While I do not agree with the articles "facts", for linux to have 20% more downtime than Windows, does not mean it needs to be down for 60 days a year.... only 20% more time than the Windows server. The math on this is fairly easy...
If a Windows server is down for 24 hours in a year, a Linux server would be down for 28.8 hours every year. (24 * 1.2 = 28.8)
The article did not state that Linux had 20% less uptime. It stated 20% more downtime. Since downtime numbers are smaller than uptime numbers in a year, the average downtimes would still be fairly close together.
The numbers everyone else is putting into their comments would be 20% less uptime, not 20% more downtime...
And for not updating pirated copies, which are used as botnets too!
Please re-read the article you are referencing and find where it states that Microsoft does not offer their security updates to unregistered versions of Windows. I just re-read the Steve Nash Q&A and the only thing I can find is where he specifically states the following:
Nash: This is a great question and one that we struggled with as we established the policy. First, I should clarity one thing. While the Windows AntiSpyware offering is only available to users of licensed copies of Windows, we do make our high priority security updates available to unlicensed users of Windows, primarily in order to prevent unlicensed Windows systems from posing a threat to the Internet if they get infected. Although, we do remind unlicensed users of Windows to get genuine.
If I am wrong about this response from Microsoft, please post the relevance section of the response from Steve Nash. The problem is not Microsoft, the problem is the standard computer user is not computer literate enough to update their system on their own. The number of botnets in existence is the simple proof of this. The lack of updated systems is not a problem with the operating system, as you would have just as many users who would have no idea how to update a rival OS as Microsoft.
All of the OS vendors I have used lately now provide some functionality for automatically updating the OS. However, none of them provided a completely automated system to update the OS without user intervention at the time of Windows XP's release. User education is the key to eliminating the botnets that cause so much of the SPAM.
IMHO, I don't really see the big issue with any of this. I never really look at the people submitting the stories. I look at the contents of the stories and that is about it. If I find the story blurb interesting, I click to follow the article, and maybe the discussion about the article. If a story doesnt catch my interest, I don't read it, and I dont go into the discussion.
In fact, today is the first time I have ever clicked on a submitters link. I did this just to see what all the fuss was about. Personally, I wont click on Beatles Beatles link again, it has nothing there to interest me, and the submitter has nothing to do with the story that is posted besides being the person who posted it.
I think this issue has been overblown, and I dont really see what the problem is. If you don't like the submitter, don't click on his link. If you don't like the story, don't follow the links to the article or the discussion.
Stop Behaving Like Children! No-one is forcing anyone to click on any links here on Slashdot, and I would personally hate the thought that someone is modifying or censoring the posts on this site.
The fact that Slashdot is COMMUNITY DRIVEN, is one of Slashdot's greatest strengths and weaknesses.
Funny. I bought an iBook and it came with a program called "DVD Player.app" which plays DVD's. I didn't have to pay extra. I didn't have to go buy it, it was just there. When I reinstall OSX from the restore DVD, the "DVD Player.app" comes with it.
You purchased the I-Book, which came with OSX. So you purchased OSX. OSX came bundled with a DVD-Player. Apples pays a licensing fee in order to bundle the DVD-Player with OSX. Therefore, by purchasing an I-Book, you purchased OSX. By purchasing OSX, you purchased the DVD-Player software. Otherwise, please find me the link to the DVD-player's site with the free download.
All Commercial operating systems bundle software that they have licensed and pay royalties on for every copy of the operating system that is purchased. Free Linux distributions (and possibly some of the paid distro's too...) do not bundle commercially licensed software with the OS, because there are licenses, licensing fees, and royalties that would have to be paid for every copy of the distribution that is in use.
Let me preface my comments. I am a staunch supporter of privacy rights.
However, before you get too far up in arms, most companies have some form of acceptable usage policies. Typically these policies state what you can and can not do while at work. Additionally, most companies have within either their acceptable use policies or security policies, a section explicitly stating that the company owns all files and information on their corporate network. You usually have to read and agree to these policies when you are hired.
I know that I have had to sign documents that stated that I have read and understand all of the companies security/privacy policies. If you don't like the companies policies, go get a new job.
>You forgot some very important pieces of information about this.
>1. You need to be a very important customer
No you dont... You just have to shell out what ever they charge now. I was at a mid-sized company the last time I had to use the support. It was regarding major problems with the MTA on our Exchange Server. Without identifying my company, and only shelling out the $225 at the time, I was speaking to one of the MTA's developers at 11PM on a Friday night....
>2. You need to PAY per incident if you don't have a contract
Please re-read my post. I believe my last line in the post reads as follows:
"I am only speaking to my experience w/ Microsoft's Pay-per-incident support...."
>3. If you are a nobody, you talk to a nobody who knows about as much about computers as your mother does.
>One of the funnier myths perceived to be true is that 'Microsoft's technical support is the best in the industry and is superior to that
>offered by the Linux community.'
While I can not speak to using the pay-per-use support of the Linux Vendors, if you use Microsoft's Incident based support system, It is really really damn good. I have not contacted any other Vendors where you can call w/ a technical support problem and speak to the developers of the application at 11:00 at night.
Please do not flame... I am not saying that the Linux community provides bad support. In terms of free support services, they kick M$ ass.... I am only speaking to my experience w/ Microsoft's Pay-per-incident support....
Moody may have pointed out that on BugTraq linux has the most vulnerabilities posted, but did he take into account that NT has its own bugtraq mailing list (NTBugTraq). Or has he looked at the number of bugs fixed in each service pack of NT. That is a much more realistic number. A mailing list? I could spam the mailing list with a load of hypothetical bugs and get the stats all screwed up (As well as myself banned...) His litmus test fails miserably......
It doesn't matter.... They may well be paper millionares. How much of the stock that they own can they legally sell at any one time. Their net worth is now pinned directly to VA. If that stock crashes, they are no longer millionares.
Although, I would not mind being a paper millionare either.... Much easier to get loans when your net worth is $$$$$$$
Re:Here is my letter to the Judge
on
DeCSS Update
·
· Score: 1
Moderate this down.... It's not even a good flame....just flamebait...
>Hemos consistently posts news that has some language error that renders the whole story stupid. "AMD announced that they will release >the Duron sometime in mid June, instead of last April."
FYI....This is not a language error. Both AMD and Intel were supposed to have their new processors on the market in April. They have pushed back their deadlines to June.
>>Now this is lame. Make it available for download, or don't do it. This old "in the near future" routine makes me sick.
Think about it. The book was probably not written in HTML, most likely it was written and edited in Word or some other Word processing package. The planning would come in by determining how they want to post it back online in HTML format. (Do you include links? Do you Thread the comments? Just post as plain text?) If you thought about what needs to be planned for instead of just BITCHING about it, you would understand at least a few of the problems facing the Slashdot Crew in creating the Book. If you really want to help them, offer to help put the book into HTML. (Then you would really see and understand the TIME it takes to put the book online!.)
I like the idea behind the book. (And the fact that no-one is aiming to profit personally). Keep pushing the message out!
Is there a way to show (As in DEMONSTRATE TO THE JUDGE) that DVD's can be copied without DeCSS using previously released software (predating the CSS encryption)?? If this can be shown and demonstrated, it would effectively KILL the argument that DeCSS is used to copy the DVD. In this case, you would still need DeCSS to view a DVD on any system that does not have the copyrighted software ported to it. This would help show an infringment upon the rights of the individuals to view DVD's. The argument that Windows already has the software should not matter. If they are not porting the copyrighted software to other OS's, it is "forcing" people to use Windows instead of the system of choice for the user. (This is purely my opinion, My arguments may not work in court....common sense seems to get left outside the door of the courtroom many times.....)
>well..they only have to buy *one* copy of RH Linux.. they can legally put that copy one a zillion friggin dell laptops.
Yes, they can. But then who is going to provide the end user support. By having individually licensed copies on each computer, RedHat or LinuxCare or whoever is providing the support for the OS, not DELL. Think about it. This is the way Redhat and all the other distribution make money....not by selling the OS, but by providing support for it after you buy it!
They have not yet PROVEN anything. Wait for the performance benchmarks before you start spouting the OS bigotry. And I realize that this is flamebait, but I like both OS's for different reasons and purposes....
I love the fact that poso.com is so small the owner is using a HOTMAIL Email address: ps84@hotmail.com and has the website hosted by with only a single page residing on "their" server.(Probably just being hosted by Etailprice.com who hosts the rest of their site.) The Administrative and billing contact for both Etailprice.com and poso.com is Isaiah Choo and he only has an email address at greatshop.com (The Company that owns etailprice.com)
I would love to hear other peoples opinions on the idea that this company (Perfect Solution Multimedia Inc) appears to be something smaller than my garage....
>>and with a properly set up unix box, he >>probably won't need much tech support at all. >> point -> click -> any questions?
Same goes for Windows.... I love linux, but if you know as much about windows as you do linux, you would know that a properly setup Windows box shouldnt need tech support either. It is the same for Linux. Where the tech support calls come into play is installing new software. (least in my experience it is installing new things that messup perfectly good PC's) And, installing Windows software is easier at the moment than Linux. If you dont believe me, go home tonight and put your computer infront of your grandparent and try and talk them through a Windows program install..(double click on setup....next...next...next....finish) and then try talking them through a linux program install... ( tar xzf package.tgz.... cd package... make.... make install.... )
Which do you think is easier.....Windows GUI method or the Linux command line.... I know for a fact that it would be easier for my grandparents to click on a GUI than remember command line commands. Until Linux gets an InstallShield (C) type program that is widely used, Windows will be easier to install new programs on. And support....Gateway will provide excellent support for Windows....dont know if they will provide support for Linux.
>You're just talking about a SysAdmin position. >That's an "operator" position. Back ten years ago >that was, umm, like being one of the monkeys who >mounted the tape reels. Now there's a mystique >about it all, so saying you want a job as a >SysAdmin is like being the kid who wants to be a >Train Engineer. > >The real tech positions involve things like >developing hardware or software. Not just >running the machines. And business is SCREAMING >for people who can develop product.
I know that this may seem like flame bait to some, but the above post is a bit of a flame on SysAdmins. I realize that some developers may know how to administer their PC or entire networks, but to make a blanket statement that SysAdmins is like being someone who just mounts tape reels is an insult. I know many developers who dont even know how to rebuild their systems when they trash them, and have no clue about the higher level SysAdmin stuff like network security.
This is not a job where you babysit machines. It takes an understanding of the services and OS's that the business is running. Most developers that I know wouldnt know how to setup a DNS server. Not that they couldnt learn, but they do not have the interest. Also, most good SysAdmin's that I do know have an aptitude for understanding the OS's that they work with. I for one have a degree in Civil Engineering, but find managing the infrastructure of a 3000+ user network with 50+ remote sites "fun". It is challenging and intellectually stimulating. (And, yes I know how to program....not well, but I know how....my idea of fun is not having a compiler spit out missing ; errors and having to hunt for bugs.)
IMHO, dont bash what you apparently dont know that much about.
I wouldnt consider myself an MS stormtrooper. It is more finding a stable configuration, and then not mucking with it.
And to your saying people are always blaming problems on bad sysadmin...setup..etc... I have noticed that it is the same with all OS's. I will say, that for me, (IMHO) NT is easier for the novice to setup. I can now put a Slackware box up with KDM and KDE configured in about 1hr. and most of that setup time is configuring the packages I want. It takes the same setup time for NT as well... My experience is that if you know either OS, you can get a very stable machine out if it.
I also hate the MS memory and resource management and would love to use Linux as my desktop, but I do not have a MS compatible office suite and cant afford to buy one and wont for work. My office is a MS workshop, but for security analysis and networking issues, I boot to Linux.
One thing that you haven't learned about NT then is that you dont always have to reboot. Yes, you need to reboot much more when installing or changing software than Linux, but you can always say no and stop and restart the service. (Same basic prinicple on Linux) I also agree that NT is unstable when you are adding and removing alot of programs. This is due to Microsofts bad design and using a Single Registry instead of the Unix way of 100+ text files. However, it is the same as with Linux, that you have to know how to configure the machine in order for the programs to run properly and not crash. I have had Mail, File and Web servers that have seen uptimes around 1 year. I dont see this as an unstable operating system. The big thing with Linux and NT is that Linux is more stable RIGHT OUT OF THE BOX. NT needs to be tweaked. BUT, they are BOTH Stable OS's when properly configured.
I know this will piss alot of people off....let the flames begin....
Slashdot Mirror
While I do not agree with the articles "facts", for linux to have 20% more downtime than Windows, does not mean it needs to be down for 60 days a year.... only 20% more time than the Windows server. The math on this is fairly easy...
If a Windows server is down for 24 hours in a year, a Linux server would be down for 28.8 hours every year. (24 * 1.2 = 28.8)
The article did not state that Linux had 20% less uptime. It stated 20% more downtime. Since downtime numbers are smaller than uptime numbers in a year, the average downtimes would still be fairly close together.
The numbers everyone else is putting into their comments would be 20% less uptime, not 20% more downtime...
All of the OS vendors I have used lately now provide some functionality for automatically updating the OS. However, none of them provided a completely automated system to update the OS without user intervention at the time of Windows XP's release. User education is the key to eliminating the botnets that cause so much of the SPAM.
IMHO, I don't really see the big issue with any of this. I never really look at the people submitting the stories. I look at the contents of the stories and that is about it. If I find the story blurb interesting, I click to follow the article, and maybe the discussion about the article. If a story doesnt catch my interest, I don't read it, and I dont go into the discussion.
In fact, today is the first time I have ever clicked on a submitters link. I did this just to see what all the fuss was about. Personally, I wont click on Beatles Beatles link again, it has nothing there to interest me, and the submitter has nothing to do with the story that is posted besides being the person who posted it.
I think this issue has been overblown, and I dont really see what the problem is. If you don't like the submitter, don't click on his link. If you don't like the story, don't follow the links to the article or the discussion.
Stop Behaving Like Children! No-one is forcing anyone to click on any links here on Slashdot, and I would personally hate the thought that someone is modifying or censoring the posts on this site.
The fact that Slashdot is COMMUNITY DRIVEN, is one of Slashdot's greatest strengths and weaknesses.
Yet in your previous post you state:
Funny. I bought an iBook and it came with a program called "DVD Player.app" which plays DVD's. I didn't have to pay extra. I didn't have to go buy it, it was just there. When I reinstall OSX from the restore DVD, the "DVD Player.app" comes with it.
You purchased the I-Book, which came with OSX. So you purchased OSX. OSX came bundled with a DVD-Player. Apples pays a licensing fee in order to bundle the DVD-Player with OSX. Therefore, by purchasing an I-Book, you purchased OSX. By purchasing OSX, you purchased the DVD-Player software. Otherwise, please find me the link to the DVD-player's site with the free download.
All Commercial operating systems bundle software that they have licensed and pay royalties on for every copy of the operating system that is purchased. Free Linux distributions (and possibly some of the paid distro's too...) do not bundle commercially licensed software with the OS, because there are licenses, licensing fees, and royalties that would have to be paid for every copy of the distribution that is in use.
Let me preface my comments. I am a staunch supporter of privacy rights.
However, before you get too far up in arms, most companies have some form of acceptable usage policies. Typically these policies state what you can and can not do while at work. Additionally, most companies have within either their acceptable use policies or security policies, a section explicitly stating that the company owns all files and information on their corporate network. You usually have to read and agree to these policies when you are hired.
I know that I have had to sign documents that stated that I have read and understand all of the companies security/privacy policies. If you don't like the companies policies, go get a new job.
>You forgot some very important pieces of information about this.
>1. You need to be a very important customer
No you dont... You just have to shell out what ever they charge now. I was at a mid-sized company the last time I had to use the support. It was regarding major problems with the MTA on our Exchange Server. Without identifying my company, and only shelling out the $225 at the time, I was speaking to one of the MTA's developers at 11PM on a Friday night....
>2. You need to PAY per incident if you don't have a contract
Please re-read my post. I believe my last line in the post reads as follows:
"I am only speaking to my experience w/ Microsoft's Pay-per-incident support...."
>3. If you are a nobody, you talk to a nobody who knows about as much about computers as your mother does.
Why respond...this is just a troll....
>One of the funnier myths perceived to be true is that 'Microsoft's technical support is the best in the industry and is superior to that
>offered by the Linux community.'
While I can not speak to using the pay-per-use support of the Linux Vendors, if you use Microsoft's Incident based support system, It is really really damn good. I have not contacted any other Vendors where you can call w/ a technical support problem and speak to the developers of the application at 11:00 at night.
Please do not flame... I am not saying that the Linux community provides bad support. In terms of free support services, they kick M$ ass.... I am only speaking to my experience w/ Microsoft's Pay-per-incident support....
> rm -r /*.* ???
/*"
You forgot the "f"....to truly do damage you need
"rm -rf
Moody may have pointed out that on BugTraq linux has the most vulnerabilities posted, but did he take into account that NT has its own bugtraq mailing list (NTBugTraq). Or has he looked at the number of bugs fixed in each service pack of NT. That is a much more realistic number. A mailing list? I could spam the mailing list with a load of hypothetical bugs and get the stats all screwed up (As well as myself banned...) His litmus test fails miserably......
It doesn't matter.... They may well be paper millionares. How much of the stock that they own can they legally sell at any one time. Their net worth is now pinned directly to VA. If that stock crashes, they are no longer millionares.
Although, I would not mind being a paper millionare either.... Much easier to get loans when your net worth is $$$$$$$
Moderate this down.... It's not even a good flame....just flamebait...
Too make it clearer, "Last April" would be April 2000.
>Hemos consistently posts news that has some language error that renders the whole story stupid. "AMD announced that they will release
>the Duron sometime in mid June, instead of last April."
FYI....This is not a language error. Both AMD and Intel were supposed to have their new processors on the market in April. They have pushed back their deadlines to June.
Think before you post......
Just to clear things up. The Author John Taschek works for PC Week and PC Week Runs on Apache 1.3.12 on Solaris
>I see a rather large smoking gun at the scene of the crime....
>
>ZDNet is running from.... an Apache Webserver.
Get your facts right. They are running Netscape Enterprise/3.6-SP3 on a Solaris box. Follow the link below if you don't believe me.
What's ZDNet Running??
Before you post something to incite the masses more, make sure you have the facts straight!
>>Now this is lame. Make it available for download, or don't do it. This old "in the near future" routine makes me sick.
Think about it. The book was probably not written in HTML, most likely it was written and edited in Word or some other Word processing package. The planning would come in by determining how they want to post it back online in HTML format. (Do you include links? Do you Thread the comments? Just post as plain text?) If you thought about what needs to be planned for instead of just BITCHING about it, you would understand at least a few of the problems facing the Slashdot Crew in creating the Book. If you really want to help them, offer to help put the book into HTML. (Then you would really see and understand the TIME it takes to put the book online!.)
I like the idea behind the book. (And the fact that no-one is aiming to profit personally). Keep pushing the message out!
Big_Lamer
Is there a way to show (As in DEMONSTRATE TO THE JUDGE) that DVD's can be copied without DeCSS using previously released software (predating the CSS encryption)?? If this can be shown and demonstrated, it would effectively KILL the argument that DeCSS is used to copy the DVD. In this case, you would still need DeCSS to view a DVD on any system that does not have the copyrighted software ported to it. This would help show an infringment upon the rights of the individuals to view DVD's. The argument that Windows already has the software should not matter. If they are not porting the copyrighted software to other OS's, it is "forcing" people to use Windows instead of the system of choice for the user. (This is purely my opinion, My arguments may not work in court....common sense seems to get left outside the door of the courtroom many times.....)
>well..they only have to buy *one* copy of RH Linux.. they can legally put that copy one a zillion friggin dell laptops.
Yes, they can. But then who is going to provide the end user support. By having individually licensed copies on each computer, RedHat or LinuxCare or whoever is providing the support for the OS, not DELL. Think about it. This is the way Redhat and all the other distribution make money....not by selling the OS, but by providing support for it after you buy it!
They have not yet PROVEN anything. Wait for the performance benchmarks before you start spouting the OS bigotry. And I realize that this is flamebait, but I like both OS's for different reasons and purposes....
I love the fact that poso.com is so small the owner is using a HOTMAIL Email address: ps84@hotmail.com and has the website hosted by with only a single page residing on "their" server.(Probably just being hosted by Etailprice.com who hosts the rest of their site.) The Administrative and billing contact for both Etailprice.com and poso.com is Isaiah Choo and he only has an email address at greatshop.com (The Company that owns etailprice.com)
I would love to hear other peoples opinions on the idea that this company (Perfect Solution Multimedia Inc) appears to be something smaller than my garage....
>>and with a properly set up unix box, he
.... cd package ... make .... make install .... )
>>probably won't need much tech support at all.
>> point -> click -> any questions?
Same goes for Windows.... I love linux, but if you know as much about windows as you do linux, you would know that a properly setup Windows box shouldnt need tech support either. It is the same for Linux. Where the tech support calls come into play is installing new software. (least in my experience it is installing new things that messup perfectly good PC's) And, installing Windows software is easier at the moment than Linux. If you dont believe me, go home tonight and put your computer infront of your grandparent and try and talk them through a Windows program install..(double click on setup....next...next...next....finish) and then try talking them through a linux program install... ( tar xzf package.tgz
Which do you think is easier.....Windows GUI method or the Linux command line.... I know for a fact that it would be easier for my grandparents to click on a GUI than remember command line commands. Until Linux gets an InstallShield (C) type program that is widely used, Windows will be easier to install new programs on. And support....Gateway will provide excellent support for Windows....dont know if they will provide support for Linux.
>You're just talking about a SysAdmin position.
>That's an "operator" position. Back ten years ago
>that was, umm, like being one of the monkeys who
>mounted the tape reels. Now there's a mystique
>about it all, so saying you want a job as a
>SysAdmin is like being the kid who wants to be a
>Train Engineer.
>
>The real tech positions involve things like
>developing hardware or software. Not just
>running the machines. And business is SCREAMING
>for people who can develop product.
I know that this may seem like flame bait to some, but the above post is a bit of a flame on SysAdmins. I realize that some developers may know how to administer their PC or entire networks, but to make a blanket statement that SysAdmins is like being someone who just mounts tape reels is an insult. I know many developers who dont even know how to rebuild their systems when they trash them, and have no clue about the higher level SysAdmin stuff like network security.
This is not a job where you babysit machines. It takes an understanding of the services and OS's that the business is running. Most developers that I know wouldnt know how to setup a DNS server. Not that they couldnt learn, but they do not have the interest. Also, most good SysAdmin's that I do know have an aptitude for understanding the OS's that they work with. I for one have a degree in Civil Engineering, but find managing the infrastructure of a 3000+ user network with 50+ remote sites "fun". It is challenging and intellectually stimulating. (And, yes I know how to program....not well, but I know how....my idea of fun is not having a compiler spit out missing ; errors and having to hunt for bugs.)
IMHO, dont bash what you apparently dont know that much about.
I wouldnt consider myself an MS stormtrooper. It is more finding a stable configuration, and then not mucking with it.
And to your saying people are always blaming problems on bad sysadmin...setup..etc... I have noticed that it is the same with all OS's. I will say, that for me, (IMHO) NT is easier for the novice to setup. I can now put a Slackware box up with KDM and KDE configured in about 1hr. and most of that setup time is configuring the packages I want. It takes the same setup time for NT as well... My experience is that if you know either OS, you can get a very stable machine out if it.
I also hate the MS memory and resource management and would love to use Linux as my desktop, but I do not have a MS compatible office suite and cant afford to buy one and wont for work. My office is a MS workshop, but for security analysis and networking issues, I boot to Linux.
One thing that you haven't learned about NT then is that you dont always have to reboot. Yes, you need to reboot much more when installing or changing software than Linux, but you can always say no and stop and restart the service. (Same basic prinicple on Linux) I also agree that NT is unstable when you are adding and removing alot of programs. This is due to Microsofts bad design and using a Single Registry instead of the Unix way of 100+ text files. However, it is the same as with Linux, that you have to know how to configure the machine in order for the programs to run properly and not crash. I have had Mail, File and Web servers that have seen uptimes around 1 year. I dont see this as an unstable operating system. The big thing with Linux and NT is that Linux is more stable RIGHT OUT OF THE BOX. NT needs to be tweaked. BUT, they are BOTH Stable OS's when properly configured.
I know this will piss alot of people off....let the flames begin....
Just a note.... Utah is located in the North West. They are in the Northern Rocky Mountains. Utah would be considered the Pacific Northwest I believe.