Different strokes for different folks I guess. I've been using redhat since 5.1, guess I've grown to like it. Fedora suits me just fine. And the cool thing about the k12 distro is the communtiy behind it. Lots of activity on the mailing list and lots of helpful people.
The APT packaging system is cool, once you get it configured.
Apt and yum are both available to k12ltsp with frequently updated repositories.
You cannot really expect students to be compiling their own kernels.
What makes you think that would ever be necessary? Seriously. The admin doesn't even have to do this. Just install the distro hook up the clients, create accounts, and you're done.
Hard disks are cloned so that a PC is exactly the same as the other. So installation will actually just based on one manually installed computer.
This is much easier with LTSP. Thin clients don't even need hard drives.
Then send the students home with one of these disks.
Under no circumstances should it ever be a requirement to teach kids brand loyalty. Learning computers in school should be about concepts. Not the latest features of some proprietary Office suite.
I can vouch for this as well. LTSP is an amazing project.
K12LTSP is a nice fedora3 based distro with all the LTSP setup built in as well as a bundle of educational software.
I have built a lab for my kid's school with 60 machines connected to a dual xeon server. Most old junk hardware works fine as a thin client.
We saved so much money not upgrading the client machines(hardware or MS software) in the first year that we upgraded to flat panels. And we are in the process of buying some small fanless thin clients as well.
lots of help available in #ltsp & #k12ltsp on freenode and on the k12 mailing list. And if you want to support this project, buy hardware from http://www.disklessworkstations.com it is where the primary devleopment comes from.
Why is it that anytime someone asks for an example of a decent Java App the Java Fanboys come up with either Eclipse (doesn't count, only useful with Java) or Azureus?
Because both are good useful applications? Didn't realize that made someone a fanboy. I also find many applications written several other languages to be useful.
And as far as eclipse only being useful for java, check out http://www.eclipseplugincentral.com & http://eclipse-plugins.2y.net Hundreds of plugins for many for languages other than java.
Sure, you may have caught lots of PHBs with all that hype around Java but how much of it really pays off in the real world?
Not sure which real world you are referring to here, but I've always just used the right tool for the job. Sometimes its C & SDL , sometimes its PHP, sometimes its python & Tk, sometimes its a simple bash script, sometimes it J2EE.
Actually, the forum software is just part of the account management software. Your accounts are created using a Java backend. Remember how people were having terrible times simply signing up to the game? That's because the account software is written using J2EE. Remember how the login servers go down constantly? J2EE again. It's a very good example of how J2EE doesn't scale that most Slashdotters probably are familiar with, given the recent stories about the game. Almost all the server problems the game has been having are related to that J2EE layer that keeps on screwing up.
You're privvy to Blizzard's code? And you're positive that this a result of the language and APIs, not just a bad implementation?
On the Oracle front, I've lost count of the number of times I've seen an Oracle install go south soley due to their crappy suite of Java apps. Due to Java's wonderful compatibility, Oracle bundles their own version of the JRE. Frequently this causes massive conflicts with the other JRE the developer just had to install in order to make use of language features Sun didn't see fit to add until after C# did. (Keep in mind this is development, not deployment, so the web server and the DB server are on the same box.) This leads to a GIANT mess.
Sun added features oracle felt were missing long before C# came out. And I'm currently running oracle apps on konqureror in linux using the standard sun 1.4.2 jvm, not jinitiator.
And I can't imagine why anyone would use Eclipse to develop PHP code, when there are plenty of better text editors available out there. Unless you like showing off how you can use a gig of RAM to edit a 2K text file.
A gig of RAM? Seems to be running in under 47 megs for me. It is kind of nice being able to have code-assist on php when there are so many global methods available. Being able to debug, and seing code outlines are nice as well. Also, there are other usefull plugins like jdbc clients that can be used concurrently in the IDE. Not that you would have noticed when you can't get passed simply regurgitating FUD
Azureus (The #2 download on sourceforge) is a dancing text applet?
Oracle financial applications are not in the real world?
And phpeclipse isn't useful?
And your big gripe is a video game's custom forum software? (albeit an excellent game)
I've always been tought:
1,000,000 = 1 million
1,000,000,000 = 1 billion
1,000,000,000,000 = 1 trillion
1,000,000,000,000,000 = 1 quadrillion
1,000,000,000,000,000,000 = 1 quintillion
etc. up to centillion 10^603. Never figured out for sure how they are named after that.
And my favorite number would have to be 69 sexsexagintillion or 6.9 * 10^202 (I'm just imature like that)
More like ten duodecillion, assuming that the 10^40 number is correct.
You're right, I was 3 orders of magnitude off. I always forget to count undecillion. And I even double checked before attempting to make an intelligent post:)
Ok. Now that is actually a nice feature. Not sure why JVMs don't do this.
That said, if you are deploying an application to be installed into a directory along with its additional libraries, building the launch script is really not that big of a deal. And the jvm will assume jar files added on the command line with "-cp" are relative to the working directory so "C:\AppDir\lib\library1.jar" can just be library1.jar
java -cp %CLASSPATH%;C:\AppDir\lib\library1.jar;C:\AppDir\l ib\library2.jar;C:\AppDir\lib\library3.jar -Xms32M -Xmx512M -jar myjar.jar is the equivilent. Or have you never written any real Java programs?
You do realize that it is possible to place global third party libraries in a common location right? Try/jre/lib/ext/ Or do all Mono programs only use standard APIs?
* `mono program.exe' runs your program, no need to
pass a class name, or a path or setup the cp to
run.
So does `java -jar program.jar`
The layout of my files is not constrained to
one-file, one-class and the file system hierarchy
does not have to match the namespaces I have
chosen.
I guess I've just never found this to be a problem. It has forced me to keep my code organized which I found to be a good thing.
And any third party libraries should be in jar files for effeciency.
J2EE is a collection of technologies not a specific methodology or architecture. There are several ways to write "enterprise" web applications in java. If you don't like EJB & servlets, maybe you'd like to use struts with JDO, or java server faces with hibernate, or just procedural JSP with straight JDBC or mix and match whatever pieces you want.
Are you sure MS go it right, or did you just pick the wrong coding paradigm out of the available J2EE technologies?
Yes, but does it create synergy between the different organizations? What about leveraging the intellectual quotient of the engineering staff? Does it have any value-added features to enhance the bottom line? Please tell us what to think Rational!!!
Of course it does. However don't become disenfranchised. You must think outside the box to realize that this paradigm shift is only possible with our Enterprise Solution. It enables you to Improve productivity in code-centric, model-driven, and rapid application development envniroment. Thus creating a win-win situation.
But where it the resulting image like they did for the picture of the bones?
BTW, I bet this would have saved the tracers countless hours on the 1978 rotoscoped version of Lord of the Rings. Maybe enough time for them to have figured out if the wizard was named Aruman or Saruman.
Slashdot Mirror
Was that meant in response to my post?
If so, you missed the point.
I was just pointing out that it is not necessary for a k-12 user to have to compile a kernel to use the system.
I'm all for teaching them as much as possible. I've even gone as far to write an object-oriented programming tutor.
What joseamuniz was posting was FUD about linux being inherently difficult to use.
Exactly. That is why I use Debian Sarge + LTSP.
Different strokes for different folks I guess.
I've been using redhat since 5.1, guess I've grown to like it. Fedora suits me just fine.
And the cool thing about the k12 distro is the communtiy behind it. Lots of activity on the mailing list and lots of helpful people.
The APT packaging system is cool, once you get it configured.
Apt and yum are both available to k12ltsp with frequently updated repositories.
You cannot really expect students to be compiling their own kernels.
What makes you think that would ever be necessary?
Seriously. The admin doesn't even have to do this. Just install the distro hook up the clients, create accounts, and you're done.
Hard disks are cloned so that a PC is exactly the same as the other. So installation will actually just based on one manually installed computer.
This is much easier with LTSP. Thin clients don't even need hard drives.
Just set them up with a K12LTSP Lab
Then send the students home with one of these disks.
Under no circumstances should it ever be a requirement to teach kids brand loyalty.
Learning computers in school should be about concepts. Not the latest features of some proprietary Office suite.
Yay, I get to plug another poject again:
You can move a turtle around in java with Jturtle
I can vouch for this as well. LTSP is an amazing project.
K12LTSP is a nice fedora3 based distro with all the LTSP setup built in as well as a bundle of educational software.
I have built a lab for my kid's school with 60 machines connected to a dual xeon server. Most old junk hardware works fine as a thin client.
We saved so much money not upgrading the client machines(hardware or MS software) in the first year that we upgraded to flat panels. And we are in the process of buying some small fanless thin clients as well.
lots of help available in #ltsp & #k12ltsp on freenode and on the k12 mailing list.
And if you want to support this project, buy hardware from http://www.disklessworkstations.com it is where the primary devleopment comes from.
Why is it that anytime someone asks for an example of a decent Java App the Java Fanboys come up with either Eclipse (doesn't count, only useful with Java) or Azureus?
Because both are good useful applications? Didn't realize that made someone a fanboy. I also find many applications written several other languages to be useful.
And as far as eclipse only being useful for java, check out http://www.eclipseplugincentral.com & http://eclipse-plugins.2y.net
Hundreds of plugins for many for languages other than java.
Sure, you may have caught lots of PHBs with all that hype around Java but how much of it really pays off in the real world?
Not sure which real world you are referring to here, but I've always just used the right tool for the job. Sometimes its C & SDL , sometimes its PHP, sometimes its python & Tk, sometimes its a simple bash script, sometimes it J2EE.
Actually, the forum software is just part of the account management software. Your accounts are created using a Java backend. Remember how people were having terrible times simply signing up to the game? That's because the account software is written using J2EE. Remember how the login servers go down constantly? J2EE again. It's a very good example of how J2EE doesn't scale that most Slashdotters probably are familiar with, given the recent stories about the game. Almost all the server problems the game has been having are related to that J2EE layer that keeps on screwing up.
You're privvy to Blizzard's code? And you're positive that this a result of the language and APIs, not just a bad implementation?
On the Oracle front, I've lost count of the number of times I've seen an Oracle install go south soley due to their crappy suite of Java apps. Due to Java's wonderful compatibility, Oracle bundles their own version of the JRE. Frequently this causes massive conflicts with the other JRE the developer just had to install in order to make use of language features Sun didn't see fit to add until after C# did. (Keep in mind this is development, not deployment, so the web server and the DB server are on the same box.) This leads to a GIANT mess.
Sun added features oracle felt were missing long before C# came out. And I'm currently running oracle apps on konqureror in linux using the standard sun 1.4.2 jvm, not jinitiator.
And I can't imagine why anyone would use Eclipse to develop PHP code, when there are plenty of better text editors available out there. Unless you like showing off how you can use a gig of RAM to edit a 2K text file.
A gig of RAM? Seems to be running in under 47 megs for me.
It is kind of nice being able to have code-assist on php when there are so many global methods available. Being able to debug, and seing code outlines are nice as well. Also, there are other usefull plugins like jdbc clients that can be used concurrently in the IDE. Not that you would have noticed when you can't get passed simply regurgitating FUD
Azureus (The #2 download on sourceforge) is a dancing text applet?
Oracle financial applications are not in the real world?
And phpeclipse isn't useful?
And your big gripe is a video game's custom forum software? (albeit an excellent game)
Thanks for the great post.
Huh?
There are thousands of open source java projects.
Here's a few.
10^12 US system.
I've always been tought:
1,000,000 = 1 million
1,000,000,000 = 1 billion
1,000,000,000,000 = 1 trillion
1,000,000,000,000,000 = 1 quadrillion
1,000,000,000,000,000,000 = 1 quintillion
etc. up to centillion 10^603.
Never figured out for sure how they are named after that.
And my favorite number would have to be 69 sexsexagintillion or 6.9 * 10^202 (I'm just imature like that)
More like ten duodecillion, assuming that the 10^40 number is correct. :)
You're right, I was 3 orders of magnitude off. I always forget to count undecillion. And I even double checked before attempting to make an intelligent post
10,000 trillion trillion trillion is silly. The number is ten tredecillion.
10 to the 40th is ok too.
Ok.
Now that is actually a nice feature. Not sure why JVMs don't do this.
That said, if you are deploying an application to be installed into a directory along with its additional libraries, building the launch script is really not that big of a deal. And the jvm will assume jar files added on the command line with "-cp" are relative to the working directory so "C:\AppDir\lib\library1.jar" can just be library1.jar
java -cp %CLASSPATH%;C:\AppDir\lib\library1.jar;C:\AppDir\l ib\library2.jar;C:\AppDir\lib\library3.jar -Xms32M -Xmx512M -jar myjar.jar is the equivilent. Or have you never written any real Java programs?
/jre/lib/ext/
You do realize that it is possible to place global third party libraries in a common location right? Try
Or do all Mono programs only use standard APIs?
* `mono program.exe' runs your program, no need to pass a class name, or a path or setup the cp to run.
So does `java -jar program.jar`
The layout of my files is not constrained to one-file, one-class and the file system hierarchy does not have to match the namespaces I have chosen.
I guess I've just never found this to be a problem. It has forced me to keep my code organized which I found to be a good thing. And any third party libraries should be in jar files for effeciency.
J2EE is a collection of technologies not a specific methodology or architecture.
There are several ways to write "enterprise" web applications in java. If you don't like EJB & servlets, maybe you'd like to use struts with JDO, or java server faces with hibernate, or just procedural JSP with straight JDBC or mix and match whatever pieces you want.
Are you sure MS go it right, or did you just pick the wrong coding paradigm out of the available J2EE technologies?
Man, if I had a nickel for every time I saw a mute stochastic fair queueing argument at Starbucks...I'd...
Still not be able to afford a cup of their coffee?
Yes, but does it create synergy between the different organizations? What about leveraging the intellectual quotient of the engineering staff? Does it have any value-added features to enhance the bottom line? Please tell us what to think Rational!!!
Of course it does. However don't become disenfranchised. You must think outside the box to realize that this paradigm shift is only possible with our Enterprise Solution. It enables you to Improve productivity in code-centric, model-driven, and rapid application development envniroment. Thus creating a win-win situation.
Too bad they don't also give the option of allowing you to boot PXE or etherboot without a hard drive.
Would be cool to see them sellling thin clients for less than 140 or so and still profiting. Would be perfect for an LTSP network.
Isn't that link is in the story already?
At the bottom of the streak. Looks like something got hit. Maybe the street light as another poster pointed out?
I saw The Day After Tomorrow too.
Cheestastic! I loved it.
Ok, She's nice looking.
But where it the resulting image like they did for the picture of the bones?
BTW, I bet this would have saved the tracers countless hours on the 1978 rotoscoped version of Lord of the Rings. Maybe enough time for them to have figured out if the wizard was named Aruman or Saruman.
I tried that, but after all that work I was tired and went to bed with a headache.