Yes, that would sound racist. Unfortunatley, it's not the colour of your skin matters that much in these world - it's the way you behave does. I will describe a male acting a bit effeminate "a gay", which has really nothing to do with his sexuality. What about male homosexuals not acting effeminate? Well, why should I even notice them, or make assumptions based on their homosexuality? The whole point is, that the word 'gay' seems (at least to me) to have more, than one meaning - "homosexual" is one of them, but it's rarely used - that's why I don't think, that homosexuals should be really mad about people saying that something is 'teh gay'.
I think, that the real problem is, that some of gays don't act really normal (well, that's the same for many of our heterosexual friends, but that's not the case right now) - they try to act like they were girlies, while that's in my opinion not a behaviour I could accept. Many of my male friends are gay - and I don't really care, what's their sexuality - unless they act like a pussy. I still think, that in ordinary situations, a man has to act like a man - and if I use the term "gay" to describe disparagement - I only mean people, who act like that. That's something, that doesn't really depend on what your sexuality is. Just think about it.
Hmm, I wonder if should I reply rather with "Ignorance is strength!" or "See? I've told ya!". Well, thanks for pointing out the link... good to see Linux getting better and better.
PS: perhaps I wouldn't comment this article such way (by comparing Linux to BSD), if not all those nice people, that called me a troll each time I've pointed out, that having no version control system & developing entire OS basing only on patches submited on mailing list is... well.... unwise:)
Well, it surely comes, but only to *Linux*, not opensource.
And, while we're at operating systems:
*BSD projects use both CVS and bug tracking system from a long, long time. It's Linus "dislike of versioning systems" (or perhaps, being resistant to good advices), which made Linux-SCO claims as easy.
With FreeBSD Web CVS interface, you can do usual things you can do with CVS. For example, review all commits to/README in FreeBSD (just click here) in the last 9 years. Responsible people, commit dates, commit messages. SCO claiming they did the changes? Don't think so. How about Linux? Yes, Bitkeeper repository. Since when? 2.4.x, if I remember correctly... and the code was already above 20 MB tgz by that time.
Pretty late. Well, better late, than never. I'm waiting to see Linux kernel having a "core team", and a central bugzilla... not the mailing list with patches.
Being regular Python user/fan, each news, which features Python makes me happy. How do you think, will Python become more and more popular in the next years? I think so.
web development: Not only Zope and Plone, there's a lot of interesting development going on with Twisted... and, well, Twisted is not only about the web, it is about networking in general;
.NET / Java development in general: Python in Java exists already... Java gaining more and more popularity? No problem, Python is already there..NET/Mono taking the market away from Java? The industry will perhaps support more and more.NET techniques - with IronPython (featured recently on/.), Python is already there. No problem;
some people might wonder if you really need that stinkin'.NET/Java stuff at all - Python is already very portable, but that's not everything - it already supports a wide range of MacOS/Unix/win32-specific functionalities.
anything else makes you wonder, if Python is a good choice at all? What about realtime applications, like a VOIP phone (GUI included, win32/unix compatible) in Python? Do you read "interpreted" as "slow", do you wonder if Python is good enough to be useful in CPU-demanding programs like games? Anything else against it? Perhaps you're worried about Python's extensibility?
if software telephony sucks for you, perhaps you should try a real mobile phone
Is there anything you would like to add to the list?
Do you also think 2005/2006 will be the years of Python hype?
Having a small part of good things about Python, I'd really like to hear, where does it suck for you. There are many, many things I don't know about it...;)
Please tell us then, what would you tell phk to do, if you donate him.
Perhaps people, who rated your post as "Interesting" could also join the conversation.
As some slashdotters pointed out, I am against free speech (because I've proposed to trash the trolls out of BSD section). Perhaps then all those pro-free-speech people, together with all those, who think phk sounds arrogant could reply right below this message.
If you know, how to do things the better way (and I am pretty sure you do; you wouldn't criticize then), please tell us. I am pretty sure we all are interested.
Perhaps a worse problem in this area is simply the naming of the functions themselves. Function names (and semantics) have been liberally borrowed from Unix system calls (unlink), the C standard library (strcspn), and Perl (split), among other places. Some function names have multiple words separated by underscores (str_replace); others have words squashed together (strtoupper). Some functions have aliases, like disk_free_space and diskfreespace. Some functions are just plain misnamed, like the addslashes and stripslashes routines which deal with backslashes in strings. These complaints sound trivial, but the cognitive load of dealing with such a motley collection of names is anything but. I blame this problem entirely on PHP's piecemeal evolution.
"""
> That alone may convince me to look more closely > at Python, but there needs to be more argument > than that. I've got a code library with 300 > functions that I would need to port, which I > can't say I'd be looking forward to.
Well, chances are, that in Python this will be only 10-functions library or so:)
Take care, and be sure to try Python out. I think, that with such needs/approach to programming languages as yours, Python will be a pleasant adventure.
As someone else already pointed out good sides of Python... Here's my $0.25 about PHP:
"24 or so years" and "PHP - the language that seems elegant"... That's the best example, that even if you do something for a long, long time you can still be very, very wrong.
PHP is not elegant and has a very poor object model. Also, it is pretty impossible to implement some of design patterns in it because of that. PHP has inconsistent API, PHP has a long way to go before it could be considered a serious language. Popularity? So what. Windows XP is also widely used.
I understand, that being a NVidia user, you couldn't mod that other way. Oh well. At least I've got something, that works really good and has opensource drivers for it.
And "this anonymous coward" perhaps didn't get the idea, that the nvidia clone was no-brand and cheap and it wasn't suited for such displays by definition.
I never said NVidias have loosy display, because this depends on the extra parts on the hardware, not the chip itself - but I do say, that NVidia drivers suck bad, when compared to opensource ones for ATI. That's all.
"If the story is even true"... jeez christ.
I have used a cheap NVidia Riva TNT since about 2 years; Linux drivers were buggy and hanged the machine from time to time; same for FreeBSD drivers - they made machine unstable.
As I've bought a bigger CRT display (21'), it came out, that there is some "ghosting" effect on that cheap NVidia, and I need to replace it with something better, just because my cheap clone was based on the hardware unsuitable for big displays. I have heard, that ATI somehow "supports" opensource communities - or at least gives them more information, than NVidia team.
I've bought Radeon 9200 and tried FreeBSD's 4.9 DRI + XFree86 4.3.0 drivers with it.
I was stunned. Everything worked as expected, no problems at all, no hangs, no sudden reboots, no nothing.
Of cource, NVidia is making some progress in the drivers stability; also, their equipment for sure gets better each day - but I was so shocked with the stability & ease of setup of opensource ATI drivers, that I am not going to buy/recommend any other graphics cards.
The bad thing about commercial OS' is that the manufacturers have sometimes to decide, if it would be worth to release a half-baked product just to get some customers, before their concurrents get them.
The bad thing about open/free OS' is that you sometimes have to release a half-baked OS with a new number, to get more people testing it (Linux 2.6.0 or FreeBSD 5.x releases - which was never called "stable", BTW);]
And, who gets hit by those above? We, users. Damnit.
I exactly known, what you mean about the ports system. FYI, you don't mean "the port system itself", you just have problems with installation of binary packages.
Of course, you can pkg_add http://URL, and it will automatically fetch dependent packages, but the problem is, you need to know the exact url. Package name, package version,.tgz or.tbz - that's a bit confusing. You're right. It can be done better, just like the way Debian does that. Debian simply rocks when it comes to binary packages - and I am pretty happy, that it exists, so it showed the way in this area.
I suppose I will be doing some work in this area with NetBSD packages collection (pkgsrc), but that should be easily portable to FreeBSD and OpenBSD ports. The whole idea is, that if you generate an index file for all binary packages on the site. Information would include the description, requirements, size - pretty much everything found in +* files (+DESCR, +COMMENT, +PLIST and other) - perhaps I could use Berkeley DB format for it. Then, in an user-level utility, you just need to give one URL to fetch that description file (bzipped, of course). Then, such utility could work much like Debian's apt-get and apt-cache - a frontend to pkg_add and a quick way to browse all available, but uninstalled software. We'd have a friendly utility for new users for all BSDs.
Also, as pkgsrc is portable and there are already binary packages avialable for Linux (not to mention NetBSD, of course) from the latest branch of pkgsrc -- we'd just need to add that small utility to bootstrap binary kit for pkgsrc, and you'd have then binary pkgsrc available for your box -- pretty much for all Linux distributions. These are all cool projects, and they can give you perhaps much more, than some Linux distributions (especially those ones, who "lock" user in a maze of incompatible binary packages and their dependencies;). In fact, it can even be the basic package system on your Slack (and it is available from some time, so you don't have to create another Slackware-packaging-system). Oh, wel.
And, perhaps, if FreeBSD Ports not impress you, when compared to Gentoo, perhaps you should try then NetBSD packages collection. Maybe the number of operating systems and platforms will somehow impress you, it impress me for sure. Of course, there are bigger and smaller problems, as they always are, in any opensource product, but perhaps with more users activley contributing to the project (just by testing the packages -- that's just using some of your CPU cycles on pkgsrc, instead SETI@Home;)
BSD? Dead? I don't think so. There's massive active development going on in all areas of each of the BSDs, there are thousands of lines of code shared among developers, lot of new ideas submited, lots of problems solved. There are a lot of companies and sites using it (among others, About.com, Yahoo!, distributed.net, Juniper, NASA)... Check uptime stats on Netcraft itself, FreeBSD rules in the top ten.
Its just perhaps BSD people are usually too busy doing their projects to comment here, so you can get a false impression;) Or, perhaps, noone likes to answer troll comments - but you've got a point with that packaging system, so that's why I bothered;)
Of course, I fully understand, that the whole idea of "is dying" posts is to get new people here (who show a bit of zealotry) envolved. Anyway - I hardly see such people recently, and even if you manage to get some 'copy-n-paste' replies, they got tired of posting them after a while.
But I still thing trolling here could change a bit. Esp. recently, when some guy came up with a post, that he runs OpenBSD on a 4-CPU machine. That was pretty funy, in fact.
As it seems, that 90% of the trolling today was sent as Anonymous Coward, perhaps disabling anonymous posting completly would make BSD section of slashdot a nice place to discuss again, just like it should be.
Perhaps, without all these troll posts, Slashdot forum could become a good way to exchange information about BSD vs Linux, or just about BSD in general. As you can see, in the quality discussion, that happened here -- perhaps some Sparc64 FreeBSD users will switch to Gentoo if they want video; perhaps some people trying to install Gentoo on displayless Sparcs will try BSD.
That was just 1 article and 3 comments, and it already helped a few people.
Perhaps, BSD people, who post here stories, could get together and send a petition in some form to Rob Malda, as there is not much sense in seiding him individual e-mails. The situation is not too good.
And, to the trolling crowd... well, in general, I really admire the way you're having fun - all that trolling folklore can be really much creative, and sometimes i ROTFLed watching your nonsense replies - all those penisbird ASCIIs, hidden links to goatse, "mod parent down, site is a goatse link" when the parent was 100% good URL - yea, that was trolling, but that was acceptable trolling, if you ask me (well, I like Monthy Python also, why shouldn't I like some of your posts). Anyway, you don't come up with anything fresh. All that "BSD is dying, you don't have to be Kreskin" - man, I've seen that many, many times. Why do you keep repeating this? It's not funny anymore, it's boring. Also, with some filtering it is very easy to cut it out. Another thing - perhaps if you'd spent some time on actually installing & using some of BSD systems a bit, you'd realize, that BSDs - as all operating systems - have their weak points. Perhaps moving the level of trolling frmo nonsense copy-paste to highly specialized flamewar could bring anything new to the table, because now you aren't creative anymore. And non-creative troll is a lame troll, if you ask me. So, I suggest, that you rather come up with something new, or copy-paste "BSD is dying" posts somewhere else - because continuing to do that doesn't impress me much, really.
Slashdot Mirror
Yes, that would sound racist. Unfortunatley, it's not the colour of your skin matters that much in these world - it's the way you behave does. I will describe a male acting a bit effeminate "a gay", which has really nothing to do with his sexuality. What about male homosexuals not acting effeminate? Well, why should I even notice them, or make assumptions based on their homosexuality? The whole point is, that the word 'gay' seems (at least to me) to have more, than one meaning - "homosexual" is one of them, but it's rarely used - that's why I don't think, that homosexuals should be really mad about people saying that something is 'teh gay'.
I think, that the real problem is, that some of gays don't act really normal (well, that's the same for many of our heterosexual friends, but that's not the case right now) - they try to act like they were girlies, while that's in my opinion not a behaviour I could accept. Many of my male friends are gay - and I don't really care, what's their sexuality - unless they act like a pussy. I still think, that in ordinary situations, a man has to act like a man - and if I use the term "gay" to describe disparagement - I only mean people, who act like that. That's something, that doesn't really depend on what your sexuality is. Just think about it.
That's not "stealing the code", that's "following you" tactic from http://www.extremeprogramming.com ;)
When all you schoolkids learn, that good trolling is about people NOT noticing you're a troll?
Hm, could you point out, what do you mean by " Python forces you to do the same things you do in lower languages." ?
Also, your view of Java as somehow "lower" language to Python is also interesting for me. Could you please be more descriptive on this topic?
Thanks.
Hmm, I wonder if should I reply rather with "Ignorance is strength!" or "See? I've told ya!". Well, thanks for pointing out the link... good to see Linux getting better and better. PS: perhaps I wouldn't comment this article such way (by comparing Linux to BSD), if not all those nice people, that called me a troll each time I've pointed out, that having no version control system & developing entire OS basing only on patches submited on mailing list is... well.... unwise :)
Well, it surely comes, but only to *Linux*, not opensource. And, while we're at operating systems: *BSD projects use both CVS and bug tracking system from a long, long time. It's Linus "dislike of versioning systems" (or perhaps, being resistant to good advices), which made Linux-SCO claims as easy. With FreeBSD Web CVS interface, you can do usual things you can do with CVS. For example, review all commits to /README in FreeBSD (just click here) in the last 9 years. Responsible people, commit dates, commit messages. SCO claiming they did the changes? Don't think so. How about Linux? Yes, Bitkeeper repository. Since when? 2.4.x, if I remember correctly... and the code was already above 20 MB tgz by that time.
Pretty late. Well, better late, than never. I'm waiting to see Linux kernel having a "core team", and a central bugzilla... not the mailing list with patches.
- web development: Not only Zope and Plone, there's a lot of interesting development going on with Twisted... and, well, Twisted is not only about the web, it is about networking in general;
- .NET / Java development in general: Python in Java exists already... Java gaining more and more popularity? No problem, Python is already there.
.NET/Mono taking the market away from Java? The industry will perhaps support more and more .NET techniques - with IronPython (featured recently on /.), Python is already there. No problem;
- some people might wonder if you really need that stinkin'
.NET/Java stuff at all - Python is already very portable, but that's not everything - it already supports a wide range of MacOS/Unix/win32-specific functionalities.
- anything else makes you wonder, if Python is a good choice at all? What about realtime applications, like a VOIP phone (GUI included, win32/unix compatible) in Python? Do you read "interpreted" as "slow", do you wonder if Python is good enough to be useful in CPU-demanding programs like games? Anything else against it? Perhaps you're worried about Python's extensibility?
- if software telephony sucks for you, perhaps you should try a real mobile phone
Is there anything you would like to add to the list? Do you also think 2005/2006 will be the years of Python hype? Having a small part of good things about Python, I'd really like to hear, where does it suck for you. There are many, many things I don't know about it...Nice trolling. Pity I don't have any mod points to mod you down... take care.
Please tell us then, what would you tell phk to do, if you donate him.
Perhaps people, who rated your post as "Interesting" could also join the conversation.
As some slashdotters pointed out, I am against free speech (because I've proposed to trash the trolls out of BSD section). Perhaps then all those pro-free-speech people, together with all those, who think phk sounds arrogant could reply right below this message.
If you know, how to do things the better way (and I am pretty sure you do; you wouldn't criticize then), please tell us. I am pretty sure we all are interested.
And, as phk says, you'll get much more, than just some binary updates.
If you don't know all the meanings of UML acronym, you can't be "true" and "geek" at the same time.
Am I the only person, that finds all those oh-so-funny usermode-linux jokes really not-so-funny?
I know, that Google is the best thing since Veronica. So do you.
I know, that there is no other site like Google. So do you.
But do you realise, that this is getting a bit too... monopolistic? Aren't you afraid of this?
> I will grant you that you can write some really
p apers/html/ php/index.html#section_5
:)
> hideous code in PHP, that same is true for any
> other language - some more than others.
I bet you already got that, but it's not the point, that you can write bad code - the point is, that PHP API is inconsistent.
Citing:
http://www.ukuug.org/events/linux2002/
"""
Perhaps a worse problem in this area is simply the naming of the functions themselves. Function names (and semantics) have been liberally borrowed from Unix system calls (unlink), the C standard library (strcspn), and Perl (split), among other places. Some function names have multiple words separated by underscores (str_replace); others have words squashed together (strtoupper). Some functions have aliases, like disk_free_space and diskfreespace. Some functions are just plain misnamed, like the addslashes and stripslashes routines which deal with backslashes in strings. These complaints sound trivial, but the cognitive load of dealing with such a motley collection of names is anything but. I blame this problem entirely on PHP's piecemeal evolution.
"""
> That alone may convince me to look more closely
> at Python, but there needs to be more argument
> than that. I've got a code library with 300
> functions that I would need to port, which I
> can't say I'd be looking forward to.
Well, chances are, that in Python this will be only 10-functions library or so
Take care, and be sure to try Python out. I think, that with such needs/approach to programming languages as yours, Python will be a pleasant adventure.
As someone else already pointed out good sides of Python... Here's my $0.25 about PHP:
"24 or so years" and "PHP - the language that seems elegant"... That's the best example, that even if you do something for a long, long time you can still be very, very wrong.
PHP is not elegant and has a very poor object model. Also, it is pretty impossible to implement some of design patterns in it because of that. PHP has inconsistent API, PHP has a long way to go before it could be considered a serious language. Popularity? So what. Windows XP is also widely used.
click here
Anyway, I don't have enough time recently to continue the development at a higher pace...
Please help with the development!
I understand, that being a NVidia user, you couldn't mod that other way. Oh well. At least I've got something, that works really good and has opensource drivers for it.
You don't.
Have a nice day!
Dear Anonymous Cowards,
I think you hardly have any idea what's my point.
Anyway:
IT IS THE DRIVERS I COMPARE, NOT THE HARDWARE!
Perhaps now some of you get it. ATI opensource drivers are better option, at least for the configuration I want to use.
Sincerely,
--
dotz
And "this anonymous coward" perhaps didn't get the idea, that the nvidia clone was no-brand and cheap and it wasn't suited for such displays by definition. I never said NVidias have loosy display, because this depends on the extra parts on the hardware, not the chip itself - but I do say, that NVidia drivers suck bad, when compared to opensource ones for ATI. That's all. "If the story is even true"... jeez christ.
I have used a cheap NVidia Riva TNT since about 2 years; Linux drivers were buggy and hanged the machine from time to time; same for FreeBSD drivers - they made machine unstable.
As I've bought a bigger CRT display (21'), it came out, that there is some "ghosting" effect on that cheap NVidia, and I need to replace it with something better, just because my cheap clone was based on the hardware unsuitable for big displays. I have heard, that ATI somehow "supports" opensource communities - or at least gives them more information, than NVidia team.
I've bought Radeon 9200 and tried FreeBSD's 4.9 DRI + XFree86 4.3.0 drivers with it.
I was stunned. Everything worked as expected, no problems at all, no hangs, no sudden reboots, no nothing.
Of cource, NVidia is making some progress in the drivers stability; also, their equipment for sure gets better each day - but I was so shocked with the stability & ease of setup of opensource ATI drivers, that I am not going to buy/recommend any other graphics cards.
The bad thing about commercial OS' is that the manufacturers have sometimes to decide, if it would be worth to release a half-baked product just to get some customers, before their concurrents get them.
;]
The bad thing about open/free OS' is that you sometimes have to release a half-baked OS with a new number, to get more people testing it (Linux 2.6.0 or FreeBSD 5.x releases - which was never called "stable", BTW)
And, who gets hit by those above? We, users. Damnit.
I exactly known, what you mean about the ports system. FYI, you don't mean "the port system itself", you just have problems with installation of binary packages.
.tgz or .tbz - that's a bit confusing. You're right. It can be done better, just like the way Debian does that. Debian simply rocks when it comes to binary packages - and I am pretty happy, that it exists, so it showed the way in this area.
;). In fact, it can even be the basic package system on your Slack (and it is available from some time, so you don't have to create another Slackware-packaging-system). Oh, wel.
;)
;) Or, perhaps, noone likes to answer troll comments - but you've got a point with that packaging system, so that's why I bothered ;)
Of course, you can pkg_add http://URL, and it will automatically fetch dependent packages, but the problem is, you need to know the exact url. Package name, package version,
I suppose I will be doing some work in this area with NetBSD packages collection (pkgsrc), but that should be easily portable to FreeBSD and OpenBSD ports. The whole idea is, that if you generate an index file for all binary packages on the site. Information would include the description, requirements, size - pretty much everything found in +* files (+DESCR, +COMMENT, +PLIST and other) - perhaps I could use Berkeley DB format for it. Then, in an user-level utility, you just need to give one URL to fetch that description file (bzipped, of course). Then, such utility could work much like Debian's apt-get and apt-cache - a frontend to pkg_add and a quick way to browse all available, but uninstalled software. We'd have a friendly utility for new users for all BSDs.
Also, as pkgsrc is portable and there are already binary packages avialable for Linux (not to mention NetBSD, of course) from the latest branch of pkgsrc -- we'd just need to add that small utility to bootstrap binary kit for pkgsrc, and you'd have then binary pkgsrc available for your box -- pretty much for all Linux distributions. These are all cool projects, and they can give you perhaps much more, than some Linux distributions (especially those ones, who "lock" user in a maze of incompatible binary packages and their dependencies
And, perhaps, if FreeBSD Ports not impress you, when compared to Gentoo, perhaps you should try then NetBSD packages collection. Maybe the number of operating systems and platforms will somehow impress you, it impress me for sure. Of course, there are bigger and smaller problems, as they always are, in any opensource product, but perhaps with more users activley contributing to the project (just by testing the packages -- that's just using some of your CPU cycles on pkgsrc, instead SETI@Home
BSD? Dead? I don't think so. There's massive active development going on in all areas of each of the BSDs, there are thousands of lines of code shared among developers, lot of new ideas submited, lots of problems solved. There are a lot of companies and sites using it (among others, About.com, Yahoo!, distributed.net, Juniper, NASA)... Check uptime stats on Netcraft itself, FreeBSD rules in the top ten.
Its just perhaps BSD people are usually too busy doing their projects to comment here, so you can get a false impression
Have a nice day!
Of course, I fully understand, that the whole idea of "is dying" posts is to get new people here (who show a bit of zealotry) envolved. Anyway - I hardly see such people recently, and even if you manage to get some 'copy-n-paste' replies, they got tired of posting them after a while. But I still thing trolling here could change a bit. Esp. recently, when some guy came up with a post, that he runs OpenBSD on a 4-CPU machine. That was pretty funy, in fact.
As it seems, that 90% of the trolling today was sent as Anonymous Coward, perhaps disabling anonymous posting completly would make BSD section of slashdot a nice place to discuss again, just like it should be.
Perhaps, without all these troll posts, Slashdot forum could become a good way to exchange information about BSD vs Linux, or just about BSD in general. As you can see, in the quality discussion, that happened here -- perhaps some Sparc64 FreeBSD users will switch to Gentoo if they want video; perhaps some people trying to install Gentoo on displayless Sparcs will try BSD.
That was just 1 article and 3 comments, and it already helped a few people.
Perhaps, BSD people, who post here stories, could get together and send a petition in some form to Rob Malda, as there is not much sense in seiding him individual e-mails. The situation is not too good.
And, to the trolling crowd... well, in general, I really admire the way you're having fun - all that trolling folklore can be really much creative, and sometimes i ROTFLed watching your nonsense replies - all those penisbird ASCIIs, hidden links to goatse, "mod parent down, site is a goatse link" when the parent was 100% good URL - yea, that was trolling, but that was acceptable trolling, if you ask me (well, I like Monthy Python also, why shouldn't I like some of your posts). Anyway, you don't come up with anything fresh. All that "BSD is dying, you don't have to be Kreskin" - man, I've seen that many, many times. Why do you keep repeating this? It's not funny anymore, it's boring. Also, with some filtering it is very easy to cut it out. Another thing - perhaps if you'd spent some time on actually installing & using some of BSD systems a bit, you'd realize, that BSDs - as all operating systems - have their weak points. Perhaps moving the level of trolling frmo nonsense copy-paste to highly specialized flamewar could bring anything new to the table, because now you aren't creative anymore. And non-creative troll is a lame troll, if you ask me. So, I suggest, that you rather come up with something new, or copy-paste "BSD is dying" posts somewhere else - because continuing to do that doesn't impress me much, really.
http://deadly.org