And if you knew what all those defines meant (like LPCSTR and LPWSTR) then you'd understand WHY the actual declarations look like they do. Contrary to popular belief, they do have a clue to some extent and 99 times out of 100, they have far more of a clue than the people telling us how wrong they are or how bad their code is.
Ethics and Morals are an invention OF the media companies in order to get you to pay for what should be free. Content/Information wants to be free?!@$!@%!@111
I use a DVR and still watch many commercials. Sometimes I forget to skip them. Sometimes I like to watch them.
Good advertising still works, bad advertising still doesn't work.
The only way DVRs will render commercials completely useless is if they suddenly perfect automatic removal of commercials, which isn't perfect at this point and sometimes results in missing part of the short in exchange for catching the end of a commercial.
Then there is live TV, where you can't skip commercials. You can't jump forward in time. Of course many people, myself included, will wait 30 minutes into a show before watching it, so I can skip the commercials, but thats not live TV anymore.
I'll be more inclined to leave commercials when they stop using audio at a MUCH higher level than the show itself. Part of the reason I skip commercials is because I'm laying in bed with the wife sleeping next to me, commercials are so disconnected from the previous audio in both volume and general feeling that they will bother her, were as the normal television at a low volume is fine.
I'll pay for that IF there is no DRM so I can use MY DVR software and ONLY IF they sign a contract stating that they can never add commercials to the service I subscribe to.
Some of us have done what he does, for 5-10% of his price. Beyond a certain point in the size of a business your actual roll, responsibilities and work load no longer increase, you delegate. Since he doesn't actually assume more responsibility by working at a larger company, then yes, some of us are capable.
It may be different if he was somehow going to be held to a higher standard, but he isn't, its just the opposite actually. If he fails, he will get treated no differently than I would. Actually thats not true, he has a golden parachute and someone else would be more than happy to hire him elsewhere, ignoring his failure, because he 'knows people'.
Being the COO of a multi-billion dollar company is no different than being the COO from a multi-million dollar company, contrary to what you would expect.
What I wouldn't give to go back to when 'Its hard!' was not a valid excuse for not doing your job.
Its our own fault for not demanding better service. 2 year contracts let them get by with murder since you can't just jump ship and go to the better provider. While its not enforcing a monopoly, its certain promoting bad service and limiting consumer choice.
I do have some (very small) sympathy for a company that has seen a 5000% growth in data traffic. Who can realistically plan for that kind of growth?
Yes, when you order millions of iPhones, your subscriber base grows SUBSTANTIALLY and you offer unlimited data as a requirement it is to be expected. You are talking about the most hyped device in recent history, people were all over it long before it launched. We're not talking about Android which is really still a geek target and not something the general public cares about (yet) or Pre which really isn't impressive to anyone.
You know your blackberry users USE data and they don't have unlimited plans. There is no valid excuse for this condition. Its not 'some overloading in a few locations that grew faster than expected' its 'the entire network is overloaded, and was overloaded on the day of release'. Its 'We didn't plan for our 3G release, even after having a YEAR of the older model getting high data usage.
You can plan for it rather easy. You give some phones out in advanced and see how they get used. (We'll call this the original iPhone which was give out a YEAR before the 3G model) Find the average usage (Mine is roughly ~200MB/month and I'm a light user), multiply that by the number of phones that were expected to sell, or AT LEAST by the number YOU BOUGHT TO SELL FROM YOUR OWN STORES ON THE FIRST DAY (which they did pre-orders so again, plenty of data to work with), and thats at least a starting point, but they didn't bother to do that.
Yes, but most of us have more important things to worry about.
Do you worry about what credit card companies do with your purchase history? I don't, but to me its certainly more valuable then my search history since my search history consists of searchs I do for others, random searchs for stuff I read somewhere else on the net, like slashdot, and of course the stuff I actually search for directly.
My CC purchase history is pretty much exclusive to those in my family, heavily weight towards myself. FAR more useful information if you want to be paranoid.
I just dont' have the time to be paranoid over what many people are already aware of. My mailman has more accurate knowledge of my activities than Google. The fact that they automate it and do it for millions of people doesn't scare me more, it scares me less, I'm one fish in the ocean, NO ONE cares about ME. No one cares about you either, you aren't special.
Which google is more than happy to honor. I use it all the time to get a good smattering of text in alternate languages and layouts to test Unicode compliance and functionality in software I work on.
Search for something common, but with your language preference set to some RTL language and you'll get some nice real world example text to play with, useful before you've made it to the point of writing up your unit tests.
Because your openid login oage is not a google page, and they don't know your google prefs? Do you even know how OpenID works?
They'll give you dutch results as well because they are probably more relevant to English speakers in those areas.
I'm sorry you weren't aware of it, but 'Google' is not 'The Internet' and when you get bounced to another site, you get what that site offers, and not what your Google settings are. Unless you want Google to openly share your settings with everyone... which I'm sure you'd raise holy hell over as well.
The problem is, the paranoid people who care about the dashboard still haven't figure out that no one really gives a shit what they do on the Internet.
They are still under the assumption that someone actually cares what they do.
Its not the galaxy you have to worry about, its Earth. And normal carbon atoms don't consume others that get close enough, they repel them at a certain point. Of course, if you put one of these black holes on the end of a popsicle stick, it'd take years to devour the stick, which would give us plenty of time to design some sort of containment unit to keep other mass from adding to the problem.
Of course there is no actual proof that being 'sucked into a black hole' will destroy anything, its all pure theory.
Assuming that crossing the event horizon causes a conversion from mass to energy for some reason, thats still not something to be concerned about since the theoretical time dilation effects as you move closer to the event horizon are going to make it so you never really cross the event horizon.
The next assumption is that you'll be torn apart by the gravitational pull, but this is also likely as incorrect as the theories about the pressure being too great on the ocean floor for life to survive. I'm more inclined to believe the gravitational stresses would cause death, but I also believed that life couldn't survive at the very deepest parts of the ocean.
One thing science has taught me, and taught me well is more often than not, our theories are wrong. Just because there are 'great minds' working on this doesn't change that, these minds are working on 'great things'.
You realize that your last sentence basically describes what FatELF would appear as to the end user, right? Except in the case of using multiple binaries they don't share segments at all. A FatELF binary would share segments other than the.code segment. Separate binaries will use more space than FatELF.
You could always strip the extra segments out if you wanted to.
GNOME didn't invent UAC, at a minimum you should have used sudo as your example since it was around before GNOME or UAC and is almost a direct equivalent for the command line, but it wasn't first. Both are essentially versions of su that work with the users own password rather than the root password directly.
OSX didn't event frilly desktop effects, NextStep and IRIX both had them before OSX existed. IRIX used an OpenGL desktop with effects in 1988.
I'm not arguing which is 'better', just that they invented well before Linux was even a gleam in Linus' eye. The newer remakes are certainly more advanced.
1: Ability - I can accept all of that, but when their response is 'we see this all the time, we're right, your wrong' after I've shown they clearly were not right. They say 'your server isn't accepting connections' I say 'but my other client can connect and works just fine' they say 'your server isn't listening for connections we know what we're talking about' I don't have to know anything about Myth to know they are just wastes of planetary resources at that point.
2: Affiliation - If you're going to suggest on your project website to go to a specific IRC channel, then you have to realize that the feeling people get in that channel is going to be directly associated with your project.
3: Incentive - It wasn't a matter of not getting a response, I got responses before I finished stating my problem.
4: Price - Flately wrong, I spent more time trying to get them to shutup long enough to hear me out than any savings they provided. Its not free, it cost me my time, and like it or not, reflects on the project itself.
Pay support may hide it but that doesn't excuse abusive behavior in 'free' support.
In your second list:
1 - ability - Considering the 'help' I got from one guy resulted in basically 'weird, it looks like everything is working from the log', then you'll get that pretty much in first layer support from anyone so I wouldn't have wasted any time.
2 - Affiliation - When the website says 'go here for help' and you go there, and get a bad experience, you associate it with the project, they did after all, suggest I go there. This is no different in paid support or with commercial products. A commercial vender suggests support from a company I have a bad experience with I certainly do expect the parent company to address the issue, I do hold it against them.
3 - Incentive - Citation needed. Paid services most certainly do care, maybe not the drones on the phone, but you are a paying customer, they want you to stay so they can keep getting paid with your money. They piss off to many customers, they don't get paid. The drones may not realize this, but too many complaints and they'll get fired. My company has support personal too, we most CERTAINLY care about what our customers think of their service.
At the end of the day, my problem was solved, by myself, at the cost of several hours of my time. I'm not sure if it would have been quicker if I had not joined or not. Its hard to say since I'm sure the interaction did sway my path to some extent, I don't know if I would have found it sooner or later since there was no specific part in the conversation that guided me to the problem. The one helpful soul came to the same conclusion I was at when I joined. 'the debug log says its working'. I finally gave up and started checking every configuration option one at a time, as I had a working client on another machine.
Were they rude? Depends on your exact definition. Yes, I think they were. After pointing out that the reasons they were giving me were not the case, and I get a response of 'we do this all the time we know more than you' even though they clearly did not know the problem in this case nor did they bother to even look at the fact that I had proof that it they were wrong. They made the choice to not acknowledge that I may not be a complete idiot or listen. You can see for yourself: http://pastebin.com/m2cfd19dd
I'm BitS in that log, read the first 40-50 lines if you'd like. I admit that I got frustrated, but I certainly tried initially to accept the fact that they deal with newbies all day long. I admit I was frustrated when I joined and tried to take that into consideration, there was no such consideration on the other side.
I did make a mistake in my original post, looking at that log, wagnerrp was there from the start and did make every attempt at being useful, even if he didn't solve the problem, I appreciate the effort either way.
They didn't even wait for me to fully explain the problem, and after I pointed out why those suggestions were wrong and I had verified them, nothing changed.
If you can't deal with newbies day in and day out its probably best to not answer. Like it or not these people, in the channel thats suggested to go to for help, represent the project. Doesn't matter how they are affiliated with it or not. You tell people to go someone to ask a question and get shitty 'service' the project gets a bad name. Newbies don't know who is actually affiliated with the project and who isn't, but they do know they are in a channel that the project suggested.
There are assholes on both sides, but I didn't join and call them jackasses, I joined and asked for help, and was trying to explain the situation when I get a bunch of silly answers that could not possibly apply spewed at me, not once, multiple times, even after pointing out why those answers did not apply.
This isn't a case of 'asshole comes in and tells them they are a bunch of shitheads with shitty software, and they respond by being an asshole'.
This is a case of 'someone joins, gets answers before the question is finished that are wrong, they don't bother to listen just keep repeating the same answer, and the person asking gets extremely frustrated'.
This is a case of those being 'helpful' acting like children. If you're going to treat everyone like an asshole, just replace the other clients with a bot who is abusive on join.
These are people who didn't actually know what they were talking about racing to provide an answer without knowing the problem so they can stroke their egos. Not the best way to win over new users, developers or otherwise.
Which is a little less one sided than your truncated version.
Yes, I admitted it was a configuration mistake, after it was tracked down. Of course you are ignoring the fact that the error was not any of the suggestions given, and that I pointed out that those reasons could not possibly be the problem since I could connect with another client.
The problem was not properly logged in the debug files.
The problem was not known or solved by anyone on the channel.
The problem was accepted as a bug by the devs.
I didn't smear MythTV, I pointed out how arrogant assholes can ruin someones experience and cause them to leave.
I said thank you because one of those people didn't assume that I was had no idea what I was doing.
I FOUND THE PROBLEM, and relayed the solution to the channel so MAYBE it could help someone else.
You entirely missed the point because just like my original statement, you assume you were right when NO ONE in the channel was right, myself included.
I'm going to have to assume, Anonymous Coward, that you were one of the arrogant and unhelpful assholes who pissed me off in the first place.
I realize its IRC, and its free help, but it STILL has an effect on people using the software. Considering its the channel that mythtv.org or mythbuntu.org suggests to ask for help in, that DOES mean its the place people go to ask for help and not being an arrogant prick is a good start.
I have no problem accepting 'Ive never seen that error' or 'your an idiot, you did this wrong' when you actually know the answer.
But I was told what I did wrong before I even finished stating the problem.
No, I was a retard and entered the MythTV backend port as the MySQL port in the DB setup.
I did eventually get enough input and brute forced my way into finding the solution.
Actually, it could have been many things to start with, I was on about my third or forth clean install of both the backend and frontend by that point, the IRC conversation was really related to that last problem.
I did find out about the unique id problem, and that may have been an issue in one of my earlier attempts, but by the time that took place I had already manually configured unique ids for my frontends to rule that out.
None of those things were invented by Linux, sorry to disappoint. Both are copying older OSes. Which is fine, but don't try to say Windows is copying Linux, its not.
Bell UNIX, sure. IRIX sure, Solaris Sure, OS X, yep, NextStep, without a doubt.
The problem was using the wrong port for the database server in the client configuration, a port that was open and listening, but not MySQL.
The MySQL client connects, MythTV says 'Okay, got the database!' and goes on to do other things as if everything is working properly. Then when it gets around to actually using the database it just locks up waiting for the DB to respond, but since its not actually talking to a database it doesn't respond, and the REAL problem is that it never times out either. It doesn't log any error.
I did eventually find the problem myself, using some good old debugging skills. I also informed the guy who was helping me since he spends a lot of time in the two mythtv channels I was asking in and may help someone in the future. I also logged the bug with copies of the config files, a detailed description of the error, and all the log files that the mythtv and mythbuntu devs asked for.
I'm not new to this game, it was a bug that no one had reported. Admittedly, it was a stupid configuration error that was my own fault. During my setup, I even checked the little 'check database connectivity' checkbox, to which it came back and said the database was working properly. As a user I went well beyond what you SHOULD expect out of an end user, because as a developer I realize how hard it can be to debug errors and how important to have the most complete picture possible. I even added step by step details for reproducing the problem in a default Mythbuntu install.
You are responding the exact same way as the initial response from the assholes I'm complaining about. You are arrogant and worthless for help because you think you know everything about a situation when you have no idea whats going on. You are the problem.
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Actually it would be:
And if you knew what all those defines meant (like LPCSTR and LPWSTR) then you'd understand WHY the actual declarations look like they do. Contrary to popular belief, they do have a clue to some extent and 99 times out of 100, they have far more of a clue than the people telling us how wrong they are or how bad their code is.
You still expect your child to not murder, cheat and steal, and you still expect them to be punished if they do. Regardless of how much they've grown.
Ethics and Morals are an invention OF the media companies in order to get you to pay for what should be free. Content/Information wants to be free?!@$!@%!@111
I use a DVR and still watch many commercials. Sometimes I forget to skip them. Sometimes I like to watch them.
Good advertising still works, bad advertising still doesn't work.
The only way DVRs will render commercials completely useless is if they suddenly perfect automatic removal of commercials, which isn't perfect at this point and sometimes results in missing part of the short in exchange for catching the end of a commercial.
Then there is live TV, where you can't skip commercials. You can't jump forward in time. Of course many people, myself included, will wait 30 minutes into a show before watching it, so I can skip the commercials, but thats not live TV anymore.
I'll be more inclined to leave commercials when they stop using audio at a MUCH higher level than the show itself. Part of the reason I skip commercials is because I'm laying in bed with the wife sleeping next to me, commercials are so disconnected from the previous audio in both volume and general feeling that they will bother her, were as the normal television at a low volume is fine.
I'll pay for that IF there is no DRM so I can use MY DVR software and ONLY IF they sign a contract stating that they can never add commercials to the service I subscribe to.
Some of us have done what he does, for 5-10% of his price. Beyond a certain point in the size of a business your actual roll, responsibilities and work load no longer increase, you delegate. Since he doesn't actually assume more responsibility by working at a larger company, then yes, some of us are capable.
It may be different if he was somehow going to be held to a higher standard, but he isn't, its just the opposite actually. If he fails, he will get treated no differently than I would. Actually thats not true, he has a golden parachute and someone else would be more than happy to hire him elsewhere, ignoring his failure, because he 'knows people'.
Being the COO of a multi-billion dollar company is no different than being the COO from a multi-million dollar company, contrary to what you would expect.
What I wouldn't give to go back to when 'Its hard!' was not a valid excuse for not doing your job.
Its our own fault for not demanding better service. 2 year contracts let them get by with murder since you can't just jump ship and go to the better provider. While its not enforcing a monopoly, its certain promoting bad service and limiting consumer choice.
Yes, when you order millions of iPhones, your subscriber base grows SUBSTANTIALLY and you offer unlimited data as a requirement it is to be expected. You are talking about the most hyped device in recent history, people were all over it long before it launched. We're not talking about Android which is really still a geek target and not something the general public cares about (yet) or Pre which really isn't impressive to anyone.
You know your blackberry users USE data and they don't have unlimited plans. There is no valid excuse for this condition. Its not 'some overloading in a few locations that grew faster than expected' its 'the entire network is overloaded, and was overloaded on the day of release'. Its 'We didn't plan for our 3G release, even after having a YEAR of the older model getting high data usage.
You can plan for it rather easy. You give some phones out in advanced and see how they get used. (We'll call this the original iPhone which was give out a YEAR before the 3G model) Find the average usage (Mine is roughly ~200MB/month and I'm a light user), multiply that by the number of phones that were expected to sell, or AT LEAST by the number YOU BOUGHT TO SELL FROM YOUR OWN STORES ON THE FIRST DAY (which they did pre-orders so again, plenty of data to work with), and thats at least a starting point, but they didn't bother to do that.
Yes, but most of us have more important things to worry about.
Do you worry about what credit card companies do with your purchase history? I don't, but to me its certainly more valuable then my search history since my search history consists of searchs I do for others, random searchs for stuff I read somewhere else on the net, like slashdot, and of course the stuff I actually search for directly.
My CC purchase history is pretty much exclusive to those in my family, heavily weight towards myself. FAR more useful information if you want to be paranoid.
I just dont' have the time to be paranoid over what many people are already aware of. My mailman has more accurate knowledge of my activities than Google. The fact that they automate it and do it for millions of people doesn't scare me more, it scares me less, I'm one fish in the ocean, NO ONE cares about ME. No one cares about you either, you aren't special.
Which google is more than happy to honor. I use it all the time to get a good smattering of text in alternate languages and layouts to test Unicode compliance and functionality in software I work on.
Search for something common, but with your language preference set to some RTL language and you'll get some nice real world example text to play with, useful before you've made it to the point of writing up your unit tests.
Because your openid login oage is not a google page, and they don't know your google prefs? Do you even know how OpenID works?
They'll give you dutch results as well because they are probably more relevant to English speakers in those areas.
I'm sorry you weren't aware of it, but 'Google' is not 'The Internet' and when you get bounced to another site, you get what that site offers, and not what your Google settings are. Unless you want Google to openly share your settings with everyone ... which I'm sure you'd raise holy hell over as well.
Yea, because we couldn't determine two of those three things of your username alone, real shocker.
The problem is, the paranoid people who care about the dashboard still haven't figure out that no one really gives a shit what they do on the Internet.
They are still under the assumption that someone actually cares what they do.
No, they aren't, pornhub logs your porn searchs, its not powered by google.
Or just a little paranoia to assume they are hiding something.
Its not the galaxy you have to worry about, its Earth. And normal carbon atoms don't consume others that get close enough, they repel them at a certain point. Of course, if you put one of these black holes on the end of a popsicle stick, it'd take years to devour the stick, which would give us plenty of time to design some sort of containment unit to keep other mass from adding to the problem.
Of course there is no actual proof that being 'sucked into a black hole' will destroy anything, its all pure theory.
Assuming that crossing the event horizon causes a conversion from mass to energy for some reason, thats still not something to be concerned about since the theoretical time dilation effects as you move closer to the event horizon are going to make it so you never really cross the event horizon.
The next assumption is that you'll be torn apart by the gravitational pull, but this is also likely as incorrect as the theories about the pressure being too great on the ocean floor for life to survive. I'm more inclined to believe the gravitational stresses would cause death, but I also believed that life couldn't survive at the very deepest parts of the ocean.
One thing science has taught me, and taught me well is more often than not, our theories are wrong. Just because there are 'great minds' working on this doesn't change that, these minds are working on 'great things'.
Really? They expect stupid shit like not covering vents and keeping animals out to break it on a regular basis?
They need to be replaced. They've been following Microsoft's engineering principals a little too closely.
You realize that your last sentence basically describes what FatELF would appear as to the end user, right? Except in the case of using multiple binaries they don't share segments at all. A FatELF binary would share segments other than the .code segment. Separate binaries will use more space than FatELF.
You could always strip the extra segments out if you wanted to.
GNOME didn't invent UAC, at a minimum you should have used sudo as your example since it was around before GNOME or UAC and is almost a direct equivalent for the command line, but it wasn't first. Both are essentially versions of su that work with the users own password rather than the root password directly.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Su_(Unix)
OSX didn't event frilly desktop effects, NextStep and IRIX both had them before OSX existed. IRIX used an OpenGL desktop with effects in 1988.
I'm not arguing which is 'better', just that they invented well before Linux was even a gleam in Linus' eye. The newer remakes are certainly more advanced.
1: Ability - I can accept all of that, but when their response is 'we see this all the time, we're right, your wrong' after I've shown they clearly were not right. They say 'your server isn't accepting connections' I say 'but my other client can connect and works just fine' they say 'your server isn't listening for connections we know what we're talking about' I don't have to know anything about Myth to know they are just wastes of planetary resources at that point.
2: Affiliation - If you're going to suggest on your project website to go to a specific IRC channel, then you have to realize that the feeling people get in that channel is going to be directly associated with your project.
3: Incentive - It wasn't a matter of not getting a response, I got responses before I finished stating my problem.
4: Price - Flately wrong, I spent more time trying to get them to shutup long enough to hear me out than any savings they provided. Its not free, it cost me my time, and like it or not, reflects on the project itself.
Pay support may hide it but that doesn't excuse abusive behavior in 'free' support.
In your second list:
1 - ability - Considering the 'help' I got from one guy resulted in basically 'weird, it looks like everything is working from the log', then you'll get that pretty much in first layer support from anyone so I wouldn't have wasted any time.
2 - Affiliation - When the website says 'go here for help' and you go there, and get a bad experience, you associate it with the project, they did after all, suggest I go there. This is no different in paid support or with commercial products. A commercial vender suggests support from a company I have a bad experience with I certainly do expect the parent company to address the issue, I do hold it against them.
3 - Incentive - Citation needed. Paid services most certainly do care, maybe not the drones on the phone, but you are a paying customer, they want you to stay so they can keep getting paid with your money. They piss off to many customers, they don't get paid. The drones may not realize this, but too many complaints and they'll get fired. My company has support personal too, we most CERTAINLY care about what our customers think of their service.
At the end of the day, my problem was solved, by myself, at the cost of several hours of my time. I'm not sure if it would have been quicker if I had not joined or not. Its hard to say since I'm sure the interaction did sway my path to some extent, I don't know if I would have found it sooner or later since there was no specific part in the conversation that guided me to the problem. The one helpful soul came to the same conclusion I was at when I joined. 'the debug log says its working'. I finally gave up and started checking every configuration option one at a time, as I had a working client on another machine.
Were they rude? Depends on your exact definition. Yes, I think they were. After pointing out that the reasons they were giving me were not the case, and I get a response of 'we do this all the time we know more than you' even though they clearly did not know the problem in this case nor did they bother to even look at the fact that I had proof that it they were wrong. They made the choice to not acknowledge that I may not be a complete idiot or listen. You can see for yourself: http://pastebin.com/m2cfd19dd
I'm BitS in that log, read the first 40-50 lines if you'd like. I admit that I got frustrated, but I certainly tried initially to accept the fact that they deal with newbies all day long. I admit I was frustrated when I joined and tried to take that into consideration, there was no such consideration on the other side.
I did make a mistake in my original post, looking at that log, wagnerrp was there from the start and did make every attempt at being useful, even if he didn't solve the problem, I appreciate the effort either way.
They didn't even wait for me to fully explain the problem, and after I pointed out why those suggestions were wrong and I had verified them, nothing changed.
If you can't deal with newbies day in and day out its probably best to not answer. Like it or not these people, in the channel thats suggested to go to for help, represent the project. Doesn't matter how they are affiliated with it or not. You tell people to go someone to ask a question and get shitty 'service' the project gets a bad name. Newbies don't know who is actually affiliated with the project and who isn't, but they do know they are in a channel that the project suggested.
There are assholes on both sides, but I didn't join and call them jackasses, I joined and asked for help, and was trying to explain the situation when I get a bunch of silly answers that could not possibly apply spewed at me, not once, multiple times, even after pointing out why those answers did not apply.
This isn't a case of 'asshole comes in and tells them they are a bunch of shitheads with shitty software, and they respond by being an asshole'.
This is a case of 'someone joins, gets answers before the question is finished that are wrong, they don't bother to listen just keep repeating the same answer, and the person asking gets extremely frustrated'.
This is a case of those being 'helpful' acting like children. If you're going to treat everyone like an asshole, just replace the other clients with a bot who is abusive on join.
These are people who didn't actually know what they were talking about racing to provide an answer without knowing the problem so they can stroke their egos. Not the best way to win over new users, developers or otherwise.
First off, someone else posted the full coversation:
http://pastebin.com/m2cfd19dd
Which is a little less one sided than your truncated version.
Yes, I admitted it was a configuration mistake, after it was tracked down. Of course you are ignoring the fact that the error was not any of the suggestions given, and that I pointed out that those reasons could not possibly be the problem since I could connect with another client.
The problem was not properly logged in the debug files.
The problem was not known or solved by anyone on the channel.
The problem was accepted as a bug by the devs.
I didn't smear MythTV, I pointed out how arrogant assholes can ruin someones experience and cause them to leave.
I said thank you because one of those people didn't assume that I was had no idea what I was doing.
I FOUND THE PROBLEM, and relayed the solution to the channel so MAYBE it could help someone else.
You entirely missed the point because just like my original statement, you assume you were right when NO ONE in the channel was right, myself included.
I'm going to have to assume, Anonymous Coward, that you were one of the arrogant and unhelpful assholes who pissed me off in the first place.
I realize its IRC, and its free help, but it STILL has an effect on people using the software. Considering its the channel that mythtv.org or mythbuntu.org suggests to ask for help in, that DOES mean its the place people go to ask for help and not being an arrogant prick is a good start.
I have no problem accepting 'Ive never seen that error' or 'your an idiot, you did this wrong' when you actually know the answer.
But I was told what I did wrong before I even finished stating the problem.
No, I was a retard and entered the MythTV backend port as the MySQL port in the DB setup.
I did eventually get enough input and brute forced my way into finding the solution.
Actually, it could have been many things to start with, I was on about my third or forth clean install of both the backend and frontend by that point, the IRC conversation was really related to that last problem.
I did find out about the unique id problem, and that may have been an issue in one of my earlier attempts, but by the time that took place I had already manually configured unique ids for my frontends to rule that out.
None of those things were invented by Linux, sorry to disappoint. Both are copying older OSes. Which is fine, but don't try to say Windows is copying Linux, its not.
Bell UNIX, sure. IRIX sure, Solaris Sure, OS X, yep, NextStep, without a doubt.
Linux, no.
Yes, Mythbuntu.
The problem was not a security issue.
The problem was using the wrong port for the database server in the client configuration, a port that was open and listening, but not MySQL.
The MySQL client connects, MythTV says 'Okay, got the database!' and goes on to do other things as if everything is working properly. Then when it gets around to actually using the database it just locks up waiting for the DB to respond, but since its not actually talking to a database it doesn't respond, and the REAL problem is that it never times out either. It doesn't log any error.
I did eventually find the problem myself, using some good old debugging skills. I also informed the guy who was helping me since he spends a lot of time in the two mythtv channels I was asking in and may help someone in the future. I also logged the bug with copies of the config files, a detailed description of the error, and all the log files that the mythtv and mythbuntu devs asked for.
I'm not new to this game, it was a bug that no one had reported. Admittedly, it was a stupid configuration error that was my own fault. During my setup, I even checked the little 'check database connectivity' checkbox, to which it came back and said the database was working properly. As a user I went well beyond what you SHOULD expect out of an end user, because as a developer I realize how hard it can be to debug errors and how important to have the most complete picture possible. I even added step by step details for reproducing the problem in a default Mythbuntu install.
You are responding the exact same way as the initial response from the assholes I'm complaining about. You are arrogant and worthless for help because you think you know everything about a situation when you have no idea whats going on. You are the problem.