Frankly, I would like to see the SCO icon as a stylized weasel, or even, done with the utmost good taste, a fresh cowpie with steam rising off it. But that might be a bit much.:)
"...SCO has not been trying to spread fear, uncertainty and doubt to end users. We have been educating end users on the risks of running an operating system that is an unauthorized derivative of UNIX." - Darth McBride, Corporate Extortion Officer, S.tupid C.orporate O.gre
This guy is a piece of work! He can lie out of both sides of his mouth at the same time! What an ability!
SCO back as early as January 2003 (maybe a bit more) started making spurious IP mutterings.
They file suit against IBM in March 2003, telling IBM to "comply with our licensing demands or suffer the consequences".
Then, when that does get SCO purchased by IBM, they directly target Linux users with their threatening letter.
Darth and other officers at SCO make numerous statements, at times contradicting the other officers, then their own individual statements when trying to "correct" or "clarify" what they said.
So now Darth is "surprised" that someone finally told them, through RedHat's suit to "shut your gosh darn mouth, you lying piece of worm ridden filth! Put up or shut up!"
Good bye, SCO, I will not send my condolences when your company ceased to exist.
I just purchased the CDs of the Debian distro, should have it today.
I will be making a donation to the legal fund.
I have nothing against RedHat, I am a fledgling Linux user at best. But they won points in my book for just filing the suit, it will make SCO's officers lips flap less at least, which is a Good Thing.
Given that RedHat is the largest distributor of Linux (I believe that is correct, anyway), it make more sense for them to file such a suit than any other Linux distributor.
Yeah, the will get some PR strokes for getting their name out and being on the side of "right".
But, at the same time, it also gets PR for Linux in general, which is good for all, IMHO.
I tip my hat (hehe) to RedHat for doing this. It will at almost stop the garbage being spewed by SCO's officers.
The funny thing is, that SCO's statements have been, uh, entertaining at least. It has been fun watching one of their officers say one thing, another contradict it, the first one then contradicting themself, etc. Better then a keystone cops serial. The more they spoke, the more rope it created for IBM (and now RedHat) to hang the SCO with.
I would call SCO stupid, if they weren't so imcompentent.
The mouse (SCO) slaps the elephant (IBM) with its tiny gauntlet and says "I challenge you to a duel!"
The elephant carefully ponders its options, gathering data that will lead to the eventual crushing stomp and flattening of said mouse.
A top hatted party goer (RedHat) wanders by, and says "Hey, your duel is making my party a lot less fun!" The top hatted party goer smacks the mouse with his cane, and challenges the mouse ot a duel.
You could say, the mouse knew the job was dangerous when it took it. However, the mouse wasn't that wasn't too smart to begin with, IMHO.
Yeah, I read that the kernel source was there up to early July 2003.
I have searched for it in the past two weeks and see a "patch" but not the kernel itself, at least what I can tell is the kernel.
Seems the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre finally realized, after they said they were not distributing the source anymore, that they actually were for about six weeks or more, and finally removed it.
If anyone has logs of having downloaded the kernel source (complete with the code they say was "copied" to it) after their announcment that they were not distributing it, I am sure certain parties (you could guess who) would be very happy to receive that data from you.
A product is a valuable item (article, etc.) or service in the hands of the person (organization, etc.) that needs and or wants it.
Yes, there is a "process" involved in learning about, installing, tweaking Linux, but that is a secondary thing, IMHO.
Linux is a product that gives a user of it certain things, freedom from oppressive licensing, the freedom to tweak (source level), help a person handle e-mail, browse the web, network with other computers and on and on.
It is a "commodity" only in the sense that it is a tool that helps people do what they want to do with their computers, at a fraction of the cost (money and personal freedom) than other "products" out there.
Re "Flaw 1" - They did have a German staff member around the time the "infrigement" took place. It appears that they sanctioned, at least the first part, of migrating the SMP code to Linux. Additionally, there are statements from Caldera around that time, that seem to point in the direction that the company 1) intended to and 2) did in fact get their source code into Linux.
Caldera intentionally GPL'ed the code, from my research into the matter, the later distribution of the code was just the intended result of that.
The current management, which started about July 2002, evidently is either extremely stupid or intentionally are trying to "forget" this, hoping that their current stock scheme (er.. business strategy) will help them line their pockets.
I would suggest that SCO adopt a weasel as their mascot. However, I would not want fine upstanding weasels' reputations to be marred as a result.
I almost cannot determine whether lawyers or SCO board members (and senior execs) are the lowest order of life form. I am hedging towards SCO, as I have at least met one lawyer that was honest and ethical (hard to believe I know, but true).
I agree to a point, however, I see indicators pointing this way:
SCO is trying to push the slaim that JFS, NUMA and at least two other packages, which IBM holds the copyrights to, are "derivative works" of IBM's licensec System V Unix, covered by previous contract with AT&T. That is the only "IP" angle SCO is trying to work. The rest of the items in the suit hinge on this one very shaky item.
That is a very very far stretch, and the likelyhood of a judge agreeing that these are "derivative" works, is a pipe dream at best.
If that fails, the rest of SCO's case has no basis at all.
Also, SCO is very much aware that they "consciously" contributed code to Linux under the GPL, at least their pre-McBride management anyway. The fact that they distributed the code under the GPL and the fact that there are records showing them contributing to Linux (somewhere between 2.4 and 2.5 kernel) gives them even less of a leg to stand on.
IMHO, this will not even get to a trail. Pre-liminary hearings and possibly start of discovery, only to have SCO notice that the "light at the end of the tunnel is a train", with them desparately trying to work a settlement with IBM to try to further line their pockets.
Linux will continue to thrive and expand, IBM will come out smelling like a rose, SCO will be a blip in the memory of modern-day computing and Microsoft will look for their next sacrificial lamb (er.. FUD puppet) to try to continue their Linux bashing as much behind the scenes as possible.
Yes, I am an optimist, but I have looked at the potential of IBM losing as well (very very unlikely IMHO) and Linux still will come out on top, after a minor slow to handle the trial fallout.
And, I say, let SCO keep flapping their gums. They are just giving IBM, the Linux community, their customers and the SEC, more rope to hang SCO with. The more they say, the more stupid and absurd they appear.
They are donig their research, documenting that which needs to be documented, etc.
Additionally, the longer that takes, the more time the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre officers have to repeatedly open their mouths and insert their feet. The more they talk and say, the ammo it gives gives IBM (and others actually) to squash them like bugs. If the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre was smart (and collectively, the company isn't), they would just shut up and try to quietly work their extortion (er.. licensing) deals until the first court actions start.
However, that does not fit into their pump and dump stock scheme (uh, strategy). Which is the very thing that is going to get them dismantled in court in their suit with IBM, with the "death blow" delivered by the SEC, most probably.
Boy, you hit my biggest sore point on Micorsift products.
Early on, Windows 3.1, I found their help very "unhelpful", non-intuitive, etc.
Now, about 15 or so years later (from my first use of Windows), I find help for their other OSes and even products (Word 97, VC++ IDE, etc.) to be very very poor.
I have grown up a bit, technically, since my pre-DOS days (running old Unix and other older OSes on military communications systems). I am a fledgling C programmer and cutting my teeth on Java.
I have found some very helpful manuals, write ups, etc. for the technical areas I have since studied.
I still find Micorsift products help and other documentation to be very lacking indeed.
I am in a much better position to comment on such things now, as I have been a technical documentation writer and help system author for over five years now, for very specialized CAD software.
Micorsift could do a lot better in that area, if they wanted. It takes a lot of work, you really have to get into the heads of the "average" user, you have to provide detailed and exact data and instructions. I would much rather have detailed (almost to the point of boring and redundant) help and documentation than little or none.
I suspect that there are two reasons for the lack of helpful documentation from Micorsift:
1. It is not given the attention it needs to make it actually useful and 2. If they publish too much, it could reveal, in their view, too much "trade secret" or general IP material.
So, about the only way you can tell if are not infringing on their trademarks or IP in general, is that you have not received a letter from M$ notifying you of your infringement./wink
I believe that IBM (RedHat, SuSe, etc.) could take SCO to court and attempt to have an injunction placed on SCO regarding their unsubstantiated claims regarding Linux, until the court proceedings are over.
I am certain similar things have occurred in the past here in the good ol' U.S. of A.
And the suit filed (as ammended) is only about a contract dispute with IBM, breach of contract, etc.
The S.tupid C.orporate O.gre has been spreading "FUD" that it is about patents, copyright, IP, etc. None of this is actually part of their suit at all.
Their PR statements (i.e. FUD) are just designed to get them into the news, pump up their stock price, and line their pockets.
They may or may not have a case, IMHO, they do not have a case at all and the case will not even get to trial. SCO will try to bail sometime during the discovery phase, possibly with them settling with IBM for pennies on the dollar (meaning IBM buys SCO for next to nothing and SCO goes bah-bye).
No, won't buy them now, that's for sure.
With restrictions to stock given to some (or all) of S.tupid C.orporate O.gre's board or senior executives expiring on 31 October 2003, watch for large amounts of stock to be dumped, and the value shortly after drop to almost nothing.
By that time, some of the discovery phase of the court action will be done, and IBM will have more than enough ammo to proably offer that SCO settle for a buyout of pennies on the dollar.
At which point, the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will be no more.
However, it is possible that some of this "ammo" gets out before the 31 October 2003 date, and the stock will be worthless by then, that would be a fitting present for the board and senior executives of the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre, IMHO.
Regards,
Fredrick
If the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre would show the code in question (which they won't, but more on that in a moment) the code could be removed.
However, the reason the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will not do so, is so they can continue to make baseless claims and hope that people pay them money to prevent, the possibility, that the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will sue them.
I understand that, in a few months, restrictions on sales of stock owned by some (or most) of the corporate officers of the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will be lifted. Then, watch the mad mad rush to sell large blocks of stock before their house of cards crashes down around their heads.
Only problem is, for the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre, is that they will then have 1) IBM, 2) the open source community (including Linux users, developers, etc.), 3) their own customers and probably 4) Linux distributors (RedHat, etc.), 5) their investors, 6) the SEC and 7) FTC, suing or procesecuting them for years and years to come.
I am having a hard time believing that the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre could be so "stupid" to burn as many bridge (or potential bridges) they are currently setting fire to (i.e. burning). But maybe I am giving them more credit than they deserve. Maybe the board and the corporate executives of the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre are that stupid!
Regards,
Fredrick
Yep. The case is about disclosure of "trade secrets" and violation of "contract".
However, the smoke that SCO is spewing out their behind is (before the copyright registration):
We have intellectual property, it is in Linux, as a result all Linux users should pay us and then we won't sue you.
After their copyright registration (which actually proves nothing):
See, we have the copyright on Unix, so you betta be really scared now and pay us to prevent us from suing you.
All of which, from the newsgroups and forums I have seen, have been responded to with:
0./middle finger
1./middle finger and more of it
2./uh what?
3./yawn
4./long sustained yawn
5./should I really send them money?
6./I'm scared, think I am going to send them money.
And probably other responses.
Regards,
Fredrick
I agree.
IBM really has to do nothing until the court proceedings start, which will probably consist of a hearing, IBM asking for the judge to dismiss such a baseless case.
If denied, then discovery, during which, I suspect, the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will cringe and try to sneak with their tail between their legs.
Then, possibly, IBM counter-sues, SCO settles out-of-court and ceases to exist, IBM and the Linux community, put on their cowboy hats and walk off into the sunset.
The S.tupid C.orporate O.gre becomes a mere blip in the memory of modern day computing.
Regards,
Fredrick
Slashdot Mirror
Frankly, I would like to see the SCO icon as a stylized weasel, or even, done with the utmost good taste, a fresh cowpie with steam rising off it. But that might be a bit much. :)
ROFL!
...." Darth SCOver wheezes. (Cue sinister music).
Even worse:
"Linux, I'm your father, join me on the dark side
Regards,
Fredrick
"...SCO has not been trying to spread fear, uncertainty and doubt to end users. We have been educating end users on the risks of running an operating system that is an unauthorized derivative of UNIX."
- Darth McBride, Corporate Extortion Officer, S.tupid C.orporate O.gre
This guy is a piece of work! He can lie out of both sides of his mouth at the same time! What an ability!
SCO back as early as January 2003 (maybe a bit more) started making spurious IP mutterings.
They file suit against IBM in March 2003, telling IBM to "comply with our licensing demands or suffer the consequences".
Then, when that does get SCO purchased by IBM, they directly target Linux users with their threatening letter.
Darth and other officers at SCO make numerous statements, at times contradicting the other officers, then their own individual statements when trying to "correct" or "clarify" what they said.
So now Darth is "surprised" that someone finally told them, through RedHat's suit to "shut your gosh darn mouth, you lying piece of worm ridden filth! Put up or shut up!"
Good bye, SCO, I will not send my condolences when your company ceased to exist.
Regards,
Fredrick
I agree.
I just purchased the CDs of the Debian distro, should have it today.
I will be making a donation to the legal fund.
I have nothing against RedHat, I am a fledgling Linux user at best. But they won points in my book for just filing the suit, it will make SCO's officers lips flap less at least, which is a Good Thing.
Regards,
Fredrick
Given that RedHat is the largest distributor of Linux (I believe that is correct, anyway), it make more sense for them to file such a suit than any other Linux distributor.
Yeah, the will get some PR strokes for getting their name out and being on the side of "right".
But, at the same time, it also gets PR for Linux in general, which is good for all, IMHO.
I tip my hat (hehe) to RedHat for doing this. It will at almost stop the garbage being spewed by SCO's officers.
The funny thing is, that SCO's statements have been, uh, entertaining at least. It has been fun watching one of their officers say one thing, another contradict it, the first one then contradicting themself, etc. Better then a keystone cops serial. The more they spoke, the more rope it created for IBM (and now RedHat) to hang the SCO with.
I would call SCO stupid, if they weren't so imcompentent.
Regards,
Fredrick
Fine, let them do it.
The more they do so, the more data regarding such activity will come out in discovery and other court documents.
This would probably be enough ammo to then correctly handle Micorsift in regards to their DoJ "oversight".
This type of activity, IMHO, will eventually be even more damaging to Micorsift in the long run.
But given the little hand slap the courts delivered to Micorsift, maybe nothing will result, we shall see.
Regards,
Fredrick
Just read the whole suit.
:)
RedHat just got a couple mod points in my book.
This suit also places SCO on notice that their public statements can and WILL be used against them in a court of law.
I bet we hear a lot less "public" statements from the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre now.
I can't wait to see SCO crushed like the bug(s) they are.
Regards,
Fredrick
Yeah, but this actually makes even more sense.
The mouse (SCO) slaps the elephant (IBM) with its tiny gauntlet and says "I challenge you to a duel!"
The elephant carefully ponders its options, gathering data that will lead to the eventual crushing stomp and flattening of said mouse.
A top hatted party goer (RedHat) wanders by, and says "Hey, your duel is making my party a lot less fun!" The top hatted party goer smacks the mouse with his cane, and challenges the mouse ot a duel.
You could say, the mouse knew the job was dangerous when it took it. However, the mouse wasn't that wasn't too smart to begin with, IMHO.
I will not weep, when said mouse is pulverized.
Regards,
Fredrick
Yeah, I read that the kernel source was there up to early July 2003.
I have searched for it in the past two weeks and see a "patch" but not the kernel itself, at least what I can tell is the kernel.
Seems the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre finally realized, after they said they were not distributing the source anymore, that they actually were for about six weeks or more, and finally removed it.
If anyone has logs of having downloaded the kernel source (complete with the code they say was "copied" to it) after their announcment that they were not distributing it, I am sure certain parties (you could guess who) would be very happy to receive that data from you.
Regards,
Fredrick
A product is a valuable item (article, etc.) or service in the hands of the person (organization, etc.) that needs and or wants it.
Yes, there is a "process" involved in learning about, installing, tweaking Linux, but that is a secondary thing, IMHO.
Linux is a product that gives a user of it certain things, freedom from oppressive licensing, the freedom to tweak (source level), help a person handle e-mail, browse the web, network with other computers and on and on.
It is a "commodity" only in the sense that it is a tool that helps people do what they want to do with their computers, at a fraction of the cost (money and personal freedom) than other "products" out there.
Regards,
Fredrick
Re "Flaw 1" - They did have a German staff member around the time the "infrigement" took place. It appears that they sanctioned, at least the first part, of migrating the SMP code to Linux. Additionally, there are statements from Caldera around that time, that seem to point in the direction that the company 1) intended to and 2) did in fact get their source code into Linux.
Caldera intentionally GPL'ed the code, from my research into the matter, the later distribution of the code was just the intended result of that.
The current management, which started about July 2002, evidently is either extremely stupid or intentionally are trying to "forget" this, hoping that their current stock scheme (er.. business strategy) will help them line their pockets.
I would suggest that SCO adopt a weasel as their mascot. However, I would not want fine upstanding weasels' reputations to be marred as a result.
I almost cannot determine whether lawyers or SCO board members (and senior execs) are the lowest order of life form. I am hedging towards SCO, as I have at least met one lawyer that was honest and ethical (hard to believe I know, but true).
frkiii
I agree to a point, however, I see indicators pointing this way:
SCO is trying to push the slaim that JFS, NUMA and at least two other packages, which IBM holds the copyrights to, are "derivative works" of IBM's licensec System V Unix, covered by previous contract with AT&T. That is the only "IP" angle SCO is trying to work. The rest of the items in the suit hinge on this one very shaky item.
That is a very very far stretch, and the likelyhood of a judge agreeing that these are "derivative" works, is a pipe dream at best.
If that fails, the rest of SCO's case has no basis at all.
Also, SCO is very much aware that they "consciously" contributed code to Linux under the GPL, at least their pre-McBride management anyway. The fact that they distributed the code under the GPL and the fact that there are records showing them contributing to Linux (somewhere between 2.4 and 2.5 kernel) gives them even less of a leg to stand on.
IMHO, this will not even get to a trail. Pre-liminary hearings and possibly start of discovery, only to have SCO notice that the "light at the end of the tunnel is a train", with them desparately trying to work a settlement with IBM to try to further line their pockets.
Linux will continue to thrive and expand, IBM will come out smelling like a rose, SCO will be a blip in the memory of modern-day computing and Microsoft will look for their next sacrificial lamb (er.. FUD puppet) to try to continue their Linux bashing as much behind the scenes as possible.
Yes, I am an optimist, but I have looked at the potential of IBM losing as well (very very unlikely IMHO) and Linux still will come out on top, after a minor slow to handle the trial fallout.
And, I say, let SCO keep flapping their gums. They are just giving IBM, the Linux community, their customers and the SEC, more rope to hang SCO with. The more they say, the more stupid and absurd they appear.
Regards,
Fredrick
Frankly, IBM is doing just fine.
They are donig their research, documenting that which needs to be documented, etc.
Additionally, the longer that takes, the more time the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre officers have to repeatedly open their mouths and insert their feet. The more they talk and say, the ammo it gives gives IBM (and others actually) to squash them like bugs. If the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre was smart (and collectively, the company isn't), they would just shut up and try to quietly work their extortion (er.. licensing) deals until the first court actions start.
However, that does not fit into their pump and dump stock scheme (uh, strategy). Which is the very thing that is going to get them dismantled in court in their suit with IBM, with the "death blow" delivered by the SEC, most probably.
Regards,
Fredrick
Uh, copyrights are also for a limited duration.
So many years after the first publication, if I am not mistaken, but there is definitely a "time limit".
Regards,
Fredrick
Boy, you hit my biggest sore point on Micorsift products.
/wink
Early on, Windows 3.1, I found their help very "unhelpful", non-intuitive, etc.
Now, about 15 or so years later (from my first use of Windows), I find help for their other OSes and even products (Word 97, VC++ IDE, etc.) to be very very poor.
I have grown up a bit, technically, since my pre-DOS days (running old Unix and other older OSes on military communications systems). I am a fledgling C programmer and cutting my teeth on Java.
I have found some very helpful manuals, write ups, etc. for the technical areas I have since studied.
I still find Micorsift products help and other documentation to be very lacking indeed.
I am in a much better position to comment on such things now, as I have been a technical documentation writer and help system author for over five years now, for very specialized CAD software.
Micorsift could do a lot better in that area, if they wanted. It takes a lot of work, you really have to get into the heads of the "average" user, you have to provide detailed and exact data and instructions. I would much rather have detailed (almost to the point of boring and redundant) help and documentation than little or none.
I suspect that there are two reasons for the lack of helpful documentation from Micorsift:
1. It is not given the attention it needs to make it actually useful and
2. If they publish too much, it could reveal, in their view, too much "trade secret" or general IP material.
So, about the only way you can tell if are not infringing on their trademarks or IP in general, is that you have not received a letter from M$ notifying you of your infringement.
Regards,
Fredrick
I believe that IBM (RedHat, SuSe, etc.) could take SCO to court and attempt to have an injunction placed on SCO regarding their unsubstantiated claims regarding Linux, until the court proceedings are over.
I am certain similar things have occurred in the past here in the good ol' U.S. of A.
Regards,
Fredrick
And the suit filed (as ammended) is only about a contract dispute with IBM, breach of contract, etc.
The S.tupid C.orporate O.gre has been spreading "FUD" that it is about patents, copyright, IP, etc. None of this is actually part of their suit at all.
Their PR statements (i.e. FUD) are just designed to get them into the news, pump up their stock price, and line their pockets.
They may or may not have a case, IMHO, they do not have a case at all and the case will not even get to trial. SCO will try to bail sometime during the discovery phase, possibly with them settling with IBM for pennies on the dollar (meaning IBM buys SCO for next to nothing and SCO goes bah-bye).
Regards,
Fredrick
No, won't buy them now, that's for sure. With restrictions to stock given to some (or all) of S.tupid C.orporate O.gre's board or senior executives expiring on 31 October 2003, watch for large amounts of stock to be dumped, and the value shortly after drop to almost nothing. By that time, some of the discovery phase of the court action will be done, and IBM will have more than enough ammo to proably offer that SCO settle for a buyout of pennies on the dollar. At which point, the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will be no more. However, it is possible that some of this "ammo" gets out before the 31 October 2003 date, and the stock will be worthless by then, that would be a fitting present for the board and senior executives of the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre, IMHO. Regards, Fredrick
If the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre would show the code in question (which they won't, but more on that in a moment) the code could be removed. However, the reason the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will not do so, is so they can continue to make baseless claims and hope that people pay them money to prevent, the possibility, that the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will sue them. I understand that, in a few months, restrictions on sales of stock owned by some (or most) of the corporate officers of the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will be lifted. Then, watch the mad mad rush to sell large blocks of stock before their house of cards crashes down around their heads. Only problem is, for the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre, is that they will then have 1) IBM, 2) the open source community (including Linux users, developers, etc.), 3) their own customers and probably 4) Linux distributors (RedHat, etc.), 5) their investors, 6) the SEC and 7) FTC, suing or procesecuting them for years and years to come. I am having a hard time believing that the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre could be so "stupid" to burn as many bridge (or potential bridges) they are currently setting fire to (i.e. burning). But maybe I am giving them more credit than they deserve. Maybe the board and the corporate executives of the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre are that stupid! Regards, Fredrick
Yep. The case is about disclosure of "trade secrets" and violation of "contract". However, the smoke that SCO is spewing out their behind is (before the copyright registration): We have intellectual property, it is in Linux, as a result all Linux users should pay us and then we won't sue you. After their copyright registration (which actually proves nothing): See, we have the copyright on Unix, so you betta be really scared now and pay us to prevent us from suing you. All of which, from the newsgroups and forums I have seen, have been responded to with: 0. /middle finger
1. /middle finger and more of it
2. /uh what?
3. /yawn
4. /long sustained yawn
5. /should I really send them money?
6. /I'm scared, think I am going to send them money.
And probably other responses.
Regards,
Fredrick
I agree. IBM really has to do nothing until the court proceedings start, which will probably consist of a hearing, IBM asking for the judge to dismiss such a baseless case. If denied, then discovery, during which, I suspect, the S.tupid C.orporate O.gre will cringe and try to sneak with their tail between their legs. Then, possibly, IBM counter-sues, SCO settles out-of-court and ceases to exist, IBM and the Linux community, put on their cowboy hats and walk off into the sunset. The S.tupid C.orporate O.gre becomes a mere blip in the memory of modern day computing. Regards, Fredrick