Contrary to your first fallacious sentence, there are no secrets or complicated theories. It is not a secret intention at all, it's very obvious. The word does not appear over and over because it only fits in certain circumstances. The preamble is probably the most important since the preamble explains the principle philosophy we are attached to as a Government and People (Society).
To your point: To imply as you did that Liberty does not include things like privacy is not logical nor is it reasonable, unless someone does not understand the use of the word Liberty. Twice now I have expressed that the word is not simple, and very intentionally used to convey a concept. You disagreed with everything I stated, so it appears that you believe this is not true.
Start by looking at the definition of the word Liberty as I stated. The definition is extremely complex, and requires knowledge of another word "Free". Why was "Liberty" chosen where it was and why did they not use the word "Free"? Because Liberty means more than "Free" is the most obvious answer. Notice that Liberty is assigned to a person, and not the Government.
I gave the Plato's Republic suggestion since you can see much of the rhetoric used in the writing of the constitution there, and in rather short stories easier to digest and analyze one at a time.
Not my logic? Yet you propose no response in two replies other than "you are wrong". I would return the complement, however lacking any substance such a feat is not going to be justified. If you argue from fallacy, at least have the decency to use something a bit more intelligent and less obvious than you have shown twice now.
History is written by those that win wars, Tesla died in poverty with nothing. Guess who won and who wrote those books?
Interestingly, the other half of the story remains. It's easy to say "Conspiracy theory" but think harder. Look at what Edison did in PR stunts, is it really and truly only a conspiracy?
Idiot talk show? Try reading the definition of the word, then think of the concepts that go in to being "Free". Defining "liberty" is not like defining "Zero" or "blue", it's more like trying to define "rational" or "Republic".
I have read the constitution numerous times. The wording chosen is wonderfully done and very intentional. Perhaps try studying a bit more rhetoric and you will see how deliberate and intelligent the terms used really are.
Contrary to how many people think, the founding fathers were not a bunch of boobs that wrote things in a way that would be open to interpretation. With that said, many words are conceptual and not singular. Those conceptual words are very fluid and not contradictory. You see the same from masters of rhetoric through history, starting with Plato's Republic.
A last point, do you think it's unintentional that we are founded as a Republic? Perhaps you should read, or re-read, Plato's Republic. Not only is it a blueprint for our Government, but it is the prodigy for rhetoric similar to what you read in our Constitution. They used to call being able to understand and write this way being "enlightened", though that has been lost for some time now in our corrupted system.
Tesla was not only fucked by Westinghouse, but many others. The PR campaign by Edison is the worst, but JP Morgan pulling his project money since JP could not restrict access to make lots more money, and of course Westinghouse robbing him of personal wealth.
Greed has screwed us all, and continues to do so today.
Yours is an argument from fallacy, and not a very good one. The preaching of "If you have nothing to hide why can't the Government (or anyone else) know everything you do/own/have/etc... about you at all times" has obviously paid off. It helps that the majority of people today are very ignorant to the arts of rhetoric and fallacy.
Do you have any idea what the term "Liberty" means in the Constitution? The term was intentionally chosen because it deals with several items, one of which is privacy.
Why would you focus on "git" when it's not just knowledge of 1 tool required? Why do you ignore the fact that I pointed out a person would not learn this in a day in addition to learning to be a "programmer"? You also casually change your statement to dealing with a "competent programmer" where TFA and my statement deal with "teaching someone to be a programmer in a day". Obviously TFA nor myself deal with "competent programmers", but but novices "Learning in a day".
There was no issue that you presented that was rational or logical. If you presented a rational issue, I would have been able to respond. If you lose context between TFA and a post, shame on you.
I agree with what you state, but also see this as something which is a distraction to the larger picture. Zoom out further, it becomes noise and feeds a distraction. Feeding a few pawns is a side effect that is wanted, but not necessarily the end goal.
Here is an interesting analogy to contemplate. Your manager has to fire someone, who told him he had to do so? Generally those decisions are not made by the person performing the acts. Often the person that made that call plays nice guy, apologizes, lies and says "If there is anything I can do for you let me know". What if the poor sap having to fire people was the US, and the people playing nice guy are someone else?
The layers of feces covering what's really happening in the world are very think and smelly. Until we shovel enough away, it's pure speculation.
You can show me that companies don't use tools? I believe that you are not thinking rationally. I have 25 years experience and been involved in countless projects working for more companies than I can count. Every single company uses tools to manage code and binaries, unless they are tiny shops that don't work for places that require the tools. This ranges from every Automotive company, to DOD and Military, to SAP and Oracle, and the people that develop CAE and CAD software. It's not like GM uses CVS and Ford uses nothing, it's that they all use tools to manage code! These same companies require their vendors, suppliers, and tool chains to use the same tools they use. Those same companies have developers working constantly on customizing the tool chains.
Do you think it's accidental that Eclipse, KDevelop, and just about every other IDE has interfaces for connecting to numerous code management systems? I guess in your world it's all useless bunk that nobody would ever use, but your world does not match the reality I have seen and lived in for a quarter century.
Where we differ I believe, is that you see Russia and the West as completely separate from a political perspective. Is it possible that they work for the same team, at least at certain times? Look at the facts surrounding the plane crash and wonder. Also investigate who funded the Communist party in Russia and for how long they have been funded by "the west".
As with the article 2 weeks ago where they want to classify people as psychopaths by their Tweets, lets recognize this for what it is. Eugenics disguised as science. This is a way to accomplish a few things in one whack.
1. Justify monitoring and censoring
2. Classify anyone that fits a certain pattern which someone in an establishment deems "dangerous".
I'm not by any means a psychologist or psychiatrist, but at the same time I have enough understanding of the human mind from the classes I did take in college to know that this is simply not possible for countless reasons. People pushing these ideas should be put in to nice quiet rooms which are heavily padded to protect society from them.
Oh, and save the appeal to emotion fallacies since I would hate to have to humiliate you in a response.
While I am glad they are trying to make a stand, I'm wondering if the punishment will make them cave in shortly. Funny how a plane crash can change their perspective.
For those ignorant to the reference, see Poland and their reluctance to join the EU and what happened to their president for starters.
Are you sure who is the master and who is the slave? Really? Argue semantics after the regime is ousted and we can find out, but while the regime runs unchecked you don't know any better than I who is the master.
Random technologies that "I happen to use"? Hardly, these are industry standards and used at most places (as well as other tools too numerous to count that are required for a job in programming). Using git at a basic level is not trivial, and you are not going to learn it in the same day you are learning the basics of a programming language.
Mind you, I did not go in to detail on all of the knowledge a person would lack in a day of training. Such a task is impossible to do within a day of typing. Perhaps you were making that point in a very shitty way, but it seems more that you defend TFA.
Look, you could sit anyone down in a day and teach them looping and conditional expressions. Most people already understand variables, but you may have to teach them arrays. So what? This does not mean a person knows how to program. What that PHB stated is the equivalent to saying "Because I know the alphabet I can speak any language and write any novel". It's pure idiocy!
I have seen people come out of 4 years of College for coding and still not know their ass from a hole in the ground. Give them a non Microsoft product for development and they are completely lost. CSV or git, forget it. Distributed make? Maybe, but probably not. Half the time they don't even know how to find includes that are not spoon fed to them. Granted, there are some good ones out there, but mostly we churn out people that are retarded without a GUI to know most of what they need to know to do their job.
I'm sure that the person making these claims thinks they are all that and a bag of chips, but let him design a real program and see how smart he is. Give him a project that would take a real programmer a week. By the end of the week, you would start hearing the asshole complain about how the systems are all broken, probably even providing faked statistics to show everyone how the compilers are at fault.
Philosophy I agree with, though I did mention that my minor was in Liberal Arts so I do have a bit of a degree and years of education. Biochemistry requires knowledge of mathematics, so somewhat redundant with Mathematics. French is interesting, I'm not sure how you derive at that assumption. Perhaps for syntax, but not as much for problem solving skills.
Think about the larger scope of your statement. Media shows ignorance and drunken sluts as cool and functional members of society, and has for years. Gangsters are "cool" especially when they kill people, and dope dealers are an American success story (Hopefully you see the obvious sarcasm).
I used to think this was all just unintentional jibberish to entertain the masses. Seeing the long term effects on society I am believing more and more that it's intentional degeneration of society. There is much more to think about regarding what I just stated. It's my hope that people notice and pass the word to hopefully make change.
Math is one of those things where if you don't know it, you can't see what it's for, and if you know it, you can't imagine a world without it. You can always argue you don't need knowledge, and if you're nothing but a device for turning food into poop then that's true, but those with knowledge will rule you.
I would add to this statement the Liberal Arts. Rhetoric and Logic are also knowledge everyone should have. They are helpful in life all around., and not just your job. Critical thinking and communication are not strong subjects for most people graduating college.
Taking away the obvious implication of "You don't program differential equations" the logic skills gained by math help greatly in programming. I don't use derivatives per-say in programming or IT work, however understanding how to simplify complex problems has been invaluable to my career.
I graduated with a Mathematics degree and minored in Liberal Arts. I learned about computers during courses in programming that were required for the Math degree. I have never worked as a Mathematician, it was boring compared to Information Technology.
That would be correct, though it may require an impeachment to accomplish. If you read Plato's Republic, a concern even a couple thousand years ago was "Who watches the Watchers?". That act must be done in order to have a functional republic and be a "Free Society".
Start petitioning to impeach these dirt bags that are ruining our country. Doing nothing or implying "impossible to change",as your statement seems to imply, is not moving us anywhere but down into a deeper state of tyranny.
Slashdot Mirror
Contrary to your first fallacious sentence, there are no secrets or complicated theories. It is not a secret intention at all, it's very obvious. The word does not appear over and over because it only fits in certain circumstances. The preamble is probably the most important since the preamble explains the principle philosophy we are attached to as a Government and People (Society).
To your point: To imply as you did that Liberty does not include things like privacy is not logical nor is it reasonable, unless someone does not understand the use of the word Liberty. Twice now I have expressed that the word is not simple, and very intentionally used to convey a concept. You disagreed with everything I stated, so it appears that you believe this is not true.
Start by looking at the definition of the word Liberty as I stated. The definition is extremely complex, and requires knowledge of another word "Free". Why was "Liberty" chosen where it was and why did they not use the word "Free"? Because Liberty means more than "Free" is the most obvious answer. Notice that Liberty is assigned to a person, and not the Government.
I gave the Plato's Republic suggestion since you can see much of the rhetoric used in the writing of the constitution there, and in rather short stories easier to digest and analyze one at a time.
Not my logic? Yet you propose no response in two replies other than "you are wrong". I would return the complement, however lacking any substance such a feat is not going to be justified. If you argue from fallacy, at least have the decency to use something a bit more intelligent and less obvious than you have shown twice now.
History is written by those that win wars, Tesla died in poverty with nothing. Guess who won and who wrote those books?
Interestingly, the other half of the story remains. It's easy to say "Conspiracy theory" but think harder. Look at what Edison did in PR stunts, is it really and truly only a conspiracy?
What idiot talk show did you get that from?
Idiot talk show? Try reading the definition of the word, then think of the concepts that go in to being "Free". Defining "liberty" is not like defining "Zero" or "blue", it's more like trying to define "rational" or "Republic".
I have read the constitution numerous times. The wording chosen is wonderfully done and very intentional. Perhaps try studying a bit more rhetoric and you will see how deliberate and intelligent the terms used really are.
Contrary to how many people think, the founding fathers were not a bunch of boobs that wrote things in a way that would be open to interpretation. With that said, many words are conceptual and not singular. Those conceptual words are very fluid and not contradictory. You see the same from masters of rhetoric through history, starting with Plato's Republic.
A last point, do you think it's unintentional that we are founded as a Republic? Perhaps you should read, or re-read, Plato's Republic. Not only is it a blueprint for our Government, but it is the prodigy for rhetoric similar to what you read in our Constitution. They used to call being able to understand and write this way being "enlightened", though that has been lost for some time now in our corrupted system.
Tesla was not only fucked by Westinghouse, but many others. The PR campaign by Edison is the worst, but JP Morgan pulling his project money since JP could not restrict access to make lots more money, and of course Westinghouse robbing him of personal wealth.
Greed has screwed us all, and continues to do so today.
My apologies for misunderstanding your position, and my thanks for additional points as your position is a bit more clear.
Yours is an argument from fallacy, and not a very good one. The preaching of "If you have nothing to hide why can't the Government (or anyone else) know everything you do/own/have/etc... about you at all times" has obviously paid off. It helps that the majority of people today are very ignorant to the arts of rhetoric and fallacy.
Do you have any idea what the term "Liberty" means in the Constitution? The term was intentionally chosen because it deals with several items, one of which is privacy.
Why would you focus on "git" when it's not just knowledge of 1 tool required? Why do you ignore the fact that I pointed out a person would not learn this in a day in addition to learning to be a "programmer"? You also casually change your statement to dealing with a "competent programmer" where TFA and my statement deal with "teaching someone to be a programmer in a day". Obviously TFA nor myself deal with "competent programmers", but but novices "Learning in a day".
There was no issue that you presented that was rational or logical. If you presented a rational issue, I would have been able to respond. If you lose context between TFA and a post, shame on you.
I agree with what you state, but also see this as something which is a distraction to the larger picture. Zoom out further, it becomes noise and feeds a distraction. Feeding a few pawns is a side effect that is wanted, but not necessarily the end goal.
Here is an interesting analogy to contemplate. Your manager has to fire someone, who told him he had to do so? Generally those decisions are not made by the person performing the acts. Often the person that made that call plays nice guy, apologizes, lies and says "If there is anything I can do for you let me know". What if the poor sap having to fire people was the US, and the people playing nice guy are someone else?
The layers of feces covering what's really happening in the world are very think and smelly. Until we shovel enough away, it's pure speculation.
You can show me that companies don't use tools? I believe that you are not thinking rationally. I have 25 years experience and been involved in countless projects working for more companies than I can count. Every single company uses tools to manage code and binaries, unless they are tiny shops that don't work for places that require the tools. This ranges from every Automotive company, to DOD and Military, to SAP and Oracle, and the people that develop CAE and CAD software. It's not like GM uses CVS and Ford uses nothing, it's that they all use tools to manage code! These same companies require their vendors, suppliers, and tool chains to use the same tools they use. Those same companies have developers working constantly on customizing the tool chains.
Do you think it's accidental that Eclipse, KDevelop, and just about every other IDE has interfaces for connecting to numerous code management systems? I guess in your world it's all useless bunk that nobody would ever use, but your world does not match the reality I have seen and lived in for a quarter century.
Where we differ I believe, is that you see Russia and the West as completely separate from a political perspective. Is it possible that they work for the same team, at least at certain times? Look at the facts surrounding the plane crash and wonder. Also investigate who funded the Communist party in Russia and for how long they have been funded by "the west".
As with the article 2 weeks ago where they want to classify people as psychopaths by their Tweets, lets recognize this for what it is. Eugenics disguised as science. This is a way to accomplish a few things in one whack.
1. Justify monitoring and censoring
2. Classify anyone that fits a certain pattern which someone in an establishment deems "dangerous".
I'm not by any means a psychologist or psychiatrist, but at the same time I have enough understanding of the human mind from the classes I did take in college to know that this is simply not possible for countless reasons. People pushing these ideas should be put in to nice quiet rooms which are heavily padded to protect society from them.
Oh, and save the appeal to emotion fallacies since I would hate to have to humiliate you in a response.
While I am glad they are trying to make a stand, I'm wondering if the punishment will make them cave in shortly. Funny how a plane crash can change their perspective.
For those ignorant to the reference, see Poland and their reluctance to join the EU and what happened to their president for starters.
Are you sure who is the master and who is the slave? Really? Argue semantics after the regime is ousted and we can find out, but while the regime runs unchecked you don't know any better than I who is the master.
I'm pretty sure that the latter in your statement is 1/2 of the Earth's population, so the math would not work.
While your point has some merit, you are obviously about two decades behind on the Earth's population. You are off by nearly 3 billion people.
Random technologies that "I happen to use"? Hardly, these are industry standards and used at most places (as well as other tools too numerous to count that are required for a job in programming). Using git at a basic level is not trivial, and you are not going to learn it in the same day you are learning the basics of a programming language.
Mind you, I did not go in to detail on all of the knowledge a person would lack in a day of training. Such a task is impossible to do within a day of typing. Perhaps you were making that point in a very shitty way, but it seems more that you defend TFA.
Look, you could sit anyone down in a day and teach them looping and conditional expressions. Most people already understand variables, but you may have to teach them arrays. So what? This does not mean a person knows how to program. What that PHB stated is the equivalent to saying "Because I know the alphabet I can speak any language and write any novel". It's pure idiocy!
I have seen people come out of 4 years of College for coding and still not know their ass from a hole in the ground. Give them a non Microsoft product for development and they are completely lost. CSV or git, forget it. Distributed make? Maybe, but probably not. Half the time they don't even know how to find includes that are not spoon fed to them. Granted, there are some good ones out there, but mostly we churn out people that are retarded without a GUI to know most of what they need to know to do their job.
I'm sure that the person making these claims thinks they are all that and a bag of chips, but let him design a real program and see how smart he is. Give him a project that would take a real programmer a week. By the end of the week, you would start hearing the asshole complain about how the systems are all broken, probably even providing faked statistics to show everyone how the compilers are at fault.
Philosophy I agree with, though I did mention that my minor was in Liberal Arts so I do have a bit of a degree and years of education. Biochemistry requires knowledge of mathematics, so somewhat redundant with Mathematics. French is interesting, I'm not sure how you derive at that assumption. Perhaps for syntax, but not as much for problem solving skills.
Think about the larger scope of your statement. Media shows ignorance and drunken sluts as cool and functional members of society, and has for years. Gangsters are "cool" especially when they kill people, and dope dealers are an American success story (Hopefully you see the obvious sarcasm).
I used to think this was all just unintentional jibberish to entertain the masses. Seeing the long term effects on society I am believing more and more that it's intentional degeneration of society. There is much more to think about regarding what I just stated. It's my hope that people notice and pass the word to hopefully make change.
Math is one of those things where if you don't know it, you can't see what it's for, and if you know it, you can't imagine a world without it. You can always argue you don't need knowledge, and if you're nothing but a device for turning food into poop then that's true, but those with knowledge will rule you.
I would add to this statement the Liberal Arts. Rhetoric and Logic are also knowledge everyone should have. They are helpful in life all around., and not just your job. Critical thinking and communication are not strong subjects for most people graduating college.
Taking away the obvious implication of "You don't program differential equations" the logic skills gained by math help greatly in programming. I don't use derivatives per-say in programming or IT work, however understanding how to simplify complex problems has been invaluable to my career.
I graduated with a Mathematics degree and minored in Liberal Arts. I learned about computers during courses in programming that were required for the Math degree. I have never worked as a Mathematician, it was boring compared to Information Technology.
That would be correct, though it may require an impeachment to accomplish. If you read Plato's Republic, a concern even a couple thousand years ago was "Who watches the Watchers?". That act must be done in order to have a functional republic and be a "Free Society".
Start petitioning to impeach these dirt bags that are ruining our country. Doing nothing or implying "impossible to change",as your statement seems to imply, is not moving us anywhere but down into a deeper state of tyranny.