OOh, how about the highly intelligent slashdweebs who think an operating system sold in your "21st century" shouldn't have a web browser built in? How about the highly intelligent SlashDorks who think all OS purchases are through OEMs? Or the ones who think Microsoft can support an OS in the "21st century" without knowing anything about which, if any, web browser is installed? How about the "highly intelligent" Slashdweebs who think product design should be done by committee?
You misspelled "retarded solutions". How the fuck can Microsoft support an OS when they have no idea which browser a given user is running? How the fuck was MS supposed to deliver embedded browser support to their apps back in the day before the other browsers were mature? God, you people are just insane - I don't get how you can think these kinds of low-minded thoughts and still have the brainpower to use a computer to reach and post to SlashDot.
OK - a follow up. Who does this help? How is the consumer served by this usurpation of Microsoft's right to sell a product that meets customers needs and is supportable by them?
Nevermind. I know your "answer", and it's a joke. I'll do it for you.
Because, umm, it will open up the market and better browsers will prosper and advance the state of web browsing!
Ahahaha. What a joke. You could make the same argument about just outlawing Windows. It also ignores the fact that there are better browsers already. I was an IE holdout until not too long ago, and even I use Firefox now.
Correct. They can't ship Windows without IE because it's a part of the operating system Microsoft provides. What next, you going to whine you can't buy Windows without the explorer interface or without the control panel applet? Your whole argument is too asinine to comprehend. It's just wrong on so very many fundamental levels from the technical to the practical to the free market.
Don't argue. These people are just idiots. Seriously, what does it gain end-users to uninstall IE? I don't get it... "Uhh, durr, I want to uninstall explorer.exe kernel32.dll! Why can't I? MONOPOLY!!!!". They've basically become a parody of themselves.
Yes. Anything that "gets" Microsoft is not only a valid course of action, it's the best course of action. Seriously, just read the replies to this article - it's hilarious. These filthy dweebs live in their own little fantasy land.
An even better way would be to simply not use the software, music, or videos which offend your arbitrary opinions about how products should be bought and sold.
I know - that's crazy talk and your scant "justification" for piracy is just a cover for wanting free shit.
Listen. I'm a gun guy. I plan to buy hopefully a Saiga-12 and an AK-47 before they get banned in the near future. But you're simply wrong. If the rule was "you can walk into Wal-mart and buy a 9mm by grabbing it in the shrinkwrap container by the checkout and paying cash" we'd lose our gun rights very quickly.
They're going to check your ID when you buy a gun, they're going to confirm you're not mentally ill, they're going to confirm you're not a felon, etc... These are simply facts, deal with them. You lose some of your rights when you are a criminal or a danger to society. Ergo, it must be verified that you are not in these categories before you exercise those rights. It's really very simple, and silly to argue your point.
You've yet to hear a good argument because your premise is fundamentally retarded. Why don't I just shoot someone in the face when they cut in front of me in line? Why didn't the US just nuke Iraq and be done with it? Why didn't we nuke a few random Arab countries after 9/11 to show that we don't take any shit?
Retarded questions are easily answered. We didn't because a) it's immoral and b) our actions have long term repercussions. The problem with "pragmatics" is that they tend to be symptomatic of short term thinking.
It was "pragmatic" for the US to make a boogeyman out of communism then use any means necessary to fight it. It was "pragmatic" to use any means necessary to ensure a ready supply of oil from the middle east, including puppet governments and US funded terrorists. Gee, look what happened on 9/11 because of that theory.
If you're a supporter of Israel and you want their long-term survival, you're foolish to support what they're doing now and their general approach to dealing with their neighbors. If you're a supporter of justice and decent treatment of human beings, then you're similarly foolish to support Israels tactics.
If you think might=right and that there is no cost for your actions in the world, then by all means party on and see what happens sometime in the next decade or two.
Well shit, why didn't they just nuke Gaza then? Why didn't we, the US, just kill Hussein then leave Iraq to their own devices? The reason, even if you're a murderous fuck who doesn't care about killing women and children, is that actions have a price in the long term. Israel is effectively creating a crucible from which the most psychotic and evil terrorists will emerge.
The reasoning is simple from a practical side - Israel is a tiny little country in the middle of a sea of angry Arabs. 7 million people, no matter how well armed, are in deep, deep shit if a few hundred million Muslims come storming in. They'd be well served to work a little harder on forming peace with all of their neighbors.
But I guess we'll see. If Israel succeeds in drawing Lebanon into a war, then Iran, I wonder how people in the US will feel about spilling their own soldiers' blood to fight wars Israel could have avoided.
Yeah, because that's important. Has anybody polled any of the Israeli settlers in the west bank about how they feel about the various killings and house burnings perpetrated there by Israeli settlers? How many of those religious assholes who think "God" gave them their land are now cheering at pictures of dead children in the Gaza strip?
I've been to Israel several times, and the people there are great. They share a lot of our values, they work hard, they're friendly and just want to live peaceful lives like anyone else, etc... But much like the US, they have their share of assholes, and unfortunately a large number of those assholes are in their government.
So again, neither side is right. It's just that we, the US, are arming one side while they slaughter insanely poor and hopeless people like fish in a barrel with our munitions.
It should respond with roughly symmetric force. Those rockets create a lot of fear and need to be stopped, but they have killed fewer than 20 people in 7-8 years. If Israel did very accurate targeted attacks and went in with ground troops and fought door to door I think we'd see far fewer civilian deaths.
Instead, Israel is aping the US. Shock and awe, go in with such force that you make the enemy tremble before your might. If you look at Israel's position in the world and the population growth of those around them, it becomes obvious that Israel must make peace with its neighbors or it will be in serious trouble.
People are free to cheer as much as they want for whatever they want. A "crowd" is made up of many people, some of whom may deserve to die and others who don't. They have understandable reasons to cheer anything negative that befalls any Western nation (and probably most Arab nations).
As far as Hamas, they are condemning their own populace because a) they're assholes and b) they are 1.5 million people crammed into a tiny strip of land with absolutely no hope or opportunity. Is it OK for Hamas and Israel to effectively collude to murder innocents?
As far as the Arabs, again what difference does that make? Let's say there is some percent of Hamas that not only isn't afraid of civilian deaths, but actively pursues it. Does that, again, make it OK for Israel to take them up on their offer and just bomb the shit out of a downtrodden, impoverished, and marginalized people women, children, and all?
The best thing Israel could do is fight this shit commando style. Open the borders, stop the blockades, and negoatiate peace (and blocking incoming shipments and roads isn't peace). Then, if Hamas is still launching rockets send in ground troops and fight them door to door.
You don't get it. The Palestinians would be best served with non-violence or at least with confining their attacks to military targets. When you have 0 ability to beat the enemy with force, you have to look at other approaches. Nonviolence is one tactic to defeat an enemy who is incredibly ruthless and vastly more powerful than you are.
This, for example, is why Malcom X was an idiot and MLK Jr. was a genius. If African Americans had resorted to violence, very bad things would have happened. To African Americans. The idea of using violence which will harden the heart of your already ruthless and overpowering enemy is an absolute last resort when you know you're going to lose and just want a parting "Fuck You" to the enemy.
I wish people would stop spouting this ridiculous "they want Israel destroyed" claptrap. Who cares what they want. If someone came and took my land I'd want them destroyed too.
The fact, however, is that the Palestinians are powerless. Me wishing someone dead doesn't give that someone the right to kill my children.
As for the "self defense" argument, give me a fucking break. From the start of the rockets there have been like 15-20 Israel deaths in 8 years. They've killed that many innocent people in Gaze in single attacks.
If some nut shoots at me from a crowd and I return fire and kill a few kids, I go to prison. Apparently the same basic moral guideline of "you're responsible for where your munitions end up" doesn't apply when it's just poor kids in Gaza dying.
This is a familiar pattern in history, I'm just surprised to see the Israelis of all people repeating it. First you marginalize a group, then you demonize them ("terrorists!"), then you demonize them further ("they voted in Hamas, they deserve it"), then you make them threatening ("they want to destroy Israel! (ok, they have absolutely no power to do such a thing, but still!!") then you exterminate them.
You're a fucking liar. The "palestinians" were never required to stop. Hamas did stop, as evidenced by the massive dropoff in rocket attacks once the cease-fire went into effect. The simple fact is Israel broke the cease fire.
Really, both sides are assholes. It's just Israel is the asshole with US backing and a ridiculous military advantage who is murdering children and other innocents in mass numbers.
If Hamas was smarter they'd cease violence or focus violence strictly on military targets. Israel would be in a shitload of trouble then. As it stands, Israel loves this because they have an excuse to go kill the people who voted in Hamas, even though Israel helped create Hamas in the first place. And we all know voting badly makes you deserving of having your kids blown into 5 parts.
I would make a measured response. Using the rocket attacks which have killed fewer than 20 people in 7 years as a pretext to kill several hundred is a little silly now, isn't it?
As for what Israel needs to do, they need to stop the blockade first. Oh, did you forget that these people are packed like sardines in a little strip of land with no incoming resources? Rockets being fired should be treated as a police action - send in troops to find the people responsible and kill or capture them.
What I wouldn't do is pretend war is free and it's OK for me to lob bombs and have massive civilian casualties because I'm unwilling to risk my soldiers. You're right - war does suck, and Israeli soldiers will need to risk their lives to go in and clean up these assholes lobbing missiles. Doing it with a bomb from 5 miles away regardless of who gets killed is a problem.
The problem with your "theory" is Israel is placing the onus on the backs of children and civilians who may have no choice in the matter. By your "logic", 9/11 was completely justified - we DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED a leadership that has done all kinds of evil all over the world for a long time.
I have no problem sending in the military. The problem is indiscriminate bombing. The price of occupying someone's land is your soldiers die. If Israel wants to protect itself its soldiers will need to go in and fight close quarters. Better 30 Israeli soldiers die defending their country than 30 children in a school.
Shit, with your "logic" why shouldn't Israel just nuke the whole area?
Untrue, but also unimportant. Israel is just doing a fine job of breeding remorseless terrorists. It doesn't really matter who's wrong or right, both sides are going to pay a massive price. Israel thinks it can win a war like this but they can't. At some point it's smarter to accept some losses, make reasonable responses, and work for long term peace. Israel instead is just creating a petri dish for the people who will come and murder their civilians in the future.
Some of the liberals around here whom are condemning Israel would likely be upset if the SWAT team dared to use deadly force. The robbers should have been captured alive no matter how many innocent people they kill or how many shots they take at law enforcement.....M
Yeah, it's like those terrorists gave the Israelis a license to murder a bunch of folks. Whoohoo - License!
Your SWAT comparison is idiotic. A better one would be if a murderer was picking off people from inside a minimum security prison. Shit, I guess that gives us license to bomb the prison and kill everyone in it, right? Take this, bad check writer fuckers!!! BOOM!
I've historically supported Israel because they have to deal every day with the same fucking savages we dealt with on 9/11 and on other isolated days. I've been there a few times as well and the Israelis are great people. But why are we paying those fuckheads in their government billions of dollars a year when their per-capita income puts them ahead of most of the world? Why are we financing their idiotic terrorist breeding ground where they just continue to breed the next decade's terrorists by killing civilians as part of their ridiculous "hard line" approach?
Israel is basically a welfare state. They can afford a 42" plasma TV and monthly cable, but we still give them free money. Fuck that.
You know, that's what's odd. I think the Israelis are a great people and good allies to the US. The problem is they seem to be going a little...mad. You talk about strength, but I'm curious how strong Israel would be without US aid? Without US military technology? I think Israel is pretty much a 1st world country now, and it's about time they start taking care of themselves.
By all means, they should be under our nuclear umbrella (though they have their own) if e.g. Iran gets nuclear weapons. But I think enough is enough and we need to cut off the ridiculously corrupt kickback to US military corporations via US->Israeli "loans".
Seems kind of pointless though, doesn't it? Israel is just breeding the next generation of terrorists. Also, comparing Egypt and Jordan to the Palestinians is downright laughable. To say it's apples and oranges is an understatement.
The dumb terrorists will die, new terrorists will be born, and the terrorists who survive will be the smart ones. Good plan there, Israel - a nice crucible they're building.
Slashdot Mirror
OOh, how about the highly intelligent slashdweebs who think an operating system sold in your "21st century" shouldn't have a web browser built in? How about the highly intelligent SlashDorks who think all OS purchases are through OEMs? Or the ones who think Microsoft can support an OS in the "21st century" without knowing anything about which, if any, web browser is installed? How about the "highly intelligent" Slashdweebs who think product design should be done by committee?
You misspelled "retarded solutions". How the fuck can Microsoft support an OS when they have no idea which browser a given user is running? How the fuck was MS supposed to deliver embedded browser support to their apps back in the day before the other browsers were mature? God, you people are just insane - I don't get how you can think these kinds of low-minded thoughts and still have the brainpower to use a computer to reach and post to SlashDot.
OK - a follow up. Who does this help? How is the consumer served by this usurpation of Microsoft's right to sell a product that meets customers needs and is supportable by them?
Nevermind. I know your "answer", and it's a joke. I'll do it for you.
Because, umm, it will open up the market and better browsers will prosper and advance the state of web browsing!
Ahahaha. What a joke. You could make the same argument about just outlawing Windows. It also ignores the fact that there are better browsers already. I was an IE holdout until not too long ago, and even I use Firefox now.
That's what I don't get. You fuckers actually sit here and debate how Microsoft should design and sell their OS. It's just completely unreal to me.
Correct. They can't ship Windows without IE because it's a part of the operating system Microsoft provides. What next, you going to whine you can't buy Windows without the explorer interface or without the control panel applet? Your whole argument is too asinine to comprehend. It's just wrong on so very many fundamental levels from the technical to the practical to the free market.
Don't argue. These people are just idiots. Seriously, what does it gain end-users to uninstall IE? I don't get it... "Uhh, durr, I want to uninstall explorer.exe kernel32.dll! Why can't I? MONOPOLY!!!!". They've basically become a parody of themselves.
Yes. Anything that "gets" Microsoft is not only a valid course of action, it's the best course of action. Seriously, just read the replies to this article - it's hilarious. These filthy dweebs live in their own little fantasy land.
An even better way would be to simply not use the software, music, or videos which offend your arbitrary opinions about how products should be bought and sold.
I know - that's crazy talk and your scant "justification" for piracy is just a cover for wanting free shit.
Let me correct myself. If you're referring to gun "licenses", I agree with you. If you're talking about background checks when purchasing, I don't.
Listen. I'm a gun guy. I plan to buy hopefully a Saiga-12 and an AK-47 before they get banned in the near future. But you're simply wrong. If the rule was "you can walk into Wal-mart and buy a 9mm by grabbing it in the shrinkwrap container by the checkout and paying cash" we'd lose our gun rights very quickly.
They're going to check your ID when you buy a gun, they're going to confirm you're not mentally ill, they're going to confirm you're not a felon, etc... These are simply facts, deal with them. You lose some of your rights when you are a criminal or a danger to society. Ergo, it must be verified that you are not in these categories before you exercise those rights. It's really very simple, and silly to argue your point.
You've yet to hear a good argument because your premise is fundamentally retarded. Why don't I just shoot someone in the face when they cut in front of me in line? Why didn't the US just nuke Iraq and be done with it? Why didn't we nuke a few random Arab countries after 9/11 to show that we don't take any shit?
Retarded questions are easily answered. We didn't because a) it's immoral and b) our actions have long term repercussions. The problem with "pragmatics" is that they tend to be symptomatic of short term thinking.
It was "pragmatic" for the US to make a boogeyman out of communism then use any means necessary to fight it. It was "pragmatic" to use any means necessary to ensure a ready supply of oil from the middle east, including puppet governments and US funded terrorists. Gee, look what happened on 9/11 because of that theory.
If you're a supporter of Israel and you want their long-term survival, you're foolish to support what they're doing now and their general approach to dealing with their neighbors. If you're a supporter of justice and decent treatment of human beings, then you're similarly foolish to support Israels tactics.
If you think might=right and that there is no cost for your actions in the world, then by all means party on and see what happens sometime in the next decade or two.
Well shit, why didn't they just nuke Gaza then? Why didn't we, the US, just kill Hussein then leave Iraq to their own devices? The reason, even if you're a murderous fuck who doesn't care about killing women and children, is that actions have a price in the long term. Israel is effectively creating a crucible from which the most psychotic and evil terrorists will emerge.
The reasoning is simple from a practical side - Israel is a tiny little country in the middle of a sea of angry Arabs. 7 million people, no matter how well armed, are in deep, deep shit if a few hundred million Muslims come storming in. They'd be well served to work a little harder on forming peace with all of their neighbors.
But I guess we'll see. If Israel succeeds in drawing Lebanon into a war, then Iran, I wonder how people in the US will feel about spilling their own soldiers' blood to fight wars Israel could have avoided.
Yeah, because that's important. Has anybody polled any of the Israeli settlers in the west bank about how they feel about the various killings and house burnings perpetrated there by Israeli settlers? How many of those religious assholes who think "God" gave them their land are now cheering at pictures of dead children in the Gaza strip?
I've been to Israel several times, and the people there are great. They share a lot of our values, they work hard, they're friendly and just want to live peaceful lives like anyone else, etc... But much like the US, they have their share of assholes, and unfortunately a large number of those assholes are in their government.
So again, neither side is right. It's just that we, the US, are arming one side while they slaughter insanely poor and hopeless people like fish in a barrel with our munitions.
It should respond with roughly symmetric force. Those rockets create a lot of fear and need to be stopped, but they have killed fewer than 20 people in 7-8 years. If Israel did very accurate targeted attacks and went in with ground troops and fought door to door I think we'd see far fewer civilian deaths.
Instead, Israel is aping the US. Shock and awe, go in with such force that you make the enemy tremble before your might. If you look at Israel's position in the world and the population growth of those around them, it becomes obvious that Israel must make peace with its neighbors or it will be in serious trouble.
People are free to cheer as much as they want for whatever they want. A "crowd" is made up of many people, some of whom may deserve to die and others who don't. They have understandable reasons to cheer anything negative that befalls any Western nation (and probably most Arab nations).
As far as Hamas, they are condemning their own populace because a) they're assholes and b) they are 1.5 million people crammed into a tiny strip of land with absolutely no hope or opportunity. Is it OK for Hamas and Israel to effectively collude to murder innocents?
As far as the Arabs, again what difference does that make? Let's say there is some percent of Hamas that not only isn't afraid of civilian deaths, but actively pursues it. Does that, again, make it OK for Israel to take them up on their offer and just bomb the shit out of a downtrodden, impoverished, and marginalized people women, children, and all?
The best thing Israel could do is fight this shit commando style. Open the borders, stop the blockades, and negoatiate peace (and blocking incoming shipments and roads isn't peace). Then, if Hamas is still launching rockets send in ground troops and fight them door to door.
You don't get it. The Palestinians would be best served with non-violence or at least with confining their attacks to military targets. When you have 0 ability to beat the enemy with force, you have to look at other approaches. Nonviolence is one tactic to defeat an enemy who is incredibly ruthless and vastly more powerful than you are.
This, for example, is why Malcom X was an idiot and MLK Jr. was a genius. If African Americans had resorted to violence, very bad things would have happened. To African Americans. The idea of using violence which will harden the heart of your already ruthless and overpowering enemy is an absolute last resort when you know you're going to lose and just want a parting "Fuck You" to the enemy.
I wish people would stop spouting this ridiculous "they want Israel destroyed" claptrap. Who cares what they want. If someone came and took my land I'd want them destroyed too.
The fact, however, is that the Palestinians are powerless. Me wishing someone dead doesn't give that someone the right to kill my children.
As for the "self defense" argument, give me a fucking break. From the start of the rockets there have been like 15-20 Israel deaths in 8 years. They've killed that many innocent people in Gaze in single attacks.
If some nut shoots at me from a crowd and I return fire and kill a few kids, I go to prison. Apparently the same basic moral guideline of "you're responsible for where your munitions end up" doesn't apply when it's just poor kids in Gaza dying.
This is a familiar pattern in history, I'm just surprised to see the Israelis of all people repeating it. First you marginalize a group, then you demonize them ("terrorists!"), then you demonize them further ("they voted in Hamas, they deserve it"), then you make them threatening ("they want to destroy Israel! (ok, they have absolutely no power to do such a thing, but still!!") then you exterminate them.
And the Palestinians DID NOT STOP. AT ALL.
You're a fucking liar. The "palestinians" were never required to stop. Hamas did stop, as evidenced by the massive dropoff in rocket attacks once the cease-fire went into effect. The simple fact is Israel broke the cease fire.
Really, both sides are assholes. It's just Israel is the asshole with US backing and a ridiculous military advantage who is murdering children and other innocents in mass numbers.
If Hamas was smarter they'd cease violence or focus violence strictly on military targets. Israel would be in a shitload of trouble then. As it stands, Israel loves this because they have an excuse to go kill the people who voted in Hamas, even though Israel helped create Hamas in the first place. And we all know voting badly makes you deserving of having your kids blown into 5 parts.
I would make a measured response. Using the rocket attacks which have killed fewer than 20 people in 7 years as a pretext to kill several hundred is a little silly now, isn't it?
As for what Israel needs to do, they need to stop the blockade first. Oh, did you forget that these people are packed like sardines in a little strip of land with no incoming resources? Rockets being fired should be treated as a police action - send in troops to find the people responsible and kill or capture them.
What I wouldn't do is pretend war is free and it's OK for me to lob bombs and have massive civilian casualties because I'm unwilling to risk my soldiers. You're right - war does suck, and Israeli soldiers will need to risk their lives to go in and clean up these assholes lobbing missiles. Doing it with a bomb from 5 miles away regardless of who gets killed is a problem.
Take the US's military funding out of the IDF, and I don't think the IDF would be as "impressive".
The problem with your "theory" is Israel is placing the onus on the backs of children and civilians who may have no choice in the matter. By your "logic", 9/11 was completely justified - we DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED a leadership that has done all kinds of evil all over the world for a long time.
I have no problem sending in the military. The problem is indiscriminate bombing. The price of occupying someone's land is your soldiers die. If Israel wants to protect itself its soldiers will need to go in and fight close quarters. Better 30 Israeli soldiers die defending their country than 30 children in a school.
Shit, with your "logic" why shouldn't Israel just nuke the whole area?
They're the ones that are 100% at fault for this.
Untrue, but also unimportant. Israel is just doing a fine job of breeding remorseless terrorists. It doesn't really matter who's wrong or right, both sides are going to pay a massive price. Israel thinks it can win a war like this but they can't. At some point it's smarter to accept some losses, make reasonable responses, and work for long term peace. Israel instead is just creating a petri dish for the people who will come and murder their civilians in the future.
Some of the liberals around here whom are condemning Israel would likely be upset if the SWAT team dared to use deadly force. The robbers should have been captured alive no matter how many innocent people they kill or how many shots they take at law enforcement.....M
Yeah, it's like those terrorists gave the Israelis a license to murder a bunch of folks. Whoohoo - License!
Your SWAT comparison is idiotic. A better one would be if a murderer was picking off people from inside a minimum security prison. Shit, I guess that gives us license to bomb the prison and kill everyone in it, right? Take this, bad check writer fuckers!!! BOOM!
I've historically supported Israel because they have to deal every day with the same fucking savages we dealt with on 9/11 and on other isolated days. I've been there a few times as well and the Israelis are great people. But why are we paying those fuckheads in their government billions of dollars a year when their per-capita income puts them ahead of most of the world? Why are we financing their idiotic terrorist breeding ground where they just continue to breed the next decade's terrorists by killing civilians as part of their ridiculous "hard line" approach?
Israel is basically a welfare state. They can afford a 42" plasma TV and monthly cable, but we still give them free money. Fuck that.
You know, that's what's odd. I think the Israelis are a great people and good allies to the US. The problem is they seem to be going a little...mad. You talk about strength, but I'm curious how strong Israel would be without US aid? Without US military technology? I think Israel is pretty much a 1st world country now, and it's about time they start taking care of themselves.
By all means, they should be under our nuclear umbrella (though they have their own) if e.g. Iran gets nuclear weapons. But I think enough is enough and we need to cut off the ridiculously corrupt kickback to US military corporations via US->Israeli "loans".
Seems kind of pointless though, doesn't it? Israel is just breeding the next generation of terrorists. Also, comparing Egypt and Jordan to the Palestinians is downright laughable. To say it's apples and oranges is an understatement.
The dumb terrorists will die, new terrorists will be born, and the terrorists who survive will be the smart ones. Good plan there, Israel - a nice crucible they're building.