess what kernel is used for Android? Best you stop now while you still have some credibility.
Two months to learn a UI? Our secretaries learnt it in a week. Nice lie though.
No lie. They were productive in an hour, but much slower than on Win 7 for two months. One of them told me it took three months to get fully used to it. I guess to unlearn what they knew from previous versions, and to stop getting confused about what corner does what, and all the differences between metro and their smartphone. So they hadn't fully learned it for three months. I hope that's clear.
Notice I haven't had to swear yet. I'll bet that really annoys you:-)
I did not write any of the parent posts. But I happen to agree with the parent of yours.
Pretty easy to reach the control panel, which you would rarely visit once your machine is set how you like. Move your mouse to the upper right side of the screen, click "Settings". From there you can go to the old familiar Control Panel window or use the net Metro interface. Or, just start typing "Control Panel" from the Start Screen for an instant search. Not hard.
Once you realise that this is the corner to move the mouse to. What tells you that? Nothing.
The Start button was removed, which I admit seemed like a bad choice, but the new Start Screen is a vast improvement. Idiots never bothered to customize their Start Menu by deleting unnecessary icons and grouping all their shortcuts into custom folders. The new Start Screen makes customization easer, and I think works much better. I don't miss the old Start Menu one bit.
You're only the third person I've met so far who thinks so. Out of around 20 that I've asked. And how many idiots are going to customise their start screen by creating folders? About as many as did in previous windows versions.
The design changes, as with all changes over the years, were backed by studies Microsoft conducted to see how people were using computers and what improvements could be made. For example, the ability to pin applications to the Task Bar and move them around was conceived by actually observing users who not only kept programs open when they weren't using them, but often closed one program and then reopened it later for the sole purpose of having them ordered how they wanted on the Task Bar.
That ability to move things on the task bar was fixed for me in XP by installing a free app a couple of years ago. Linux has had this ability for many years. Interesting that it took so long for MS to catch up, considering that they have had a Linux lab for years so they could have innovated it from Linux long ago.
I've had no problem with Windows 8. I think it's great. I know others who also share my high opinion of the new OS.
You're the 4th person out of about 20 I've asked, who thinks so. There are people where I work who have required 2-3 months to learn how to use it, and they are intelligent people who learn quickly. Win 8 is counterintuitive.
However, since the dawn of home computing, there have always been assholes like you who simply can't cope with new ways of doing things. [yada yada insult insult]
I've been a developer since before MS Windows existed. I've used all versions from 3.1 to 7, including most server versions. I tried 8 briefly and (once you switch out of Metro) there's no noticeable improvement except startup time. I only start it once per week, and shut down at the end of the week, so that doesn't matter. I develop in VMs. So there's no reason to switch, and there are things you have to learn for no benefit. E.g. all of the Metro crap, which is fine for mobile and the worst thing possible to inflict on a desktop machine. So I won't be switching unless I'm told to.
I really don't care if Russia or New Zealand spy on every single citizen in their respective countries. I do care if my government is reading my email.
Seriously, your government probably isn't reading your email. Think about the number of emails sent each day, excluding spam. But, assuming you live in the USA, your government is storing your emails, and if you ever become interesting to them they can read your emails (including where they were sent from, who to/from, etc), listen to most of the phone calls you made (it's digital, and not much data), txts you sent/received, see where your phone went and who was nearby, etc. Obviously they have your Facebook data, so they know everyone you claim to know. That's why they need a new data centre that can store exabytes of data. And of course if one of their computers notices something potentially interesting about what you say or do online including on your smartphone, or where your mobile goes, a human might take a look. They would love everyone to carry a smartphone with GPS turned on, and to actively use something like Facebook, Google+ or Twitter. It would make their metadata so much richer. If you become interesting to them, they hope you still use Windows because they'll have easy access. It's more effort to break into iOs or Linux. So when you start to encrypt as much as possible to slow them down, be careful about the encryption tools that you use. Check what the experts say. I don't live in the USA and my government assures me that they don't spy on me or get my data from another country. Now. But I assume that the USA, China, and probably England are storing as much data about me as possible. Especially the data that goes outside my country. And some of that might come back to my government.
Our government should be spending its resources preventing foreign governments from accessing our mail, tapping our calls, and tracking our communications, and generally hardening our internet.
Good luck with that. If you can still use it easily, it can be accessed/tapped/tracked. And BTW my government should be preventing your government from accessing my mail, calls and communications. I hope that's okay?
Seriously, Sharepoint? Does anyone actually like SharePoint?
Yes, Microsoft. It locks people into Office, which locks them into Windows, which is the only thing keeping Microsoft from a steep downward spiral. Like a 747 in the air and without working engines, but in a powerful updraft.
I have been studying and practicing hypnosis lately, and the reason it is effective (in some people)...
While I agree with your message, I'm a certified hypnotherapist and it's been effective in all my clients so far.
I can put anyone into a trace once I establish rapport with them (in a situation when they know it's safe to relax). I can then get them to do or think anything that they perceive as safe at the unconscious level. Behaving like a chicken is perceived as harmful (e.g. embarrassing) by most of an audience, which is why a stage hypnotist will select and invite on-stage those who are okay with behaving that way.
I will always check with a client in advance that what I'm going to suggest, when they're in a trance, is considered safe by them. Otherwise it won't work and we're both wasting our time.
And now you are wide awake and alert again and fully aware of your surroundings. (just in case I'm better than I thought).
If Microsoft starts now (and doesn't screw up along the way) they can probably be considered a good guy by the FOSS community some time around 2040 or so.
Yes, because only then will people such as me have either lost interest or died.
I've watched them since Bill first sold MS DOS, and I'm likely to keep telling people about the tricks MS have played in the past, and therefore what they're going to do in the future if they get their way. They won't change until it's temporarily to their advantage, such as when the fines become so large that they have to avoid them (keep it up EU!)
From personal experience and what MS have said, copying goes from 10-12 times slower to only about 4 times slower. I'm running both XP and Vista on identical hardware, except that the Vista box has twice the RAM. Both are dev machines. The XP box badly needs a reinstall, XP was installed 2.5 years ago and it is running much slower than it once was. The Vista box, with Vista installed a year ago, can sometimes nearly keep up with it. It's that slow.
IMHO If you want better speed and overall better experience, upgrade to either Linux or XP according to taste.
At least when elections are stolen there, the people give a shit.
First, you need to know that the election was stolen, and most people in your country still don't seem to have figured that out.
Who knows, maybe then some of them will give a shit.
The BBC model B booted in about 1-2 seconds, because the OS was entirely in ROM. It used a 6502 CPU and was probably faster than the original IBM PC it competed against. To start it, you turned on the monitor and waited a few seconds for it to warm up, then turned on the BBC which beeped twice and was ready to go.
The Acorn Archimedes booted in about the same amount of time for the same reason. It used the original version of the ARM RISC CPU that evolved into the Strongarm, and competed against the 80386. And the Archimedes defragged the hard disk in the background as part of normal filesystem operation. MS still hasn't innovated that.
You may have noticed that Windows is free. You can download cracked versions of 2000, XP, 2003 server and (I think) Vista. I've seen most of them on one torrent site. So actually paying for Windows is optional, in the same way as keeping to speed limits is optional:-) BTW I run Ubuntu on all my boxes.
1,800 words a minute is good for speed reading, and if you then learn to use your unconscious mind you can double that at first and then speed up. I'm just finishing a Photoreading course where we turn pages as fast as we can. There are other steps in the process that also take time, but the total time is still quite short. Using this, people have read 35 books in a roughly 8-hour day, and then been able to correctly answer questions on their content. I can only read an average of about 6 pages a minute, so far (200 pages of a small textbook in 35 minutes, which was about 3,500 wpm). BTW I'm serious, the courses have been available for several years. I don't use it with novels though:-)
Do you feel safer while we're more in debt, to China, than anyone was ever in debt before to anyone, while spending a third of a $TRILLION in Iraq, $BILLIONS on fake FBI upgrades that do nothing but enrich scam contractors, and the richest among us demand more tax breaks, like "estate tax" breaks after they're dead?
Maybe. 'Cos I don't live in the US. You guys can spend all the money you want on being paranoid. The way to feel safer is to make your government stop annoying people in other countries so much. Starting with the middle east. When the US economy starts to crash in another year or two I expect its expenditure on weapons to decrease. I hope other countries will then do enough to compensate in global policing.
BTW IANAE (economist) but I think the $US is in trouble because it's less desirable worldwide. e.g. The EU now has the Euro, and you can now buy oil using other currencies. Just watch it against the Euro, gold, etc, and you'll see what I mean.
Okay, I'm going to back down quite a lot, now that I've followed the link in the "we have removed" message and found out what is supposed to be blocked. The message is there, but the actual "www.xenu.net" site appears third in the list of results. So the message probably shouldn't be displayed because the result wasn't removed.
What bothers ME is that the same "we have removed 1 result(s) from this page" message appears when I do the search using my local Google site (google.co.nz), which is NOT in the USA. This is like a North American having Chinese search results imposed on them.
My country is reasonably friendly towards the USA, we're certainly not an enemy. But either Google is imposing US laws on other countries, or else the US is. So I have to wonder whether it is an accident, or whether the US is censoring another country without being requested to. I guess it's time to make enquiries to my Government and to Google. And maybe the media would be interested.
DOS isn't done til Lotus won't run
on
JSF vs ASP.net
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
As soon as Microsoft decide that Mono is good enough to make enough people think of moving away from Windows, I think they'll try to change.Net to prevent it. AFAIK The only issue with Mono currently is that MS-specific security doesn't work under Mono, because it relies on Windows. I suggest that if you want to be able to run on something other than Windows, be careful about choosing.Net. It may still turn out to be a good choice, given that there are probably more.Net developers available, provided that you've taken into account aspects like security.
BTW The only programming I do is.Net (in New Zealand), and this is being written at home with Firefox on Linux.
Some more:
Understanding the effects of earthquakes as the shockwaves travel through rock.
Better design of submarines (water density changes with temperature, salinity and depth).
Higher-resolution ultrasonic medical scanners (humans vary in (body) density).
Does that mean that Australia will also start calling itself the United States of Australia (USA for short)? Please? That would be more entertaining than most TV shows.
"One operating system's shitty naming scheme is not an excuse for all others to do the same"
Unix was invented first, followed by Windows, followed by Linux. Linux is effectively a closed-room rewrite of Unix, and so the names for things are consistent with Unix. Just because Unix has a 'shitty naming scheme' doesn't mean that Windows should too.
"The longer names happen to suck under Linux"
Why? I don't understand your issue. It's not as if you need to type them! Just type a few letters and hit Tab. Or rename it (using copy&paste as required), or if it's in a menu then change it.
You can't search for useful packages and THERE ARE HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS of them.
Huh? Using Ubuntu I just start Synaptic Package Manager, search for likely words until I find what I want, and install it. Or I choose "Add Applications" from the Applications menu. Either way, it automatically downloads and installs everything it needs, and once it's installed it works. Oh, and of course I only have to reboot if I just installed a new kernel.
Slashdot Mirror
> Our secretaries learnt it in a week.
Wow, that's a fuckload of wasted time. Why would any business ever want to use Windows 8, knowing it will cost them so much?
Exactly. I've seen people go for 3 hour courses on Win 2000 and XP, starting with "this is a mouse".
Obviously Windows 8 is much more difficult/confusing to use than previous versions if your secretaries needed a week.
Mate and XFCE on Linux both look so similar to Win XP and 7 that someone used to Windows (Such as my father, in his 70's) can get used to either of them in minutes. Not even a few hours. :-).
So for a normal Windows user Linux is much easier to convert to than Windows 8. Admins have some learning to do though
lol.. why the fuck would anyone copy an OS that nobody uses?
ROLFMHO You're showing your ignorance. Lots of people use desktop Linux, including development teams where I work, which has MS Gold Partner banners draped around. They only had to get one copy of Linux of course, so as usual lots of people are counted as one. In mobile, guess what kernel is used for Android? Best you stop now while you still have some credibility.
Two months to learn a UI? Our secretaries learnt it in a week. Nice lie though.
No lie. They were productive in an hour, but much slower than on Win 7 for two months. One of them told me it took three months to get fully used to it. I guess to unlearn what they knew from previous versions, and to stop getting confused about what corner does what, and all the differences between metro and their smartphone. So they hadn't fully learned it for three months. I hope that's clear.
Notice I haven't had to swear yet. I'll bet that really annoys you :-)
WINE runs both IE6 and MS Office. Since you have licenses you're legit, although IE6 can be run under WINE without a Windows license.
I did not write any of the parent posts. But I happen to agree with the parent of yours.
Pretty easy to reach the control panel, which you would rarely visit once your machine is set how you like. Move your mouse to the upper right side of the screen, click "Settings". From there you can go to the old familiar Control Panel window or use the net Metro interface. Or, just start typing "Control Panel" from the Start Screen for an instant search. Not hard.
Once you realise that this is the corner to move the mouse to. What tells you that? Nothing.
The Start button was removed, which I admit seemed like a bad choice, but the new Start Screen is a vast improvement. Idiots never bothered to customize their Start Menu by deleting unnecessary icons and grouping all their shortcuts into custom folders. The new Start Screen makes customization easer, and I think works much better. I don't miss the old Start Menu one bit.
You're only the third person I've met so far who thinks so. Out of around 20 that I've asked. And how many idiots are going to customise their start screen by creating folders? About as many as did in previous windows versions.
The design changes, as with all changes over the years, were backed by studies Microsoft conducted to see how people were using computers and what improvements could be made. For example, the ability to pin applications to the Task Bar and move them around was conceived by actually observing users who not only kept programs open when they weren't using them, but often closed one program and then reopened it later for the sole purpose of having them ordered how they wanted on the Task Bar.
That ability to move things on the task bar was fixed for me in XP by installing a free app a couple of years ago. Linux has had this ability for many years. Interesting that it took so long for MS to catch up, considering that they have had a Linux lab for years so they could have innovated it from Linux long ago.
I've had no problem with Windows 8. I think it's great. I know others who also share my high opinion of the new OS.
You're the 4th person out of about 20 I've asked, who thinks so. There are people where I work who have required 2-3 months to learn how to use it, and they are intelligent people who learn quickly. Win 8 is counterintuitive.
However, since the dawn of home computing, there have always been assholes like you who simply can't cope with new ways of doing things. [yada yada insult insult]
I've been a developer since before MS Windows existed. I've used all versions from 3.1 to 7, including most server versions. I tried 8 briefly and (once you switch out of Metro) there's no noticeable improvement except startup time. I only start it once per week, and shut down at the end of the week, so that doesn't matter. I develop in VMs. So there's no reason to switch, and there are things you have to learn for no benefit. E.g. all of the Metro crap, which is fine for mobile and the worst thing possible to inflict on a desktop machine. So I won't be switching unless I'm told to.
I really don't care if Russia or New Zealand spy on every single citizen in their respective countries.
I do care if my government is reading my email.
Seriously, your government probably isn't reading your email. Think about the number of emails sent each day, excluding spam. But, assuming you live in the USA, your government is storing your emails, and if you ever become interesting to them they can read your emails (including where they were sent from, who to/from, etc), listen to most of the phone calls you made (it's digital, and not much data), txts you sent/received, see where your phone went and who was nearby, etc. Obviously they have your Facebook data, so they know everyone you claim to know. That's why they need a new data centre that can store exabytes of data. And of course if one of their computers notices something potentially interesting about what you say or do online including on your smartphone, or where your mobile goes, a human might take a look. They would love everyone to carry a smartphone with GPS turned on, and to actively use something like Facebook, Google+ or Twitter. It would make their metadata so much richer. If you become interesting to them, they hope you still use Windows because they'll have easy access. It's more effort to break into iOs or Linux. So when you start to encrypt as much as possible to slow them down, be careful about the encryption tools that you use. Check what the experts say.
I don't live in the USA and my government assures me that they don't spy on me or get my data from another country. Now. But I assume that the USA, China, and probably England are storing as much data about me as possible. Especially the data that goes outside my country. And some of that might come back to my government.
Our government should be spending its resources preventing foreign governments from accessing our
mail, tapping our calls, and tracking our communications, and generally hardening our internet.
Good luck with that. If you can still use it easily, it can be accessed/tapped/tracked. And BTW my government should be preventing your government from accessing my mail, calls and communications. I hope that's okay?
Seriously, Sharepoint? Does anyone actually like SharePoint?
Yes, Microsoft. It locks people into Office, which locks them into Windows, which is the only thing keeping Microsoft from a steep downward spiral.
Like a 747 in the air and without working engines, but in a powerful updraft.
These will be the first Surfaces actually sold (as opposed to shipped and in warehouses).
Eventually, when the paperwork is signed off in a few years.
I installed that on lots of 8MHz 286's. It had "doors" as described. Not sure of its release date though.
I have been studying and practicing hypnosis lately, and the reason it is effective (in some people)...
While I agree with your message, I'm a certified hypnotherapist and it's been effective in all my clients so far.I can put anyone into a trace once I establish rapport with them (in a situation when they know it's safe to relax). I can then get them to do or think anything that they perceive as safe at the unconscious level. Behaving like a chicken is perceived as harmful (e.g. embarrassing) by most of an audience, which is why a stage hypnotist will select and invite on-stage those who are okay with behaving that way.
I will always check with a client in advance that what I'm going to suggest, when they're in a trance, is considered safe by them. Otherwise it won't work and we're both wasting our time.
And now you are wide awake and alert again and fully aware of your surroundings. (just in case I'm better than I thought).
Well said, WebCowboy!
Especially the 2nd and last paragraphs "Those in-the-know KNOW there is a catch..." and "...by introducing tainted IP into FOSS"
Yes, because only then will people such as me have either lost interest or died.
I've watched them since Bill first sold MS DOS, and I'm likely to keep telling people about the tricks MS have played in the past, and therefore what they're going to do in the future if they get their way. They won't change until it's temporarily to their advantage, such as when the fines become so large that they have to avoid them (keep it up EU!)
From personal experience and what MS have said, copying goes from 10-12 times slower to only about 4 times slower.
I'm running both XP and Vista on identical hardware, except that the Vista box has twice the RAM. Both are dev machines.
The XP box badly needs a reinstall, XP was installed 2.5 years ago and it is running much slower than it once was.
The Vista box, with Vista installed a year ago, can sometimes nearly keep up with it. It's that slow.
IMHO If you want better speed and overall better experience, upgrade to either Linux or XP according to taste.
Who knows, maybe then some of them will give a shit.
The BBC model B booted in about 1-2 seconds, because the OS was entirely in ROM. It used a 6502 CPU and was probably faster than the original IBM PC it competed against.
To start it, you turned on the monitor and waited a few seconds for it to warm up, then turned on the BBC which beeped twice and was ready to go.
The Acorn Archimedes booted in about the same amount of time for the same reason. It used the original version of the ARM RISC CPU that evolved into the Strongarm, and competed against the 80386. And the Archimedes defragged the hard disk in the background as part of normal filesystem operation. MS still hasn't innovated that.
You may have noticed that Windows is free. You can download cracked versions of 2000, XP, 2003 server and (I think) Vista. I've seen most of them on one torrent site. So actually paying for Windows is optional, in the same way as keeping to speed limits is optional :-)
BTW I run Ubuntu on all my boxes.
1,800 words a minute is good for speed reading, and if you then learn to use your unconscious mind you can double that at first and then speed up. I'm just finishing a Photoreading course where we turn pages as fast as we can. There are other steps in the process that also take time, but the total time is still quite short. Using this, people have read 35 books in a roughly 8-hour day, and then been able to correctly answer questions on their content. I can only read an average of about 6 pages a minute, so far (200 pages of a small textbook in 35 minutes, which was about 3,500 wpm). BTW I'm serious, the courses have been available for several years. I don't use it with novels though :-)
Maybe. 'Cos I don't live in the US. You guys can spend all the money you want on being paranoid. The way to feel safer is to make your government stop annoying people in other countries so much. Starting with the middle east.
When the US economy starts to crash in another year or two I expect its expenditure on weapons to decrease. I hope other countries will then do enough to compensate in global policing.
BTW IANAE (economist) but I think the $US is in trouble because it's less desirable worldwide. e.g. The EU now has the Euro, and you can now buy oil using other currencies. Just watch it against the Euro, gold, etc, and you'll see what I mean.
Okay, I'm going to back down quite a lot, now that I've followed the link in the "we have removed" message and found out what is supposed to be blocked. The message is there, but the actual "www.xenu.net" site appears third in the list of results. So the message probably shouldn't be displayed because the result wasn't removed.
What bothers ME is that the same "we have removed 1 result(s) from this page" message appears when I do the search using my local Google site (google.co.nz), which is NOT in the USA. This is like a North American having Chinese search results imposed on them.
My country is reasonably friendly towards the USA, we're certainly not an enemy. But either Google is imposing US laws on other countries, or else the US is. So I have to wonder whether it is an accident, or whether the US is censoring another country without being requested to. I guess it's time to make enquiries to my Government and to Google. And maybe the media would be interested.
As soon as Microsoft decide that Mono is good enough to make enough people think of moving away from Windows, I think they'll try to change .Net to prevent it. .Net. It may still turn out to be a good choice, given that there are probably more .Net developers available, provided that you've taken into account aspects like security.
.Net (in New Zealand), and this is being written at home with Firefox on Linux.
AFAIK The only issue with Mono currently is that MS-specific security doesn't work under Mono, because it relies on Windows.
I suggest that if you want to be able to run on something other than Windows, be careful about choosing
BTW The only programming I do is
Would David Bowie do? http://www.davidbowie.com/
Those seem valid to me.
Some more:
Understanding the effects of earthquakes as the shockwaves travel through rock.
Better design of submarines (water density changes with temperature, salinity and depth).
Higher-resolution ultrasonic medical scanners (humans vary in (body) density).
Does that mean that Australia will also start calling itself the United States of Australia
(USA for short)?
Please?
That would be more entertaining than most TV shows.
"One operating system's shitty naming scheme is not an excuse for all others to do the same"
Unix was invented first, followed by Windows, followed by Linux.
Linux is effectively a closed-room rewrite of Unix, and so the names for things are consistent with Unix.
Just because Unix has a 'shitty naming scheme' doesn't mean that Windows should too.
"The longer names happen to suck under Linux"
Why? I don't understand your issue. It's not as if you need to type them! Just type a few letters and hit Tab. Or rename it (using copy&paste as required), or if it's in a menu then change it.
Huh? Using Ubuntu I just start Synaptic Package Manager, search for likely words until I find what I want, and install it. Or I choose "Add Applications" from the Applications menu. Either way, it automatically downloads and installs everything it needs, and once it's installed it works. Oh, and of course I only have to reboot if I just installed a new kernel.