Well, based on the fact that is was Tom's Hardware, I didn't expect a 680X0 review. But I am interested in how my old Cromemco 68020 based system stacks up. Gosh, it was only $100,000 when it was new in 1986. I bet it ate PS/2s for lunch! Now, where did I put that Maximizer card?
It's as if everyone has forgotten what the second world war was about. Do they not teach this stuff over in Europe? I was just watching a special on the History Channel here in the US and was watching pictures of WWII in color. I was born 25 years after that war, but this special made me realise that it was not that long ago. The way people are reacting today, you would have thought that 9/11/01 was sixty years ago.
130xe? Gawd thoses things were so cheeply put together! Get an old 1979 vintage Atari 800! Now there's a real computer! My brother an I had to repair a 130xe keyboard. That was about 15 years ago! Keys pressing against plastic membranes?!?! Spacebar cutting traces? Ack! The original 800 was built like a tank! In hindsight, After Warner Communications sold Atari to Jack, I'm glad that I moved to the Amiga! You all know the connection between the Atari 800 and the Amiga right? Or do I have to go into another history lesson? *Sigh!*
Very true. The invention of the digital time base corrector allowed helical scan systems to produce "broadcast quality" images. I have read about "analog" TBC systems for some 2" quad machines.
I saw one of those Ampex-Nagra 1" portable machines on ebay. They are very rare and collectable.
Actually you could use a standard oxide Betamax cassette in an original Betacam machine, just don't expect any kind of interchange. If you attempt to play a betacam tape in a betamax, you will get no video, but you can hear some poor quality audio going way too fast.
I have two BVW-40s that were given to me, one actually works and is in great condition. Usually machines like that are beat to hell!
Re:Ask experts : Betamax audio head TOO FAR APART!
on
Why VHS Was Better
·
· Score: 1
I don't think you know what you are talking about.
Sony beat JVC and others to market with a consumer camcorder. (Betacord?) As far as pain in shuttling tape, Sony would usually unwrap the tape from the helical drum before rewinding and fast-forwarding to reduce wear on the tape and the drum. VHS would un-tension the tape, but did not completely remove it from contacting the drum.
The "beta" tape wrap was noted as being less stressful to the tape. Panasonic used the "M" wrap in it's first attempt at a professional 1/2" cassette. (M-Format) They later went to something like the "beta" wrap for M-II (circa 1986).
M-Format only shared the cassette, tape formulation, and transport with VHS. It recorded a component signal where VHS and S-VHS are composite Color Under systems.
S-VHS had a luminance bandwidth of around 400 lines (Standard VHS is around 240)to would compare to Betamax but it's color bandwidth was not much better than standard VHS. S-VHS (Which was used by a local broadcaster for news) looked like shit on-air and according to the engineers that worked there, they were hard to maintain. JVC, which marketed S-VHS to broadcasters has a terrible reputation in this industry.
For the last time... There is almost no relation between the consumer Betamax and professional Betacam formats. In 1982 the only relation between betacam and betamax was the size of the cassette shell and the tape formulation. Everything has changed since then. Please Everyone, stop comparing Betacam to the crappy JVC home video system. (VHS)
You are comparing a consumer product (S-VHS) to a professional (Betacam-SP). I would assume from this that you are too young to have ever seen a BetaMAX machine. Note the MAX not CAM.
The proper type of machine to compare a S-VHS machine to is the SuperBetamax or the Betamax-ED formats.
In nearly 20 years of following video technology, I have hever heard the term "Vertical Helical Scan". It actually doesn't mean anything! Is the scanner helical or vertical? I don't think Mr. Fenton has this right. In a quick search of the global JVC web site, I did not find a reference to "Vertical Helical Scan" even among many articles about the history of VHS.
Hmmm, If it's "Vertical" why are the tracks on the tape at a diagonal and nearly horizontal??? VHS does use a "Helicial" scanning system, very much like Betamax. The closest thing to a "Vertical" scanner is they nearly 50 year old 2" Quadruplex format invented by Ampex. It had a scanning "disk" that scanned transverse to the tape.
Actually Betacam's direct competition was Panasonic "M Format". Both Betacam and M-Format came out around 1982. It predates MII by about four years. MII went up against Betacam-SP. Betacam and M-Format were oxide tape based. Betacam and M-Format used Betamax and VHS cassettes respectively. Beta-SP and M-II were metal tape based. M-II discontinued the use of the VHS "M" tape wrap and actually was more similar to Betamax with it's "beta" tape wrap which was more gentle to the tape. M-II also used a different cassette shell from "M" or VHS. Betacam-SP could still play back and record oxide Betacam tapes. What this basicly means is that Sony allowed for backwards compatibility and Panasonic did not. Also, the only major US adopter of M-II was NBC and some of their affiliates. I remember watching Letterman on NBC when they went to M-II and noticed TONS of dropouts! The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson refued to switch and continued to record on 1" Type-C.
Neither Betacam, nor M-Format used "Color-Under" for recording. "Color Under" is a composite system of doing a frequency shift of the chroma to place it under the luminance. Betacam and M-Format were component based. Standard Betacam recorded Luminance and Chroma on separate tracks.
The "Real" hands-down quality winner was a 2-inch Helicial format made in the `70's by a company called IVC.
For a history lesson, go to http://www.lionlmb.org/quadpark.html
AM radio has severe limitations in dynamic range
and distortion from atmosphereic disruptions. My parents listened to AM radio for decades, and continue to. Is this why my parents (Who are in their 70's) can't hear anymore?
I think the RIAA should protest against AM radio! That bump music that Rush, G. Gordon and Hannity play is hurting my hearing!
I am humbled to have a developer of such standing to have responded to my post. I seem to remember the release of World Construction Set as being sometime back in the early `90's for the Amiga!!!
The term "bitter divroce" was not my own. I borrowed that from something I read elsewhere. If you read the bios of Alen and Stewart on the Luxology site they limit their involvement with lightwave to 2001. In talking to people at NewTek about missing plugins in the MacOSX version of Lightwave, they claim that they don't have the sourcecode to the plugins to port them!!!
I've been using Lightwave since version 1.1 and I've been using it on the Mac since version 5 (It's first release for Mac).
I really like it's rendering quality, and I'm fairly comfortable with it after using it for 10 years, but I'm not pleased with it's direction. There has been a few long-standing bugs that NewTek is telling me that I have to pay for an upgrade to fix. There has been a bitter divorce between the developers and NewTek and I'm not too sure about the future of Lightwave. The original developers have started a new company called Luxology, and I think that they are developing a new 3D application that will compete with Lightwave.
Right now I would pick Cinema4D or Maya if you are looking long term. I would choose Lightwave if I needed the best render quality right now.
Quote:"IIRC, Apple was charging just $50 per machine, and the cloners were going for the ultra high end machines, and as they didn't have the volumes that Apple had, could release the machines before them."
I had heard that the fees were too low. I didn't know quite how low! I did hear that Apple offered a new deal upon the release of OS8 that probably could have kept the clones, but aparently the cost was too high for them. My understanding is that the new fees would have actually accounted for the cost of R&D!
Slashdot Mirror
Hilarious! Kudos, from a Mac user. :)
Nah, I'm sure the door is closed, and I'm convinced that the light stays on. I just can't fit in there with all the left-overs.
There is a giant frozen turkey inside the nebula.
You're talking about the woman that I love. Back off! :)
Actually I do think she's pretty cool.
I have met some French people and thought they were quite wonderful. You may have a point there.
Well, based on the fact that is was Tom's Hardware, I didn't expect a 680X0 review. But I am interested in how my old Cromemco 68020 based system stacks up. Gosh, it was only $100,000 when it was new in 1986. I bet it ate PS/2s for lunch! Now, where did I put that Maximizer card?
Re: Tealover being modded down...
The truth hurts, doesn't it?
And you are a nameless AC. I have no respect for you. Pthhhhhhh!
It's as if everyone has forgotten what the second world war was about. Do they not teach this stuff over in Europe? I was just watching a special on the History Channel here in the US and was watching pictures of WWII in color. I was born 25 years after that war, but this special made me realise that it was not that long ago. The way people are reacting today, you would have thought that 9/11/01 was sixty years ago.
Well said! I'd mod you up if I had points right now :(
Quote: " And believe it or not, I'm not a political kind of person"
So maybe you shouldn't be talking about these issues at all?
130xe? Gawd thoses things were so cheeply put together! Get an old 1979 vintage Atari 800! Now there's a real computer! My brother an I had to repair a 130xe keyboard. That was about 15 years ago! Keys pressing against plastic membranes?!?! Spacebar cutting traces? Ack! The original 800 was built like a tank! In hindsight, After Warner Communications sold Atari to Jack, I'm glad that I moved to the Amiga! You all know the connection between the Atari 800 and the Amiga right? Or do I have to go into another history lesson? *Sigh!*
Revolution? Sometimes necessary. Popular? No one wants to die. Die for a heroic cause? We all weep and praise him or her.
Quote: "Next, we will probably have an unpopular war with Iraq (admittedly, mostly Bush's fault...)"
When is any war "popular"?
Jackass.
Very true. The invention of the digital time base corrector allowed helical scan systems to produce "broadcast quality" images. I have read about "analog" TBC systems for some 2" quad machines.
I saw one of those Ampex-Nagra 1" portable machines on ebay. They are very rare and collectable.
Actually you could use a standard oxide Betamax cassette in an original Betacam machine, just don't expect any kind of interchange. If you attempt to play a betacam tape in a betamax, you will get no video, but you can hear some poor quality audio going way too fast.
I have two BVW-40s that were given to me, one actually works and is in great condition. Usually machines like that are beat to hell!
I don't think you know what you are talking about.
Sony beat JVC and others to market with a consumer camcorder. (Betacord?)
As far as pain in shuttling tape, Sony would usually unwrap the tape from the helical drum before rewinding and fast-forwarding to reduce wear on the tape and the drum. VHS would un-tension the tape, but did not completely remove it from contacting the drum.
The "beta" tape wrap was noted as being less stressful to the tape. Panasonic used the "M" wrap in it's first attempt at a professional 1/2" cassette. (M-Format) They later went to something like the "beta" wrap for M-II (circa 1986).
M-Format only shared the cassette, tape formulation, and transport with VHS. It recorded a component signal where VHS and S-VHS are composite Color Under systems.
S-VHS had a luminance bandwidth of around 400 lines (Standard VHS is around 240)to would compare to Betamax but it's color bandwidth was not much better than standard VHS. S-VHS (Which was used by a local broadcaster for news) looked like shit on-air and according to the engineers that worked there, they were hard to maintain. JVC, which marketed S-VHS to broadcasters has a terrible reputation in this industry.
For the last time... There is almost no relation between the consumer Betamax and professional Betacam formats. In 1982 the only relation between betacam and betamax was the size of the cassette shell and the tape formulation. Everything has changed since then. Please Everyone, stop comparing Betacam to the crappy JVC home video system. (VHS)
You are comparing a consumer product (S-VHS) to a professional (Betacam-SP). I would assume from this that you are too young to have ever seen a BetaMAX machine. Note the MAX not CAM.
The proper type of machine to compare a S-VHS machine to is the SuperBetamax or the Betamax-ED formats.
In nearly 20 years of following video technology, I have hever heard the term "Vertical Helical Scan". It actually doesn't mean anything! Is the scanner helical or vertical? I don't think Mr. Fenton has this right. In a quick search of the global JVC web site, I did not find a reference to "Vertical Helical Scan" even among many articles about the history of VHS.
Hmmm, If it's "Vertical" why are the tracks on the tape at a diagonal and nearly horizontal??? VHS does use a "Helicial" scanning system, very much like Betamax. The closest thing to a "Vertical" scanner is they nearly 50 year old 2" Quadruplex format invented by Ampex. It had a scanning "disk" that scanned transverse to the tape.
Perhaps you ment "Video Home System"???
Actually Betacam's direct competition was Panasonic "M Format". Both Betacam and M-Format came out around 1982. It predates MII by about four years. MII went up against Betacam-SP. Betacam and M-Format were oxide tape based. Betacam and M-Format used Betamax and VHS cassettes respectively. Beta-SP and M-II were metal tape based. M-II discontinued the use of the VHS "M" tape wrap and actually was more similar to Betamax with it's "beta" tape wrap which was more gentle to the tape. M-II also used a different cassette shell from "M" or VHS. Betacam-SP could still play back and record oxide Betacam tapes. What this basicly means is that Sony allowed for backwards compatibility and Panasonic did not. Also, the only major US adopter of M-II was NBC and some of their affiliates. I remember watching Letterman on NBC when they went to M-II and noticed TONS of dropouts! The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson refued to switch and continued to record on 1" Type-C.
Neither Betacam, nor M-Format used "Color-Under" for recording. "Color Under" is a composite system of doing a frequency shift of the chroma to place it under the luminance. Betacam and M-Format were component based. Standard Betacam recorded Luminance and Chroma on separate tracks.
The "Real" hands-down quality winner was a 2-inch Helicial format made in the `70's by a company called IVC.
For a history lesson, go to http://www.lionlmb.org/quadpark.html
AM radio has severe limitations in dynamic range
and distortion from atmosphereic disruptions. My parents listened to AM radio for decades, and continue to. Is this why my parents (Who are in their 70's) can't hear anymore?
I think the RIAA should protest against AM radio! That bump music that Rush, G. Gordon and Hannity play is hurting my hearing!
Xenon,
I am humbled to have a developer of such standing to have responded to my post. I seem to remember the release of World Construction Set as being sometime back in the early `90's for the Amiga!!!
The term "bitter divroce" was not my own. I borrowed that from something I read elsewhere. If you read the bios of Alen and Stewart on the Luxology site they limit their involvement with lightwave to 2001. In talking to people at NewTek about missing plugins in the MacOSX version of Lightwave, they claim that they don't have the sourcecode to the plugins to port them!!!
I personally see stormy seas ahead.
I've been using Lightwave since version 1.1 and I've been using it on the Mac since version 5 (It's first release for Mac).
I really like it's rendering quality, and I'm fairly comfortable with it after using it for 10 years, but I'm not pleased with it's direction. There has been a few long-standing bugs that NewTek is telling me that I have to pay for an upgrade to fix. There has been a bitter divorce between the developers and NewTek and I'm not too sure about the future of Lightwave. The original developers have started a new company called Luxology, and I think that they are developing a new 3D application that will compete with Lightwave.
Right now I would pick Cinema4D or Maya if you are looking long term. I would choose Lightwave if I needed the best render quality right now.
Quote:"IIRC, Apple was charging just $50 per machine, and the cloners were going for the ultra high end machines, and as they didn't have the volumes that Apple had, could release the machines before them."
I had heard that the fees were too low. I didn't know quite how low! I did hear that Apple offered a new deal upon the release of OS8 that probably could have kept the clones, but aparently the cost was too high for them. My understanding is that the new fees would have actually accounted for the cost of R&D!
Your Candidate? Ack!