And that study may or may not be accurate, but Microsoft has no idea. They haven't gone through the code, it's just a bunch of hot air. Hope this doesn't stir up the water and get them looking.
Actually I'd prefer Microsoft had to prove Linux, and OO, violates MS patents. Then when they can't everyone will know exactly what MS is doing, spreading FUD. If I were someone like Linus and had the money I'd sue MS to prove Linux uses any MS patents.
Virtually all academic subjects, all the way up to college and even much of the graduate level, were laid out decades if not hundreds of years ago.
That may be true for English textbooks but it's definitely not true for books in Swahili, Hausa, or many other languages. And the places where these languages are spoken is where the XO can help the most. What you're saying shows a typical Eurocentric attitude.
Text books in the Third World are expensive, especially when they have to be replace yearly do to editing of corrections and updating them.
I don't think you see how basic the need is in the third world. The need is huge for very basic skills in reading and algebra. Those books don't have to be updated at all.
I hope you don't mean all they need in the Third World is to add, subtract, and read.
'start a Patent Militia' Them be fighting words, I'll bring my d20.
Instead of the D20 I'd rather have Canon's new EOS 1Ds Mark III with it's new 21.1-megapixel full-frame Canon CMOS sensor. Now we are seeing DSLRs closing in on low end medium format digital backs as well as 35mm film. I got my issue of "Digital Photo Pro" today and it has a review of it and of Nikon's new fullframe D3.
It makes me wonder what Thomas Jefferson would think about today's citizens.
Thomas Jefferson was originally opposed to patents, however eventually his friend James Madison convinced him that patents could prove more beneficial than not having patents. He even took out some patents himself. One was a machine that processed hemp aka marijuana, which up until the cotton gin was invented was the most widely used material for making cloth.
Seems to me that a system for implementing one-click ordering should be patentable
One click ordering should NOT be patentable. Though I don't know much about programming or databases it seems to me that they are an obvious use of cookies. Either the data can be kept in the cookie or the cookie holds a unique value, primary key, which points to a table in a database, then when the buy button is pressed the id number of the item is added to the table in the db for the purchaser. Once all items are chosen the "buy now" button is pressed then a page is written showing the data from the table.
I've seen very few textbooks released in e-book format; most of the ones I have seen were in very specialized subjects and released under the GNU FDL.
Do you live in the Third World? They are most useful there, however they are used elsewhere. U Penn list more than 25,000 e-books. The University of Texas lists more. Those are just the first 2 results of a Google of e-books "text books", which lists almost 25,000 results. Of the XO ZDNet" has this to say:
"Assuming this device can survive its harsh environment and continue to function over a period of a half-dozen or more years (still a stretch, in my estimation), a single lightweight (but rugged) device, could easily outlast 100 textbooks in a hot and humid environment. And, by any measure, a $100 laptop equipped with 100 electronic textbooks could be worth its weight in gold in such a third-world setting."
The original idea of the patent system was that some individual inventor could come up with the invention in their bedroom, get a patent, then go round venture capitalists looking for funding to implement it without having to worry about them stealing his idea and implementing it themselves.
No, patents were originally granted to encourage public disclosure. With a patent an inventor has to publicly disclose the invention, but then they get a limited monopoly to the right to market it. If an inventor wants to be able to talk to someone who can build or manufacture an item but wants to make sure they can't steal it for themselves all that's needed is a contract, the ubiquitous Non Disclosure Agreement, NDA.
(re)Register Republican NOW. Vote Ron Paul in the primary. It'll drive the politicians NUTS!
I'll change my registration just before the primary to Republican so I can vote for Ron Paul. Then afterwards I'll change it right back to "No Party Preference". This is stupid, with an open primary I could vote for the best candidate for each party. Of course that would reduce the power of the parties though.
I hadn't heard that the USPTO was 'selling' patents, personally. Perhaps charging filing fees (which you pay whether you are granted a patent or not), yes, but AFAIK, they don't take money to award a patent.
Ah but the USPTO is selling patents. The more patent they issue the more people will apply for patents, and pay when making a claim. If the USPTO were to start turning down patent applications the number of applications would decline. For them it's a matter of volume.
I've had the notebook that I'm typing on right now for about 5 years. The battery's shot, but the power supply works (though patchworked with new wires) and the laptop itself still works fine. Sure, 500mhz won't play many games, but it works fine for going online.
I also have my other laptop from the late '90s. I've never lost or broke a laptop. So in my experience, it's 0% lost or broken.
My experience with laptops has been compleatly different than your's. My first laptop had to have it's hdd and motherboard be replaced in the first year. The LCD on my second one cracked when I had it only a few months. Even though I got an extended warranty with it when I got it the LCD wasn't covered. I'm hoping the laptop I'm typing this on will last me at least 3 years.
I find it ironic that the OLPC project is always regarded with such high praise, while any mention of a school district investing in laptops is always met with disdain and remarks such as "why does a kid need a laptop anyway?
More and more colleges are requiring laptops. Some even require a specific brand or model with a specific OS, usually Windows. Some colleges include a laptop in the tuition, others require students to get one themselves.
To me, sounds like they just went with tech-jargon-BS and said that the computer is the best way to move to a better education.
I must of missed it, can you show me where they say a computer is the best way to improve education?
If all the money they spent, and want to spend, on 3rd-world education went to just.. um... BOOKS, then they would have probably accomplished twice their goal by now.
Text books in the Third World are expensive, especially when they have to be replace yearly do to editing of corrections and updating them. With a net connection an e-book on a laptop these can easily, quickly, and cheaply. A child have even be able to carry a number of e-books on one XO, then when they finish one class the text used can be placed with new text. Then you can have not just one BOOK but a bunch of BOOKS.
Sorry, but Lao Tzu said "Give A Man A Fish, Feed Him For A Day. Teach A Man To Fish, Feed Him For A Lifetime".
No matter who said it it still applies. However thanks for informing me Lao Tzu said it, I'll check on it.
So it's not a Christian saying just something Christians stole from a culture and now think of as theirs; like Christmas.
Every Christian holiday or celebration can be traced back somewhere else, each has a pagan, heathen, or other root. Christians have even taken others as their saints. Heck Christians even built their churchs on someone else's sacred site.
Anyway, more money (total value of goods) comes out of Africa than goes into it.
Diamonds, gold, and other metals like coltan are extracted from Africa and the average African see nothing from it, except for conflicts and death. Most if not all of the fighting in Africa is over a natural resource.
Basically the west's farm subsidies destroyed the value of local farm economies and we now extract a lot of raw materials from the ruins of their economies
Which is why the WTO meetings in Geneva failed. Nations like Brazil and India demanded the west; Europe, Japan, and the US to stop subsidizing agriculture in those countries. These subsidies distort the market, a US farmer is able to grow, harvest, then ship produce to most places cheaper than farmers there can grow food. And not because because the farmer has lower costs but because the government gives them billions of dollars in subsidies. Eventually India walked out because the west wouldn't budge. The US offered to lower some subsidies some but the EU and Japan refused to.
Food aid makes this process somewhat worse by preventing mass death that would adjust the local population size to something the local ecosystem is able to support.
Actually aid hurts because it drives farmers off of their farms. Afterall why should a farmer stay on a farm bleeding, sweating, and going into debt when western food is imported into his or her country and sold for less than they spend growing food?
Granted, there are significant political issues related to the random political borders etc but that landscape is way to complex for such simple analysis.
Yea, politics has a lot to do with it. At one tyme Zimbabwe used to be the breadbasket of south Africa, they were able to grow enough to feed Zimbabwe and still was able to export a lot of food, agriculture used to be the country's major money earner. However after president Robert Mugabe came to power he forced all of the white farmers off of the farms then gave them to his cronies and supporters. Because these people didn't know how to farm they weren't able to grow food. So now Zimbabwe is a basket case instead of a breadbasket.
Now this isn't true everywhere. For instance Ethiopia, it used to grow enough food too however because of droughts they haven't been able to grow enough. And some blame global warming on the drought. It's complicated but if the warming affected rainfall it would impact farming.
Put another way, I think there's a really good chance that these laptops will actually end up feeding people, very possibly more people than the equivalent amount spent on food, by making them more a part of the *OVERUSED EUPHEMISM WARNING* 'global village'. It'll bring their reality into our personal world more.
I've said basically the same thing elsewhere when posting about this article. For instance if these laptops were built in the areas where they are being used. I've specifically mentioned Brazil as an example. If the XO were built in the favells of Sao Paulo, Brazil, it would mean building them would create jobs The construction or renovation of the building will means jobs if only temporary. Those who actually build them will learn skills for building computers for businesses as well as homes. Others may learn programming. With more people earning more money they will create a demand for more and better food, which creates an incentive for many of those leaving the countryside to move to the cities to stay there. With more able to pay more for food agricultural workers can be paid better, and since they are paid better they will create demand for other things such as better healthcare and education.
I hope the distribution isn't limited to third-world countries; there are some poor areas right here in the U.S. that could use these machines. Certain Indian reservations come to mind...
Like the Rosebud reservation in the Blackhills, in 2003 it's unemployment was 85%. Or "Fort Mojave Indian Reservation along the California-Arizona-Nevada border, the unemployment rate climbed from 27.2 percent in 1991 to 74.2 percent in 1997."
I need a computer with decent outdoor screen and great battery life, one that's cheap enough I can afford to let it sink into a swamp without diving in and fighting the alligators and leeches for it (I do wildlife research in Florida). This machine may be just the ticket.
Na, go ahead and wrestle those gators, then cook yourself some gator tail. For some extras go to Hog Valley for some wild boor.
It should be the children's property, not the government's,
No, the XO is the property of whoever paid for it. I bet when you got your text books in school up through high school the books were issued to you and you had to return them. The same thing should be with these laptops.
Other things help to, e.g., microcredit programs have been shown to be a big boon to economic development and provide opportunities to develop business skills to tackle bigger challenges
Yea, the economist Dr. Yunus founder of the Grameen Bank, a microcredit bank, won a Nobel Peace Prize for his work on providing microcredit to the poor and showing it can improve people's lives. Combining the XO and microcredit may have a tremendous effect. Even farmers can see an improvement, one problem rural people have in the Third World is they don't know what resources they have or how much they can make from it. For instance whereas on the world market a coyote, trader, may only pay a farmer a penny per pound of coffee and the farmer not knowing coffee is being traded for a dollar per pound will accept the penny. But knowing how much coffee trades for the farmer can ask for a fairer price for his coffee. In India I heard of a program where instead of relying on traders, whether good or coyote, a farmer can list his produce on a trading site in the web and get an even better price.
The only way to separate infrastructure from services that use it are laws though.
Hardly. I could go start a co-op right now that was arranged as I described. The only way to force everyone, everywhere to adopt such a structure involuntarily, of course, is to pass laws making it mandatory. If that's what you want then we'll simply have to agree that our goals are mutually exclusive, however much our preferences may be aligned.
You disagree with me with your first word, "Hardly". Then you agree when you say "The only way to force everyone, everywhere to adopt such a structure involuntarily, of course, is to pass laws making it mandatory."
a co-op is, by definition, limited by its forced equality.
There is no force other than legal involved in co-ops. I voluntarily joined two co-ops, nobody held a firearm to my head saying I had to join. Nor does anyone use one to force me to shop at either one either. Actually, I'd guess most people don't know about co-op or don't know one in their area. I'd heard of co-op more than 30 years ago but until I moved I didn't know of any or how they worked. I almost stumbled on the first one I joined. In a health food store, which didn't sell any health food, I asked where I could find a store that had a good selection of organic food. I went there liked what I saw and learned it was a co-op, then when I could I joined. From there I learned of others in the area, and joined a second one.
At any tyme if I don't like how either one is run there's nothing forcing me to remain a member, not only that but if I even decide to leave I will get a refund of my membership dues I paid when I joined. There's no force and no coercion involved.
at the same time it's hardly ideal for every member's investment to be limited to the least common denominator the way it is in a co-op
Though I have only limited experience I know of no co-op where people will monetarily invest more or less than others. All of the co-ops I know have the same membership dues for everyone. Everyone pays the same and everyone has the same vote.
There is also a basic principle in capitalism that the greatest profit results from fulfilling the most urgent needs. Its corollary is that, in general, those with the greatest accumulation of past profits (i.e. those with the most to invest) tend to make the most efficient decisions. Forcing an equal share in the decisions when the members have manifestly unequal decision-making abilities is hardly efficient.
As I state above there is no unequal decision making abilities in a co-op, now some may be more effective in persuading others but that's true in C and S corporations as well. Ineffective decision making also is found in these corporations. Chrysler had to be bailed out by the governmen tin the 1980s because of bad decision making, and corporations seek banruptcy for protection for the sane reason. Also another principle in capitalism is a voluntary exchange, which is exactly what a co-op is all about. Notice how "coop" is part of "cooperation" co-op members voluntarily agree to cooperate.
Oh, I want to touch on one other thing that's related, the Corporation. Originally a corporation was granted a charter with the requirement that it benefited and improved society, the public good, or to serve a public purpose in some way. Amount the first corporations chartered was the Dutch East India Company and the Honourable East India Company in 1602 and 1600 respectively. They were chartered because they served the purpose of improving society by encouraging international trade. Both of these corporations were shipping companies and where prior to corporat
That's kind of what I'm thinking. I love my MacBook Pro but there are times I really don't need it. Traveling, I might be able to easily get buy with just an OLPC that would let me do a little surfing or hacking. The battery life, weight, and size would be great. I don't need all the extra power most of the time.
Though I've only had my Macbook Pro several weeks I love it too. However as I'd be taking my camera as well I want more storage and the ability to do some preliminary editing as well.
At $400, it's just too much. I know it's buy-one-donate-one, but that's still just too high.
After spending more than $3000 on my new MBP I don't think $400 is too much if it can be used for what I want to do with it. I admit is a lot for me, and half of the price of Photoshop CS. Then again I'm on disability and don't work. I'm hoping to break into photography though.
But I live in Brazil, one of the mains backers of this project, at least vocally. And I know that many kids here could benefit from these computers. But I am sure that this money could be spent elsewhere, because even in this country, which has in general better living standards than many others, there are still a lot of desperate people. People that don't have enough to eat. Millions of people still don't have access to clean water and basic sanitation. I say they should be a priority.
Further up the thread I mentioned how Brazil was one of the supporter of the OLPC and made a suggestion. If the OLPC were to have the XOs made as close to where they are used it could produce another benefit. In Brazil for instance if the laptops were made in Brazil this would create jobs. Even better is to make them even closer, such as in the favelas of Rio for the schools of Rio. Then some workers could take their skills and apply them to building computers for business and home users. Others might learn programming thus learn to program for businesses. The creation of new jobs would boost the economy creating more jobs. With more people working there's more incentive for people to also farm and grow food for those workers, while also creating more opportunities in construction. Each job created can create more jobs.
I'ld like to add that they need to produce millions of near identical computers to get the economy of scale to produce it at $150-200 cost.
I'll add that it would help if the laptops were produced in the country if not the region that buys them. One nation mentioned as buying or having an interest in buying the XO is Brazil. If OLPC were to open a factory in Brazil to build them n ot only would it benefit education in Brazil but it would create jobs there too. They might not last long but the skills gained by the workers can be used somewhere else, a group of workers could start a business building computers and selling them. Others can write software.
The durability and the low power consumption make this very interesting to me. If I can plug my phone into it via a USB port it could be a great connectivity solution while camping. (Festival-type campground camping in rural but not backwoods areas, where I can still get a cell signal, and be reachable in case of a work emergency. Backwoods camping is a different beast, if I'm going to the woods I am gone and don't expect to reach me.)
When in the backwoods hiking I want to be able to upload my photos, so what I'd like is a laptop with wireless broadband where the signal can travel hundreds of miles. And the weight doesn't matter as much to me as it seems to matter to others. The way I look at it is that if I can't backpack with 50 lbs now when I used to backpack with 100 lbs I'm in real bad shape.
Slashdot Mirror
And that study may or may not be accurate, but Microsoft has no idea. They haven't gone through the code, it's just a bunch of hot air. Hope this doesn't stir up the water and get them looking.
Actually I'd prefer Microsoft had to prove Linux, and OO, violates MS patents. Then when they can't everyone will know exactly what MS is doing, spreading FUD. If I were someone like Linus and had the money I'd sue MS to prove Linux uses any MS patents.
FalconVirtually all academic subjects, all the way up to college and even much of the graduate level, were laid out decades if not hundreds of years ago.
That may be true for English textbooks but it's definitely not true for books in Swahili, Hausa, or many other languages. And the places where these languages are spoken is where the XO can help the most. What you're saying shows a typical Eurocentric attitude.
FalconText books in the Third World are expensive, especially when they have to be replace yearly do to editing of corrections and updating them.
I don't think you see how basic the need is in the third world. The need is huge for very basic skills in reading and algebra. Those books don't have to be updated at all.
I hope you don't mean all they need in the Third World is to add, subtract, and read.
Falcon'start a Patent Militia' Them be fighting words, I'll bring my d20.
Instead of the D20 I'd rather have Canon's new EOS 1Ds Mark III with it's new 21.1-megapixel full-frame Canon CMOS sensor. Now we are seeing DSLRs closing in on low end medium format digital backs as well as 35mm film. I got my issue of "Digital Photo Pro" today and it has a review of it and of Nikon's new fullframe D3.
FalconIt makes me wonder what Thomas Jefferson would think about today's citizens.
Thomas Jefferson was originally opposed to patents, however eventually his friend James Madison convinced him that patents could prove more beneficial than not having patents. He even took out some patents himself. One was a machine that processed hemp aka marijuana, which up until the cotton gin was invented was the most widely used material for making cloth.
FalconSeems to me that a system for implementing one-click ordering should be patentable
One click ordering should NOT be patentable. Though I don't know much about programming or databases it seems to me that they are an obvious use of cookies. Either the data can be kept in the cookie or the cookie holds a unique value, primary key, which points to a table in a database, then when the buy button is pressed the id number of the item is added to the table in the db for the purchaser. Once all items are chosen the "buy now" button is pressed then a page is written showing the data from the table.
FalconI've seen very few textbooks released in e-book format; most of the ones I have seen were in very specialized subjects and released under the GNU FDL.
Do you live in the Third World? They are most useful there, however they are used elsewhere. U Penn list more than 25,000 e-books. The University of Texas lists more. Those are just the first 2 results of a Google of e-books "text books", which lists almost 25,000 results. Of the XO ZDNet" has this to say:
"Assuming this device can survive its harsh environment and continue to function over a period of a half-dozen or more years (still a stretch, in my estimation), a single lightweight (but rugged) device, could easily outlast 100 textbooks in a hot and humid environment. And, by any measure, a $100 laptop equipped with 100 electronic textbooks could be worth its weight in gold in such a third-world setting."
FalconThe original idea of the patent system was that some individual inventor could come up with the invention in their bedroom, get a patent, then go round venture capitalists looking for funding to implement it without having to worry about them stealing his idea and implementing it themselves.
No, patents were originally granted to encourage public disclosure. With a patent an inventor has to publicly disclose the invention, but then they get a limited monopoly to the right to market it. If an inventor wants to be able to talk to someone who can build or manufacture an item but wants to make sure they can't steal it for themselves all that's needed is a contract, the ubiquitous Non Disclosure Agreement, NDA.
Falconyou have to have a working model (if it's a physical device) or software that runs (if it's software) that the patent examiner can try out.
Software should never ever be patneted!!`
FALCON(re)Register Republican NOW. Vote Ron Paul in the primary. It'll drive the politicians NUTS!
I'll change my registration just before the primary to Republican so I can vote for Ron Paul. Then afterwards I'll change it right back to "No Party Preference". This is stupid, with an open primary I could vote for the best candidate for each party. Of course that would reduce the power of the parties though.
FalconI hadn't heard that the USPTO was 'selling' patents, personally. Perhaps charging filing fees (which you pay whether you are granted a patent or not), yes, but AFAIK, they don't take money to award a patent.
Ah but the USPTO is selling patents. The more patent they issue the more people will apply for patents, and pay when making a claim. If the USPTO were to start turning down patent applications the number of applications would decline. For them it's a matter of volume.
Abolish all patents!
FalconTaking two devices to make an improved, or different device is perfectly valid.
It may be valid but it's not valid to issue a patent for it.
FalconI've had the notebook that I'm typing on right now for about 5 years. The battery's shot, but the power supply works (though patchworked with new wires) and the laptop itself still works fine. Sure, 500mhz won't play many games, but it works fine for going online.
I also have my other laptop from the late '90s. I've never lost or broke a laptop. So in my experience, it's 0% lost or broken.
My experience with laptops has been compleatly different than your's. My first laptop had to have it's hdd and motherboard be replaced in the first year. The LCD on my second one cracked when I had it only a few months. Even though I got an extended warranty with it when I got it the LCD wasn't covered. I'm hoping the laptop I'm typing this on will last me at least 3 years.
FalconI find it ironic that the OLPC project is always regarded with such high praise, while any mention of a school district investing in laptops is always met with disdain and remarks such as "why does a kid need a laptop anyway?
More and more colleges are requiring laptops. Some even require a specific brand or model with a specific OS, usually Windows. Some colleges include a laptop in the tuition, others require students to get one themselves.
FalconTo me, sounds like they just went with tech-jargon-BS and said that the computer is the best way to move to a better education.
I must of missed it, can you show me where they say a computer is the best way to improve education?
If all the money they spent, and want to spend, on 3rd-world education went to just.. um... BOOKS, then they would have probably accomplished twice their goal by now.
Text books in the Third World are expensive, especially when they have to be replace yearly do to editing of corrections and updating them. With a net connection an e-book on a laptop these can easily, quickly, and cheaply. A child have even be able to carry a number of e-books on one XO, then when they finish one class the text used can be placed with new text. Then you can have not just one BOOK but a bunch of BOOKS.
FalconSorry, but Lao Tzu said "Give A Man A Fish, Feed Him For A Day. Teach A Man To Fish, Feed Him For A Lifetime".
No matter who said it it still applies. However thanks for informing me Lao Tzu said it, I'll check on it.
So it's not a Christian saying just something Christians stole from a culture and now think of as theirs; like Christmas.
Every Christian holiday or celebration can be traced back somewhere else, each has a pagan, heathen, or other root. Christians have even taken others as their saints. Heck Christians even built their churchs on someone else's sacred site.
Anyway, more money (total value of goods) comes out of Africa than goes into it.
Diamonds, gold, and other metals like coltan are extracted from Africa and the average African see nothing from it, except for conflicts and death. Most if not all of the fighting in Africa is over a natural resource.
Basically the west's farm subsidies destroyed the value of local farm economies and we now extract a lot of raw materials from the ruins of their economies
Which is why the WTO meetings in Geneva failed. Nations like Brazil and India demanded the west; Europe, Japan, and the US to stop subsidizing agriculture in those countries. These subsidies distort the market, a US farmer is able to grow, harvest, then ship produce to most places cheaper than farmers there can grow food. And not because because the farmer has lower costs but because the government gives them billions of dollars in subsidies. Eventually India walked out because the west wouldn't budge. The US offered to lower some subsidies some but the EU and Japan refused to.
Food aid makes this process somewhat worse by preventing mass death that would adjust the local population size to something the local ecosystem is able to support.
Actually aid hurts because it drives farmers off of their farms. Afterall why should a farmer stay on a farm bleeding, sweating, and going into debt when western food is imported into his or her country and sold for less than they spend growing food?
Granted, there are significant political issues related to the random political borders etc but that landscape is way to complex for such simple analysis.
Yea, politics has a lot to do with it. At one tyme Zimbabwe used to be the breadbasket of south Africa, they were able to grow enough to feed Zimbabwe and still was able to export a lot of food, agriculture used to be the country's major money earner. However after president Robert Mugabe came to power he forced all of the white farmers off of the farms then gave them to his cronies and supporters. Because these people didn't know how to farm they weren't able to grow food. So now Zimbabwe is a basket case instead of a breadbasket.
Now this isn't true everywhere. For instance Ethiopia, it used to grow enough food too however because of droughts they haven't been able to grow enough. And some blame global warming on the drought. It's complicated but if the warming affected rainfall it would impact farming.
FalconPut another way, I think there's a really good chance that these laptops will actually end up feeding people, very possibly more people than the equivalent amount spent on food, by making them more a part of the *OVERUSED EUPHEMISM WARNING* 'global village'. It'll bring their reality into our personal world more.
I've said basically the same thing elsewhere when posting about this article. For instance if these laptops were built in the areas where they are being used. I've specifically mentioned Brazil as an example. If the XO were built in the favells of Sao Paulo, Brazil, it would mean building them would create jobs The construction or renovation of the building will means jobs if only temporary. Those who actually build them will learn skills for building computers for businesses as well as homes. Others may learn programming. With more people earning more money they will create a demand for more and better food, which creates an incentive for many of those leaving the countryside to move to the cities to stay there. With more able to pay more for food agricultural workers can be paid better, and since they are paid better they will create demand for other things such as better healthcare and education.
FalconI hope the distribution isn't limited to third-world countries; there are some poor areas right here in the U.S. that could use these machines. Certain Indian reservations come to mind...
Like the Rosebud reservation in the Blackhills, in 2003 it's unemployment was 85%. Or "Fort Mojave Indian Reservation along the California-Arizona-Nevada border, the unemployment rate climbed from 27.2 percent in 1991 to 74.2 percent in 1997."
I need a computer with decent outdoor screen and great battery life, one that's cheap enough I can afford to let it sink into a swamp without diving in and fighting the alligators and leeches for it (I do wildlife research in Florida). This machine may be just the ticket.
Na, go ahead and wrestle those gators, then cook yourself some gator tail. For some extras go to Hog Valley for some wild boor.
FalconIt should be the children's property, not the government's,
No, the XO is the property of whoever paid for it. I bet when you got your text books in school up through high school the books were issued to you and you had to return them. The same thing should be with these laptops.
FalconOther things help to, e.g., microcredit programs have been shown to be a big boon to economic development and provide opportunities to develop business skills to tackle bigger challenges
Yea, the economist Dr. Yunus founder of the Grameen Bank, a microcredit bank, won a Nobel Peace Prize for his work on providing microcredit to the poor and showing it can improve people's lives. Combining the XO and microcredit may have a tremendous effect. Even farmers can see an improvement, one problem rural people have in the Third World is they don't know what resources they have or how much they can make from it. For instance whereas on the world market a coyote, trader, may only pay a farmer a penny per pound of coffee and the farmer not knowing coffee is being traded for a dollar per pound will accept the penny. But knowing how much coffee trades for the farmer can ask for a fairer price for his coffee. In India I heard of a program where instead of relying on traders, whether good or coyote, a farmer can list his produce on a trading site in the web and get an even better price.
FalconThe only way to separate infrastructure from services that use it are laws though.
Hardly. I could go start a co-op right now that was arranged as I described. The only way to force everyone, everywhere to adopt such a structure involuntarily, of course, is to pass laws making it mandatory. If that's what you want then we'll simply have to agree that our goals are mutually exclusive, however much our preferences may be aligned.
You disagree with me with your first word, "Hardly". Then you agree when you say "The only way to force everyone, everywhere to adopt such a structure involuntarily, of course, is to pass laws making it mandatory."
a co-op is, by definition, limited by its forced equality.
There is no force other than legal involved in co-ops. I voluntarily joined two co-ops, nobody held a firearm to my head saying I had to join. Nor does anyone use one to force me to shop at either one either. Actually, I'd guess most people don't know about co-op or don't know one in their area. I'd heard of co-op more than 30 years ago but until I moved I didn't know of any or how they worked. I almost stumbled on the first one I joined. In a health food store, which didn't sell any health food, I asked where I could find a store that had a good selection of organic food. I went there liked what I saw and learned it was a co-op, then when I could I joined. From there I learned of others in the area, and joined a second one.
At any tyme if I don't like how either one is run there's nothing forcing me to remain a member, not only that but if I even decide to leave I will get a refund of my membership dues I paid when I joined. There's no force and no coercion involved.
at the same time it's hardly ideal for every member's investment to be limited to the least common denominator the way it is in a co-op
Though I have only limited experience I know of no co-op where people will monetarily invest more or less than others. All of the co-ops I know have the same membership dues for everyone. Everyone pays the same and everyone has the same vote.
There is also a basic principle in capitalism that the greatest profit results from fulfilling the most urgent needs. Its corollary is that, in general, those with the greatest accumulation of past profits (i.e. those with the most to invest) tend to make the most efficient decisions. Forcing an equal share in the decisions when the members have manifestly unequal decision-making abilities is hardly efficient.
As I state above there is no unequal decision making abilities in a co-op, now some may be more effective in persuading others but that's true in C and S corporations as well. Ineffective decision making also is found in these corporations. Chrysler had to be bailed out by the governmen tin the 1980s because of bad decision making, and corporations seek banruptcy for protection for the sane reason. Also another principle in capitalism is a voluntary exchange, which is exactly what a co-op is all about. Notice how "coop" is part of "cooperation" co-op members voluntarily agree to cooperate.
Oh, I want to touch on one other thing that's related, the Corporation. Originally a corporation was granted a charter with the requirement that it benefited and improved society, the public good, or to serve a public purpose in some way. Amount the first corporations chartered was the Dutch East India Company and the Honourable East India Company in 1602 and 1600 respectively. They were chartered because they served the purpose of improving society by encouraging international trade. Both of these corporations were shipping companies and where prior to corporat
That's kind of what I'm thinking. I love my MacBook Pro but there are times I really don't need it. Traveling, I might be able to easily get buy with just an OLPC that would let me do a little surfing or hacking. The battery life, weight, and size would be great. I don't need all the extra power most of the time.
Though I've only had my Macbook Pro several weeks I love it too. However as I'd be taking my camera as well I want more storage and the ability to do some preliminary editing as well.
At $400, it's just too much. I know it's buy-one-donate-one, but that's still just too high.
After spending more than $3000 on my new MBP I don't think $400 is too much if it can be used for what I want to do with it. I admit is a lot for me, and half of the price of Photoshop CS. Then again I'm on disability and don't work. I'm hoping to break into photography though.
FalconBut I live in Brazil, one of the mains backers of this project, at least vocally. And I know that many kids here could benefit from these computers. But I am sure that this money could be spent elsewhere, because even in this country, which has in general better living standards than many others, there are still a lot of desperate people. People that don't have enough to eat. Millions of people still don't have access to clean water and basic sanitation. I say they should be a priority.
Further up the thread I mentioned how Brazil was one of the supporter of the OLPC and made a suggestion. If the OLPC were to have the XOs made as close to where they are used it could produce another benefit. In Brazil for instance if the laptops were made in Brazil this would create jobs. Even better is to make them even closer, such as in the favelas of Rio for the schools of Rio. Then some workers could take their skills and apply them to building computers for business and home users. Others might learn programming thus learn to program for businesses. The creation of new jobs would boost the economy creating more jobs. With more people working there's more incentive for people to also farm and grow food for those workers, while also creating more opportunities in construction. Each job created can create more jobs.
FalconI'ld like to add that they need to produce millions of near identical computers to get the economy of scale to produce it at $150-200 cost.
I'll add that it would help if the laptops were produced in the country if not the region that buys them. One nation mentioned as buying or having an interest in buying the XO is Brazil. If OLPC were to open a factory in Brazil to build them n ot only would it benefit education in Brazil but it would create jobs there too. They might not last long but the skills gained by the workers can be used somewhere else, a group of workers could start a business building computers and selling them. Others can write software.
FalconThe durability and the low power consumption make this very interesting to me. If I can plug my phone into it via a USB port it could be a great connectivity solution while camping. (Festival-type campground camping in rural but not backwoods areas, where I can still get a cell signal, and be reachable in case of a work emergency. Backwoods camping is a different beast, if I'm going to the woods I am gone and don't expect to reach me.)
When in the backwoods hiking I want to be able to upload my photos, so what I'd like is a laptop with wireless broadband where the signal can travel hundreds of miles. And the weight doesn't matter as much to me as it seems to matter to others. The way I look at it is that if I can't backpack with 50 lbs now when I used to backpack with 100 lbs I'm in real bad shape.
Falcon