I generally subscribe to the idea that if something is good, it will become popular all on it's own.
16 years later and no one has heard of it.. not good.
There are of of course exceptions, where something is so far ahead of its time that no one appreciates it, or where something is never given a fair shake... but I think guile falls under neither group. It was a nice idea, but let it die and use javascript/lua/python/whatever..
If you don't like the parenthesized S-expression syntax commonly associated with Guile, use M-expressions. Guile supports a curly-bracket syntax called ECMAScript
In the time it takes someone to interpret what that even means.. they've lost interest in using it. Like I said.. the niche of people who would use an extension language is pretty small. The fact that they have to learn something new makes it even smaller. This is why using actual javascript vice something that is based off the same thing would make more sense. Most geeks have at least a basic understanding of it.. and could start using it right away.
I'd also like to add that their basic argument of "lets not use something popular that could go out of style, but instead use something that has never been in style at all!" seems a bit odd.
This has of course been going on forever, and I'm quite weary of it.
It also tends to evoke one of my more hated cringe phrases: "If people would only take the time to learn it, everyone would be using it!". Sometimes this is true.. however most of the time good things do become popular, and if something has been around for a while and not taken off, it's either way ahead of its time (rare) or not infact all that great (way more common).
I'm not a fan of the GPL either, but I think licensing has little to do with it.
Extension languages fill a small void. People who are tech savy enough to want to make changes to the way their programs work and have basic programming ability, but arn't skilled enough or don't have the time/interest to make a full blown patch.
I think they've got it all backwards here. You don't ignore popularity and pick an extension language based on it's language features.. you pick a language based purely on it's popularity and ignore language features. Using some obscure (even if well suited) language just narrows that void even more to people who can't be bothered to write a patch, but can be bothered to learn a whole new language.
I actually find sftp more convenient, as there is no real server setup (assuming you are already running ssh), no annoying firewall configuration, and you don't need to specify a password every time (assuming you have ssh keys set up). The added security is just a (nice) bonus.
There have been much better alternates (sftp for instance) for a long time. I suspect few people on slashdot still use FTP unless they really have to (no alternatives offered). That said, just about every web host still supports FTP, and all the click-n-drool web dev tools have built in FTP clients. It's still the lowest common denominator for newbies to get their files on the web.
That's actually an interesting way of looking at it.
I agree, slashdot wouldn't be the same if it wasn't for the occasional "how'd that get posted" story and "did some kid code this in his basement" bugs. It's kinda like when freenode went from their home grown (and buggy as hell) IRCd to whatever they are using now. They gained stability, but lost some of that warm n` fuzzy feeling.
But truth is, for all I've griped about the "new" slashdot (and then the "new" one after that)... and the dubious submissions... I still find myself active here quite frequently.
Slashdot isn't perfect.. but it's still a damn good thing.
Find and take up something you enjoy, whether it be racquetball, basketball, biking, bowling, skating, golf, etc, and it will never feel like work.
This was the ticket for me. I can't stand working out for the sake of working out. Playing floor hockey with the guys at work twice a week however, I look _forward_ to that.
I didn't get involved in sports for a long time because I'm not a competative person, nor athletic enough, and as such felt I'd end up bringing some serious team down. The fact is there are lots of people out there like this.. who just want to have some fun without making a big deal out of who wins or loses. Find some of these people and get involved!
I hate working out for the sake of working out, and spending an hour at a gym.. ugh.
For me getting involved in non-serious sports was the ticket. I'm not competative (or athletic) enough to be on a serious sports team... but there are lots of people who arn't either, and they do stuff too.
Find an activity you _enjoy_ doing.. find some people who also enjoy it.. and get involved. Running on a treadmill while looking at a wall twice a week and playing a game of floor hockey with the guys at work twice a week are two very different experiences, and will both get you to the same place.
That's kind of the problem in tech.. you have to have a selling product to fund research.. but keeping that selling product current requires resources itself.
A huge cash boost (should) let them do some R&D for a while.. and we might get something more practical.
As an aside, I realize the current generation of makerbot isn't all that useful or practical.. but I still really want one!:(
The whole situation pisses me off. It's nothing specific against google. It's that companies are being bought not for their product, or customer base, or innovations, or capabilities.. but effectively for legal ammo to sue the shit out of other companies/protect themselves from being sued. The actual products (you know, the whole point of all this.. or what used to be the point) can atrophy and die for all anyone cares.. as long as they get their IP!
I know this isn't news to anyone at this point, but the whole damn system is broken.
If you are talking virtualization in it's relationship to cloud computing, then I agree.
Virtualization on your own hardware though... not much difference from the current state. It's just another (sometimes open source) piece of software we learn to trust (along with all the other software we use).
Figuring out the next step in the right direction is the second step.
This is largely the problem, because I acknowledge that while I doing think everything that’s happening now is a good idea, a lot of it really does make sense. The ideas of cloud computing makes my shutter, but from a business standpoint I can see where it’s a good idea.
If your into cars, it’s like longing for the days when you could get in there and change a spark plug without a computer (hyperbole! calm down car guys!) while acknowledging that today’s cars are significantly more reliable.
The way I enjoy(ed) working with computers is making less and less sense in light of modern approaches, and the new way (which I don’t enjoy) is making more sense.
I really hate the direction software and computers are heading.
I'm not that old.. but it just seems like every new thing makes me cringe. Maybe it's for the best and this is the way people want it, and maybe I'm just too attached to the way things are now (or I guess the way things were) to adapt to all this new thinking, but dammit if I don't feel something I'm passionate about is slipping away.
Maybe I should just go plant trees for a living or something:(
Thing I've found with memory management is, that while it "just works" and you don't have to think of it for relatively straight forward stuff.. when you start getting into more complex OO designs, memory management actually becomes more of a pain in some situation!
Memory leaks in a managed language _are_ possible! When you start having references flying left and right.. you get into situations where two objects you are finished with are referencing each other (or themselves) and thus trick the garbage collector into keeping them around. Throw swing into the mix and the fun really starts. As a design gets more and more complicated.. you have to be very diligent (and practice good design) to ensure everything has a clean route to being dereferenced.
Compared to un-managed languages where you clean the memory yourself.. which is a pain in the ass for small, straight forward stuff.. but I've found takes a lot of the headache out of complex stuff (as backwards as that may seem).
Things like the transistor, which from my understanding came out of basic fundemental research vice trying to make a profitable end product, are mostly what I was talking about. Seems like we arn't doing this any more (or maybe I just don't notice because it's subtile). People do R&D.. but it always seems specific goal oriented, rather than "give some smart people some money and see what we get" oriented.
I do generally agree with your point, and my post was poorly worded in that regard. Innovation is a bunch of baby steps.
The best argument against patents is to apply their use today to innovation of the past. You can't just go out and invent something these days.. without violating a patent on soldering a copper wire to a metal pin or something stupid (ok, I know.. hyperbole.. but you get the point).
I think we care, we just don't have the framework in place to explore big ideas any more.
We have become very good at improving existing technology. Release product, take user feedback, make improvements, sell update product.. rinse and repeat.
The magic word of the day has become ROI.
We don't have Bell labs doing hard core research any more, and no one will invest in anything which doesn't have a clear pathway to profit.
That I can agree with. If I pay for the phone.. unless they offer a discount or something (which I might actually take)..
Is there any evidence that google is collecting data in this way or plans to? (real question not a snide comment, I really don't follow this stuff actively)
Slashdot Mirror
I generally subscribe to the idea that if something is good, it will become popular all on it's own.
16 years later and no one has heard of it.. not good.
There are of of course exceptions, where something is so far ahead of its time that no one appreciates it, or where something is never given a fair shake ... but I think guile falls under neither group. It was a nice idea, but let it die and use javascript/lua/python/whatever ..
Here's the problem.
If you don't like the parenthesized S-expression syntax commonly associated with Guile, use M-expressions. Guile supports a curly-bracket syntax called ECMAScript
In the time it takes someone to interpret what that even means.. they've lost interest in using it. Like I said.. the niche of people who would use an extension language is pretty small. The fact that they have to learn something new makes it even smaller. This is why using actual javascript vice something that is based off the same thing would make more sense. Most geeks have at least a basic understanding of it.. and could start using it right away.
I'd also like to add that their basic argument of "lets not use something popular that could go out of style, but instead use something that has never been in style at all!" seems a bit odd.
I'm with you!
This has of course been going on forever, and I'm quite weary of it.
It also tends to evoke one of my more hated cringe phrases: "If people would only take the time to learn it, everyone would be using it!". Sometimes this is true.. however most of the time good things do become popular, and if something has been around for a while and not taken off, it's either way ahead of its time (rare) or not infact all that great (way more common).
I'm not a fan of the GPL either, but I think licensing has little to do with it.
Extension languages fill a small void. People who are tech savy enough to want to make changes to the way their programs work and have basic programming ability, but arn't skilled enough or don't have the time/interest to make a full blown patch.
I think they've got it all backwards here. You don't ignore popularity and pick an extension language based on it's language features .. you pick a language based purely on it's popularity and ignore language features. Using some obscure (even if well suited) language just narrows that void even more to people who can't be bothered to write a patch, but can be bothered to learn a whole new language.
To each their own I guess ;p
I actually find sftp more convenient, as there is no real server setup (assuming you are already running ssh), no annoying firewall configuration, and you don't need to specify a password every time (assuming you have ssh keys set up). The added security is just a (nice) bonus.
I think more importantly, universal.
There have been much better alternates (sftp for instance) for a long time. I suspect few people on slashdot still use FTP unless they really have to (no alternatives offered). That said, just about every web host still supports FTP, and all the click-n-drool web dev tools have built in FTP clients. It's still the lowest common denominator for newbies to get their files on the web.
That's actually an interesting way of looking at it.
I agree, slashdot wouldn't be the same if it wasn't for the occasional "how'd that get posted" story and "did some kid code this in his basement" bugs. It's kinda like when freenode went from their home grown (and buggy as hell) IRCd to whatever they are using now. They gained stability, but lost some of that warm n` fuzzy feeling.
I know I shouldn't be feeding the trolls..
But truth is, for all I've griped about the "new" slashdot (and then the "new" one after that) ... and the dubious submissions... I still find myself active here quite frequently.
Slashdot isn't perfect.. but it's still a damn good thing.
Find and take up something you enjoy, whether it be racquetball, basketball, biking, bowling, skating, golf, etc, and it will never feel like work.
This was the ticket for me. I can't stand working out for the sake of working out. Playing floor hockey with the guys at work twice a week however, I look _forward_ to that.
I didn't get involved in sports for a long time because I'm not a competative person, nor athletic enough, and as such felt I'd end up bringing some serious team down. The fact is there are lots of people out there like this.. who just want to have some fun without making a big deal out of who wins or loses. Find some of these people and get involved!
I hate working out for the sake of working out, and spending an hour at a gym.. ugh.
For me getting involved in non-serious sports was the ticket. I'm not competative (or athletic) enough to be on a serious sports team... but there are lots of people who arn't either, and they do stuff too.
Find an activity you _enjoy_ doing.. find some people who also enjoy it.. and get involved. Running on a treadmill while looking at a wall twice a week and playing a game of floor hockey with the guys at work twice a week are two very different experiences, and will both get you to the same place.
Hopefully to fund research.
That's kind of the problem in tech.. you have to have a selling product to fund research.. but keeping that selling product current requires resources itself.
A huge cash boost (should) let them do some R&D for a while .. and we might get something more practical.
As an aside, I realize the current generation of makerbot isn't all that useful or practical.. but I still really want one! :(
Semi related.. but someone tried (or maybe succeeded, I can't remember) to patent patent trolling as a business model...
Both cases kinda piss me off to be honest.
The whole situation pisses me off. It's nothing specific against google. It's that companies are being bought not for their product, or customer base, or innovations, or capabilities.. but effectively for legal ammo to sue the shit out of other companies/protect themselves from being sued. The actual products (you know, the whole point of all this.. or what used to be the point) can atrophy and die for all anyone cares.. as long as they get their IP!
I know this isn't news to anyone at this point, but the whole damn system is broken.
* its
Please forgive, it's Friday :(
If you are talking virtualization in it's relationship to cloud computing, then I agree.
Virtualization on your own hardware though... not much difference from the current state. It's just another (sometimes open source) piece of software we learn to trust (along with all the other software we use).
I'll stick with my gentoo thank you very much ;p
This was more of a general "direction of the industry" statement than a "oh god, I'm gonna hate the next windows" statement.
Figuring out the next step in the right direction is the second step.
This is largely the problem, because I acknowledge that while I doing think everything that’s happening now is a good idea, a lot of it really does make sense. The ideas of cloud computing makes my shutter, but from a business standpoint I can see where it’s a good idea.
If your into cars, it’s like longing for the days when you could get in there and change a spark plug without a computer (hyperbole! calm down car guys!) while acknowledging that today’s cars are significantly more reliable.
The way I enjoy(ed) working with computers is making less and less sense in light of modern approaches, and the new way (which I don’t enjoy) is making more sense.
I really hate the direction software and computers are heading.
I'm not that old.. but it just seems like every new thing makes me cringe. Maybe it's for the best and this is the way people want it, and maybe I'm just too attached to the way things are now (or I guess the way things were) to adapt to all this new thinking, but dammit if I don't feel something I'm passionate about is slipping away.
Maybe I should just go plant trees for a living or something :(
Thing I've found with memory management is, that while it "just works" and you don't have to think of it for relatively straight forward stuff.. when you start getting into more complex OO designs, memory management actually becomes more of a pain in some situation!
Memory leaks in a managed language _are_ possible! When you start having references flying left and right.. you get into situations where two objects you are finished with are referencing each other (or themselves) and thus trick the garbage collector into keeping them around. Throw swing into the mix and the fun really starts. As a design gets more and more complicated.. you have to be very diligent (and practice good design) to ensure everything has a clean route to being dereferenced.
Compared to un-managed languages where you clean the memory yourself.. which is a pain in the ass for small, straight forward stuff.. but I've found takes a lot of the headache out of complex stuff (as backwards as that may seem).
Things like the transistor, which from my understanding came out of basic fundemental research vice trying to make a profitable end product, are mostly what I was talking about. Seems like we arn't doing this any more (or maybe I just don't notice because it's subtile). People do R&D .. but it always seems specific goal oriented, rather than "give some smart people some money and see what we get" oriented.
I do generally agree with your point, and my post was poorly worded in that regard. Innovation is a bunch of baby steps.
Indeed.
The best argument against patents is to apply their use today to innovation of the past. You can't just go out and invent something these days.. without violating a patent on soldering a copper wire to a metal pin or something stupid (ok, I know.. hyperbole.. but you get the point).
I think we care, we just don't have the framework in place to explore big ideas any more.
We have become very good at improving existing technology. Release product, take user feedback, make improvements, sell update product.. rinse and repeat.
The magic word of the day has become ROI.
We don't have Bell labs doing hard core research any more, and no one will invest in anything which doesn't have a clear pathway to profit.
That I can agree with. If I pay for the phone.. unless they offer a discount or something (which I might actually take) ..
Is there any evidence that google is collecting data in this way or plans to? (real question not a snide comment, I really don't follow this stuff actively)
They probably bought them for their IP, for the benefit of their lawyers ;p
Remember back when products succeeded based somewhat on innovation and marketing.
sigh.. good times :)
* astroturfing
* arguments
sigh .. monday :(