Microsoft: We now take over BMW! EU: Hey, USA! See? They're fucking evil! USA: Yeah, yeah, you're right. I guess we kinda screwed up that DOJ trial. This is pretty embarrassing, you know... EU: OH MY GOD! Now they're swallowing our banks! We can feel the money being sucked out of us... rectally! THE HORROR!! USA: Mister Gates, would you care to explain yourself before we inevitably raid every single office your company has ever owned (as well as a few others while we're at it), brutally sodomizing the workers before using flamethrowers to torch them down along with the building, after which we will do things best not mentioned for the sake of our international relationships to you, your family and all your friends? Bill Gates: Er... Donations?
Meanwhile in Redmond, VA... Steve Ballmer: *having half of his face painted blue, waving a chair over his head* They can take our lives but they can't take our monopoly! What we need now is cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder...
Oh, the EU have a whole lot of other options that might very well happen.
For example, if the US went berserk and threatened the EU with economic sanctions if poor, poor Microsoft wasn't met with a bit more forgivingness the EU could settle the case with a slap on the wrist and then ban software (and related) patents in any form, commence a continent-wide government IT switch to Linux/BSD/OS X, decree that each and every document used for conversation between/with governmental bodies has to be in Open Document format (or another open standard where apprpriate) without vendor-specific extensions of any kind and set money aside to subsidize FOSS and companies deploying/switching to FOSS solutions.
Entirely unquestionable, entirely doable and entirely a huge raised middle finger. Not to mention that a lot of ISVs would see this continent-wide switch to *nix as a reason to port their software to *nix, which would not only weaken Microsoft's position in the OS market but also take away one of Windows' biggest strengths.
In the end the result is always the same: Microsoft has to make sure they don't anger the EU enough to warrant serious action against them, even if it would save them in the short term. Microsoft is big but not nearly big enough to stand up against a continent.
In addition to what the sibling has said: Source code is not equivalent to a documentation. Firstly, they can't be expected to give away the source coder under something even slightly resembling a permissive licence, making it useless as documentation, as you can look up how something works but then you can't use that knowledge in your own implementation without risking a lawsuit.
Secondly, the EU asked for a documentation, not the source code. It should be obvious that those are two very different things. If you don't think so install a program like sshd and then try to figure out how to connect to and communicate with it using only the source code instead of the documentation.
We don't hate you. At least us Germans don't. Unless football (and we both know that American Football is just a rugby spin-off) is involved we just hate Tony Blair. And maybe your pop music, but ours is much worse, actually.
As for the French... Well, they're the French. They are probably already conspiring against us with, er, Quebec.
That was around level 10, right? At least that's when my enchanter was capable of killing just about anything in under three seconds. Granted, this power was mostly fuelled by a whole bunch of "Fortify Intelligence by 300 for 10 Seconds on Self" items and excessive abuse of Soultrap (trapping the same enemy over and over), but usually he could just wipe out any resistance without even having to switch between his Ring of Armageddon and his Ring of Ridiculous Life Drain. Dagoth Ur would be my bitch if ever cared to attack him.
Yeah, enchanters are gods, as are alchimists. All they have to do is raise their Intelligence, then use the increased Intelligence to raise it further. With an Intelligence score of 4000, the soul of an Ascended Sleeper and an item that can actually hold that much power there's not much that you can't get away with. The same goes for a bunck of potions with Raise Strength by 1000 for 60 Seconds.
I wonder if they managed to balance this stuff in Oblivion.
Kagrenac did not do evil. Kageranac tried to let his people tap the power of the Heart, making them de facto gods.
Depending on your viewpoint that by itself is pretty evil. I should have made clear from which viewpoint I'm telling the story, because the definition of "evil" differs from person to person. You are correct, however, in pointing out that the war was a religious one.
Oh, and Morrowind is not a real RPG, because you can't make yourself a god (despite having the tools to do so) and take over the world.
Well, the role you play is limited. I still think that it's an RPG, it just has limited freedom.
Actually, I'd ssay that it fails the test for not allowing the player to, well, play a role. I can roleplay without having maximum achievements (see Risus), but I can't roleplay without playing a role.
Oh, and PQ has maximum achievments - at some point your stats would become so high that they wouldn't fit into an integer anymore...
By the way, to get back to the original topic of this thread: I'd also say that MMORPGs are particularly bad representatives of the RPG genre. Most players play them for either a) getting off on their stats or b) social interaction. The social interaction usually happens in a non-roleplay way, making MMORPGs quite different from singleplayer RPGs (where you are forced to play a role as there is no OOC (Out Of Character)) and pen-and-paper RPGs (where in-character and OOC conversation is mixed but you are usually spending most of the time in character and there is no OOC conversation between player characters like in MMORPGs).
MMORPGs focus on the stat-raising and social aspects of RPGs (which is why I'd consider a version of Progress Quest with a built-in IRC client the archetypal MMORPG), but most of the time only feature very basic roleplaying.
The alternative is haveing everyone doing the same mission.
Now scale that mission up. Turn it into a GM-instigated server-wide event that changes this particular server's world, depending on the way the players act. Take this concept so far that after a while the game world wildly varies between servers. Bing, you've got a world that is more dynamic than a generic MMORPG world by orders of magnitude. To be more specific, you get Atys (or at least what's planned for Atys).
TES is a great example for that- what the hell is the story in [...] Morrowind?
Long ago on the island of Vvardenfell: The Dwemer (TES' equivalent to dwarves) gained access to tools of incredible might, which their lead scientist Kagrenac used to do evil, as lead scientists are wont to do. This resulted in a war between the Dwemer and the Chimer, at the end of which the Dwemer vanished without a trace. Yes, the tools were involved into that, as well. Dagoth Ur was sent to destroy the tools, but his friend and ally Nerevar Indoril stopped him (the fact that Nerevar was the Chimers' war chief might have been a factor, too). However, Dagoth Ur soon was corrupted by the tools and turned into some sort of mad god. Nerevar recognized the danger that the tools posed and defeated Dagoth Ur and his minions, but unbeknownst to him they survived, merely "sleeping". After the battle Nerevar was killed by his three advisors Vivex, Almalexia and Sotha Sil, who then proceeded to use the tools to turn themselves into gods and forcefully establish a cult centered around themselves ("the Tribunal") as the dominant religion on Vvardenfell. Azura (a real goddess and somewhat on Nerevar's side) was quite pissed and cursed the Chimer (turning them into the black-skinned Dunmer). She also announced that Nerevar would return and reestablish the old ways.
Fast forward to Morrowind (the game, not the region): The emperor Uriel Septim VII (having limited prophetic abilities) has sent a prisoner matching the Nerevarine's description to Vvardenfell where he should establish that he was in fact the reborn Nerevar (the "Nerevarine") while really being a member of the Blades, the Empire's elite spies, as an act of religious manipulation in order to further his influence in Vvardenfell. As it turns out this man is the Nerevarine and with a tiny bit of support from Azura he swiftly proceeds to defeat Dagoth Ur and the Tribunal.
(I do know that some details are missing.)
Yes, it's not easy to find out everything about the story, but it's certainly there and it's not quite bad. In fact, Morrowind has a pretty immersive world - just take the time and read the books you encounter. You learn a lot about the game's world, the people and their culture. I think it's quite impressive to which lengths the developers have gone creating their world.
Actually, both styles of RPG have the same right to be called "RPG". Western-style RPGs let the player play his own character, making up his own role as he plays. The world reacts to the way the player plays the game - to the role he has chosen to play. Eastern-style RPGs define a role that the player plays; the player's actions have little to no no effect on the role.
Both ways involve the player playing a role.
I still tend to think of eastern-style RPGs as Action Adventures, though.
RPG Maker XP has already produced at least one English PC game on sale...
I'm a (somewhat former) member of a major German RPG Maker community and this has piqued my interest (old interests die hard, just like habits)... Do you have any further informations on this?
The thing is that sometimes it's better to hve a big slice of a small pie than a microscopic slice from a big one. Take SubEthaEdit, for example: SEE is a nice editor, but in the Windows world it wouldn't sell that well because there's a whole lot of nice editors for Windows. Even the fact that SEE is a collaborative editor (which happen to be extremely rare on any platform) wouldn't make up for the fact that the Windows editor market is already saturated. The Mac editor market, on the other hand, is smaller but less crowded so it's still possible to come up with a good product and secure a bit of market share.
Some people are quite happy with making a decent living off their software. Not everyone wants to become the next Microsoft... And the size of a company is no indicator for the quality of their software.
Re:Vista Graphics could be an issue
on
Apple Joins BAPCo
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· Score: 1
Besides, it might just be cheaper to use a generic graphics card instead of a custom device...
When I wrote that the EU isn't keen on US corporations I said "unlike Ireland, which is a subsidiary of Microsoft". Of course, with Ireland being a member of the EU, it should have been "with the exception of Ireland[...]".
Slashdot Mirror
Maybe Microsoft's conception of "fair" is, that lobbying in the EU is not as effective as in the USA?
It depends. Our anti-software patent lobbying has been quite effective...
Microsoft: We now take over BMW!
EU: Hey, USA! See? They're fucking evil!
USA: Yeah, yeah, you're right. I guess we kinda screwed up that DOJ trial. This is pretty embarrassing, you know...
EU: OH MY GOD! Now they're swallowing our banks! We can feel the money being sucked out of us... rectally! THE HORROR!!
USA: Mister Gates, would you care to explain yourself before we inevitably raid every single office your company has ever owned (as well as a few others while we're at it), brutally sodomizing the workers before using flamethrowers to torch them down along with the building, after which we will do things best not mentioned for the sake of our international relationships to you, your family and all your friends?
Bill Gates: Er... Donations?
Meanwhile in Redmond, VA...
Steve Ballmer: *having half of his face painted blue, waving a chair over his head* They can take our lives but they can't take our monopoly! What we need now is cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder, cannon fodder...
It's the final countdown!
Dededee dee, dededededee, dededee dee dededededededee...
Oh, the EU have a whole lot of other options that might very well happen.
For example, if the US went berserk and threatened the EU with economic sanctions if poor, poor Microsoft wasn't met with a bit more forgivingness the EU could settle the case with a slap on the wrist and then ban software (and related) patents in any form, commence a continent-wide government IT switch to Linux/BSD/OS X, decree that each and every document used for conversation between/with governmental bodies has to be in Open Document format (or another open standard where apprpriate) without vendor-specific extensions of any kind and set money aside to subsidize FOSS and companies deploying/switching to FOSS solutions.
Entirely unquestionable, entirely doable and entirely a huge raised middle finger. Not to mention that a lot of ISVs would see this continent-wide switch to *nix as a reason to port their software to *nix, which would not only weaken Microsoft's position in the OS market but also take away one of Windows' biggest strengths.
In the end the result is always the same: Microsoft has to make sure they don't anger the EU enough to warrant serious action against them, even if it would save them in the short term. Microsoft is big but not nearly big enough to stand up against a continent.
They probably are quite sure of our case...
In addition to what the sibling has said: Source code is not equivalent to a documentation. Firstly, they can't be expected to give away the source coder under something even slightly resembling a permissive licence, making it useless as documentation, as you can look up how something works but then you can't use that knowledge in your own implementation without risking a lawsuit.
Secondly, the EU asked for a documentation, not the source code. It should be obvious that those are two very different things. If you don't think so install a program like sshd and then try to figure out how to connect to and communicate with it using only the source code instead of the documentation.
We don't hate you. At least us Germans don't. Unless football (and we both know that American Football is just a rugby spin-off) is involved we just hate Tony Blair. And maybe your pop music, but ours is much worse, actually.
As for the French... Well, they're the French. They are probably already conspiring against us with, er, Quebec.
That was around level 10, right? At least that's when my enchanter was capable of killing just about anything in under three seconds. Granted, this power was mostly fuelled by a whole bunch of "Fortify Intelligence by 300 for 10 Seconds on Self" items and excessive abuse of Soultrap (trapping the same enemy over and over), but usually he could just wipe out any resistance without even having to switch between his Ring of Armageddon and his Ring of Ridiculous Life Drain. Dagoth Ur would be my bitch if ever cared to attack him.
Yeah, enchanters are gods, as are alchimists. All they have to do is raise their Intelligence, then use the increased Intelligence to raise it further. With an Intelligence score of 4000, the soul of an Ascended Sleeper and an item that can actually hold that much power there's not much that you can't get away with. The same goes for a bunck of potions with Raise Strength by 1000 for 60 Seconds.
I wonder if they managed to balance this stuff in Oblivion.
Kagrenac did not do evil. Kageranac tried to let his people tap the power of the Heart, making them de facto gods.
Depending on your viewpoint that by itself is pretty evil. I should have made clear from which viewpoint I'm telling the story, because the definition of "evil" differs from person to person. You are correct, however, in pointing out that the war was a religious one.
Oh, and Morrowind is not a real RPG, because you can't make yourself a god (despite having the tools to do so) and take over the world.
Well, the role you play is limited. I still think that it's an RPG, it just has limited freedom.
Thanks, but my proofreading sucks. I used the term "Nerevarine" before explaining it. Late-night posting really is a bad habit...
Actually, I'd ssay that it fails the test for not allowing the player to, well, play a role. I can roleplay without having maximum achievements (see Risus), but I can't roleplay without playing a role.
Oh, and PQ has maximum achievments - at some point your stats would become so high that they wouldn't fit into an integer anymore...
By the way, to get back to the original topic of this thread: I'd also say that MMORPGs are particularly bad representatives of the RPG genre. Most players play them for either a) getting off on their stats or b) social interaction. The social interaction usually happens in a non-roleplay way, making MMORPGs quite different from singleplayer RPGs (where you are forced to play a role as there is no OOC (Out Of Character)) and pen-and-paper RPGs (where in-character and OOC conversation is mixed but you are usually spending most of the time in character and there is no OOC conversation between player characters like in MMORPGs).
MMORPGs focus on the stat-raising and social aspects of RPGs (which is why I'd consider a version of Progress Quest with a built-in IRC client the archetypal MMORPG), but most of the time only feature very basic roleplaying.
If you can only find enjoyment in watching a bar fill, you will never enjoy an RPG. /restated
Except of course for Progress Quest.
The alternative is haveing everyone doing the same mission.
Now scale that mission up. Turn it into a GM-instigated server-wide event that changes this particular server's world, depending on the way the players act. Take this concept so far that after a while the game world wildly varies between servers. Bing, you've got a world that is more dynamic than a generic MMORPG world by orders of magnitude. To be more specific, you get Atys (or at least what's planned for Atys).
TES is a great example for that- what the hell is the story in [...] Morrowind?
Long ago on the island of Vvardenfell: The Dwemer (TES' equivalent to dwarves) gained access to tools of incredible might, which their lead scientist Kagrenac used to do evil, as lead scientists are wont to do. This resulted in a war between the Dwemer and the Chimer, at the end of which the Dwemer vanished without a trace. Yes, the tools were involved into that, as well. Dagoth Ur was sent to destroy the tools, but his friend and ally Nerevar Indoril stopped him (the fact that Nerevar was the Chimers' war chief might have been a factor, too). However, Dagoth Ur soon was corrupted by the tools and turned into some sort of mad god. Nerevar recognized the danger that the tools posed and defeated Dagoth Ur and his minions, but unbeknownst to him they survived, merely "sleeping". After the battle Nerevar was killed by his three advisors Vivex, Almalexia and Sotha Sil, who then proceeded to use the tools to turn themselves into gods and forcefully establish a cult centered around themselves ("the Tribunal") as the dominant religion on Vvardenfell. Azura (a real goddess and somewhat on Nerevar's side) was quite pissed and cursed the Chimer (turning them into the black-skinned Dunmer). She also announced that Nerevar would return and reestablish the old ways.
Fast forward to Morrowind (the game, not the region): The emperor Uriel Septim VII (having limited prophetic abilities) has sent a prisoner matching the Nerevarine's description to Vvardenfell where he should establish that he was in fact the reborn Nerevar (the "Nerevarine") while really being a member of the Blades, the Empire's elite spies, as an act of religious manipulation in order to further his influence in Vvardenfell. As it turns out this man is the Nerevarine and with a tiny bit of support from Azura he swiftly proceeds to defeat Dagoth Ur and the Tribunal.
(I do know that some details are missing.)
Yes, it's not easy to find out everything about the story, but it's certainly there and it's not quite bad. In fact, Morrowind has a pretty immersive world - just take the time and read the books you encounter. You learn a lot about the game's world, the people and their culture. I think it's quite impressive to which lengths the developers have gone creating their world.
Actually, both styles of RPG have the same right to be called "RPG". Western-style RPGs let the player play his own character, making up his own role as he plays. The world reacts to the way the player plays the game - to the role he has chosen to play. Eastern-style RPGs define a role that the player plays; the player's actions have little to no no effect on the role.
Both ways involve the player playing a role.
I still tend to think of eastern-style RPGs as Action Adventures, though.
RPG Maker XP has already produced at least one English PC game on sale...
I'm a (somewhat former) member of a major German RPG Maker community and this has piqued my interest (old interests die hard, just like habits)... Do you have any further informations on this?
The gPod was much cooler than the iGame. Heck, I'd pay for that thing and the last console I have paid for was a used Sony Playstation...
No sweat. They'll announce that they'll move back to PPC with 10.5.
The thing is that sometimes it's better to hve a big slice of a small pie than a microscopic slice from a big one. Take SubEthaEdit, for example: SEE is a nice editor, but in the Windows world it wouldn't sell that well because there's a whole lot of nice editors for Windows. Even the fact that SEE is a collaborative editor (which happen to be extremely rare on any platform) wouldn't make up for the fact that the Windows editor market is already saturated. The Mac editor market, on the other hand, is smaller but less crowded so it's still possible to come up with a good product and secure a bit of market share.
Some people are quite happy with making a decent living off their software. Not everyone wants to become the next Microsoft... And the size of a company is no indicator for the quality of their software.
Besides, it might just be cheaper to use a generic graphics card instead of a custom device...
When I wrote that the EU isn't keen on US corporations I said "unlike Ireland, which is a subsidiary of Microsoft". Of course, with Ireland being a member of the EU, it should have been "with the exception of Ireland[...]".
Before you mod me down tell why so many applications specify "10.2.8 and up only" or some such.
They did not contain libraries against most current programs link?
And now I'll mod you-- D'oh!
I don't really think a human brain could fr
Grim Fandango was utterly phenomenal.
Except for the utterly horrible controls. Seriously, some genres aren't really suited to be played with a gamepad and adventures are one of them.
They should have hired Bioware to completely rewrite them...