Hanging is too much, indeed. Many jurisdictions still eschew vehicle inspections, leading to faulty cars. We encourage commercial vehicle drivers to drive very long shifts. We let vehicle product makers (seatbelts and airbag makers come to mind) go for decades installing inferior substandard equipment. We let people drink/smoke drive, then kill and maim unwitting victims. Civility means caring about consequences. AI doesn't care.
Yes, there is litigation available, product recalls, and more.
The proposition of allowing an AI to become a corpus, rather than addressing the real needs of safety seems crazy to me. Do we not care for each other's safety and well-being? That's my paramount idea. I'm constantly reminded of the Aspie readers of Slashdot by how literally they must take every word, missing meaning along the way.
There is no preponderance of evidence that says AI is 100x safer than humans, or that the regimen inured is sufficient to be able to react safely and responsibly to the myriad circumstances. You cite marketing, not actual sampled statistics. You infer; you do not know this.
The second part of your reply is just as specious; you have no evidence. I retain an open mind towards the subject, but still want to drive towards human safety, and not permit the corpus of an AI-entity to absolve poor work against the lives of humans. It is our UPMOST responsibility to work towards the safety of each other, where the term "each other" is humanity.
Where is the zeal, the quest for quality in such logic? Where is the trust in those that use a mantra of "shit happens?"
There are lives at stake. There is no corpus of an AI that should be allowed to be the "fall guy", no actuary that pins it on Dataset 0x34A780D44. That's blame throwing. Instead. pillory the heads of the assholes that didn't diligently run the tests over the edge case possibilities and shortcut to "results" that murdered your loved one.
There should be no actuarial sloth here: hang a real human: gets results.
Neither Tesla or some concept of a robot should be permitted indemnification. Instead, they should be held responsible, just as humans are. Corporations use the ostensible indemnification to behave irresponsibly. Lives are at stake, and their personal skin needs to be in the game.
Even if you use VPNs and Tor exits, Twitter knows who you are. If you don't believe analytics can surmise exactly who you are on any site, given enough posts, you're a fool.
If you think you're a digital bad ass, understand that most platforms where You're The Product figured you out long ago, and don't care.
Browser fingerprinting is the easiest method, and but one of dozens.
They don't squeeze out competition, rake private data, and make the user the item for sale. They don't target industry segments, then low-ball that segment until it drips red blood as mom-and-pops die out, killing and maiming small business.
They don't read your every email for keywords to sell you something. Mozilla doesn't sell your private data to firms that would use it to apply bias to political processes.
It's free. People look at "free" and salivate like Homer Simpson.
But they're actually being sold, and after realizing that, rationalize it and then get more free stuff. Android is a similar notion. Just being a consumer helps underwrite the cost of the product. Apple knows it, and there is no escaping the sale of the device user's info. Someone's buying it.
Does one need a smartphone every minute of every day? No, but like nicotine, opoids, and sugar, addicts are easy targets. Donuts? Sure. Cigarettes? Sure. Opoids? Sure feels good. No one wants to walk away, yet everyone decries monetizing consumers. It's difficult not to have it both ways, even if you're Richard Stallman. This stuff gets paid for, somehow, some way. Until people realize they're the product, they'll continue to have moments of cognitive dissonance.
Disclosure is part of the law in a number of jurisdictions. Others don't want to have that strange moment when one of the two says, "Oh, BTW, I'm poz.". A lot of poz guys get broken hearts that way. Some guys want to be aware of the status, while it doesn't matter to others.
There can never be a wholesome benchmark, because the variety of workload possibilities is very large. Phoronix does good work in this area, but most often, it's done with Linux, where a Windows user wanted to know-- or someone plugged in an external GPU unit and wanted to see what it could do, given differing possibilities.
There won't be a simple one-score benchmark, so long as people do differing things with GPUs, which started out as graphics processors but now serve many masters as a math co-processor. Even there, differing GPU cores do differing things (some are adept at 8-bit or 16-bit math, others are clever at geometric math, some are great with fast array sorts, etc etc).
Mod parent up. It's like citing a 0-60sec figure. There's much more to it.
My guess as to why: no vendor wants to reveal what's in their secret sauce firmware and OS modifications, or even the OS itself (which varies about once per calendar quarter). The US probably has its own methods for implanting location-based stinkware that Huawei and ZTE (and soon Motorola/Lenovo??) do as well.
Otherwise, it's a market shutdown to benefit Samsung and Apple, who largely lead the world outside of China Inc.
And as such, it could be just another shell tossed in the trade wars.
The First Amendment is not SCREAM ABOVE EVERYONE ELSE BECAUSE YOU HAVE THE DOUGH. It's equal access. You have my input because: I can write, too, and will continue to do so.
I would also be in favor of the right not to have to listen to things like political robocalls. But one mountain at a time.
Egalitarianism is better than plutocracy. Citizens United was one of the worst SCOTUS decisions in memory, and my memory is long.
Say you developed a pool of funds for any candidate, any issue. The candidate controls the funds, but cannot know who made the contribution.
Or congruently, all contributions are made to a blockchain, where all contributors are public knowledge from a pool that can be the only source of funds used (save personal appearances, one's own contributions to publicly visible media, and just plain walking a district)?
Free speech isn't so free. Some is completely overwhelming. Spend all your funds on a single full-page ad in the local bird cage liner. Or spend it on flyers, stickers, whatever. But a finite amount is a wise idea. Further, identifying contributors is a good idea. The We The People part, in my mind, doesn't include corporations, which are not people, and shouldn't IMHO, be treated as though they were.
The effective employment cost of many federally covered employees is approximately another 12-54% in benefits and withholding matching (unemployment, SSmatching, and more).
You do the math. The gig/contractor/might-be-employee pays this as a contractor. No pesky NLRB to get in the way, no regulations about firing them, and more. It's a scam, and yet another cut at human dignity for the benefit of the corporate concept.
And I suppose we don't educate women in the USA, where the birthrate is very steadily climbing, and has been for 200years+, since the invasion.
And also why the global birthrate is up, not down, save for just a few countries (Japan as an example, acknowledged). You can't blame it on Asia and Africa. Yes, the numbers are high there, but they're largely high across the planet, and the geometry continues with the up arrow, not the down arrow.
Not so sure how you got to THAT conclusion. The media makes a pile of cash from candidates and parties. Instead, how about town halls, and actually showing up to them?
There is an unanswered question that the courts haven't addressed, which amounts to the volume of speech, and if we're equal, then how does one temper the campaign expenditures that buy the airwaves and ad sales, to the detriment of our poor ears and eyes? Campaign expenditure limits would be lovely, including public lists of campaign donors. Then we'd know who's funding campaign and balloted issues.
I agree that the gig economy didn't produce the problem, rather, it's a side effect. Lots of tax revenue isn't captured, and overall effective employment costs are stanched by larger corporations that allow this to happen.
Everyone from the person that delivers the paper to you (if such a thing still happens) to freelancers of every stripe are part of the gig economy, and the overall economy suffers because real employment costs are shifted to individuals and when they can't get enough gigs, the government and charitable organizations who then foot the bills.
That works, perhaps short term. You still haven't addressed the near geometric growth of the population. This earth is finite in size. Years ago, I was able to take a trip around the entire planet in a series of flights. I started in the states, went to Singapore, then to London, then back. Much of the planet is mountains, deserts, and ocean.
I saw huge globs of plastics in the ocean. Lots of people living in arid climates.
It's babies, a basic biological drive. There are too many of them. It's not sustainable, given the near exponential growth. People aren't fastidious by nature. Portions of them have slowly woken up to sustainability, but many have not. Think about the huge deadzone in the Gulf of Mexico, the damaged Great Barrier Reef, and all of the other places that have become signs that we're no where near close to sustainability, yet babies keep coming faster than before. Without thought, it's eventually doom.
A colleague of mine deals with the millions of people in camps in Africa, victims of incessant war and strife. For some, life is living in a camp with no real chance of having a life of their own.
The climate deniers are one problem, but babies are still a problem that we're ignoring, and it's at the root of the pestilence of greed.
The multi-nationals aren't going to agree with you, because they're enslaved to Wall Street. Less labor costs mean higher profits, in a pure and simple way. They're not motivated to do so, and in the current anti-regulatory climate, tax gifts to big business (small business didn't do very well) have made fundings even worse.
It's the "gig economy" that's the problem, where up to 20% of us don't actually have FICA withholdings from any employer at all. It keeps personnel counts down for the corporations, and means there's less pesky litigation from employees, because contractors can be largely fired at will, for any and all kinds of reasons, really anything at all.
But this isn't just IBM's problem, but keeping IBM in focus, all of their costs drop if they move jobs out of the USA, and kill senior employment to reduce their most expensive, tenured employees. It doesn't even really keep IBM "fresh" with younger people, just cuts costs. After all, like contractors, employees aren't people, they're just cogs in the money machine.
You mean the corporate welfare system, where corporations stash profits overseas, and find ways to pay not one cent of US Federal taxes? The one that so vastly underpays its employees that the employees have to get government assistance for basics like food and housing-- not to mention the screaming costs of health care?
BizAmericaInc has been playing both sides of the issue for decades. Corporations are mandated to provide a maximized return for shareholders, and can be sued if they don't. The very phrase "Corporate Citizen" has become an excuse to flaunt the law, and kill the very idea of seniority as a base of pay. They'll make it up by spending face-saving PR to give themselves the make-over of goodness, then bribe a politician to get the legislation or taxpayer-funded growth bonds needed to continue to screw the system. Bah.
This is why limiting campaign contributions from corporations, PACs, and even individuals is SO important-- they can't buy these "edges" if they can't afford them.
Removing the ability for national parties to fund local elections is important, too, so that micro-targeting specific districts won't cause legislative majorities that drag down the goals of government into squabbling orthodox masses of mud.
Ultimately, the resources are finite. Space itself isn't useful. For each human, there's a need for water, and food, and where to put their waste and poo. We've already caused the climate to change, what new disaster do you want next?
I built my own 8-bit system with a Z-80A. Lots of us old codgers out there that programmed with paper tape, cloads, and binary front panel loads.
There are products, sure.
We went from a pair of wires for internal networks to coax, to twisted pairs, to fiber, to wireless, with branches for telco-supplied interconnect and carrier supplied interconnect. Carriers used CSU/DSUs along with telcos until networking protocols evolved, then fiber became practical. Some carriers still use DSL because they're cheap.
We went from ASR-33 and TWX terminals to DecWriters, 5250s, 3270s, Televideo terminals to micros with RF modulators to CGA, until HDTV and UHD became monitors.
Operating systems went from CP/M and Apple DOS through MS-DOS while BSD evolved and became Solaris, NeXT, MacOS, and Linux in the middle.
The original Lisa and Mac were the first mainstream GUIs that Microsoft desperately tried to copy into Windows, a couple dozen versions until they beat IBM at that game, and it kind of worked at Windows 7.
But UI is now UX. Crappy window managers no longer are used.
My bag phone in the 1980s became smaller and smaller until GSM got smart and moved towards GPRS and beyond, and LTE is pretty good-- but it was iOS and Android standing on the shoulders of Palm and others that made the UI tenable on smartphones.
The browser wars continue to this day. They subvert the operating system GUI/UI/UX and have become most people's window on the world.
Before there was GPS, there was LORAN.
So it's all evolving, incrementally, ruled by Moore's Law and consumer demand (businesses and people). It's easy to get stoic when you've seen a lot of change and evolution, but revolutions are really rare, and you know them when you see them. Sometimes it's getting in front of a parade, then dragging the marchers forward, like Elon Musk, a very crazy visionary, like Jobs before him. Both had visions and set the bar high, failing, but succeeding more than failing, catching the public's fancy on the way up. There will be more like them.
And there will also be crooks, liars, and the disillusioned, those that ran out of money, and those that ran into cabals and monopolies. Not much changes but stays the same. Business ecosystems evolve services, and it never was Google's intent to do good, rather, to make money, and it's Amazon's job to bust business models in its favor. Somethings will never change, and building monopolies is a natural defense against the innovative.
Slashdot Mirror
Hanging is too much, indeed. Many jurisdictions still eschew vehicle inspections, leading to faulty cars. We encourage commercial vehicle drivers to drive very long shifts. We let vehicle product makers (seatbelts and airbag makers come to mind) go for decades installing inferior substandard equipment. We let people drink/smoke drive, then kill and maim unwitting victims. Civility means caring about consequences. AI doesn't care.
Yes, there is litigation available, product recalls, and more.
The proposition of allowing an AI to become a corpus, rather than addressing the real needs of safety seems crazy to me. Do we not care for each other's safety and well-being? That's my paramount idea. I'm constantly reminded of the Aspie readers of Slashdot by how literally they must take every word, missing meaning along the way.
There is no preponderance of evidence that says AI is 100x safer than humans, or that the regimen inured is sufficient to be able to react safely and responsibly to the myriad circumstances. You cite marketing, not actual sampled statistics. You infer; you do not know this.
The second part of your reply is just as specious; you have no evidence. I retain an open mind towards the subject, but still want to drive towards human safety, and not permit the corpus of an AI-entity to absolve poor work against the lives of humans. It is our UPMOST responsibility to work towards the safety of each other, where the term "each other" is humanity.
Where is the zeal, the quest for quality in such logic? Where is the trust in those that use a mantra of "shit happens?"
There are lives at stake. There is no corpus of an AI that should be allowed to be the "fall guy", no actuary that pins it on Dataset 0x34A780D44. That's blame throwing. Instead. pillory the heads of the assholes that didn't diligently run the tests over the edge case possibilities and shortcut to "results" that murdered your loved one.
There should be no actuarial sloth here: hang a real human: gets results.
Neither Tesla or some concept of a robot should be permitted indemnification. Instead, they should be held responsible, just as humans are. Corporations use the ostensible indemnification to behave irresponsibly. Lives are at stake, and their personal skin needs to be in the game.
Even if you use VPNs and Tor exits, Twitter knows who you are. If you don't believe analytics can surmise exactly who you are on any site, given enough posts, you're a fool.
If you think you're a digital bad ass, understand that most platforms where You're The Product figured you out long ago, and don't care.
Browser fingerprinting is the easiest method, and but one of dozens.
Mozilla makes software for browsers. No monopoly.
They don't squeeze out competition, rake private data, and make the user the item for sale. They don't target industry segments, then low-ball that segment until it drips red blood as mom-and-pops die out, killing and maiming small business.
They don't read your every email for keywords to sell you something. Mozilla doesn't sell your private data to firms that would use it to apply bias to political processes.
Is Mozilla benign? By comparison, hell yeah.
No and NO!!!
It's free. People look at "free" and salivate like Homer Simpson.
But they're actually being sold, and after realizing that, rationalize it and then get more free stuff. Android is a similar notion. Just being a consumer helps underwrite the cost of the product. Apple knows it, and there is no escaping the sale of the device user's info. Someone's buying it.
Does one need a smartphone every minute of every day? No, but like nicotine, opoids, and sugar, addicts are easy targets. Donuts? Sure. Cigarettes? Sure. Opoids? Sure feels good. No one wants to walk away, yet everyone decries monetizing consumers. It's difficult not to have it both ways, even if you're Richard Stallman. This stuff gets paid for, somehow, some way. Until people realize they're the product, they'll continue to have moments of cognitive dissonance.
Disclosure is part of the law in a number of jurisdictions. Others don't want to have that strange moment when one of the two says, "Oh, BTW, I'm poz.". A lot of poz guys get broken hearts that way. Some guys want to be aware of the status, while it doesn't matter to others.
There can never be a wholesome benchmark, because the variety of workload possibilities is very large. Phoronix does good work in this area, but most often, it's done with Linux, where a Windows user wanted to know-- or someone plugged in an external GPU unit and wanted to see what it could do, given differing possibilities.
There won't be a simple one-score benchmark, so long as people do differing things with GPUs, which started out as graphics processors but now serve many masters as a math co-processor. Even there, differing GPU cores do differing things (some are adept at 8-bit or 16-bit math, others are clever at geometric math, some are great with fast array sorts, etc etc).
Mod parent up. It's like citing a 0-60sec figure. There's much more to it.
There's no evidence. Nothing.
My guess as to why: no vendor wants to reveal what's in their secret sauce firmware and OS modifications, or even the OS itself (which varies about once per calendar quarter). The US probably has its own methods for implanting location-based stinkware that Huawei and ZTE (and soon Motorola/Lenovo??) do as well.
Otherwise, it's a market shutdown to benefit Samsung and Apple, who largely lead the world outside of China Inc.
And as such, it could be just another shell tossed in the trade wars.
Speaking about yourself in the first person plural apparently is a speech pattern of yours. I get it.
Your "we" is not my "we".
The First Amendment is not SCREAM ABOVE EVERYONE ELSE BECAUSE YOU HAVE THE DOUGH. It's equal access. You have my input because: I can write, too, and will continue to do so.
I would also be in favor of the right not to have to listen to things like political robocalls. But one mountain at a time.
Egalitarianism is better than plutocracy. Citizens United was one of the worst SCOTUS decisions in memory, and my memory is long.
Hey, it was tested in a Windows 7 VM, so it ought to work everywhere!
Right?
Hello City of Atlanta? Oh, the city's on hold? Oh. Gosh.
Let's go hypothetical for a moment.
Say you developed a pool of funds for any candidate, any issue. The candidate controls the funds, but cannot know who made the contribution.
Or congruently, all contributions are made to a blockchain, where all contributors are public knowledge from a pool that can be the only source of funds used (save personal appearances, one's own contributions to publicly visible media, and just plain walking a district)?
Free speech isn't so free. Some is completely overwhelming. Spend all your funds on a single full-page ad in the local bird cage liner. Or spend it on flyers, stickers, whatever. But a finite amount is a wise idea. Further, identifying contributors is a good idea. The We The People part, in my mind, doesn't include corporations, which are not people, and shouldn't IMHO, be treated as though they were.
The effective employment cost of many federally covered employees is approximately another 12-54% in benefits and withholding matching (unemployment, SSmatching, and more).
You do the math. The gig/contractor/might-be-employee pays this as a contractor. No pesky NLRB to get in the way, no regulations about firing them, and more. It's a scam, and yet another cut at human dignity for the benefit of the corporate concept.
And I suppose we don't educate women in the USA, where the birthrate is very steadily climbing, and has been for 200years+, since the invasion.
And also why the global birthrate is up, not down, save for just a few countries (Japan as an example, acknowledged). You can't blame it on Asia and Africa. Yes, the numbers are high there, but they're largely high across the planet, and the geometry continues with the up arrow, not the down arrow.
Not so sure how you got to THAT conclusion. The media makes a pile of cash from candidates and parties. Instead, how about town halls, and actually showing up to them?
There is an unanswered question that the courts haven't addressed, which amounts to the volume of speech, and if we're equal, then how does one temper the campaign expenditures that buy the airwaves and ad sales, to the detriment of our poor ears and eyes? Campaign expenditure limits would be lovely, including public lists of campaign donors. Then we'd know who's funding campaign and balloted issues.
I agree that the gig economy didn't produce the problem, rather, it's a side effect. Lots of tax revenue isn't captured, and overall effective employment costs are stanched by larger corporations that allow this to happen.
Everyone from the person that delivers the paper to you (if such a thing still happens) to freelancers of every stripe are part of the gig economy, and the overall economy suffers because real employment costs are shifted to individuals and when they can't get enough gigs, the government and charitable organizations who then foot the bills.
That works, perhaps short term. You still haven't addressed the near geometric growth of the population. This earth is finite in size. Years ago, I was able to take a trip around the entire planet in a series of flights. I started in the states, went to Singapore, then to London, then back. Much of the planet is mountains, deserts, and ocean.
I saw huge globs of plastics in the ocean. Lots of people living in arid climates.
It's babies, a basic biological drive. There are too many of them. It's not sustainable, given the near exponential growth. People aren't fastidious by nature. Portions of them have slowly woken up to sustainability, but many have not. Think about the huge deadzone in the Gulf of Mexico, the damaged Great Barrier Reef, and all of the other places that have become signs that we're no where near close to sustainability, yet babies keep coming faster than before. Without thought, it's eventually doom.
A colleague of mine deals with the millions of people in camps in Africa, victims of incessant war and strife. For some, life is living in a camp with no real chance of having a life of their own.
The climate deniers are one problem, but babies are still a problem that we're ignoring, and it's at the root of the pestilence of greed.
The multi-nationals aren't going to agree with you, because they're enslaved to Wall Street. Less labor costs mean higher profits, in a pure and simple way. They're not motivated to do so, and in the current anti-regulatory climate, tax gifts to big business (small business didn't do very well) have made fundings even worse.
It's the "gig economy" that's the problem, where up to 20% of us don't actually have FICA withholdings from any employer at all. It keeps personnel counts down for the corporations, and means there's less pesky litigation from employees, because contractors can be largely fired at will, for any and all kinds of reasons, really anything at all.
But this isn't just IBM's problem, but keeping IBM in focus, all of their costs drop if they move jobs out of the USA, and kill senior employment to reduce their most expensive, tenured employees. It doesn't even really keep IBM "fresh" with younger people, just cuts costs. After all, like contractors, employees aren't people, they're just cogs in the money machine.
You mean the corporate welfare system, where corporations stash profits overseas, and find ways to pay not one cent of US Federal taxes? The one that so vastly underpays its employees that the employees have to get government assistance for basics like food and housing-- not to mention the screaming costs of health care?
BizAmericaInc has been playing both sides of the issue for decades. Corporations are mandated to provide a maximized return for shareholders, and can be sued if they don't. The very phrase "Corporate Citizen" has become an excuse to flaunt the law, and kill the very idea of seniority as a base of pay. They'll make it up by spending face-saving PR to give themselves the make-over of goodness, then bribe a politician to get the legislation or taxpayer-funded growth bonds needed to continue to screw the system. Bah.
This is why limiting campaign contributions from corporations, PACs, and even individuals is SO important-- they can't buy these "edges" if they can't afford them.
Removing the ability for national parties to fund local elections is important, too, so that micro-targeting specific districts won't cause legislative majorities that drag down the goals of government into squabbling orthodox masses of mud.
Ultimately, the resources are finite. Space itself isn't useful. For each human, there's a need for water, and food, and where to put their waste and poo. We've already caused the climate to change, what new disaster do you want next?
I built my own 8-bit system with a Z-80A. Lots of us old codgers out there that programmed with paper tape, cloads, and binary front panel loads.
There are products, sure.
We went from a pair of wires for internal networks to coax, to twisted pairs, to fiber, to wireless, with branches for telco-supplied interconnect and carrier supplied interconnect. Carriers used CSU/DSUs along with telcos until networking protocols evolved, then fiber became practical. Some carriers still use DSL because they're cheap.
We went from ASR-33 and TWX terminals to DecWriters, 5250s, 3270s, Televideo terminals to micros with RF modulators to CGA, until HDTV and UHD became monitors.
Operating systems went from CP/M and Apple DOS through MS-DOS while BSD evolved and became Solaris, NeXT, MacOS, and Linux in the middle.
The original Lisa and Mac were the first mainstream GUIs that Microsoft desperately tried to copy into Windows, a couple dozen versions until they beat IBM at that game, and it kind of worked at Windows 7.
But UI is now UX. Crappy window managers no longer are used.
My bag phone in the 1980s became smaller and smaller until GSM got smart and moved towards GPRS and beyond, and LTE is pretty good-- but it was iOS and Android standing on the shoulders of Palm and others that made the UI tenable on smartphones.
The browser wars continue to this day. They subvert the operating system GUI/UI/UX and have become most people's window on the world.
Before there was GPS, there was LORAN.
So it's all evolving, incrementally, ruled by Moore's Law and consumer demand (businesses and people). It's easy to get stoic when you've seen a lot of change and evolution, but revolutions are really rare, and you know them when you see them. Sometimes it's getting in front of a parade, then dragging the marchers forward, like Elon Musk, a very crazy visionary, like Jobs before him. Both had visions and set the bar high, failing, but succeeding more than failing, catching the public's fancy on the way up. There will be more like them.
And there will also be crooks, liars, and the disillusioned, those that ran out of money, and those that ran into cabals and monopolies. Not much changes but stays the same. Business ecosystems evolve services, and it never was Google's intent to do good, rather, to make money, and it's Amazon's job to bust business models in its favor. Somethings will never change, and building monopolies is a natural defense against the innovative.