Slashdot needs a 4 CPU system to run MySQL... maybe with queries caching it could do the same job with just one CPU and an extra gig or RAM (forums are a lot of read and just a little of write). That's a lof of money saving !!!
eww, I do not want to know where those facts came from.
The point isn't: can I come up with a situation in which it is pointless to use a product. If your web server gets that big, then maybe you can afford the 'REAL BIG DB', but why spend tons of money when you don't even know you'll be getting your money's worth.
One of the great things about SQL is it is pretty much uniform. To change from mysql to oracle could probably be done with sed; of course the 'transaction' parts would probably need to be rewritten, but then again, so does most software when it is meant for an order of magnitude or more than it was originally used at.
I take it from your statements that you are assuming the slave is a read only copy of the other database.
You can set up and I have set up two mysql servers that replicate against each other, so you can update either node.
While testing this setup, hitting each side with hundreds of queries per second (sorry can't remember the exact numbers at this point). The only problem I had was the logs filled up the 18gb disk in a day. No data was lost.
Not sure how much more fault tolerance you need in a free product...
I do not subscribe to IEEE Computer Magazine and so do not have access to that article.
However, you have not given us any information that would lead us to lend credibility to those figures. The sample size for the IDE drives compared to SCSI drives brings to mind "statistical error". A single bad batch of drives can mess up any lot of 24 drives.
To cite some useless personal figures: I have owned 10 ide drives in the past 4 years (all but 3 still in use). Only one of the ones not in use were because of a failure. The other two just were too small for their own good...
That would be a failure rate of 10% over 4 years, or 2.5%/year.
I have never owned enough SCSI drives to be statistically significant : ).
I agree with you in principal. I would like to have a nice setup using solid state disks without breaking the bank.
However, the question posed was just that, [do you have plans for a floppy based distro], not 'do you have plans for a distribution small enough to fit on a floppy or more expensive hardware'.
I have had more floppy drives fail on me than hard drives and many, many more floppy disks fail than either. I can understand why he would not want to code strictly for this situation.9
I was looking forward to being able to register a domain that was more personal than.com or.org, but I don't particularly like how the.name addresses are going to be distributed.
GNR (Global Name Registry) is holding onto the second tier dns, so you could not register yablonski.name (not my name), but they will register francis.yablonski.name..
I'd rather kiss up to the owner of yablonski.name than pay GNR for every person in my family that wants a web presence...
I had to respond to at least one of these comments like this..
It will not solve domain problems like penicillin used to solve many infections, but that doesn't mean it isn't going help.
There are big differences in how things work now and how they could (and to some degree will without question) work with this system.
Right now, with very few TLD's (except for the almost unusable country codes), a company could more easily make the argument that their organization on the net is also a commercial business.. : P
With many more TLD, it would be much harder to make those arguments. So for example in your example, if Amazon contests a native held amazon.tribes, their argument would hold no water. In any case, the basis of ownership is exclusivity.. The basis of capitalism is invention.. Companies have shown lots of in recent years coming up with names that are catchy and easy to remember, even while the dictionary names disappeared.. Are you worried about amazon.sex, even though you were there and they had none.. Anyway, I could ramble about that for a while, but I don't see that squatting is going to happen nearly as much as today (relative amounts that is)
Yes it would be great if companies and people who had nothing to do with commerce, networks or non-profits didn't buy them, but it is also much easier to do now with only 3 major TLDs to horde.
Why don't we put together a blue ribbon panel.. no an Inquisition.. and we'll put you as the head and you will check each application to make sure that porn shops aren't trying to buy.art domains
Good enough for government work........
If the moderators found this to be provocation, it would actually be a point in their favor, since you bring up irrelevant points and try to come to conclusions from them.
By the same token, you could say that:
What's sad is that [Unix] has been lingering on since [1969], and has barely advanced...
Also, it is ironic that you choose the word distribution to describe linux, when in fact BSD is more synomous w/ distribution than linux. All of those linux milestones are kinda bogus because that is only a kernel rev. Where are all of the kernel patches for the other operating systems? I know my solaris box at work is not running the same kernel it was running when it was installed..
The clever troll uses facts and misinterprets them.
Whatever... just because you can't scale it to every atom in the universe doesn't mean it's broken.
The whole point of DNS is to make it EASIER to remember site locations. Your solution, although scalable, makes it harder. Why do you think nobody uses that solution? Because it sucks. I don't know where IBM is located and I don't care. In a wider field of TLD's it's not that hard to try to find it, even if they relinquish their.com address... lets see, ibm.comp, perhaps.. ibm.food, nah..
And what about people... people want nameservice too.. Again, the better points of DNS is that it doesn't matter where you are or what your ip is. If your ISP annoys you into going somewhere else, you take your domain with you and nobody notices (except for a couple days of course).. If you move across town, I don't want to have to change my domain just as much as I would want to change it with my isp. Gee, used to be eightball.belair.md.us, then was eightball.richmond.va.us... !!!why don't you freakin' stay in one place!!!! (ps - moved a couple times after this as well) On top of that, maybe I don't want to lead people to my doorstep..
And this misuse you speak of.. how are you supposed to keep it from happening in this system as well?? You're gonna have to prove it one way or another that you live there and it does nothing about name squatting.. At least you can prove that IBM has nothing to do with: food, sex, banking, personal name or art. Adding more TLDs would actually lower the value of each TLD, so it's not worth getting ibm.food because no one in their right mind would ever go there. If people want to spend money on that.. fine, they are helping to support the infrastructure, but doesn't necessarily cause any confusion..
Actually, now that I think about it, your solution may be less scalable than adding new TLD's and is perhaps dangerous to DNS itself.. The whole point of new TLD's is to relieve the pressure on the.com namespace.. the whole reason we got into this mess is because it hasn't been expanded. What were the options? Well we make money and we don't educate.. I guess that makes us a dotcom. And individuals.., what are their options? I don't make money directly, I don't educate and I'm not a non-profit, who cares then.. If everytime there was some confusion over a domain, we had to bifurcate, we wouldn't just end up with confidentialinsurance.ci.kalamazoo.longhorn.wa.us (I'm guessing of course, though all of those domain levels are in use).. How is anybetter than confidentialinsurance_kalamazoo.ins.. hell, you can't find anything on the web anyway without a search engine... If everybody had to use the long a$$ physical location scheme that would be the biggest boost to alternate forms of address lookups they could possibly hope for.
I would suggest that this virus will be much less disruptive than the 'Love Bug' simply because after the initial infection, there are not any files left to infect.
So, the stupid ones will stop sending mail to the rest of us!
Re:Sounds kind of limited to me
on
IP Over SCSI?
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· Score: 1
Another reason is sometimes you have no option.. I had the opportunity to buy a couple Sparc 2's. I needed them to be dual homed, but I could not find a card to provide the second nic (ps, I was looking at what was available there, not what could be bought third party as the budget for this project is very low).
I looked for information how to do this without luck.. just a couple deja entries of 'I did it, why can't you?' Oh, well...
Not that you really need to read another, 'me too', but its really the algorithm that chooses what keyword to use that is at fault here. This message at the time of my reading is labeled 'Flamebait', but it actually has 3 funny votes and only 1 flamebait.
Go figure...
Re:OK...anyone from Slashdot want to take this up?
on
Why Not MySQL?
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· Score: 1
Not that it is very important, but it is in mysql.
Re:OK...anyone from Slashdot want to take this up?
on
Why Not MySQL?
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· Score: 1
My mistake if it is so... but I had not heard anyone talk of locking without reference to the SQL command LOCK. Also, when I read through the mysql manual, nothing came out and bit me that said otherwise.. Sorry for wasting more of your time. ; )
A question, if you would allow, about RDBMS
on
Why Not MySQL?
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· Score: 1
Declaration: I use mysql and am happy with what it does
Question: What is it about mysql that does not fit the RDBMS definition?
Looking it up on a couple sites (foldoctech. glossary) and an unsuccessful search for Cobb's original designs.. There didn't seem to include anything that mysql didn't support. Maybe mysql doesn't support the full set of SQL92 specs, but nothing but revisionism makes that what RDBMS is. It seems as if it were more of a value judgement... 'Apache 1.0 isn't a REAL webserver, it doesn't support HTTP/1.1'... Maybe, maybe not, you tell me, and I would like citings, not personal reflections.. I think we have a good grasp of what mysql does and does not do (for the most part). I am not trying to make it out to be [insert other db]'s equal.
Of course you don't get a book without popularity... but a book might worry people with vested interests (in their software or their own money in the bank : )
Re:OK...anyone from Slashdot want to take this up?
on
Why Not MySQL?
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· Score: 1
The article says nothing about all writes using table level locking. What it does say is that locking is only done at the table level. So instead of being able to exclusively change one record, you have to keep all records from being changed. I would tend to think that if you are using locks in the first place, you probably need transactions, and mysql is already out of the picture.
More than anything, I think it is a problem with which keyword is chosen.. As I read it now, it is rated '2 - flamebait'. When I looked at what each vote was, there was one flamebait, two funny and one overrated (knock down from 3, I would guess)..
Looks like it should be rated 'funny' if just because of votes..
> Until then, kudos to Billington for waiting when everyone else is running like rabid rabbits towards whatever technological > fad is in vogue this year. When the time is right, we'll have the Library of Congress accessible over the Internet.
According to your timeline, when the time is right, we will then have to wait for the books to be digitized. If we start now, when electronic paper is practical, we will have a nice library to use it with.
Even before electronic paper, there are other machines that are almost as useful, after all, all computers aren't mini-towers, even a laptop is almost useful, but there are smaller things out there... like palmtops (such as sony's PCG-C1XS picturebook computer)
The 'library' (small ell) is free and easy to get to. That doesn't mean that it will have what you need... When I lived in Richmond, the local library was very lame, for example. If the library has a couple pc's then it would cost the same to access the e-LOC then it would be to browse their much smaller stock of books.
The 'Library' or the LOC, is restricted and not so easy for everyone to reach. That bus far you speak of would be $50+ and two days travel time one way for some people. That PC is looking cheaper already...
To browse the internet in your underwear still requires the above mentioned PC , telephone line and ISP, alas.. : )
In anycase it is Billington who uses the 'A' word, and with less justification or proof...
I have recently been looking at the Gigadrive. Usually, I prefer a 'real machine' to an appliance, but maintaining them can be a hassle at times. Just the space issue can be enough to make you want to abandon the versatile model of servers and go for the sleek trimmed down version..
In an earlier slashdot article, it is billed as a 'lan party' drive. I was considering using it for convenient off machine storage, after all, when you are upgrading a machine like a file server (actually I call mine the application server), I generally don't have that much disk space on other machines, but would still like to keep it available. I would also like to have my printer available without needing that machine up..
Yes, it is more expensive than a drop in disk and a printer server put together, but that's the price you pay for convenience.
One of the questions I wondered about was the hacking possibilites of the linksys drive. I would assume there is some sort of solid state drive on it... Maybe getting into linux would not be possible, but it is definitely worth looking into. You might be able to enable the services people carp about (not sure that nfs is necessarily worse than samba, but their team is definitely cooler : ).. Also I wonder about the possiblity of a field upgrade of the hard drive.
I have heard that they are planning on doing larger versions of the drive that use RAID 5 (for the paranoid), that would be cool...
They are so much less expensive than the other NAS appliances out there (besides DLINK, what are they joined at the hip or something, its like they have the same product for everything).. like a smaller Snap server is $900..
What about the new firewire drives. I don't quite understand how they are used(please read this as "I don't understand", and keep the replies non-religious : ). The way I have heard about firewire devices are that they are kinda autonomous devices.. whether the manufacturers set them up to do this is something else.. That would definitely change my view of firewire if it was... I don't have any AV equipment and I don't really have any intention in the short run to get any. So those things don't excite me, however, having networked devices (of a sort)
A nice hack would be to have a small drop in machine like the linksys with firewire and the ability to add whatever drive you wanted. Then, the TiVO network!!
Some of these questions might have been answered on the previous slashdot story, but I could not get it to display any of the sub comments. When I was logged in, it would not keep my login and when I changed the format, it came back with no comments.
You could try to use VESA mode to get something better than 640x480. Instructions are in the FAQ, I believe. A quick search should find it none the less.
Come on, show some imagination. The same way that the iopener can only be used with their service...
This is supposed to be easy for everyone... 'point and double click and you're done', they're not going to be putting in 'hacker instructions' for you to make it difficult for yourself. It can and will be done, whether Scot Hacker's assumptions hold true.
Slashdot Mirror
Slashdot needs a 4 CPU system to run MySQL... maybe with queries caching it could do the same job with just one CPU and an extra gig or RAM (forums are a lot of read and just a little of write). That's a lof of money saving !!!
eww, I do not want to know where those facts came from.
The point isn't: can I come up with a situation in which it is pointless to use a product. If your web server gets that big, then maybe you can afford the 'REAL BIG DB', but why spend tons of money when you don't even know you'll be getting your money's worth.
One of the great things about SQL is it is pretty much uniform. To change from mysql to oracle could probably be done with sed; of course the 'transaction' parts would probably need to be rewritten, but then again, so does most software when it is meant for an order of magnitude or more than it was originally used at.
I take it from your statements that you are assuming the slave is a read only copy of the other database.
You can set up and I have set up two mysql servers that replicate against each other, so you can update either node.
While testing this setup, hitting each side with hundreds of queries per second (sorry can't remember the exact numbers at this point). The only problem I had was the logs filled up the 18gb disk in a day. No data was lost.
Not sure how much more fault tolerance you need in a free product...
I do not subscribe to IEEE Computer Magazine and so do not have access to that article.
However, you have not given us any information that would lead us to lend credibility to those figures. The sample size for the IDE drives compared to SCSI drives brings to mind "statistical error". A single bad batch of drives can mess up any lot of 24 drives.
To cite some useless personal figures: I have owned 10 ide drives in the past 4 years (all but 3 still in use). Only one of the ones not in use were because of a failure. The other two just were too small for their own good...
That would be a failure rate of 10% over 4 years, or 2.5%/year.
I have never owned enough SCSI drives to be statistically significant : ).
Darn you.. make me think.. What am I made of skills?
Real Link
Even though I tested it, here is a plain text version in case it gets screwed up:\
http://iain.lancs.ac.uk/html/gallery-misc1.html
I agree with you in principal. I would like to have a nice setup using solid state disks without breaking the bank.
However, the question posed was just that, [do you have plans for a floppy based distro], not 'do you have plans for a distribution small enough to fit on a floppy or more expensive hardware'.
I have had more floppy drives fail on me than hard drives and many, many more floppy disks fail than either. I can understand why he would not want to code strictly for this situation.9
Not having SMP is not a flaw, it is a lack of a feature.
Considering how much scrutiny their code goes through it would be quite a lot of work to get SMP code up to OBSD's standards.
>.info and .name are good
.com or .org, but I don't particularly like how the .name addresses are going to be distributed.
I was looking forward to being able to register a domain that was more personal than
GNR (Global Name Registry) is holding onto the second tier dns, so you could not register yablonski.name (not my name), but they will register francis.yablonski.name..
I'd rather kiss up to the owner of yablonski.name than pay GNR for every person in my family that wants a web presence...
I had to respond to at least one of these comments like this.. .art domains
It will not solve domain problems like penicillin used to solve many infections, but that doesn't mean it isn't going help.
There are big differences in how things work now and how they could (and to some degree will without question) work with this system.
Right now, with very few TLD's (except for the almost unusable country codes), a company could more easily make the argument that their organization on the net is also a commercial business.. : P
With many more TLD, it would be much harder to make those arguments. So for example in your example, if Amazon contests a native held amazon.tribes, their argument would hold no water. In any case, the basis of ownership is exclusivity.. The basis of capitalism is invention.. Companies have shown lots of in recent years coming up with names that are catchy and easy to remember, even while the dictionary names disappeared.. Are you worried about amazon.sex, even though you were there and they had none.. Anyway, I could ramble about that for a while, but I don't see that squatting is going to happen nearly as much as today (relative amounts that is)
Yes it would be great if companies and people who had nothing to do with commerce, networks or non-profits didn't buy them, but it is also much easier to do now with only 3 major TLDs to horde.
Why don't we put together a blue ribbon panel.. no an Inquisition.. and we'll put you as the head and you will check each application to make sure that porn shops aren't trying to buy
Good enough for government work........
DISCLAIMER: I use solaris, linux and bsd.
If the moderators found this to be provocation, it would actually be a point in their favor, since you bring up irrelevant points and try to come to conclusions from them.
By the same token, you could say that:
What's sad is that [Unix] has been lingering on since [1969], and has barely advanced...
Also, it is ironic that you choose the word distribution to describe linux, when in fact BSD is more synomous w/ distribution than linux. All of those linux milestones are kinda bogus because that is only a kernel rev. Where are all of the kernel patches for the other operating systems? I know my solaris box at work is not running the same kernel it was running when it was installed..
The clever troll uses facts and misinterprets them.
The microwave could reset its time using NTP or the like.. that would be cool.
Whatever... just because you can't scale it to every atom in the universe doesn't mean it's broken.
.com address... lets see, ibm.comp, perhaps.. ibm.food, nah..
.com namespace.. the whole reason we got into this mess is because it hasn't been expanded. What were the options? Well we make money and we don't educate.. I guess that makes us a dotcom. And individuals.., what are their options? I don't make money directly, I don't educate and I'm not a non-profit, who cares then.. If everytime there was some confusion over a domain, we had to bifurcate, we wouldn't just end up with confidentialinsurance.ci.kalamazoo.longhorn.wa.us (I'm guessing of course, though all of those domain levels are in use).. How is anybetter than confidentialinsurance_kalamazoo.ins.. hell, you can't find anything on the web anyway without a search engine... If everybody had to use the long a$$ physical location scheme that would be the biggest boost to alternate forms of address lookups they could possibly hope for.
The whole point of DNS is to make it EASIER to remember site locations. Your solution, although scalable, makes it harder. Why do you think nobody uses that solution? Because it sucks. I don't know where IBM is located and I don't care. In a wider field of TLD's it's not that hard to try to find it, even if they relinquish their
And what about people... people want nameservice too.. Again, the better points of DNS is that it doesn't matter where you are or what your ip is. If your ISP annoys you into going somewhere else, you take your domain with you and nobody notices (except for a couple days of course).. If you move across town, I don't want to have to change my domain just as much as I would want to change it with my isp. Gee, used to be eightball.belair.md.us, then was eightball.richmond.va.us... !!!why don't you freakin' stay in one place!!!! (ps - moved a couple times after this as well) On top of that, maybe I don't want to lead people to my doorstep..
And this misuse you speak of.. how are you supposed to keep it from happening in this system as well?? You're gonna have to prove it one way or another that you live there and it does nothing about name squatting.. At least you can prove that IBM has nothing to do with: food, sex, banking, personal name or art. Adding more TLDs would actually lower the value of each TLD, so it's not worth getting ibm.food because no one in their right mind would ever go there. If people want to spend money on that.. fine, they are helping to support the infrastructure, but doesn't necessarily cause any confusion..
Actually, now that I think about it, your solution may be less scalable than adding new TLD's and is perhaps dangerous to DNS itself.. The whole point of new TLD's is to relieve the pressure on the
I would suggest that this virus will be much less disruptive than the 'Love Bug' simply because after the initial infection, there are not any files left to infect.
So, the stupid ones will stop sending mail to the rest of us!
Another reason is sometimes you have no option.. I had the opportunity to buy a couple Sparc 2's. I needed them to be dual homed, but I could not find a card to provide the second nic (ps, I was looking at what was available there, not what could be bought third party as the budget for this project is very low).
I looked for information how to do this without luck.. just a couple deja entries of 'I did it, why can't you?'
Oh, well...
Not that you really need to read another, 'me too', but its really the algorithm that chooses what keyword to use that is at fault here. This message at the time of my reading is labeled 'Flamebait', but it actually has 3 funny votes and only 1 flamebait.
Go figure...
Not that it is very important, but it is in mysql.
My mistake if it is so... but I had not heard anyone talk of locking without reference to the SQL command LOCK. Also, when I read through the mysql manual, nothing came out and bit me that said otherwise.. Sorry for wasting more of your time. ; )
Declaration: I use mysql and am happy with what it does
Question: What is it about mysql that does not fit the RDBMS definition?
Looking it up on a couple sites (foldoc tech. glossary) and an unsuccessful search for Cobb's original designs.. There didn't seem to include anything that mysql didn't support. Maybe mysql doesn't support the full set of SQL92 specs, but nothing but revisionism makes that what RDBMS is.
It seems as if it were more of a value judgement... 'Apache 1.0 isn't a REAL webserver, it doesn't support HTTP/1.1'... Maybe, maybe not, you tell me, and I would like citings, not personal reflections..
I think we have a good grasp of what mysql does and does not do (for the most part). I am not trying to make it out to be [insert other db]'s equal.
Of course you don't get a book without popularity... but a book might worry people with vested interests (in their software or their own money in the bank : )
The article says nothing about all writes using table level locking.
What it does say is that locking is only done at the table level. So instead of being able to exclusively change one record, you have to keep all records from being changed.
I would tend to think that if you are using locks in the first place, you probably need transactions, and mysql is already out of the picture.
More than anything, I think it is a problem with which keyword is chosen..
As I read it now, it is rated '2 - flamebait'.
When I looked at what each vote was, there was one flamebait, two funny and one overrated (knock down from 3, I would guess)..
Looks like it should be rated 'funny' if just because of votes..
> Until then, kudos to Billington for waiting when everyone else is running like rabid rabbits towards whatever technological
> fad is in vogue this year. When the time is right, we'll have the Library of Congress accessible over the Internet.
According to your timeline, when the time is right, we will then have to wait for the books to be digitized.
If we start now, when electronic paper is practical, we will have a nice library to use it with.
Even before electronic paper, there are other machines that are almost as useful, after all, all computers aren't mini-towers, even a laptop is almost useful, but there are smaller things out there... like palmtops (such as sony's PCG-C1XS picturebook computer)
The 'library' (small ell) is free and easy to get to. That doesn't mean that it will have what you need... When I lived in Richmond, the local library was very lame, for example. If the library has a couple pc's then it would cost the same to access the e-LOC then it would be to browse their much smaller stock of books.
The 'Library' or the LOC, is restricted and not so easy for everyone to reach. That bus far you speak of would be $50+ and two days travel time one way for some people. That PC is looking cheaper already...
To browse the internet in your underwear still requires the above mentioned PC , telephone line and ISP, alas.. : )
In anycase it is Billington who uses the 'A' word, and with less justification or proof...
In an earlier slashdot article, it is billed as a 'lan party' drive. I was considering using it for convenient off machine storage, after all, when you are upgrading a machine like a file server (actually I call mine the application server), I generally don't have that much disk space on other machines, but would still like to keep it available. I would also like to have my printer available without needing that machine up..
Yes, it is more expensive than a drop in disk and a printer server put together, but that's the price you pay for convenience.
One of the questions I wondered about was the hacking possibilites of the linksys drive. I would assume there is some sort of solid state drive on it... Maybe getting into linux would not be possible, but it is definitely worth looking into. You might be able to enable the services people carp about (not sure that nfs is necessarily worse than samba, but their team is definitely cooler : ).. Also I wonder about the possiblity of a field upgrade of the hard drive.
I have heard that they are planning on doing larger versions of the drive that use RAID 5 (for the paranoid), that would be cool...
They are so much less expensive than the other NAS appliances out there (besides DLINK, what are they joined at the hip or something, its like they have the same product for everything).. like a smaller Snap server is $900..
What about the new firewire drives. I don't quite understand how they are used(please read this as "I don't understand", and keep the replies non-religious : ). The way I have heard about firewire devices are that they are kinda autonomous devices.. whether the manufacturers set them up to do this is something else.. That would definitely change my view of firewire if it was... I don't have any AV equipment and I don't really have any intention in the short run to get any. So those things don't excite me, however, having networked devices (of a sort)
A nice hack would be to have a small drop in machine like the linksys with firewire and the ability to add whatever drive you wanted. Then, the TiVO network!!
Some of these questions might have been answered on the previous slashdot story, but I could not get it to display any of the sub comments. When I was logged in, it would not keep my login and when I changed the format, it came back with no comments.
thanks,
Steve
Sorry for the lateness of the reply...
You could try to use VESA mode to get something better than 640x480. Instructions are in the FAQ, I believe. A quick search should find it none the less.
Come on, show some imagination. The same way that the iopener can only be used with their service...
This is supposed to be easy for everyone... 'point and double click and you're done', they're not going to be putting in 'hacker instructions' for you to make it difficult for yourself. It can and will be done, whether Scot Hacker's assumptions hold true.