Freedom means freedom for PEOPLE--not businesses!!!
You clearly don't see the difference between a business and a person. Of course, the fact that the US Supreme Court said that a corporation is a person doesn't help my case but still...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Re:What have you done to discuss gov. corruption?
on
TIA Project to End
·
· Score: 1
If a criminal has a gun to your head, talking to him or bribing him isn't going to improve the situation.
Well, I guess if you don't mind being killed then it's perfectly ok. Sure, you'll "solve" the problem. But you'll also end up being killed. Ever wonder why police attempts to mediate first in hostage situations? According to your view, they should go in guns-blazing first. The disgruntled employee or whoever that is holding the hostages is going to kill people if you just go in attacking. Sure, you'll "solve" the problem in the sense that the hostage taker will be killed; but so will many others...
We're not killing all Iraqis; we're rounding up the criminals. These criminals have tortured, murdered, and raped. If they shoot at us, we shoot back.
No doubt that many of them are criminals. But A LOT of them are also innocent civilians. US military actually shoots people first--they won't wait to be shot at. It's not that the soldiers want to kill innocent people; it's just that they are not sure who is innocent and not:
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?Sectio nID=40&ItemID=4208
It took over ten years after WWII to make Germany a peaceful, self-sustaining state. Why do we think Iraq can be changed in a year or two?
I CLIAM that USA will never bring Iraq, or Afghanistan, or any of its future targets (Iran?) to the level of Germany after WWII. Why? Because Germany (and Japan too) was a developed, industrialized country during WWII. There was very little nation building there. There were functioning courts there before, they had a plutocracy, they had voting, more egalitarian than Iraq is now, etc. If USA DOES manage to bring any of its targets in the Middle East to the level of Germany and Japan, I will personally COMMEND you. Unfortunately, it's not going to happen. Also, it seems that USA doesn't want to stick around for 10 years and absorb more than $500billion in costs (although oil will pay for all of this if it can get it).
The infrastructure was- A. Already in very poor shape with large portions of the country not receiving regular power or water. B. Rebuilding the infrastructure has been complicated by criminals and terrorists from out of the country sabotaging the infrastructure. C. Even though this is true, we now having continuous power and water in most of the country.
Yes the infrastructure wasn't exactly in great shape. But it was in better shape before the war. Why do you think there are daily protests? The basic necessities aren't at an acceptable level. Maybe it will be fixed in the future--the question is when. Don't forget that Iraq is a fairly "rich" country, even under Saddam and UN sanctions. It was better off than most Asian, South American and African countries.
I'm not sure where you got this. No one here wants to kill people just for the fun of it. However, again, if a criminal has a gun to your head, or if a despot has a gun to the head of his people, how do you resolve this? Even so, this was probably one of the most bloodless wars ever fought.
The fact that you still think this has to eliminating a dictator shows you lack of information. I hope you do realize that this has nothing to do with that (if it did, why didn't USA invade Liberia, which needs help? Or some other African country?). As far as the bloodless war comment is concerned, well I guess if you count lives by numbers, sure. Although, with your 10-year rebuilding plan, I suspect more American soldiers and more Iraqi civilians will die in this war than any war in the last 50 years (not couting Vietnam and Corea). It's bloodless all right...At one time, bloodless actually meant NO blood is spilled (as in bloodless coup) but I guess times have changed...
I guess we should have let the Nazi's run Europe and Saddam to continue raping his citizens; And hey, if he's trying get the weapons to nuke Israel, that's okay too.
This happens all the time... whenever governments want to circumvent their laws, they simply get someone else to do it. Examples include torturing people (against US laws but USA simply passes the people to some other country), financing enemies of the state (eg. Iran-Contra; totally illegal but the govt gets away with it), money lanundering (this often involves getting 3rd parties to do all the work in return for large amounts of money eg. Iraqgate; money laundering to Iraq via Banda de la Franca), etc...
In some sense, civil liberties are nonexistent. The govt can do whatever the hell they want with you. There is one thing though... YOU have to make a mistake first.
This is very bad... IBM, like all large corporations, is simply using its patents to attack others. How much do you want to bet that IBM will use the same tactic against other Linux competitors in the future (if Linux becomes popular)?
Allying with the devil to defeat your enemy is never encouraged (as history of US imperialism in recent memory, including unholy alliances with Usama bin Laden in 90's and Saddam Hussein in late 80's show). SCO may be an enemy but IBM isn't a good friend either... They are on the Linux side now because they are profitting from it... but watch out in 10 years...
I wish IBM hadn't reverted to patent rights "manipulations" to defend Linux. Even if IBM is successful now, it will not mean anything. GPL is not being tested and IBM could simply turn around and use the court case to attack other entrants to the Linux world...
Man you guys are beyond help (no offense). Everything you say is true but think about what you are saying! You are basically supporting corporate ownership of human lives! Needless to say, you have been bought out by the capitalist propaganda. You just basically placed an entity called THE CORPORATION above a worker. I suppose your view of the world is that the corporation is more important to a country than a worker (ie. a human).
This sound might sound ridiculous but your last paragraph sounds like another argument you business-oriented folks put forth 50 years ago. Everyone is equal and treated as equals based on their skin colour. But if you are bad for business (and you know there are a few racist customers), you'll be fired. Your rights are not being violated. You can go and find a job somewhere else....
Your argument sounds just like that. Of course, you probably won't see it that way...just like how those discriminating 50 years ago didn't see it either...
And trying to equate this to a worker building faulty components is just plain ignorance. I don't want to even get started on that. I can see why you would say that though. If you look at it from a monetary point of view, both reduce profits. Mone is all you care about huh?
Pretty soon...If I drive a car that is not aligned with your corporation or its associates, am I going to get fired too? Maybe a board member owns stock in another car company?:(
Of course, according to your view, which is nothing more than the status quo, it isn't violation of anything. That's why YOU support it; that's why the law supports it; that's why governments support it; etc. BUT *I* am saying it IS a violation. The concept might be a bit too revolutionary for you but abolishing slavery, or giving the commoner the right to vote were totally unthinkable ideas at one time too...
I call for a revolution...no, this isn't a joke...
Sivaram's Information Manifesto for the Ages
A person's thoughts, feelings, and works outside of work shall not be cause for dismissal; Only the person's performance shall merit termination. By allowing the corporations to get a stranglehold on people outside work, capitalists are shifting power to the few elites who control and benefit dispropotionately from these measures. It is a sick view that business comes before freedom. The fact that corporations own the water, supply the food, control the transportation, and pretty soon healthcare, education and the police, is no reason to back down!!!
Citizens cannot rely on the "elected" officials and the lawyer-influenced courts to protect themselves. Commercial censorship is a direct attack on freedom. The fact that you "work" for a corporation does not mean anything in the given climate of monopolies and oligopolies. What is a journalist to do when less than 5 companies own nearly all the media? What is an aerospace worker to do when you have two choices?
Some of you are probably laughing at this... but I actually mean everything I say--except for the actual revolution part (it's not time yet:| I'll let you know when it comes)
I'm unemployed and the way things are, I don't think I'll get a job in the tech field anymore so this doesn't really impact me that much but...
I am not saying that we are not a corporate slave. I personally said that before. I was simply mad at the fact that so many people support the present state of affairs...
Remember, companies can not VIOLATE your right to free speech...But they also have the right to fire you. You simply have to be willing to trade your voluntary employment contract with them to continue speaking.
That's commercial censorship. It is widely accepted and all capitalists are in favour of it. But that's not freedom of speech.
I always thought that capitalism will collapse due to a class war due to discrepancies in wealth (as Marx claimed).... but now it looks like there is another reason. Its collapse might actually be due to its erosion of democracy. At the rate things are going, there will be no difference between a police state and a corporate state!!!
[ Perhaps the most interesting part of this is the chilling side effect: might I get fired if I present this committee's article to my director? She's very pro-Microsoft... ]
I think people DO get fired for things like that... You might not get fired for giving the report to her. But if you gave it to her competitor (say another manager or something) or a more senior person, you may very well get fired. You'll be in a situation where you put forth reports claiming MS isn't so good, while she claims MS is good. A clear conflict. Unless the guy you give the report to (i.e. other manager or higher up) comes to your aid, I can see you being fired easily.
I don't think things were as bad--in some sense--a few decades ago. Now, I think it's a lot worse for workers. I can't recall reading or hearing about anyone signing contracts 20 years ago where the employers own almost everything the person does, etc. I think part of the reason is that information is more widespread and has far more power now. To illustrate my point, did you know that messages being posted on stock market message boards actually cause millions of dolalrs of wealth increase or decrease? You can actually pump or dump a stock by spreading rumours on message boards. It isn't legal but it was shown to work during the stock market boom a few years ago. This just goes to show the strength of information...
My theory was that you can overthrow governments via the internet in the future (bloodless democratic overthrow). I never considered that scenario for corporations. Well, I guess the same sort of impact can be directed at corporations (a mass boycott campaign can easily destroy a product line or even a corporation). So the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. What is happening now is nothing more than reactionary policies of corporations. If the workers didn't have as much power none of this would matter. For example, if Greer's words don't mean much, he wouldn't get fired. Unfortunately for the corporation, the employees are more influential than ever. I suspect this is going to get worse and worse. I wouldn't be surprised if you got fired in the future for walking into your company wearing a pro-Linux jacket when your company is closely aligned with non-Linux forces (say Microsoft, although I am not implying MS is bad). I suspect this phenomenon will pervade all businesses in the future...
What's next is corporations ruling over the lives of everyone. All industries will be monopolies or oligopolies. If you or anyone who works for a corporation criticizes any other corporation, you will be fired and blacklisted from all corporations...
This is the best post here... I can't believe so many slashdotters are supporting the firing. I guess just goes to show how many corporation-worshiping free market capitalists are here:(
If you ever wonder why software with bugs and massive security flaws, now we know why. All the "security" consultants are in bed with large corporations and could care less about security. They just want contracts to justify corporate software even though everyone knows they aren't secure...
How can you justifying fucking idiocy like this? When did we start worshipping corporations? I didn't know you capitalists would stoop that low for money.:( If you don't think this is a violation of freedom of speech, you don't know what freedom is!!!!!
Note: that attack is not meant at you personally... just directed at people who have your view...
I just hope one day that the courts stick up for freedom of speech. If I work for a company and comment on things on my own time, it should be fine. Otherwise, it is a gross abuse of freedom of speech. It's too bad that many here actually support that view. It doesn't surprise me that most people here are capitalists and would put money before everything in their lives. It's really sucks. Government can't fire for you for things like that; religious organizations can't; etc; But CORPORATIONS can...:(:(:(:(:(:(
Countries like USA are already pretty much there. Already there are many lawsuits for seemingly idiotic things. To see what I mean, just look at the disclaimers/restrictions/whatever on products that you buy. Next time you watch a movie, look at what is on the back of the ticket. Next time you buy a computer, look at the conditions...
What you are proposing won't happen. The reason is because lawyers make their living OFF OTHERS. That is, the only reason lawyers make a ton of money is because others (namely those not qualified with the law) pay them. Lawyers do not make money off their own lawsuits (that would be detrimental). Even in a society filled with lawyers, these lawyers will prey on those that are not lawyers (as a side note, there must always be some who are not lawyers--at least under an elitist system like capitalism).
If you've studied economics you know what would happen...
Perhaps you should dump the capitalistic economics and start looking at real economics...
If you look at science, there wasn't a lot of patent protection in the 1700's, 1800's, and even early 1900's. Whenever someone invented something, it was copied quite easily. Take flight for instance. The growth in aviation occurred early on when a lot of competition was present. Wright Brothers, for example, did not have a patent on flight.
All you economics-loving capitalists will be shown for the fraud that you are... If you system doesn't collapse, it will when a revolt starts when you hoard a life-saving drug and only offer it to the wealthy...
It's an insult to call modern day capitalist economics as true economics. All these fools who call themselves economists will all be discredited within 200 years... (capitalist) economists are nothing more than the modern day alchemists!!!
As some people in this thread have mentioned, I think astrologers simply use the stars/planets as a navigational tool. I don't think any astrologer has ever attempted to tie gravity with astrology (I could be wrong though). Do they even know what gravity is?
My point is that you cannot dismiss astrology simply because there may be some truth to it. Since most astrological descriptions are so vague, it's hard to prove that they are wrong.
Elphants do have nails...but they don't smoke cigars--I could be wrong though;)...
We could turn to astrology to find the answers. Figure out the best sign for your child. Then find an animal (or even some big mass like an anvil) and artificially replicate the gravity that would have been exerted by particular stars/planets.
Maybe I should keep a hippo or an elephant around if my kid is born. Maybe it could help.. (of course, the fact that I don't even have a girlfriend kind of makes this difficult but that's another story;) )...
You are overestimating the present state of science. There can very well be forces and things we don't understand in the universe.
For instance, we just discovered (i.e. in the last 30 or so years) that the vast majority of the mass (something like 75%(?)) in the universe is contained in dark matter. We thought we understood the universe fairly well but now we just realize that we couldn't even see the most dominant mass in the universe. How do you know dark matter doesn't affect the birth of a child?
Similarly, consider superstring theory. I don't know much about it but my feeling is that it will be accepted by science. From what I understand (which isn't much) superstring theory is supposed to postulate that there are more dimensions in the universe. From what I could recall, there are soemthing like 10 dimensions (although these dimensions are nothing like the 4D spacetime). All this time, we live with 4D and all of a sudden we realize there may be more (assuming that is what superstring actually proves)). How do you know these extra dimensions don't impact astrology?
My view is that there are some truths in astrology--we just don't know what they are. It's kind of like tradional medicine (i.e. non-scientific medicine). Traditional medicine is supposed to be totally bogus according to science, yet I have a feeling that some of it is true. People, in the past, couldn't have just made up these medicines. They would have refined it over time. Some may be pure junk; but some won't be. We just don't know what... same thing with astrology...
We are not automatons because of quantum mechanics. Every "choice" or path is based on a probability. And these are supposed to be "random". For instance, the position of an electron in an atom is supposed to be "random" within the probability distribution. If you go with that view, you cannot be an automaton (ie. robot-like creature lacking free will)...
To put it another way, for a given cause the effect comes from a whole multitude of "random" possibilities...
Slashdot Mirror
Freedom means freedom for PEOPLE--not businesses!!!
You clearly don't see the difference between a business and a person. Of course, the fact that the US Supreme Court said that a corporation is a person doesn't help my case but still...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
If a criminal has a gun to your head, talking to him or bribing him isn't going to improve the situation.
Well, I guess if you don't mind being killed then it's perfectly ok. Sure, you'll "solve" the problem. But you'll also end up being killed. Ever wonder why police attempts to mediate first in hostage situations? According to your view, they should go in guns-blazing first. The disgruntled employee or whoever that is holding the hostages is going to kill people if you just go in attacking. Sure, you'll "solve" the problem in the sense that the hostage taker will be killed; but so will many others...
We're not killing all Iraqis; we're rounding up the criminals. These criminals have tortured, murdered, and raped. If they shoot at us, we shoot back.
No doubt that many of them are criminals. But A LOT of them are also innocent civilians. US military actually shoots people first--they won't wait to be shot at. It's not that the soldiers want to kill innocent people; it's just that they are not sure who is innocent and not:
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?Sectio nID=40&ItemID=4208
It took over ten years after WWII to make Germany a peaceful, self-sustaining state. Why do we think Iraq can be changed in a year or two?
I CLIAM that USA will never bring Iraq, or Afghanistan, or any of its future targets (Iran?) to the level of Germany after WWII. Why? Because Germany (and Japan too) was a developed, industrialized country during WWII. There was very little nation building there. There were functioning courts there before, they had a plutocracy, they had voting, more egalitarian than Iraq is now, etc. If USA DOES manage to bring any of its targets in the Middle East to the level of Germany and Japan, I will personally COMMEND you. Unfortunately, it's not going to happen. Also, it seems that USA doesn't want to stick around for 10 years and absorb more than $500billion in costs (although oil will pay for all of this if it can get it).
The infrastructure was- A. Already in very poor shape with large portions of the country not receiving regular power or water. B. Rebuilding the infrastructure has been complicated by criminals and terrorists from out of the country sabotaging the infrastructure. C. Even though this is true, we now having continuous power and water in most of the country.
Yes the infrastructure wasn't exactly in great shape. But it was in better shape before the war. Why do you think there are daily protests? The basic necessities aren't at an acceptable level. Maybe it will be fixed in the future--the question is when. Don't forget that Iraq is a fairly "rich" country, even under Saddam and UN sanctions. It was better off than most Asian, South American and African countries.
I'm not sure where you got this. No one here wants to kill people just for the fun of it. However, again, if a criminal has a gun to your head, or if a despot has a gun to the head of his people, how do you resolve this? Even so, this was probably one of the most bloodless wars ever fought.
The fact that you still think this has to eliminating a dictator shows you lack of information. I hope you do realize that this has nothing to do with that (if it did, why didn't USA invade Liberia, which needs help? Or some other African country?). As far as the bloodless war comment is concerned, well I guess if you count lives by numbers, sure. Although, with your 10-year rebuilding plan, I suspect more American soldiers and more Iraqi civilians will die in this war than any war in the last 50 years (not couting Vietnam and Corea). It's bloodless all right...At one time, bloodless actually meant NO blood is spilled (as in bloodless coup) but I guess times have changed...
I guess we should have let the Nazi's run Europe and Saddam to continue raping his citizens; And hey, if he's trying get the weapons to nuke Israel, that's okay too.
lol... First o
This happens all the time... whenever governments want to circumvent their laws, they simply get someone else to do it. Examples include torturing people (against US laws but USA simply passes the people to some other country), financing enemies of the state (eg. Iran-Contra; totally illegal but the govt gets away with it), money lanundering (this often involves getting 3rd parties to do all the work in return for large amounts of money eg. Iraqgate; money laundering to Iraq via Banda de la Franca), etc...
In some sense, civil liberties are nonexistent. The govt can do whatever the hell they want with you. There is one thing though... YOU have to make a mistake first.
Sivaram Velauthapillai
This is very bad... IBM, like all large corporations, is simply using its patents to attack others. How much do you want to bet that IBM will use the same tactic against other Linux competitors in the future (if Linux becomes popular)?
Allying with the devil to defeat your enemy is never encouraged (as history of US imperialism in recent memory, including unholy alliances with Usama bin Laden in 90's and Saddam Hussein in late 80's show). SCO may be an enemy but IBM isn't a good friend either... They are on the Linux side now because they are profitting from it... but watch out in 10 years...
I wish IBM hadn't reverted to patent rights "manipulations" to defend Linux. Even if IBM is successful now, it will not mean anything. GPL is not being tested and IBM could simply turn around and use the court case to attack other entrants to the Linux world...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Man you guys are beyond help (no offense). Everything you say is true but think about what you are saying! You are basically supporting corporate ownership of human lives! Needless to say, you have been bought out by the capitalist propaganda. You just basically placed an entity called THE CORPORATION above a worker. I suppose your view of the world is that the corporation is more important to a country than a worker (ie. a human).
:(
This sound might sound ridiculous but your last paragraph sounds like another argument you business-oriented folks put forth 50 years ago. Everyone is equal and treated as equals based on their skin colour. But if you are bad for business (and you know there are a few racist customers), you'll be fired. Your rights are not being violated. You can go and find a job somewhere else....
Your argument sounds just like that. Of course, you probably won't see it that way...just like how those discriminating 50 years ago didn't see it either...
And trying to equate this to a worker building faulty components is just plain ignorance. I don't want to even get started on that. I can see why you would say that though. If you look at it from a monetary point of view, both reduce profits. Mone is all you care about huh?
Pretty soon...If I drive a car that is not aligned with your corporation or its associates, am I going to get fired too? Maybe a board member owns stock in another car company?
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Of course, according to your view, which is nothing more than the status quo, it isn't violation of anything. That's why YOU support it; that's why the law supports it; that's why governments support it; etc. BUT *I* am saying it IS a violation. The concept might be a bit too revolutionary for you but abolishing slavery, or giving the commoner the right to vote were totally unthinkable ideas at one time too...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
huh??
I call for a revolution...no, this isn't a joke...
:| I'll let you know when it comes)
Sivaram's Information Manifesto for the Ages
A person's thoughts, feelings, and works outside of work shall not be cause for dismissal; Only the person's performance shall merit termination. By allowing the corporations to get a stranglehold on people outside work, capitalists are shifting power to the few elites who control and benefit dispropotionately from these measures. It is a sick view that business comes before freedom. The fact that corporations own the water, supply the food, control the transportation, and pretty soon healthcare, education and the police, is no reason to back down!!!
Citizens cannot rely on the "elected" officials and the lawyer-influenced courts to protect themselves. Commercial censorship is a direct attack on freedom. The fact that you "work" for a corporation does not mean anything in the given climate of monopolies and oligopolies. What is a journalist to do when less than 5 companies own nearly all the media? What is an aerospace worker to do when you have two choices?
The destruction of your life is in your hands...
Sincerely,
Sivaram Velauthapillai, anti-Capitalist
Some of you are probably laughing at this... but I actually mean everything I say--except for the actual revolution part (it's not time yet
I'm unemployed and the way things are, I don't think I'll get a job in the tech field anymore so this doesn't really impact me that much but...
I am not saying that we are not a corporate slave. I personally said that before. I was simply mad at the fact that so many people support the present state of affairs...
Remember, companies can not VIOLATE your right to free speech...But they also have the right to fire you. You simply have to be willing to trade your voluntary employment contract with them to continue speaking.
That's commercial censorship. It is widely accepted and all capitalists are in favour of it. But that's not freedom of speech.
I always thought that capitalism will collapse due to a class war due to discrepancies in wealth (as Marx claimed).... but now it looks like there is another reason. Its collapse might actually be due to its erosion of democracy. At the rate things are going, there will be no difference between a police state and a corporate state!!!
[ Perhaps the most interesting part of this is the chilling side effect: might I get fired if I present this committee's article to my director? She's very pro-Microsoft... ]
I think people DO get fired for things like that... You might not get fired for giving the report to her. But if you gave it to her competitor (say another manager or something) or a more senior person, you may very well get fired. You'll be in a situation where you put forth reports claiming MS isn't so good, while she claims MS is good. A clear conflict. Unless the guy you give the report to (i.e. other manager or higher up) comes to your aid, I can see you being fired easily.
I don't think things were as bad--in some sense--a few decades ago. Now, I think it's a lot worse for workers. I can't recall reading or hearing about anyone signing contracts 20 years ago where the employers own almost everything the person does, etc. I think part of the reason is that information is more widespread and has far more power now. To illustrate my point, did you know that messages being posted on stock market message boards actually cause millions of dolalrs of wealth increase or decrease? You can actually pump or dump a stock by spreading rumours on message boards. It isn't legal but it was shown to work during the stock market boom a few years ago. This just goes to show the strength of information...
My theory was that you can overthrow governments via the internet in the future (bloodless democratic overthrow). I never considered that scenario for corporations. Well, I guess the same sort of impact can be directed at corporations (a mass boycott campaign can easily destroy a product line or even a corporation). So the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. What is happening now is nothing more than reactionary policies of corporations. If the workers didn't have as much power none of this would matter. For example, if Greer's words don't mean much, he wouldn't get fired. Unfortunately for the corporation, the employees are more influential than ever. I suspect this is going to get worse and worse. I wouldn't be surprised if you got fired in the future for walking into your company wearing a pro-Linux jacket when your company is closely aligned with non-Linux forces (say Microsoft, although I am not implying MS is bad). I suspect this phenomenon will pervade all businesses in the future...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
What's next is corporations ruling over the lives of everyone. All industries will be monopolies or oligopolies. If you or anyone who works for a corporation criticizes any other corporation, you will be fired and blacklisted from all corporations...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
This is the best post here... I can't believe so many slashdotters are supporting the firing. I guess just goes to show how many corporation-worshiping free market capitalists are here :(
Sivaram Velauthapillai
If you ever wonder why software with bugs and massive security flaws, now we know why. All the "security" consultants are in bed with large corporations and could care less about security. They just want contracts to justify corporate software even though everyone knows they aren't secure...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
How can you justifying fucking idiocy like this? When did we start worshipping corporations? I didn't know you capitalists would stoop that low for money. :( If you don't think this is a violation of freedom of speech, you don't know what freedom is!!!!!
Note: that attack is not meant at you personally... just directed at people who have your view...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
I just hope one day that the courts stick up for freedom of speech. If I work for a company and comment on things on my own time, it should be fine. Otherwise, it is a gross abuse of freedom of speech. It's too bad that many here actually support that view. It doesn't surprise me that most people here are capitalists and would put money before everything in their lives. It's really sucks. Government can't fire for you for things like that; religious organizations can't; etc; But CORPORATIONS can... :(:(:(:(:(:(
Sivaram Velauthapillai
So companies can violate your freedom of speech on YOUR OWN TIME? Are we going to be corporate slaves soon?
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Countries like USA are already pretty much there. Already there are many lawsuits for seemingly idiotic things. To see what I mean, just look at the disclaimers/restrictions/whatever on products that you buy. Next time you watch a movie, look at what is on the back of the ticket. Next time you buy a computer, look at the conditions...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
What you are proposing won't happen. The reason is because lawyers make their living OFF OTHERS. That is, the only reason lawyers make a ton of money is because others (namely those not qualified with the law) pay them. Lawyers do not make money off their own lawsuits (that would be detrimental). Even in a society filled with lawyers, these lawyers will prey on those that are not lawyers (as a side note, there must always be some who are not lawyers--at least under an elitist system like capitalism).
Sivaram Velauthapillai
If you've studied economics you know what would happen...
Perhaps you should dump the capitalistic economics and start looking at real economics...
If you look at science, there wasn't a lot of patent protection in the 1700's, 1800's, and even early 1900's. Whenever someone invented something, it was copied quite easily. Take flight for instance. The growth in aviation occurred early on when a lot of competition was present. Wright Brothers, for example, did not have a patent on flight.
All you economics-loving capitalists will be shown for the fraud that you are... If you system doesn't collapse, it will when a revolt starts when you hoard a life-saving drug and only offer it to the wealthy...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
It's an insult to call modern day capitalist economics as true economics. All these fools who call themselves economists will all be discredited within 200 years... (capitalist) economists are nothing more than the modern day alchemists!!!
Sivaram Velauthapillai
As some people in this thread have mentioned, I think astrologers simply use the stars/planets as a navigational tool. I don't think any astrologer has ever attempted to tie gravity with astrology (I could be wrong though). Do they even know what gravity is?
My point is that you cannot dismiss astrology simply because there may be some truth to it. Since most astrological descriptions are so vague, it's hard to prove that they are wrong.
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Elphants do have nails...but they don't smoke cigars--I could be wrong though ;) ...
We could turn to astrology to find the answers. Figure out the best sign for your child. Then find an animal (or even some big mass like an anvil) and artificially replicate the gravity that would have been exerted by particular stars/planets.
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Maybe I should keep a hippo or an elephant around if my kid is born. Maybe it could help.. (of course, the fact that I don't even have a girlfriend kind of makes this difficult but that's another story ;) )...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
You are overestimating the present state of science. There can very well be forces and things we don't understand in the universe.
For instance, we just discovered (i.e. in the last 30 or so years) that the vast majority of the mass (something like 75%(?)) in the universe is contained in dark matter. We thought we understood the universe fairly well but now we just realize that we couldn't even see the most dominant mass in the universe. How do you know dark matter doesn't affect the birth of a child?
Similarly, consider superstring theory. I don't know much about it but my feeling is that it will be accepted by science. From what I understand (which isn't much) superstring theory is supposed to postulate that there are more dimensions in the universe. From what I could recall, there are soemthing like 10 dimensions (although these dimensions are nothing like the 4D spacetime). All this time, we live with 4D and all of a sudden we realize there may be more (assuming that is what superstring actually proves)). How do you know these extra dimensions don't impact astrology?
My view is that there are some truths in astrology--we just don't know what they are. It's kind of like tradional medicine (i.e. non-scientific medicine). Traditional medicine is supposed to be totally bogus according to science, yet I have a feeling that some of it is true. People, in the past, couldn't have just made up these medicines. They would have refined it over time. Some may be pure junk; but some won't be. We just don't know what... same thing with astrology...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
Assuming that you are correct, thanks for the correction. I thought the original guy was right with his quote but thanks for pointing out it wasn't...
Sivaram Velauthapillai
We are not automatons because of quantum mechanics. Every "choice" or path is based on a probability. And these are supposed to be "random". For instance, the position of an electron in an atom is supposed to be "random" within the probability distribution. If you go with that view, you cannot be an automaton (ie. robot-like creature lacking free will)...
To put it another way, for a given cause the effect comes from a whole multitude of "random" possibilities...
Sivaram Velauthapillai