ugh.. unless I have a dirt powered 300 baud modem.... I wont be on the net in 2200 and neither will you.
Yes the Telephone evolved, but it is still illegal to wiretap without a warrant (well unless your a terrorist or they simply, say you're a terrorist).
The point is, tech evolves, but the disgusting overbearing thirst for more control over we the people, by those in power... remains constant if not increasing.
We could evolve freedom of speech out of the constitution (and we have already in some ways)... but that doesn't make it "right" or "better"
I mean this country would be so much easier to control if we just shut everyone up and made them do whatever the rich told them to do. Granted thats how it is now, except we can still bitch about it... mostly because it does nothing to change the problem anyways. We're enslaved and thats that.
SciFi is a road map for human evolution. We dream it, then we become it.
We, the rebels... are too small and controlled by the system. Gotta work to eat, gotta work for them, to get paid...
There is a war coming against our own people and our own interests.
As Q said on TNG:P "The trial never ended"...
We will lose this fight, I'm sure. We are expendable and we will turn on our beleifs for financial self interest. Like I said, everyone has to eat, pay the bills etc.
But we have to keep our heads and see the big picture. Play both sides if you have to... but when it comes down to it, always side with freedom and privacy. America may be dead... but the concept was sound.
Thats not why. Whats driving offshoring is the promise of slave wages. We can not compete with slave wages and never will. We just cant. Our country has to degrade to their poverty level before our workers are competitively priced.
The problem is, in order for that to happen, our country has to be first destroyed by our own capitalistic greed.
We are doomed.
We could block importation of goods, or place extremely high taxes on them so we can lower the taxes on our citizens... (which would be a good idea) but... in the end i think we wont because we like cheap products... even if it means losing your job.
No one really cares about America, or its people. The world doesnt care, and we the American people dont even care. We exist to be exploited by those who have the money.... and they certainly dont care.
The top 1%... blah blah blah... we've heard it all before... they have a ridiculous amount of wealth... and yet we in the broke 99% have nothing. Thats not going to cahnge because no one cares.
Its that simple. WE NEED TO STOP PRETENDING THAT WE GIVE A DAMN, and just kill the country.... oh but before we do, lets bleed her dry for all the pennies she has. And that is exactly whats happening and the mentality.
I think many are just doubtful, but yeah there fanboys are everywhere. Any geek should/could appreciate what you've said though. These are people trying something new, and problem solving along the way.
Networked life has a long way to go in its evolution:P We shouldnt act like we've hit the destination yet. These folks are trying something new, and perhaps its possible... or perhaps it will be possible in the near future. Either way, these folks are taking steps to find that out. We cant shit on them for that, fail or not... its still interesting and challenging.
I myself am reserved about it for many reasons beyond technical challenges... but It does have benefits and what they learn in doing this will benefit future developments.
I found the presentation interesting and it certainly does sound possible and in many ways exciting, however as a gamer... there are some specific issues. Latency being a huge issue, but also video quality. For example, I play work and play on a 30inch monitor at 2560x1600. The native resolution of my monitor exceeds their services capability. Now many people have different native monitor resolutions, and everyone wants, and should be playing at that native resolution (if they're lcd etc).
So my 2560x1600 native res would increase my latency on their service... and thats even IF they provide such a resolution.
It sounds as if currently, they offer 4:3 SD 720x486 and "HD" 16:9... but he didnt specify which HD resolution that was specifically. I'm going to guess that 1280x720 is the resolution they consider "HD" because of obvious latency issues.
So, how would 1080p effect their latency numbers? How would 2560x1600 effect those latency numbers?
How about dual display users?
The other issue is Image quality...
The Asian student in the video asked about if the service was "lossy" and i think the speaker misunderstood the question because he answered with information about the packet loss mostly... but its clear that this compression scheme is lossy... but how much so? That would be a factor to many users who want the absolute best visuals they can get. In other words, sure some server could be running Crysis at 4xAA but hows it look in their codec? I mean it could negate the benefits of 4xaa and all of that processing power used to render crysis at 4xaa. Again this needs to be seen to understood. I'm sure they have worked very hard at figuring out this problem. It doesnt mean they have the perfect answer to it yet, but i'm sure they have balanced and made tradeoffs as much as they can to provide image quality etc...
BUT... how does it compare to my local system running the game. Thats the big question.
I think resolution is an interesting problem. I dont want to run a game thats "comprsesed video" thats now being scaled up to fill my 30inch screen. I would rather play at a native resolution. Scaling up compressed video isnt ideal in any situation... and my experience working in games and post production leads me to believe that scaling up a compressed video stream just cant look better than my local machine. Then factor in the latency issues. I can get a lower ping easily on my fiber... soooooo a lot of this will all come down to "trying it out"
I'm positive about it though. I find it technically challenging and fascinating that these folks are trying something new, and navigating the hurdles as they come. The service does look to have some very interesting benefits. I think the spectating thing is a great feature. Perhaps someday we will see their codec chip become a standard feature on our local hardware, such as an nvidia chip etc... so we can stream our games to others ourselves.
I like what they're doing but i'm reserved in that i like to own my stuff. I find that we're losing a part of gaming when we go to a server client relationship. We will kill the future classic gaming scene when the server software isnt available to us the gamer, or the enthusiast who enjoys classic gaming.
Destroying the used gaming market... I'm not to thrilled with either. There is something to be said for owning what you buy, or at least the physical copy. I dont think many people are thrilled with the idea of buying something they may not be able to use in the future due to being locked out by some service's disinterest in supporting that old game.
There are still people to thsi day that play counter strike, and they can only do so thanks to the ability to run their own server. The Call of Duty Modern Warfare2 fans are generally pissed off that their "scene" is effectively destroyed by the inability to run their own servers... SO much that they've figured out how to hack the software into a server mode...
I clearly see benefits in this service, but there will be
If everyone is being taxed for the "perceived loss", shouldnt that then make piracy legal? Wouldnt the pirated material being downloaded have been paid for by the people... thus making piracy completely legal?
exactly. Its obvious that no matter what rules they make, its going to come down to the people inside the plane. The only thing that will really save you, is yourself and others on that plane.
Twitter? Come on. This is just some idiot thinking hes doing something special, when in fact hes not. This is just dumb.
The fine is enough to discourage people.
No one cares if they're name goes on twitter for being a drunk. If anything it probably shows they had a good time and go laid, or that they're depressed and lonely. Perhaps that will help them get laid more.
It will be the twitter list for people you want to party with.
Apple competes against microsoft as well. Dell doesnt make an OS. Apple is definitely competing with windows. Just watch all of Apple's mac vs PC commercials and anti vista and windows 7 stuff.
I hear you. Undocumented APIs etc... put that aside. Has IE hurt anyone? Firefox is my browser of choice, and Chrome is quickly winning me over from firefox (although its not there yet).
I dont even launch IE EVER...
I have installed Safari on my PC as well for giggles (and also because ITUNES secretly installs it when it "Auto updates"... talk about sneaky shit...
But what harm has IE done?
Netscape? Did the browser market really suffer?
Opera is still around and I cant find anyone that uses it... and its a good browser!
I mean the options are all still there and available.
Again i'm just speaking browsers. The whole undocumented API nonsense etc... MS should and has paid through the ass for but... its not a reason to go after them for everything when the competition does it as well.
Thats like making Derek Jeter play short stop blind folded because he's more popular than the visiting team's short stop who happens to be better. At what point do we all MS to play fairly?
I mean at the end of the day, this punishment has to end no?
So if I buy OSX and install OSX on my non apple pc, Apple will support me?
Apple is NOT in the same market as Microsoft when we talk about OS. BUT they are in the same market as computer options. You can buy a PC of a MAC, thats the way its been forever now.
That is two options, not a monopoly.
You cant say MS owns a monopoly on the PC market when there are other OSes in the PC market, and APPLE has not even dared to set foot into that market. They have kept the two seperate.
Apple has its OWN monopoly in its OWN market on its own hardware and does not support me buying OSX and isntalling it on non apple hardware.
This is about Browsers too, atleast the article is... Macs come with Safari, itunes, ichat, mail, search light etc all installed. This no different than what MS does, except MS is not allowed to do so.
Again... APPLE is a monopoly. Far greater than windows. Granted they dont have the same number of users... but of thsoe users, and potential buysers of Apple products... they only have ONE CHOICE... from Apple, when and how they say so.
Apple still controls their hardware with an iron fist. Perhaps the EU should force Apple to support NON APPLE COMPUTERS before we continue on assuming that they are even in the same OS market as Microsoft and Linux.
Really? So you can buy Apple computers with Linux on them or just windows 7?
Apple controls the entire Apple computer market and ship their computers with Safari, Searchlight, Mail, ichat, and itunes. Microsoft can barely get away with including Media player at this point. They had to remove their email and IM programs, and now they have to offer you which browser you want?
Gee... It sounds like I would just buy a mac if i wanted a complete OS with tools out of the box... It sure would be nice if MS provided that... oh they cant by law.
So Legally MS is gimped, and Apple walks away free? How is that fair? Oh right because we hate Microsoft.
Slashdot Mirror
Learn to use a computer or be kind to someone that knows computers :)
You could take away all of the taxes, and labor costs per hour are still going to be too high to compete with China's .50 cents an hour.
I dont know where you live, but i doubt you can afford to live on anything even close to that.
ugh.. unless I have a dirt powered 300 baud modem.... I wont be on the net in 2200 and neither will you.
Yes the Telephone evolved, but it is still illegal to wiretap without a warrant (well unless your a terrorist or they simply, say you're a terrorist).
The point is, tech evolves, but the disgusting overbearing thirst for more control over we the people, by those in power... remains constant if not increasing.
We could evolve freedom of speech out of the constitution (and we have already in some ways)... but that doesn't make it "right" or "better"
I mean this country would be so much easier to control if we just shut everyone up and made them do whatever the rich told them to do. Granted thats how it is now, except we can still bitch about it... mostly because it does nothing to change the problem anyways. We're enslaved and thats that.
Enjoy your net. You let them do it.
SciFi is a road map for human evolution. We dream it, then we become it.
We, the rebels... are too small and controlled by the system. Gotta work to eat, gotta work for them, to get paid...
There is a war coming against our own people and our own interests.
As Q said on TNG :P "The trial never ended"...
We will lose this fight, I'm sure. We are expendable and we will turn on our beleifs for financial self interest. Like I said, everyone has to eat, pay the bills etc.
But we have to keep our heads and see the big picture. Play both sides if you have to... but when it comes down to it, always side with freedom and privacy. America may be dead... but the concept was sound.
The fucked up thing is... They will win. they will get what they want.
Cyberpunk may be scifi, but all scifi becomes reality at somepoint. It is a roadmap for humanity and it does become real.
Will will soon see ourselves deep within that battle where many who crave freedom will not find it on the new corporate internet in 2020.
Get ready for the War... I'm not kidding.
Thats not why. Whats driving offshoring is the promise of slave wages. We can not compete with slave wages and never will. We just cant. Our country has to degrade to their poverty level before our workers are competitively priced.
The problem is, in order for that to happen, our country has to be first destroyed by our own capitalistic greed.
We are doomed.
We could block importation of goods, or place extremely high taxes on them so we can lower the taxes on our citizens... (which would be a good idea) but... in the end i think we wont because we like cheap products... even if it means losing your job.
No one really cares about America, or its people. The world doesnt care, and we the American people dont even care. We exist to be exploited by those who have the money.... and they certainly dont care.
The top 1%... blah blah blah... we've heard it all before... they have a ridiculous amount of wealth... and yet we in the broke 99% have nothing. Thats not going to cahnge because no one cares.
Its that simple. WE NEED TO STOP PRETENDING THAT WE GIVE A DAMN, and just kill the country.... oh but before we do, lets bleed her dry for all the pennies she has. And that is exactly whats happening and the mentality.
I think many are just doubtful, but yeah there fanboys are everywhere. Any geek should/could appreciate what you've said though. These are people trying something new, and problem solving along the way.
Networked life has a long way to go in its evolution :P We shouldnt act like we've hit the destination yet. These folks are trying something new, and perhaps its possible... or perhaps it will be possible in the near future. Either way, these folks are taking steps to find that out. We cant shit on them for that, fail or not... its still interesting and challenging.
I myself am reserved about it for many reasons beyond technical challenges... but It does have benefits and what they learn in doing this will benefit future developments.
I found the presentation interesting and it certainly does sound possible and in many ways exciting, however as a gamer... there are some specific issues. Latency being a huge issue, but also video quality. For example, I play work and play on a 30inch monitor at 2560x1600. The native resolution of my monitor exceeds their services capability. Now many people have different native monitor resolutions, and everyone wants, and should be playing at that native resolution (if they're lcd etc).
So my 2560x1600 native res would increase my latency on their service... and thats even IF they provide such a resolution.
It sounds as if currently, they offer 4:3 SD 720x486 and "HD" 16:9... but he didnt specify which HD resolution that was specifically. I'm going to guess that 1280x720 is the resolution they consider "HD" because of obvious latency issues.
So, how would 1080p effect their latency numbers? How would 2560x1600 effect those latency numbers?
How about dual display users?
The other issue is Image quality...
The Asian student in the video asked about if the service was "lossy" and i think the speaker misunderstood the question because he answered with information about the packet loss mostly... but its clear that this compression scheme is lossy... but how much so? That would be a factor to many users who want the absolute best visuals they can get. In other words, sure some server could be running Crysis at 4xAA but hows it look in their codec? I mean it could negate the benefits of 4xaa and all of that processing power used to render crysis at 4xaa. Again this needs to be seen to understood. I'm sure they have worked very hard at figuring out this problem. It doesnt mean they have the perfect answer to it yet, but i'm sure they have balanced and made tradeoffs as much as they can to provide image quality etc...
BUT... how does it compare to my local system running the game. Thats the big question.
I think resolution is an interesting problem. I dont want to run a game thats "comprsesed video" thats now being scaled up to fill my 30inch screen. I would rather play at a native resolution. Scaling up compressed video isnt ideal in any situation... and my experience working in games and post production leads me to believe that scaling up a compressed video stream just cant look better than my local machine. Then factor in the latency issues. I can get a lower ping easily on my fiber... soooooo a lot of this will all come down to "trying it out"
I'm positive about it though. I find it technically challenging and fascinating that these folks are trying something new, and navigating the hurdles as they come. The service does look to have some very interesting benefits. I think the spectating thing is a great feature. Perhaps someday we will see their codec chip become a standard feature on our local hardware, such as an nvidia chip etc... so we can stream our games to others ourselves.
I like what they're doing but i'm reserved in that i like to own my stuff. I find that we're losing a part of gaming when we go to a server client relationship. We will kill the future classic gaming scene when the server software isnt available to us the gamer, or the enthusiast who enjoys classic gaming.
Destroying the used gaming market... I'm not to thrilled with either. There is something to be said for owning what you buy, or at least the physical copy. I dont think many people are thrilled with the idea of buying something they may not be able to use in the future due to being locked out by some service's disinterest in supporting that old game.
There are still people to thsi day that play counter strike, and they can only do so thanks to the ability to run their own server. The Call of Duty Modern Warfare2 fans are generally pissed off that their "scene" is effectively destroyed by the inability to run their own servers... SO much that they've figured out how to hack the software into a server mode...
I clearly see benefits in this service, but there will be
If everyone is being taxed for the "perceived loss", shouldnt that then make piracy legal? Wouldnt the pirated material being downloaded have been paid for by the people... thus making piracy completely legal?
And those measures worked out so well... :)
exactly. Its obvious that no matter what rules they make, its going to come down to the people inside the plane. The only thing that will really save you, is yourself and others on that plane.
The Patriot Act really helped to stop this guy (rolls eyes)
Twitter? Come on. This is just some idiot thinking hes doing something special, when in fact hes not. This is just dumb.
The fine is enough to discourage people.
No one cares if they're name goes on twitter for being a drunk. If anything it probably shows they had a good time and go laid, or that they're depressed and lonely. Perhaps that will help them get laid more.
It will be the twitter list for people you want to party with.
Panasonic, another great American company leading the way to the future!
I'll toss FIOS under the bus too. Verizon's HD varies greatly. I'm not sure if its the channel companies themselves or Verizon doing it...
Either way, I hate watching fast motion movies or tv shows where the bitrate is too low.
Try watching "How its Made" on discovery HD and watch how compressed things look as fast moving manufactured parts pass through machinery.
Same for HBO films etc.
Apple competes against microsoft as well. Dell doesnt make an OS. Apple is definitely competing with windows. Just watch all of Apple's mac vs PC commercials and anti vista and windows 7 stuff.
Also, Itunes is far more popular than windows media player... and it secretly tries to install Safari via itunes's auto update.
Should iTunes be bundled with every Windows install? Should it be bundled with every OSX install?
I hear you. Undocumented APIs etc... put that aside. Has IE hurt anyone? Firefox is my browser of choice, and Chrome is quickly winning me over from firefox (although its not there yet).
I dont even launch IE EVER...
I have installed Safari on my PC as well for giggles (and also because ITUNES secretly installs it when it "Auto updates"... talk about sneaky shit...
But what harm has IE done?
Netscape? Did the browser market really suffer?
Opera is still around and I cant find anyone that uses it... and its a good browser!
I mean the options are all still there and available.
Again i'm just speaking browsers. The whole undocumented API nonsense etc... MS should and has paid through the ass for but... its not a reason to go after them for everything when the competition does it as well.
Thats like making Derek Jeter play short stop blind folded because he's more popular than the visiting team's short stop who happens to be better. At what point do we all MS to play fairly?
I mean at the end of the day, this punishment has to end no?
Apple is in a dominant position in the Apple market. They are their own market. They are in complete control.
Its like saying I cant put coca-cola in a non coca-cola glass.
So if I buy OSX and install OSX on my non apple pc, Apple will support me?
Apple is NOT in the same market as Microsoft when we talk about OS. BUT they are in the same market as computer options. You can buy a PC of a MAC, thats the way its been forever now.
That is two options, not a monopoly.
You cant say MS owns a monopoly on the PC market when there are other OSes in the PC market, and APPLE has not even dared to set foot into that market. They have kept the two seperate.
Apple has its OWN monopoly in its OWN market on its own hardware and does not support me buying OSX and isntalling it on non apple hardware.
This is about Browsers too, atleast the article is... Macs come with Safari, itunes, ichat, mail, search light etc all installed. This no different than what MS does, except MS is not allowed to do so.
Again... APPLE is a monopoly. Far greater than windows. Granted they dont have the same number of users... but of thsoe users, and potential buysers of Apple products... they only have ONE CHOICE... from Apple, when and how they say so.
Apple still controls their hardware with an iron fist. Perhaps the EU should force Apple to support NON APPLE COMPUTERS before we continue on assuming that they are even in the same OS market as Microsoft and Linux.
Safari has 100% of the installed/prebundled browser market on OSX.
Really? So you can buy Apple computers with Linux on them or just windows 7?
Apple controls the entire Apple computer market and ship their computers with Safari, Searchlight, Mail, ichat, and itunes. Microsoft can barely get away with including Media player at this point. They had to remove their email and IM programs, and now they have to offer you which browser you want?
Gee... It sounds like I would just buy a mac if i wanted a complete OS with tools out of the box... It sure would be nice if MS provided that... oh they cant by law.
So Legally MS is gimped, and Apple walks away free? How is that fair? Oh right because we hate Microsoft.
And why werent they? Isnt that the point? Apple does the same thing and they walk away untouched.
Safari, Itunes, Searchlight etc...
damn fucking damn fucking editing skills damn argh.. DOH!