Fair enough. I've tried to learn Ruby so I'm not a dolt... but the syntax, to me, is downright offensive.
It's sad that people have trouble with Perl's syntax because hiding behind the scary surface is a brilliant sort of orderly chaos that's unlike any language I've ever used. In terms of Perl, as a language, I think I've begun to enter a class of 'Perl Mastery', and there are still things I find out about every now and then that the language does that are just utterly fantastic.
It is possible to write clean and understandable Perl code. What it takes is simply clean and understandable programming. A guy once told me, referring to Java, "You can take shitty programmers and put them in the language, and despite all of its efforts to stop them, they will write shitty code." Most people writing Perl are still basically writing C code... and that's when you really do miss what Perl has to offer.
Suit yourself. I've found that over 90% of the people who publically state that they've migrated from Perl to Ruby or Python or PHP were drawn in by features of those languages that they *thought* Perl didn't have. Some of them are rather shocked when you show them just what they've left behind. And each one of those languages has borrowed a lot from Perl anyway (hell, PHP used to be *implemented* in Perl).
Use whatever language suits you best.
Personally, I don't fully agree with Larry about one thing - I have yet to see Perl 5 hit any serious limits. The only way I see Perl 5 hitting any limits is in the fact that us Perl people want to go orders of magnitude more insane than we ever were before, and we simply need to re-invent programming once again to do it.
Until Perl 6 hits, I'll happily continue producing mod_perl portals that will smoke the competition in performance, security and robustness. When Perl 6 hits, well, we'll have a nice party on our hands:)
Re:Perl 6 for serious projects?
on
Larry Wall on Perl 6
·
· Score: 2, Informative
Perl 6 is currently a serious development project. But since you must ask, check out the first CMS written in Perl 6:
Yes, but that is nonsense in this context. Perl isn't aggressively marketed by the world's largest software corporation, piloted by the richest man on earth. Thus a decision to use Perl is much more likely based on experienced merit versus perceived merit.
You're absolutely right. For PBX-PBX calls on the same LAN, you have no excuse to use anything but G.711.
If you have to terminate to a VoIP provider as opposed to your own PRI, use compression if you have to.
Jesus that's a big server for Asterisk. I've pinned up 600 calls / 60 cps with RTP (mind you, ulaw) against the echo app and sat at an average 70-80% idle on a modest old dual Xeon.
Asterisk may have messy code, but in my experience it's stable and it will smack the shit out of proprietary alternatives in terms of call rates, etc.
If that's true, that would be really retarded. Surely Windows must have a kernel layer at least *something* like any modern UNIX's VFS - that is, a common interface to disparate filesystems on disparate block devices.
That's not how I see it at all. I really don't believe in so-called "intellectual property" laws at all, but as long as the government and the industry are going to hold us to their draconian standards, then by god, we have our freedom defenses like the GPL and we're going to hold them to those in response.
The appalling fact here isn't so much that First 4 Internet may have ripped off a few routines from LAME -- the appalling fact is that they produced a DRM scheme that Sony BMG adopted that has infected hundreds of thousands of Windows computers and, well, yada, yada, yada.
GPL code in Sony's Rootkit? I call that 'tactical ammo' to fire back at Sony with.
Convex made the prediction years ago that as the technology powering commodity processors advanced, the market for specialized supercomputer hardware would die off.
Looks like it's happening. The Superdome can either run PA/RISC or Itanium2. Opterons on a Cray system?
And it's not just limited to processors either. I have a bag of sticks of 72-pin DIMMs in the closet (yes, the kind PCs used to use) that came out of a supercomputer. Technology advances in supercomputing will make their way back into the general computing market, where the sales and hence production is much higher.
Besides, the whole "one big machine" theory seems to be slowly dying off as well. We live in the day of high-performance interconnects and 10Gig ethernet.
Going back to your skyscraper analogy, you better well use the mass market crane if it's capable of doing all the same lifting your specialized crane is, because otherwise a competitor might just slip in and outbid you on the job.
The Denver Police serve the people of Denver, so when there is a Denver-level vote on the issue of marijuana prohibition, the Denver Police should listen to the Denver citizens about policing Denver.
Similarly, if a large amount of American citizens participate in P2P, then the American government should make note of this and not kneejerk to 'throw them all in jail'.
To me, this speaks to a much bigger problem than so-called "intellectual property" (quoted because I agree with Stallman that the term is absolute propoganda BS).
Recently, Denver became the first city to pass legislation that totally legalizes the possession of up to an ounce of marijuana by adults 21 years and older. This happened because anti-WoD organizations got the bill up for public consideration, and finally, the citizens voted in favor of it.
Of course, possession is still illegal in the state, and also on the federal law, so it's still not really 'legal'. What bothered me so much about the news is the psychotic response from the government, saying "We will still jail you under state law!" in a very draconian tone.
The big point here is that this is supposed to be a government by the people, for the people.
The people have fucking spoken, and you've openly told them that you're going to ignore their will?
Anyone have any statistics on this so-called P2P epedemic? It seems to me that with the excessively large number of Americans (hell, people WORLD WIDE) that actively participate in P2P, it's the system of content distribution that needs to change -- not the further criminalization of the practice!
There are two flavors of time - TAI (Temps Atomique International or somesuch, I believe), which is measured by the decay of cesium atoms. There is also UTC (Universal Coordinated Time) which is measured by the rotation of the earth.
Naturally, there is drift - this is where the leap seconds come from. Right now, UTC time is 22 seconds behind TAI time. What they are proposing, it seems, is eliminating UTC. I see absolutely no good or sound reason to do this, given that precision timekeeping insturments already measure time in TAI.
Besides, how would they switch? Have a "leap time scale" day when time suddenly shifts by 22 seconds? This stuff would cause *way* more problems than it would solve, and I'm pretty sure it would solve exactly 0.
Yes, but bear with me for a moment. There are a *lot* of people who don't like software patents, and there are a *lot* of people who won't like plot patents, and there are a *lot* of people like me that don't like patents at all.
If we all formed trusts, patented everything we could think of - not with the intent of making money, but with the intent of flooding the market, we could end up with a really big cannon to aim at anyone who tries to use their patents to act obnoxiously.
Open source is already trying this idea to defend itself from software patents, so why not extend it to books and everything else we can think of? Patent everything from ways to keep track of employee timesheets to method and procedure for avoiding getting hit by a car.
I have an idea to help bring about the end of patents. How much do they actually cost to file, without an attorney? We should all pool our resources (everyone being all of those that think patents have gone wild, from corporations to individuals) and write as many patents for as many possible things as we can think of. File, file, file, file, file a trillion patents until you're liable for damages if you're not careful about how you lock your door at home. I'm starting to be convinced that the only way to deal with this nonsense is to send it soaring ahead, because hell, maybe it would just burn up in the atmosphere.
This is *very* exciting to me. Why? Because in order for the patent system of the United States (hell, the mere IDEA that you can 'OWN' an IDEA) to die, it has to collapse in on itself like a black hole.
CAPTAIN, WE'RE ABOUT TO HIT CRITICAL MASS!
(Oh, and I'm staking my claim here and now for this plot line. Patent pending, motherfuckers.)
Slashdot Mirror
Fair enough. I've tried to learn Ruby so I'm not a dolt... but the syntax, to me, is downright offensive.
It's sad that people have trouble with Perl's syntax because hiding behind the scary surface is a brilliant sort of orderly chaos that's unlike any language I've ever used. In terms of Perl, as a language, I think I've begun to enter a class of 'Perl Mastery', and there are still things I find out about every now and then that the language does that are just utterly fantastic.
It is possible to write clean and understandable Perl code. What it takes is simply clean and understandable programming. A guy once told me, referring to Java, "You can take shitty programmers and put them in the language, and despite all of its efforts to stop them, they will write shitty code." Most people writing Perl are still basically writing C code... and that's when you really do miss what Perl has to offer.
Suit yourself. I've found that over 90% of the people who publically state that they've migrated from Perl to Ruby or Python or PHP were drawn in by features of those languages that they *thought* Perl didn't have. Some of them are rather shocked when you show them just what they've left behind. And each one of those languages has borrowed a lot from Perl anyway (hell, PHP used to be *implemented* in Perl).
:)
Use whatever language suits you best.
Personally, I don't fully agree with Larry about one thing - I have yet to see Perl 5 hit any serious limits. The only way I see Perl 5 hitting any limits is in the fact that us Perl people want to go orders of magnitude more insane than we ever were before, and we simply need to re-invent programming once again to do it.
Until Perl 6 hits, I'll happily continue producing mod_perl portals that will smoke the competition in performance, security and robustness. When Perl 6 hits, well, we'll have a nice party on our hands
Perl 6 is currently a serious development project. But since you must ask, check out the first CMS written in Perl 6:
/ WWW/Kontent.pm
http://search.cpan.org/~brentdax/WWW-Kontent-0.01
I'd like to arrange for their prompt and bloody assassination.
Yes, but that is nonsense in this context. Perl isn't aggressively marketed by the world's largest software corporation, piloted by the richest man on earth. Thus a decision to use Perl is much more likely based on experienced merit versus perceived merit.
You seem to have forgotten Amazon.com, which uses HTML::Mason (a Perl/mod_perl templating system) to serve every customer-facing page.
...is using a piece of software primarily backed by Sun Microsystems as a benchmark of what's good. :)
...is Slashdot posting trolls on the front page?
You're absolutely right. For PBX-PBX calls on the same LAN, you have no excuse to use anything but G.711. If you have to terminate to a VoIP provider as opposed to your own PRI, use compression if you have to.
Jesus that's a big server for Asterisk. I've pinned up 600 calls / 60 cps with RTP (mind you, ulaw) against the echo app and sat at an average 70-80% idle on a modest old dual Xeon.
Asterisk may have messy code, but in my experience it's stable and it will smack the shit out of proprietary alternatives in terms of call rates, etc.
You can keep calling it a myth all day long; unfortunately, that just doesn't take any of the truth out of it.
Suit yourself. Perhaps you'd also like to roll around town in a deluxe bubble in case you might catch an illness.
Jesus christ you people irritate me.
Perhaps then you'll enlighten me on the byte code to 'prompt the user for input'? At some point, things *have* to get specialized.
Java is essential for any big ecommerce servlet.
s/servlet// && examine 'amazon.com' && say that again;
(Hint: Amazon.com OBIDOS = HTML::Mason + mod_perl)
Also, s/amazon.com/ticketmaster.com/ && remove HTML::Mason for another test case.
You see, this "Java is the only option" nonsense is nothing more than a meme started by people like this:
"There won't be ANYTHING we won't say to people to try and convince them that OUR way is the way to go. " --Bill Gates
But since you're just at CS101, I don't expect you to be anything but clueless in this matter, so don't feel bad.
If that's true, that would be really retarded. Surely Windows must have a kernel layer at least *something* like any modern UNIX's VFS - that is, a common interface to disparate filesystems on disparate block devices.
That's not how I see it at all. I really don't believe in so-called "intellectual property" laws at all, but as long as the government and the industry are going to hold us to their draconian standards, then by god, we have our freedom defenses like the GPL and we're going to hold them to those in response.
The appalling fact here isn't so much that First 4 Internet may have ripped off a few routines from LAME -- the appalling fact is that they produced a DRM scheme that Sony BMG adopted that has infected hundreds of thousands of Windows computers and, well, yada, yada, yada.
GPL code in Sony's Rootkit? I call that 'tactical ammo' to fire back at Sony with.
Convex made the prediction years ago that as the technology powering commodity processors advanced, the market for specialized supercomputer hardware would die off.
Looks like it's happening. The Superdome can either run PA/RISC or Itanium2. Opterons on a Cray system?
And it's not just limited to processors either. I have a bag of sticks of 72-pin DIMMs in the closet (yes, the kind PCs used to use) that came out of a supercomputer. Technology advances in supercomputing will make their way back into the general computing market, where the sales and hence production is much higher.
Besides, the whole "one big machine" theory seems to be slowly dying off as well. We live in the day of high-performance interconnects and 10Gig ethernet.
Going back to your skyscraper analogy, you better well use the mass market crane if it's capable of doing all the same lifting your specialized crane is, because otherwise a competitor might just slip in and outbid you on the job.
The Denver Police serve the people of Denver, so when there is a Denver-level vote on the issue of marijuana prohibition, the Denver Police should listen to the Denver citizens about policing Denver.
Similarly, if a large amount of American citizens participate in P2P, then the American government should make note of this and not kneejerk to 'throw them all in jail'.
To me, this speaks to a much bigger problem than so-called "intellectual property" (quoted because I agree with Stallman that the term is absolute propoganda BS).
Recently, Denver became the first city to pass legislation that totally legalizes the possession of up to an ounce of marijuana by adults 21 years and older. This happened because anti-WoD organizations got the bill up for public consideration, and finally, the citizens voted in favor of it.
Of course, possession is still illegal in the state, and also on the federal law, so it's still not really 'legal'. What bothered me so much about the news is the psychotic response from the government, saying "We will still jail you under state law!" in a very draconian tone.
The big point here is that this is supposed to be a government by the people, for the people.
The people have fucking spoken, and you've openly told them that you're going to ignore their will?
Anyone have any statistics on this so-called P2P epedemic? It seems to me that with the excessively large number of Americans (hell, people WORLD WIDE) that actively participate in P2P, it's the system of content distribution that needs to change -- not the further criminalization of the practice!
No, it's more like a Hummer - Lexus cars are fast.
There are two flavors of time - TAI (Temps Atomique International or somesuch, I believe), which is measured by the decay of cesium atoms. There is also UTC (Universal Coordinated Time) which is measured by the rotation of the earth.
Naturally, there is drift - this is where the leap seconds come from. Right now, UTC time is 22 seconds behind TAI time. What they are proposing, it seems, is eliminating UTC. I see absolutely no good or sound reason to do this, given that precision timekeeping insturments already measure time in TAI.
Besides, how would they switch? Have a "leap time scale" day when time suddenly shifts by 22 seconds? This stuff would cause *way* more problems than it would solve, and I'm pretty sure it would solve exactly 0.
This was pointed out by DJB a while back:
http://cr.yp.to/djbdns/ipv6mess.html
Yes, but bear with me for a moment. There are a *lot* of people who don't like software patents, and there are a *lot* of people who won't like plot patents, and there are a *lot* of people like me that don't like patents at all.
If we all formed trusts, patented everything we could think of - not with the intent of making money, but with the intent of flooding the market, we could end up with a really big cannon to aim at anyone who tries to use their patents to act obnoxiously.
Open source is already trying this idea to defend itself from software patents, so why not extend it to books and everything else we can think of? Patent everything from ways to keep track of employee timesheets to method and procedure for avoiding getting hit by a car.
I have an idea to help bring about the end of patents. How much do they actually cost to file, without an attorney? We should all pool our resources (everyone being all of those that think patents have gone wild, from corporations to individuals) and write as many patents for as many possible things as we can think of. File, file, file, file, file a trillion patents until you're liable for damages if you're not careful about how you lock your door at home. I'm starting to be convinced that the only way to deal with this nonsense is to send it soaring ahead, because hell, maybe it would just burn up in the atmosphere.
This is *very* exciting to me. Why? Because in order for the patent system of the United States (hell, the mere IDEA that you can 'OWN' an IDEA) to die, it has to collapse in on itself like a black hole.
CAPTAIN, WE'RE ABOUT TO HIT CRITICAL MASS!
(Oh, and I'm staking my claim here and now for this plot line. Patent pending, motherfuckers.)