And if the people running the project act like that on a regular basis, then their project will usually be forked and a lot of people will jump to the new project. Take the XFree86 to Xorg situation for example.
People also don't like crappy UI's, programs with really absurd/dorky names that make no sense to anyone but nerds who get the inside joke (if there even is one), and O/S's that don't support their favorite software.
Why is this posted to this story? If you want to complain about Microsoft Windows, you should at least find a story about Microsoft. Though while we are at it, I'd also like to complain about how they base everything on the business model where everyone should have to pay $50 for a simple utility any second semister CS student could bang out in a weekend.
You know, unless the Linux community understands and finally makes strides to make Linux a) look like a program you would actually go out and spend your hard earned money on and b) make the UI and naming convention on the included software logical.
You seem confused. Linux is not an alternate name for Microsoft. Linux is something different, and I would spend my hard earned money on, but they give it away for free...actually I guess I do spend some money on it even though they don't make me.
Then again maybe you are talking about the cross platform Win98 act-alikes known as GNOME/KDE. So many confuse these with Linux as many lowest common denominator distros use their wm, dm, and such as the default. I would agree with you there, they really managed to emulate much of the crappyness of Microsoft, however KDE seems to be going in the "wrong" direction...
Thanks for the responce. That was what I was looking for. Sorry to be harsh, but vague statments like that set off my bullshit meter. My experience with GTK matched the other guy's, so I didn't think your statment was fair. I also wanted a real discussion because I am thinking of doing a little GUI programming in the near future, and want the pros and cons of the different toolkits.
I was annoyed especially because many times before trolls have made vague dismissive comments just like yours, and even when I would take the time to give detailed links, they'd just come back with another detailed statment. A very efficient attack for the trolls, for little effort on their part, they'd either make someone waste lots of time or others wouldn't believe the poster's statments, even though they were true.
Yeah, I'm letting the trolls win by changing my attitude...
So should GTK+ have implemented all of its data structures inline?
Isn't this how most libraries do it--specify their data structures in the header file? Where is the problem?
Or just passed around void* everywhere and ignored data structures?
Doesn't it already do this? So GTK using gpointer everywhere which is a typedef for void* (look in glib/gtypes.h) was just my imagination?
As for POSIX, I should have completed it by saying "and other standards." I wasn't confused exactly, there just weren't any stable / usable implementations of all those standards in place at the time, especially with Linux and GCC. POSIX does have functions for regular expressions--regcomp, regexec, and regfree.
What the hell is with these types of posts? "Do my research." "Where is your proof?" When GTK an open source library is the proof. WTF? You can download and look at the source code, then you yourself can say if the other poster's comments are true or not. If you knew anything about the subject, I doubt you would make such a vague statement.
Thanks for wasting our time.
As to what the poster was talking about, one of my guesses as to mistakes would be how GTK is entangled with Glib. It's been a while since I've done anything with GTK and Glib, but it seems to me the majority of problems intended to be solved by Glib have been solved by POSIX. I realize GTK predated POSIX, but shouldn't they have written it for POSIX compatiblilty instead of Glib in version 2.0? It just shows to me that GNU has the same "not invented here" mentality as Microsoft...
Microsoft didn't really mess up with Vista, at least not in the way you said. Their goal is to get people to pay for the upgrade and new installs of their OS. Though they may not have the adoption level they wanted, eventually many people will likely upgrade to Vista or buy a new computer with Vista. (Sad but true) Either way Microsoft has their money, even if those people decide to go with XP. I've heard some noise about people switching to nonMS OSes, but I doubt Joe User even knows any reason to choose something besides Microsoft, so he will just buy whatever is put in front of him....and with the DRM, Vista has a good lock in strategy too. Maybe DRM will die, like most other severe copy protection, but who can say.
As for KDE 4.0, there is always room for improvement. I personally think both Gnome and KDE suck bad, but I have been using a few KDE apps lately. If they just make things more efficient, I might reconsider and use KDE more. I haven't tried 4.0, but it sounded like they were going in the right directon...however, I don't like how they basicly built the whole thing to be a clone of the horrid Win98. Isn't there a better model for the core structure of a GUI?
Slow as compared to what? A webpage with tonnes of javascript? Hardly. X11 will certainly work better than some web based crap. Obviously if the programmer would write remote admin tools to work over the internet in the first place, it would work worlds better, but apparenly no one is interested in doing that...
Then again, I blame MS, since they want to make it so everyone has to pay some guy $50(US) for a simple program any second semester CS student could write, just because the guy took some MCSE classes and paid thousands of $$$ just for the rights to link to some library, and soon they'll probably have to pay thousands for a key too. And of course no one in the MS world will accept downloading Python or Java, so non-MS solutions for Windows users is "unacceptable". Not to mention Microsoft's poor design practices make it so everyone is afraid to download anything which may be called a program. Don't forget their tactics made everyone think there can be no such thing as standard protocols. Wonderful. Parasitic business models make everything work so well.
but can't we do better than a web-based program for this stuff?
It seems too many people can't wrap their heads around the idea that the internet / networking is more than just the web and http.
I understand the need for an easy to use remote admin tool
You mean like ssh and the X11 Windowing System? Yeah, you need the proper lines in ssh_config and sshd_config, (look in the man pages for 'X11') but after that, you can execute an X program remotely with little effort. 'ssh user@remotecomputer xload -rv' I've had trouble with OpenGL apps because ssh's forwarding doesn't support it, but that is the price of security. It does work if you drop privs with xhost and point your DISPLAY env to the X terminal, but that is dangerously insecure.;-) Then again, who needs opengl apps to admin a machine?
...Makes me wonder what part of the core curriculum should be dropped to accommodate it,...
How about just using proper teaching methods. Then you won't have to spend more time on each subject than necessary. The whole word method of learning to read is for Chinese (which has thousands of characters) or Egyptian (which doesn't include vowels in their writing). You should use phonics to teach English, because that is the proper way. My friend's little girl will spell words like "turtle" as "trrrtl" when she hasn't seen it before because she was taught with the whole word method. At least with phonics she would get somewhere in the ballpark.
"Discovery math" is not a teaching method for math, it was supposed to teach logic and get the students thinking ahead. I looked up the website of the people who created it, and the site even said as much. What idiot decided this was a way to teach math? Oh yeah, a bureaucrat. And so the kids just count with their fingers every time they need to do math, assuming they can do any math at all.
Actually, you shouldn't have to drop anything. Shouldn't first aid be taught in health class? Since when is it not? They had at least some first aid in class when I was in high school, have they completely dropped it?
All that matters is the letters each player gets is random. There are a couple of ways to solve this problem:
During a visit to his brother, he could divide a bag of tiles between them. Will be the most identical to the game, but will mean they will sacrifice a play set to just games between the both of them.
Or, just before play, each player could take half the tiles out of his/her bag.
Considering that this is/. it's hard to believe the submitter is stupid enough to not know the difference.
??? Do you read at +5 or something? Since I've started using the new discussion system, I have had to read at -1 (apparently filtering doesn't work?), I am going to tell you, you are giving the slashdot user base too much credit.
I am seriously thinking of going back to the old discussion system just so I don't have to sift through all the troll / clueless / shill comments. Then again it would be nice to have my own little app to read slashdot...has anyone created a good open source app or python library for slashdot?
You know, it seems to me you just need a protocol so you can play it over email or IM. Why not just send messages saying the name of the word you placed and where. Like "kitten" 4, 3 h -- meaning the x location is 4, y=3, and h the word is horizontal, v means the word is vertical. Something like that. I know it would be inconveinent to find the tiles in your pile, so maybe you could just write the letters on slips of paper for your brother's part...
If you already have two identical boards, I don't see why this wouldn't work.
Why is this modded up? This doesn't make any sense....or is there some sort of new interdimensonal technology which can modify a chip's circuit after it has been manufactured? WTF?
Or are you saying some black hat may break into the project's server and make some "interesting" modifications to the circuit, which ends up being used by the people manufacturing your hardware. Yeah, that could happen, except the same argument could be made with closed source as well...
This is a total straw man considering that most open source software companies will support their paid product just the same as a closed source company. It is the sites and programmers giving away the software for free who say "no warranties", because obviously they are not going to have time or money to assist everyone who has a problem with their software.
A hardware company which sells hardware products based on open source designs will most certainly have a warranty for their product just the same way closed source hardware companies have warranties. Just because the product you sell is based on open source, doesn't mean you can't warranty it. In fact, you could have more confidence in the design because many other people have tested it too. Who ships out a product without at least testing it a little anyway?
Yeah, because microsoft would never try to extend their monopoly through deceptive practices. Maybe you should stop taking your "medication" or perhaps get back on it, either way, it isn't working. Just because Hollywood wants to force Microsoft to do something, doesn't mean MS doesn't want to do it and would find any excuse to do so. Hollywood just gave them a way to mask their next big plan to squash competition.
The huge driver behind DRM is the content owners, not operating system makers.
That is a load of crap. Microsoft may be trying to make it look like Hollywood is making them do DRM, but it is really a plan to extend their monopoly. First they make sure isn't possible to legally view popular content except on their system.
Then "because of piracy", they'll negotiate the hardware mfgrs into only running OSes with Microsoft or other "trusted companies" (meaning fortune 500 companinies) or perhaps just anyone who can afford a really expensive key from Verisign, which hobbyists and small time developers couldn't possibly buy. In fact, Vista already does that with hardware drivers which touch DRM content.
Then why did you say "But like it or not, GNOME and KDE are part of the platform we all refer to as Linux"? My point was that no one should say GNOME and KDE are a part of linux, and they shouldn't be integrated into anything, and I don't think complaining or even submitting bug reports/suggestions will help the problem, because the people working on KDE/GNOME are clueless. If you are going to complain, you should complain they are using KDE and GNOME. It would help to either convince people to use alternatives (even Xfce, which I don't think is much better), or to create a better product. GNOME/KDE should not even be in the picture, they do not help with anything.
First off, I say your 1 is a bad idea. What if you fix the permissions and want to delete the file before the program refreshes its info? That is assuming it ever refreshes. You are also assuming your algorithm correctly identifies what can be done, there may be some funky underlying or incompatible system which may make your program think you can't write, but it is allowed. At most it should give some visual indication the operation you want to do may not work, but not allowing it at all is bad.
Your second mistake is not realizing most of the people who write Gnome and KDE stuff are mostly script kiddies and windows programmers. They don't understand basic things (especially about computer security) and often don't know anything at all about essential subjects needed for Linux programming. It would be better to either find or start a project which is easy to use and another which makes it easy to transition from MS Windows. MS Windows is not easy to use at all, there are just so many users who have learned its broken ways.
I've been using Linux for my desktop for over a decade, and I have very rarely even used KDE / Gnome at all. Mostly just to try them out (and see what a peice of crap they are), and sometimes I use Konqueror for file browsing and a KDE app hear and there. In fact, most of the time I avoid KDE/Gnome programs like the plague. If I hear they have dependancies of either, I usualy don't even bother to download a program. Yeah, I'll use a core KDE app sometimes, but it isn't my "platform".
You can't tell me using GNOME/KDE is the only way to run Linux. In fact, they more or less seem to be just ways for MS Windows users to transition to Linux, not a real system. Who the hell would call something trying to emulate the horrid horrid Win98 a usable system??? The devil above Bill Gates?
Those quirks sound like they are due to problems with Gnome/KDE, not Linux. You are not required to use Gnome or KDE with Linux, though I suppose if you are attached to using a GUI instead of editing text files, then one of them would be the more obvious choice. I think the main problem here would be Linux being geared more toward Unix sysadmins (who want to edit text files) than the standard MSWindows user (who wants it all on the GUI), and those who are writing the "easy to use" GUI software aren't the level of hardcore programmers like those who are working on the kernel or "less" user friendly (for MS users) software--such as blackbox and such.
Many seem to claim editing text files isn't user friendly, but really most config files for programs which run on linux have really good descriptions in the comments, so if you can read english and understand simple concepts like this=that, I don't undersand how this is more difficult than navigating through hundreds of menus, tabs, and dialog boxes to get to what is often a poorly named and poorly placed setting.
Though to acknowledge one of your complaints, Debian's packaging and dependancy system is quite broken, and I don't think Red Hat's is any better. May as well go with Slackware's, it may not hunt down all those deps for you, but at least the software will install. I've had conditions where I try to install something on Debian, and it says I need, say Python 2.4 or greater, but I have 2.5 installed. WTF?
But of course, Linux has the advantage of being open source, so if you have the time and ability, you can fix it...
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And if the people running the project act like that on a regular basis, then their project will usually be forked and a lot of people will jump to the new project. Take the XFree86 to Xorg situation for example.
Why is this posted to this story? If you want to complain about Microsoft Windows, you should at least find a story about Microsoft. Though while we are at it, I'd also like to complain about how they base everything on the business model where everyone should have to pay $50 for a simple utility any second semister CS student could bang out in a weekend.
You seem confused. Linux is not an alternate name for Microsoft. Linux is something different, and I would spend my hard earned money on, but they give it away for free...actually I guess I do spend some money on it even though they don't make me.
Then again maybe you are talking about the cross platform Win98 act-alikes known as GNOME/KDE. So many confuse these with Linux as many lowest common denominator distros use their wm, dm, and such as the default. I would agree with you there, they really managed to emulate much of the crappyness of Microsoft, however KDE seems to be going in the "wrong" direction...
Thanks for the responce. That was what I was looking for. Sorry to be harsh, but vague statments like that set off my bullshit meter. My experience with GTK matched the other guy's, so I didn't think your statment was fair. I also wanted a real discussion because I am thinking of doing a little GUI programming in the near future, and want the pros and cons of the different toolkits.
I was annoyed especially because many times before trolls have made vague dismissive comments just like yours, and even when I would take the time to give detailed links, they'd just come back with another detailed statment. A very efficient attack for the trolls, for little effort on their part, they'd either make someone waste lots of time or others wouldn't believe the poster's statments, even though they were true.
Yeah, I'm letting the trolls win by changing my attitude...
Isn't this how most libraries do it--specify their data structures in the header file? Where is the problem?
Doesn't it already do this? So GTK using gpointer everywhere which is a typedef for void* (look in glib/gtypes.h) was just my imagination?
As for POSIX, I should have completed it by saying "and other standards." I wasn't confused exactly, there just weren't any stable / usable implementations of all those standards in place at the time, especially with Linux and GCC. POSIX does have functions for regular expressions--regcomp, regexec, and regfree.
What the hell is with these types of posts? "Do my research." "Where is your proof?" When GTK an open source library is the proof. WTF? You can download and look at the source code, then you yourself can say if the other poster's comments are true or not. If you knew anything about the subject, I doubt you would make such a vague statement.
Thanks for wasting our time.
As to what the poster was talking about, one of my guesses as to mistakes would be how GTK is entangled with Glib. It's been a while since I've done anything with GTK and Glib, but it seems to me the majority of problems intended to be solved by Glib have been solved by POSIX. I realize GTK predated POSIX, but shouldn't they have written it for POSIX compatiblilty instead of Glib in version 2.0? It just shows to me that GNU has the same "not invented here" mentality as Microsoft...
Microsoft didn't really mess up with Vista, at least not in the way you said. Their goal is to get people to pay for the upgrade and new installs of their OS. Though they may not have the adoption level they wanted, eventually many people will likely upgrade to Vista or buy a new computer with Vista. (Sad but true) Either way Microsoft has their money, even if those people decide to go with XP. I've heard some noise about people switching to nonMS OSes, but I doubt Joe User even knows any reason to choose something besides Microsoft, so he will just buy whatever is put in front of him. ...and with the DRM, Vista has a good lock in strategy too. Maybe DRM will die, like most other severe copy protection, but who can say.
As for KDE 4.0, there is always room for improvement. I personally think both Gnome and KDE suck bad, but I have been using a few KDE apps lately. If they just make things more efficient, I might reconsider and use KDE more. I haven't tried 4.0, but it sounded like they were going in the right directon...however, I don't like how they basicly built the whole thing to be a clone of the horrid Win98. Isn't there a better model for the core structure of a GUI?
Slow as compared to what? A webpage with tonnes of javascript? Hardly. X11 will certainly work better than some web based crap. Obviously if the programmer would write remote admin tools to work over the internet in the first place, it would work worlds better, but apparenly no one is interested in doing that...
Then again, I blame MS, since they want to make it so everyone has to pay some guy $50(US) for a simple program any second semester CS student could write, just because the guy took some MCSE classes and paid thousands of $$$ just for the rights to link to some library, and soon they'll probably have to pay thousands for a key too. And of course no one in the MS world will accept downloading Python or Java, so non-MS solutions for Windows users is "unacceptable". Not to mention Microsoft's poor design practices make it so everyone is afraid to download anything which may be called a program. Don't forget their tactics made everyone think there can be no such thing as standard protocols. Wonderful. Parasitic business models make everything work so well.
Well, okay, so she isn't a child, she's a 30 year old crack whore.
From how I understood the article, they comprimized a few big hosting companies, which serve thousands of websites.
It seems too many people can't wrap their heads around the idea that the internet / networking is more than just the web and http.
You mean like ssh and the X11 Windowing System? Yeah, you need the proper lines in ssh_config and sshd_config, (look in the man pages for 'X11') but after that, you can execute an X program remotely with little effort. 'ssh user@remotecomputer xload -rv' I've had trouble with OpenGL apps because ssh's forwarding doesn't support it, but that is the price of security. It does work if you drop privs with xhost and point your DISPLAY env to the X terminal, but that is dangerously insecure. ;-) Then again, who needs opengl apps to admin a machine?
How about just using proper teaching methods. Then you won't have to spend more time on each subject than necessary. The whole word method of learning to read is for Chinese (which has thousands of characters) or Egyptian (which doesn't include vowels in their writing). You should use phonics to teach English, because that is the proper way. My friend's little girl will spell words like "turtle" as "trrrtl" when she hasn't seen it before because she was taught with the whole word method. At least with phonics she would get somewhere in the ballpark.
"Discovery math" is not a teaching method for math, it was supposed to teach logic and get the students thinking ahead. I looked up the website of the people who created it, and the site even said as much. What idiot decided this was a way to teach math? Oh yeah, a bureaucrat. And so the kids just count with their fingers every time they need to do math, assuming they can do any math at all.
Actually, you shouldn't have to drop anything. Shouldn't first aid be taught in health class? Since when is it not? They had at least some first aid in class when I was in high school, have they completely dropped it?
You are lucky. They don't do that where I live. They just play "infomercials" during the time they would normally be off air.
All that matters is the letters each player gets is random. There are a couple of ways to solve this problem:
??? Do you read at +5 or something? Since I've started using the new discussion system, I have had to read at -1 (apparently filtering doesn't work?), I am going to tell you, you are giving the slashdot user base too much credit.
I am seriously thinking of going back to the old discussion system just so I don't have to sift through all the troll / clueless / shill comments. Then again it would be nice to have my own little app to read slashdot...has anyone created a good open source app or python library for slashdot?
You know, it seems to me you just need a protocol so you can play it over email or IM. Why not just send messages saying the name of the word you placed and where. Like "kitten" 4, 3 h -- meaning the x location is 4, y=3, and h the word is horizontal, v means the word is vertical. Something like that. I know it would be inconveinent to find the tiles in your pile, so maybe you could just write the letters on slips of paper for your brother's part...
If you already have two identical boards, I don't see why this wouldn't work.
Sarah Werning's profile page @ Berkeley -- Her photos
I think the story at science daily is more interesting than the BBC one.
Or they had a blood transfusion...
I don't understand why that poster assumed they all got HIV from sex. Yes, that is one possible way to contract it, but not the only way.
Why is this modded up? This doesn't make any sense. ...or is there some sort of new interdimensonal technology which can modify a chip's circuit after it has been manufactured? WTF?
Or are you saying some black hat may break into the project's server and make some "interesting" modifications to the circuit, which ends up being used by the people manufacturing your hardware. Yeah, that could happen, except the same argument could be made with closed source as well...
This is a total straw man considering that most open source software companies will support their paid product just the same as a closed source company. It is the sites and programmers giving away the software for free who say "no warranties", because obviously they are not going to have time or money to assist everyone who has a problem with their software.
A hardware company which sells hardware products based on open source designs will most certainly have a warranty for their product just the same way closed source hardware companies have warranties. Just because the product you sell is based on open source, doesn't mean you can't warranty it. In fact, you could have more confidence in the design because many other people have tested it too. Who ships out a product without at least testing it a little anyway?
Yeah, because microsoft would never try to extend their monopoly through deceptive practices. Maybe you should stop taking your "medication" or perhaps get back on it, either way, it isn't working. Just because Hollywood wants to force Microsoft to do something, doesn't mean MS doesn't want to do it and would find any excuse to do so. Hollywood just gave them a way to mask their next big plan to squash competition.
That is a load of crap. Microsoft may be trying to make it look like Hollywood is making them do DRM, but it is really a plan to extend their monopoly. First they make sure isn't possible to legally view popular content except on their system.
Then "because of piracy", they'll negotiate the hardware mfgrs into only running OSes with Microsoft or other "trusted companies" (meaning fortune 500 companinies) or perhaps just anyone who can afford a really expensive key from Verisign, which hobbyists and small time developers couldn't possibly buy. In fact, Vista already does that with hardware drivers which touch DRM content.
Then why did you say "But like it or not, GNOME and KDE are part of the platform we all refer to as Linux"? My point was that no one should say GNOME and KDE are a part of linux, and they shouldn't be integrated into anything, and I don't think complaining or even submitting bug reports/suggestions will help the problem, because the people working on KDE/GNOME are clueless. If you are going to complain, you should complain they are using KDE and GNOME. It would help to either convince people to use alternatives (even Xfce, which I don't think is much better), or to create a better product. GNOME/KDE should not even be in the picture, they do not help with anything.
First off, I say your 1 is a bad idea. What if you fix the permissions and want to delete the file before the program refreshes its info? That is assuming it ever refreshes. You are also assuming your algorithm correctly identifies what can be done, there may be some funky underlying or incompatible system which may make your program think you can't write, but it is allowed. At most it should give some visual indication the operation you want to do may not work, but not allowing it at all is bad.
Your second mistake is not realizing most of the people who write Gnome and KDE stuff are mostly script kiddies and windows programmers. They don't understand basic things (especially about computer security) and often don't know anything at all about essential subjects needed for Linux programming. It would be better to either find or start a project which is easy to use and another which makes it easy to transition from MS Windows. MS Windows is not easy to use at all, there are just so many users who have learned its broken ways.
I've been using Linux for my desktop for over a decade, and I have very rarely even used KDE / Gnome at all. Mostly just to try them out (and see what a peice of crap they are), and sometimes I use Konqueror for file browsing and a KDE app hear and there. In fact, most of the time I avoid KDE/Gnome programs like the plague. If I hear they have dependancies of either, I usualy don't even bother to download a program. Yeah, I'll use a core KDE app sometimes, but it isn't my "platform".
You can't tell me using GNOME/KDE is the only way to run Linux. In fact, they more or less seem to be just ways for MS Windows users to transition to Linux, not a real system. Who the hell would call something trying to emulate the horrid horrid Win98 a usable system??? The devil above Bill Gates?
Those quirks sound like they are due to problems with Gnome/KDE, not Linux. You are not required to use Gnome or KDE with Linux, though I suppose if you are attached to using a GUI instead of editing text files, then one of them would be the more obvious choice. I think the main problem here would be Linux being geared more toward Unix sysadmins (who want to edit text files) than the standard MSWindows user (who wants it all on the GUI), and those who are writing the "easy to use" GUI software aren't the level of hardcore programmers like those who are working on the kernel or "less" user friendly (for MS users) software--such as blackbox and such.
Many seem to claim editing text files isn't user friendly, but really most config files for programs which run on linux have really good descriptions in the comments, so if you can read english and understand simple concepts like this=that, I don't undersand how this is more difficult than navigating through hundreds of menus, tabs, and dialog boxes to get to what is often a poorly named and poorly placed setting.
Though to acknowledge one of your complaints, Debian's packaging and dependancy system is quite broken, and I don't think Red Hat's is any better. May as well go with Slackware's, it may not hunt down all those deps for you, but at least the software will install. I've had conditions where I try to install something on Debian, and it says I need, say Python 2.4 or greater, but I have 2.5 installed. WTF?
But of course, Linux has the advantage of being open source, so if you have the time and ability, you can fix it...