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BeOS 5.0 Available for Free - But Not Yet
A huge number of people have submitted over the last few days/weeks that BeOS5.0 will be free. You can grab it from free.be.com - although I hope you've got a fast connection.Update: 03/28 01:22 by H :It doesn't appear to be ready yet - and we have an anonymous source at Be, who claims that there were some show-stopping bugs in the code, even up until last night. Could be hoax though, as it appears to be rolling now. They also announced that they are open sourcing (No license that I can see) the User Interface components Tracker and Deskbar, which have their own web sites. I've heard word that the free.be.com isn't working - check out http://www.be.com/products/freebeos/ for a more secure connection.
of course he was being sarcastic. Linux *isn't* "leading edge" by any definition (no offense, moderators).
To help understand what's so special about BeOS, here's something to try out. (Also check out all the software at bebits.com.) In BeOS 5's applications you'll find a program called 3dmix. (Click on the BeOS Icon in the upper right hand corner and scroll to Applications...)
To learn how to use 3dmix it's best to start with a ready-to-go project. There are some projects located at http://www.catastropherecords.com. Once there go to CatRec Misc, download one of the (smaller) 3dmix projects, expand it, open the folder, and double-click the ".3dmix" file. Everything will start up by itself after that.
Once it's all running press the 'W' key. This is a 3D representation of a stage and you can move the individual instruments around to change the mix. Click on one of the instrument representations and type a 'P' to get a visual representation of the sound from that instrument. You can also drag the stage around to see it from different angles. Also, try pressing the 'D' key to put it in demo mode.
Click 'W' again to go back to the individual tracks. Double-click one of them and you can edit it it, add filters, etc...
Last but not least check out the 'About 3dmix' screen! Once it's up click on it.
- Have Fun
Just a note to some of the messages I've seen; some of you complained you weren't going to bother cause your machine wasn't listed as compatible etc., *just try it*, it's really no sweat to double click this thing to see if it works! I would expect it would at least work in vga mode if all else fails - which is rather too small to work with but at least you can try it out - and I think you will find it's pretty cool. Some complained about being stuck with a 512mb limit - this isn't really true, I can download all kinds of beos applications to my win98 disk and run them from there, and it mounts linux/nt and dos/win98 partitions so you can use them all to store files. Some preference files etc. will be stored in your /home directory but that is hardly going to fill up soon. Just don't be afraid to try it, trust me you'll like it!
Are you serious? "Leading edge"? Don't get me wrong, I love running Linux at home, and cut my teeth on Unix -- but it's design is *not* "leading edge". Linux is based on a venerable and trusted design. It is essentially a highly modified monolithic kernel architecture [source: "Linux Kernel Internals"]. BeOS is far newer and certainly more modern than Linux is. There's plenty of resources around that describe BeoS (and Linux) internals. John
ftp://128.253.254.56/upload/be/BeOS 5-DevTools.zip
ftp://davros.cwru.edu/pub/
Enjoy!
Ken
It will install on any drive with a (V)FAT(32), NTFS , or EXT2 (that's right!) filesystem. In addition, you can take the disk-image, burn it on CD and have yourself a nice little installation CD.
You do of course realise that mp3 decoding has little to do with the OS? The cpu load while playing mp3s is dependant entirely on how optimized the mp3 player you happen to be using is.
All the mp3 player needs it for the OS to schedule it often enough to avoid dropouts. Which linux does as well as beos.
Its nice that netpositive is multithreaded, but there is nothing stopping anyone from writing a multithreaded browser for linux that would exhibit the exact same properties. Mozilla for example.
The only thing I've found so far that is clearly better than Linux is the font handling.
And the Tracker has blown up on me several times (in about 2 hours of usage). Fortunately, it didn't seem to bother the rest of the OS.
All in all, there is some cool stuff here, but nothing compelling enough to make me want to switch and learn a whole new set of APIs, however clean they may be.
Perhaps if I did video editing, but for my custom audio applications, there is nothing here that can't be had with linux. Latency wise, if 2.5ms isn't good enough, you can always migrate from linux to RT/Linux, as David Olofson has shown. If 3ms on Be isn't good enough, well, you're fucked.
Am I teh only one feeling that Be is in it's last resort to get something rolling for them. I mean, when Be OS first came out it's strong points were that it was teh first really PopwerPC native OS available. The technology itself is nothing breathtaking, except for the fact that it was developped in a really really short time. Sure it's small and can fit on a disk, but they aren't the first nor the only one with that. They have a couple of nice things, like the RAM image thing, teh journaling filesystem, teh system-wide contact database. But overall they didn't bring anything groundbreaking new. They are just a nice system designed with today's technologies. But sadly they would have needed thing built with tomnorrow's technology. Now this latest move ios only the last of a long long string of moves from Be to get attention, mindshare etc etc. Am I the only one seeing it this way?
Yes, BeOS comes with the full complement of gnu tools, including gcc.
WWJD? JWRTFM!!!
In a new press release (also on Yahoo!), Be has announced that they will be releasing the source code to the Tracker and the Deskbar - available at http://www.opentracker.org and http://www.opendeskbar.org respectively, and covered by "an extremely open and lenient" modified BSD license. Be is encouraging developers to further develop the two fundemental parts of the BeOS user interface in "new, exciting and unforeseen ways."
Cool!
WWJD? JWRTFM!!!
This post addresses your complaint. He claims to have SMP working. I cannot verify this as my multiprocessor machines are sparcs.
_damnit_
_damnit_
It's my job to freeze you. -- Logan's Run
Now I have to buy yet ANOTHER hard drive for _this_ operating system. *sigh* When will it stop!?!?!
Be..all that you can...Be
"Electric Relaxation" - ATCQ
- Bwana
"Electric Relaxation" - ATCQ
- Bwana
Hrm... how about slapping BeOS' Tracker and Deskbar on top of Apple's Darwin? The result: complete GUI OS that's X11-free (for those who care), fat-linked for Intel & PPC hardware. That would be interesting.
yes yes and yes. It's only because windows 9* disable the second CPU, but you can boot from a floppy disk, or bypass windows with an itemmenu in config.sys/autoexec.bat and launch beos.bat or beos.com or whatever the name is
--
BeDevId 15453
Download BeOS R5 Lite free!
"Science will win because it works." - Stephen Hawking
DVD: I think there are some licensing issues Be is struggling with. Be would probably get themselves sued hard if they decided to support DVD media the same way they support CD media (ripper built in to CD Player, CD Burner designed for audio, etc.) Of course, Xing isn't getting sued for leaving their keys lying about where any Scandinavian hacker could find them, but that's a whole 'nother rant.
GL Hardware Accel.: Still in development. BeNews had a couple of articles (OpenGL Status in Release 5 and R. Jason Sams Talks About the OpenGL on BeOS) on this last month. Sams goes into the guts of the new OpenGL subsystem. They're using some neat tricks to optimize the performance, so when it (finally) arrives, it should be lickety-split quick.
Every day we're standing in a wind tunnel
Facing down the future coming fast - Rush
This sig intentionally left blank.
It's only 40 megs, what's the big deal about having a fast connection? It's smaller than most videogame demos.
seanf();
And let's all remember, this is _not_ "BeOS 5.0", shall we?
This is "Developer Release 5.0", IE: we haven't even seen BeOS _1_.0 yet. I don't think their website even admits that anymore; it's mutated into a Big Lie, the same way most of them start...
Cheers,
-- jra
-----
Well, if the first release that they considered a 'complete consumer release' was _not_ numbered 1.0, then I have as much respect for them as I do for anyone else who does not understand how to assign version numbers, ie: none -- completely regardless of how good the product is.
If I can't trust the vendor not to give in to marketing on something as simple as version numbers, how in hell can I trust them on anything else? Let's have a little self-confidence, companies? Keerist; their primary market is geeks. Are _we_ unable to think a version 1.0 is purchasable too?
I can feel my hair growing points...
Cheers,
-- jra
-----
So far, it is no go. Does this have to made as a different type of image? Can this be extracted? Also I thought that this was a working BFS formatted partition. Does BFS support El-Torrito loading?
I'm new to the world of cd-burning, and I'm curious to see if this hack works. Ofcourse none of this would be needed had they supplied support for FreeBSD's FFS :-) -Peter
. Penguins Surely Ca
About 2 or 3 EST this morning The Register said Ars Technica had the link. Went there, clicked the link to Be, it was already slashdotted. Now the story has disappeared without a trace from Ars Technica.
Other cool stuff on The Register right now, another Brit spy looses another laptop, and look for the hidden Motorola/IBM story (hint: eleven)
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
Do you mean they took down the download site (free/be.com) or they took down the main page (be.com)? 'cause the main page was just as inaccessible about 3am est.
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
Yes, but for what it's worth, I had no problems viewing Be's site before the link was posted. Then suddenly....Poof! Gone.
I checked it right before the post to /. and it was okay. /. completely jumped the gun on this.
First of all, of course this is a publicity stunt. allmost everything that a company does is a publicity stunt these days. Be is a publicaly traded company, so everything that they do publically has to promote the company. secondly, Their OS is concitered technically superior(except for the lack of multiuser support (scedualed for release 6 or 7)) but without the programs of a linux/windows os. third, BEOS IS NOT IN THE OPEN-SOURCE COMMUNITY. the project has never been open source, they dont have a community to give back to. Allmost every piece of software for BeOS is Open, except for a few (really excelent) large apps.
Any sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology
A few years ago, Be tried to get popular OEMs to offer BeOS on new machines. The OEMs would get the licences for BeOS for free, and then could charge the end user. Only a few OEMs took up the offer, the rest had exclusive contracts with MS, which meant that the couldn't package any other OS (remember Refund Day?).
Free BeOS is a great move, BeOS5PE is a little restricted, due to licencing and size constraints, but the missing features aren't used by the average desktop user, and there are always alternatives to the missing features. For example, since the MP3 encoder isn't in the PE, and only in Pro, you can use GoGo and GoGo-Gadget instead. You can also download the Development stuff in a separate file. (only 20Mb)
BeOS is a very simple OS to use, but provides a wealth of information anout how you're computer runs. Maybe a new User gets BeOS, realises that there is a world outside MS, and it is better, and eventually gets interested in GNU and BSD OSs. (Linux, Hurd, *BSD, etc) This can only be a good thing for these communities. Know any GNU/Linux Distribution which installs itself non destructivly in Windows, in the same amount of time, and is just as accessable?
The release of BeOS 5PE will benefit Be with more publicity, but I think it will benefit (and liberate) the average computer user even more.
Am i the only one that can't reach this site. I get server reset errors.
Oh well
Pointless comment of the night!
I assume that this image, like any other filesystem image is made by a utility like dd. How do I place that on a CD to make it bootable in such a fashion that people talk about? Personally I think that Be are fucking idiots for not releasing a CD image. Why the hell would a company that does anything to conquer Microsoft customers, require that they would run Microsoft OS's... But back to the real issue, I read a bunch of the posts here, and I saw people saying and concurring that burning a CD is possible. If anybody did this successfully or has a plausible explanation on how to do this and with what kind of tools, please speak. I am very much all ears.
Wealth is the product of man's capacity to think. -Ayn Rand
Really?!? Who would of thought that a company needs to use a trick or a gimmick to get people to take a look at their product. Where could they have possibly come up with that? This is something totally new and should be stopped immediately.
But of course, since it's not open source, it must be evil. Why would any group of people in their right mind believe that they have the skills and intelligence to create something on their own, without the help of millions of wannabe programmers poking and proding at their source code. How are they ever going to be successful if they don't have 35 different versions of ICQ?
Find their HeadQuarters and burn it to the ground!
-- I care not for your foolish signatures.
And I'd hardly call the people who code open-source "wannabe programmers" - I'd imagine they're far better coders than you are, seeing as how you're so closed-minded I doubt you ever try and learn new techniques.
:)
This was not an attack at _all_ open source coders. That would be insane. It's simply a comment on that fact that we have hundreds (!) of Instant Messaging clients, and only three Instant Messaging _Servers_ (Jabber, gicqd and KiT) that I know of.
Linux is an excellent server platform, but has not made the leap in _current_ server-side apps, at least for the ones I'm looking for
And I do not profess to be a programmer, I know my strengths and weaknesses, and programming is one of my weaknesses.
-- I care not for your foolish signatures.
The free version is much more crippled then Be had led everyone to believe.
You obviously weren't paying attention. These limitations have been known about for months, and there is already a story on BeNews on how to get around them.
-lx
About 90% of the software on my BeOS system is freeware, not shareware. Compared to the Windows/Mac world, there's a ton of freeware, and much of it is of better quality than gpl'd linux programs.
-lx
Wrong. First, Linux is not derived from Minix. Secondly, it is not a microkernel, by Linus' own admission. For a while, he lamented having not designed Linux to be a microkernel based OS like Minix, until he decided to be an ass and start slamming Tannebaum all over the place, at which point he somehow converted to thinking monolithic kernels were leet. And no shit you can replace smtp and http servers without rebooting - the fact that those 2 things are not in the kernel doesn't make it a microkernel.
-lx
For crying out loud, does it not occur to people that someone might possibly have said that before? That possibly it's been the title of every other jackassed BeOS article in the media for the last 4 years?
-lx
I have an NE2000 compatible PCI (Realtek) and it works fine. Why not just give it a try, it's worth it.
But NT has a microkernel! And Linux doesn't!... Your analogy has left me completely stumped. You should think of a better one.
That's like saying "xxx OS" is based on a Microkernel because you can launch and quit different programs without rebooting.
Actually I've een wondering about this all fucking day. I can't get to Be.com to check the prices or even what the upgrade offer was. Thank god someone answered my questions. Now if the leechers would let me just go buy my upgrade copy ;)
WARNING: LAST LINE IS TOUNGE IN CHEEK.
"Fighting the underpants gnomes since 1998!" "Bruce Schneier knows the state of schroedinger's cat"
No, you don't understand why I was excited (and I'm a BeOS user, too).
:)
The reason I'm excited is because somebody can take the source and make it work with X-Windows. This would be a pretty awesome hacking opportunity for an enterprising individual(s). It's not that this thing will compile straight out of the box, but with some hacking and pounding, who knows what you might be able to do with it?
Try using Gnutella to find it. I've seen it on several servers now, and it must be quicker that these overloaded FTP servers.
(Got over 300K/sec, compared to the 3K/sec I was getting via ftp from Sweden).
Usually suggests they're still uploading it themselves.
I'm still trying to download it after 3 hours of trying! I guess the demand for it was a bit unanticipated, but at least there are new servers springing up occassionally.
Amirror that just about seems to have uploaded the necessary files:
http://freebe.nerdygirls.com/
There were 100,000 people signed up for email notification for the release - something tells me that more than just Slashdot readers are interested in FreeBe. I'll bet it's been slashdotted since midnight last night...
However, there are some downsides-it supports a very limited number of ethernet cards-I tried using an SMC card, and it wouldn't autodetect or let me install manually. Does anyone know a way to get it to?
| I just like BeOS because it puts the lie to Linus's uninformed
| and defamatory ranting about microkernels.
Not exactly. BeOS is not a microkernel. It's a very modular
system, but drivers and kernel modules share the same address
space, permissions, etc with the main kernel.
Brian
I'm not sure which license you're reading, but if you look
at http://opentracker.org/license.html, you'll note it's
pretty open-ended.
The app_server side isn't half as hard as the attribute,
query, and node monitoring stuff that really makes the
Tracker fly.
Brian
| You're missing the point. The neato query and node
:-)
| monitoring stuff comes from the filesystem, not the tracker.
| Doing such things with the ext2 filesystem would be less
| than straightforward.
That was, I believe, exactly my point. The GUI side of tracker
is very nice, but the stuff that makes it very snappy and
responsive is the filesystem support. After working on BeOS
for a few years, I massively miss node monitoring in UNIX
Brian
Yeah, it's old, but my kid is studying Shakespeare now in school. Doust thou understand? :)
And, according to the update, it is Not to Be.
--
then it comes to be that the soothing light at the end of your tunnel is just a freight train coming your way
I just got their message saying that BeOS 5 is available.
It even started to appear on ftp.sunet.se.
-jfedor
ftp://dl.xs4all.nl/pub/mirror/Beos/
-jfedor
Then create a boot floppy from floppy.img, and reboot! (try dd if=floppy.img of=/dev/fd0 bs=512 conv=sync; sync )
I don't have a floppy drive, what do I do?
-jfedor
Be's upgrade policy is that minor revisions (4.1, 4.2, etc...) are always free, while major releases (3.0, 4.0, 5.0, etc) are for pay (but users of previous versions pay less).
Yes it is; go to ftp://ftp.worldonline.fr/BeOs
I'm getting 50kBps right now.
Hmmm...they still don't support any of my scsi cards (Advansys ABP940U and DPT SmartRaid III), although there are nice open-sourced Linux drivers. But they _do_ support Lucent winmodems now! Whoopee!
Is there a nice direct URL to the file? The fifteen million layers of web proxys I have to browse through haven't realised that the site has updated.
-- Help Digitise the Public Domain at DP.
Uh, correction, ftp.be.com...
I strongly believe that trying to be clever is detrimental to your health. -- Linus Torvalds
Shouldn't it be possible to just create a partition on a disk of the correct size, dump their filesystem image to it (use dd, Luke), mark it as a BeOS partition in fdisk, and give it an entry in LILO?
That's what I'm going to try, anyway. The only reason I can see that it wouldn't work is if the image filesystem lacks a boot loader. Am I oversimplifying or missing something here?
The sites have been more or less overwelmed since yesterday. Posting it now really doesn't mean anything new. Even if it wasn't posted on slashdot the site would still be overwelmed today.
Goddamn, so it was. And by BE itself.
Wow! For all you cl-obsessives out there, I would like to point out that this is the only gui that even mac-fanatics admit is as easy as MacOs's.
...
Yes, I know I ramble and my spelling isn't quite up to scratch. If you wish to complain,
BEOS is a full operating system. When you install it into the windows partition, it is simply a loopback BFS filesystem, and does a "loadlin"-like function and basically takes over.. Main attraction is avoiding repartitioning.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
No No No.. All wrong.. it says "within other operating systems" IT runs, as it always has, independently. All it does inside windows it put a loadlin-like program and a loopback BFS filesystem as a file and takes over, it is in no way dependent, nor has it ever been on windows.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
Nope, can still be repartitioned, the FAQ just puts too much stress on the loopback install capability. They say in the faq, "*IF* I install.. within windows, will performance suffer.." BeOS has always been standalone.. And the Pro edition only bundles more software, not enable standalone, as near as I can tell.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
At least they are also offering linux capability too..but even then, witht he current offerings it looks like I won't be taking a Free Be CD and installing it directly on a un-initialized system.. Oh well, I wonder how much BeOS 5 will cost me for a *real* version.. I bought BeOS 4, and got 4.5 for free, but they probably won't do that again :)
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
Find it funny that slashdot had the story as "BeOS 5.0 available for free" Before Be released it, and then, to make up for the mistake, changed it to "BeOS 5.0 avaialble for free - But Not Yet" Pretty much at the same time it *did* become available, therefore making the story incorrect again? :)
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
had his cd copy land on his desk this morning - raises doubts to the rumours of 'show-stopping bug code'. He immediately picked up the phone and started telling his friends how good it was.
insignificant sig
The site is up again, as of 8:42 AM Eastern Time. Go to it!
Here's how I managed a CD Burn. First I downloaded the 50MB FreeBeos 5 distribution. Ran that .exe and it installed itself onto about 500+MB of windows disk space. The big be.image file is 500MB. My first attempt was to just copy all those files in the BeOs directory to a CD, but that didn't quite work. Here's what ended up working
1. I made a boot floopy using the BeOs tool that was installed as part of the BeOs5 install above.
2. I ran the Win 500 MB BeOs by clicking their link (had to hit space bar during beOs boot to get a safe video mode).
3. I mounted my C hard drive under BeOs from within Beos
4. I ran the BeOs included CDBurner application and burned just one track. the 500 MB image file in the BeOs folder on the C: drive.
5. Now pickup at the target machine I really want to install on to and not be limited by Windows or 500 MB.
Stick in the BeOs boot floppy from #1.
6. Stick in the CD we just burned
7. Boot up machine. May need to hit space bar to choose CD ROM to load from and safe video mode.
8. BeOS loads from the CD and then I can install to hard drive using built in partition tools.
Posted this running BeOs browser from 1.5 GB partition.
Good Luck!
jrw
Slashdot played a part - but i'd be interested in Logs for URL referers.
-Docvert converts MSWord to OpenDocument, clean HTML
Now the big question(s) that remain for Be to become a true rival to Microsoft for the desktop are:
When will BE include DVD support, both the UDF file system and the ability to play DVD video via software or hardware players....?
When will accelerated OpenGL support appear for Be...?
It seems to me that as a "Media OS" these should be the priorities for Be developers. If Be had these features, I wouldn't even think of booting Windows anymore, and I bet a lot of people would feel the same way. BeOS combines the usability of a *really decent* GUI with the underlying power far superior to WinAnything.
Just my 2....
Boo hoo, give 'em a chance. I am currently posting this with Be R5 and Netpositive, btw, don't throw lettuce, throw me a T-bone instead, I am not a friggin vegetarian.
"If you can't take the heat, get the hell out of the kitchen"
Succinct analysis that overlooks a critical point. Red Hat's stocks are held mostly by people who do only have one interest; they want their stock values to go up and profit to be made. Red Hat now has to balance two masters, their shareholders and the "community" which put them on the map.
VA Linux on the other hand has always been a more conventionally modeled company (if originally selling a slightly unconventional product) doesn't have quite the same baggage to deal with.
Mirrors are here: BTW I can get a listing at their ftp server but it's all still not available so I wont give filenames to stop the hammering. The above FTP sites are mirrors of . They are synchronized with ftp.be.com at least once per day, sometimes more often. We encourage you to use these mirrors if your connection to ftp.be.com is slow.
Sorry if previous post unreadable
ftp://ftp.be.com/pub/MIRRORS
I just noticed the same thing!
ftp://ftp.sunet.se/pub/os/BeOS/
All the FTPs are not ready anyway... and they are logjammed.
EC
"...we are moving toward a Web-centric stage and our dear PC will be one of
EverCode
...since you actually paid for BeOS 4.5, you're entitled to the $29.95 upgrade pricing to the full version of BeOS 5, with RealMedia codec, Mp3 encoding codec, and all those other royalty things... plus the goodies. Good thing you didn't pirate 4.5, right? :)
Wah!
I am typying this from netpositive. Wow. Setup was so hassle free. Wish linux/windows installation was so easy (Win is easy, but time consuming). Sound, video, everything works great.
Note to users of fairly new hard ware. Be does NOT support UDMA66/100. I had to change out my IBM from 66 to 33 to get the OS to boot. Also note that you are only allowed 500 MB for the BE partition, but you can mount FAT32 (ext2 also???) partitions.
Other than the small problem of UDMA-66, it is a promising OS
It's getting re-uploaded to sunet.se now. Looks like it's going a bit faster than last time, too.
Why dont try their site:
www.be.com
futang futang!
Okay you can get it now (its now 9:00 Central). And there are around 5 to 7 mirrors (some not available til 11:00 A.M.). Go get it.
futang futang!
No thanks, I think I am going to buy the professional version to endorse buying quality products. If you want to look at the source code, go work for the company, and then you can develop all you want.
futang futang!
I will throw my hard earned lettuce at Be as it is closed source, see there...they will make money.
futang futang!
Yeah, and the tons of 50 different box covers that Linux has due to the assorted distributions isn't any different than the 35 different versions of ICQ, thats variety. I like closed source becaue I like to eat!
futang futang!
tsk tsk...run it once, and then you will know.
futang futang!
From what I can tell, the personal edition is watered down enough that it laughable compared to the full version. The personal edition is started from within windows or off a floppy and is not a seperate partition. Almost not worth the download.
Scott Hussey PGP signature available at www.keyserver.net
From the ReadMe of BeOS Personnal Edition :
---
- Disk Space (Part 1)
When it's uncompressed, BeOS 5 Personal Edition inflates to 512 megabytes, no more, no less. This means that you need to have 512 megabytes of disk space available before you start the installation instructions (below). The BeOS 5 Pro Edition can be installed in a partition as small as 256 megabytes or as large as your largest hard drive.
[...]
To install BeOS 5 Personal Edition you need:
- A Pentium-based computer with at least 32 megabytes of RAM (P90 or higher is recommended).
- At least 512 megabytes of free disk space on a non-compressed FAT, FAT32, or NTFS drive.
- Windows 95/98, 2000, or NT4.- A blank floppy.
---
Look at the LAST line. The BeOS *Personnal* edition REQUIRES Windows!
It comme in ONE big file that is 512Megs which is the BFS from wich BeOS will boot.
If you want to install it on a partition you MUST purchase the *Pro* edition.
From their FAQ.
---
Q. Will I be able to install BeOS 5 Personal Edition within operating systems other than Windows?
A: Not at this time.
---
Forget about it if you want to install it on it's own partition.
Now that's cool, I just have to install VMWare. Put a windows95/98 on a VM then install BeOS Personnal Edition.
Now that's trully innovative!
Now I know why all the mirrors are /.ed when they probably aren't going to post the OS for another few hours. I doubt all the Be employees are even at work yet. . .
> I'm Joe user
No you're not. You're Anonymous Coward - the hot gritter troll. If on the page written by the TWO GODS - God Rob and God CmdrTaco it says so, the so it is ! Don't lie
:)
1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
The web site is dead but the ftp server is still up.
...
Someone could post some mirrors or the names of the files in ftp://ftp.be.com/pub/beos/ dir which has no read acces (i.e. cannot list the files there)...
Pleaaseee - i am shift-reloading the site for 5 hours now and it's still down
1% APY, No fees, Online Bank https://captl1.co/2uIErYq Don't let your $$$ sit in a no-interest acct.
ftp://ftp.uu.net/tmp/
yep, I did, and, funny thing, I used a mirror that was posted on this thread!!! So, dude, just read slashdot if you want to find out the best mirrors :o)))
BeOS rocks!!!!
Sigged!
Be has said on a number of occasions that they're shifting focus to the WebPad embedded device market, and I don't blame them. Having used BeOS in the past, I can see how a trimmed down version with a good browser would do a great job. By giving away their old operating system, they'll be able to attract developers, so they can have a better product for investors. Can't blame 'em one bit.
--
Donald Roeber
Donald Roeber
Generating 2048 Bits of Randomness...
Here is the conclusion I am drawing: Be posted the links to mirrors before actually having the program ready for download.
Bad, bad Be.
Unless anyone has managed to find the file, in which case, post a working mirror please!!
In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe. -Carl Sagan
You ever wonder how to make a Windows 98 app run faster? I found out in a "this is too dumb to work, so let's try it" experiment. No fancy mods or wires needed. Just twirl your mouse around over the Window in question. Gee, Windows is interactive! OUCH! Thank you Mr. Gates.
..They should have made a request at least to register apps using that code to leave their URL on a Be homepage for advertising, or offer to sell them in a BeDepot kind of store. But insanely great is the right direction and that's why Apple has come back.
Being a Mac person at heart though now mostly Linux (strengthened by someone wiping my hard disk) I have to say I keep thinking about the BeOS which, while you can't do everything like Linux (because someone has worked on the problem somewhere), what it does it does awesomely well. Kicking and screaming at Mr. Gate$ on a seven month implementation Quicktime 4 for Windows as a porting layer (probably first to do it) for a huge layout application in the beginning of last year, I really don't like Windows that's for sure, though I've developed some expertise in it. Sure, now this Quark/Illustrator predecessor can play Quicktime movies if you want it to, and it was interesting using the half of the MacOS that got ported to x86 to run Quicktime. I was even able to port resource files as-is for the most part. But everything still looks like shit on Windows (well at least not so jaggy with Quicktime though). And you can't trust its event handling for shit, which I found out when implementing Mac Toolbox based dragging etc. Compare that to "everything works though it usually looks weak" on Linux, and "everything looks great and you get synergies from the OS" on BeOS. Don't know enough about OS X client to say but Be feels most powerful using it, as in horsepower under the hood.
I met Gassee once briefly at a press conference in Japan a couple years ago I told him I wanted to do a media art installation on the BeOS (and did once) but every time I want to get back to it, there isn't as much need. Thought it would be good for quick prototyping of apps but hell flat storyboards go a long way, you can surf web pages with a more ubiquitous interface, and there are only about a zillion ways to script this sort of thing in linux.
What I could never figure out for years and always wondered why, is why Be didn't just release a while back an x86 ram-resident kernel for free that would let people run apps written for BeOS on Windows. It would totally extend the reach of developers and give Be a market. Otherwise the idea of coexistence with Windows is total crap. One manufacturer in Japan (Fujitsu) sold a Be/Win double boot machine once. Who cares if it can only do one processor, that would be the gateway to the Windows market where people only need the faster chips for games and that's not what BeOS is yet about. If you want two processors run Windows in VMWare on BeOS..
Be is right to be worried about Apple hardware, heck even users get burned, repeatedly, like I have been.. and I've been an Apple owner since the II (Integer Basic). They certainly should be able to make an Altivec version, for the G4 machines that are out there now, but they will never get information from Apple about hardware. Apple owes them nothing and is plenty capable of making sure BeOS doesn't run on Apple hardware in the future if they want.
Originally I remember in PR2/R3 days that Be couldn't get documentation on Motorola's supervisor mode which was needed to make BeOS run like BeOS. When the company newsletter talks constantly about the microseconds advantage of one type of semaphore over the other, and gives you real world demonstration of how to own the scheduler in realtime, you have to love it. So BeOS has always been for me like a cheapo Silicon Graphics Machine. It was insanely great and I always got a big smile when I booted up (faster on a Mac 9600MP two years ago than my SuSE on Inspiron 7.5K 40MHz Pentium III laptop does ordinarily now.. with less screen artifacts).
I looked for other domain names that might indicate Be was planning on opening more but didn't find any in a cursory search.. if they would open more of the OS, so that it would actually begin to work with Linux, Be would become *dangerous*.
So I put the Be CVS client onto my Linux laptop last night and wouldn't mind running the OS on this or one of my other older linux macines.. but the real question is why doesn't Be just make a small free modular distro for x86 that you can put onto millions of CDs in popular magazines, or download in minutes from CNet and friends. The kernel is small and was getting smaller aparently for the appliance market, end users could plug and play modules to enable other services or hardware support. It would be cool, like Linux in a 100 mb zip distribution but this would be mere megabytes. Maybe some of those enablers would find their way back into Linux. It would run Be programs reasonably well inside windows. (I do not know if there are major problems with this, but missing the extra CPU for one thing is only a problem for people with two CPUs and irrelevant IMHO). Be would suddenly look as though they had opened the floodgates of Unix inside windows and you could imagine running Windows and Linux apps side by side (though that might just suck if Windows is still really in charge, see the first paragraph.. maybe you could let people run it badly like this but offer to let Windows boot up after Be's kernel so that Windows isn't really in charge). Maybe it could be a GUI shell inside of which Linux code (hell the whole KDE or Gnome environment might fit why not?) could run, maybe superficially prettified. Be could start providing APIs for its widgets and compete with Troll QT and Eazel, they could use the exact same API and totally stomp all .
While it feels like Be will pick up more momentum relatively speaking, and I would seriously consider putting another hard drive into my Inspiron for BeOS to keep perspective on Linux and would like to buy a CD from them again (hell I want them to succeed!) I just don't see the killer strategy yet. Maybe more newbies will consider installing BeOS than Linux on their Windows box but not a guarantee. You need to have some way for Be to get into Windows desktops or they will always be a hobbyist OS. Seems to me Be has squandered the head start they had, and is not taking a big enough step now.
At the moment I don't see the current free BeOS being a huge threat to Apple. If anything I'd say the ex-Apple people at Eazel and the new Linux kernel are big threats to Be. As Linux GUIs get (even just a little) better and realtime slicing in major apps gets (just a little better) there will be a little less edge for Be. These advances will still not approach Be, but just get a little closer. Be will still be far better unless you maybe install the SGI/SuSE journaling file system, someone reinvents some of Be's search capability for Linux, and Linux gets a bit more preemtive so Netscape doesn't hang your computer. Or if Eazel expands, a gnome company hires some great designers, or Apple gets stupid and opens Aqua without lawsuit threats.
Be should realize their current booming announcement is not nearly enough to get the kind of volume of product out there in the time frame they need. Be has already relinquished their software site to someone else (huh?) and if they don't have something to base cashflow on they are finished. They should get more revenue from CD sales, sure. But if they want to coexist with Windows or make a serious play for spreading at a more accelerated rate they need to either make a much more Windows friendly gateway (ram-resident kernel, no need to partition, and Be programs running on Windows as far as the user knows) and/or seriously open up a lot more interface, and put some weight behind getting it used. Obviously Be programs will work better on the BeOS, but there is little percentage in being a prima donna about not letting its apps run unmodified on the windows desktop at all.
Their liscense for the tracker and deskbar *are* insanely great (so what if they got slashdotted last night midway through getting my opentracker CVS client updated). It makes LGPL look wimpy.. its free!
Looking for more of that.
Today's Be Developer newsletter says that large performance enhancements for SIMD capabilities like that in the Pentium III, other new Pentium II scalar performance enhancement, and a total rewrite of the geometry pipeline to support hardware OpenGL acceleration multiple textures (with new OS interface layer), and multiple graphics devices, did not make the FreeBe release.
Will they provide a patch for BeOS the file that is BeOS in a file?..
Apparently there was a backhoe incident at Be so they couldn't get the software out at first. Not a major blow since I took it for slashdotting :)
Be SMP tech has hauled ass for years.
Been dying to have it back as I listen to screeching, popping, clucking mp3 in realplayer for linux. It's worth trying to locate a cd copy and trying it.
I'm not using Windows 9x though, I'm using Windows 2000, which does not disable the second CPU.
I'll give the boot disk a try though... and to think, I was going to pull the floppy drive out of my box because I never use it ;)
szcx
I've finally worked around all the issues with the preview version. I now have a dual-boot Linux/Be system. I have all my Linux partitions automatically mounted on boot, true type fonts work great, my windows partition is now BFS, lilo is working great, and I'm really impressed with the installer. The only problem I'm having with the whole thing is SSH failing to compile even though it's supposed to. Any other ideas on how to make this Be system more Linux-like? (eg XFree86, etc)
Maybe you should have clicked on the "license" link :)
http://opentracker.org/license.html
Basically the BSD license. Do anything. Go nuts. Include the copyright. No warranties.
I think it's along the lines of Linux on a UMSDOS partition, with a Windows icon to launch everything.
The free version of Be installs on your C: drive, reserving space for a filesystem image, and creating a pretty Windows icon.
When you start the free version of Be from your desktop, it pushes Windows out of the way, and takes over the operation of your computer (aka WinLinux). So, it's really not "running under" Windows.
BeOS is a full-fledged operating system, for PowerPC and Intel systems. The full-fledged version of BeOS boots natively, and has its own native filesystem.
I don't think Be is releasing their source anytime soon.
I found these rather fun constant definitions in BarApp.h (part of the open source deskbar). They are used for the hidden menu that allows one to select the style of the windows border.
Be does that sometimes. Here's the enum they use for platforms (read through them!):
typedef enum {
B_BEBOX_PLATFORM = 0,
B_MAC_PLATFORM,
B_AT_CLONE_PLATFORM,
B_ENIAC_PLATFORM,
B_APPLE_II_PLATFORM,
B_CRAY_PLATFORM,
B_LISA_PLATFORM,
B_TI_994A_PLATFORM,
B_TIMEX_SINCLAIR_PLATFORM,
B_ORAC_1_PLATFORM,
B_HAL_PLATFORM
} platform_type;
is_computer_on_fire has got to be my favorite function of all time. I've actually seen Linux logs with:
lpr: Printer on fire?
I hadn't seen is_computer_on before, though. I love an OS with a sense of humor.
errr, Be is not tring to compete with Windows and MacOS for the desktop pc. they are focusing on webpad OS named Stinger, hence, they are giving away their desktop os for free. your logic makes no sense.
Sorry for the lateness of the reply...
You could try to use VESA mode to get something better than 640x480. Instructions are in the FAQ, I believe. A quick search should find it none the less.
is that Be is trying to get us to wet our appetite for the main product by offering a limited version to try for free. Hey, it's a good strategy for me, I would never shell out the $50+ bux to test out BeOS when I got Win2k and Linux already. But now I can check it out for free, and who knows?
-rt-
** Evil Canadians are taking over the world. Learn about the conspiracy
What the hell, it only supports two network cards? In the network configuration thing, it only lets you add a "NE2000 compatible ISA" or "3com EtherLink II 503 ISA" card. Where's the PCI support?
Find out what's new in BeOS 5 in the Latest Release Features.
Before downloading and installing BeOS 5 Personal Edition, please read the Readme file for important information.
Mirrors are already posted. Have fun ...
Q: How large of a BFS partition will I get?
A: The 40MB download decompresses to a 500MB file in your Windows partition, into which the Be File System and BeOS is installed. Because BeOS 5 Personal Edition must reside on your C: drive, you'll need at least 600MB free on C:
About your ATI All In Wonder card. The TV isn't
supported with the default TV application for ATI but
there is an application on bebits.com called
ATI TV (or something similar, just search for it).
It may work with your card. Hope this helps.
>Don't be so reactionary, I'm not saying Be is "evil", just not as good as Linux
Assuming the above was not a troll, I'd be interested to hear what your support is for that statement. What do you see about Linux as being better than BeOS specifically?
Try creating an iso image with the right el-torito image and burning it to CD. You can do _that_, can't you?
"The romance of Silicon Valley was about money - excuse me, about changing the world, one million dollars at a time."
Visit
Yeah - and both be and linux players use mpg123 or amp. Same difference. Thing is, it works _better_ on be. And damn near perfect SMP - double your performace!
"The romance of Silicon Valley was about money - excuse me, about changing the world, one million dollars at a time."
Visit
Well, have fun.
"The romance of Silicon Valley was about money - excuse me, about changing the world, one million dollars at a time."
Visit
If you read in kernel/OS.h past that (not sure if it's there in R5), you'll find two functions:
int is_computer_on(void);
and
double is_computer_on_fire(void);
"The romance of Silicon Valley was about money - excuse me, about changing the world, one million dollars at a time."
Visit
Be is one of those incredibly conscientious software houses that is becoming more and more rare, these days. From a Quality Assurance point of view, there is no better desktop operating system.
First, the installation is as painless as it gets. Just follow the instructions, put the image file where they tell you, prep a boot floppy, and reboot. There is no clucking about which drivers, irqs, scanlines, etc. It comes up in 640x480x8x60hz, and you can immediately change resolutions. It is an act of frustration when I come back to Windows or Linux to install, and having to think about these things. This was also mostly true for R4.5, although you had to tell it which NIC you have.
Secondly, from a user interface point of view, the quality of BeOS is very apparent. It reacts quickly to the user, placing a high importance on the User Interface server, which handles input events. This is unlike most other OS's, which consider the user to be the slowest part of the system, and give them scraps of time, inbetween more important things, like sleeping.
Finally, the OS design of BeOS is very, very tight. Once you accept that BeOS is not meant to be the next Unix, and accept that innovation occasionally means jettisoning cruft, you will find that underneath this pretty facade is one /very/ customizable system. Take the Be Filesystem, for example. The ability is there to define custom attributes for files, giving the ability to build database-like indexes of a mail directory, for instance, or perhaps an archive of MP3s, and save queries into that index as a new kind of directory. It's fully journaled, which is one of the reason it seems to come up so fast, and why BeOS users are rarely afraid to turn off their computers at night. I know it isn't Open Source, and it may offend the Linux Zealots, with its You-do-it-this-way simplicity, but please, do not judge BeOS until you have downloaded R5 personal, and tried it for yourself. You only have 60 megs of diskspace to lose, and and entire world to gain.
Weapons of Mass Analysis
How early was the release? The tracker has evolved quite a bit, since the Developer Preview days. Mostly adding various configurability options.
If you are comparing this to the MacOS finder.. Let me engage in a little trolling. Can we said multithreaded? ;) Copying a file doesn't hang the tracker. Or slow down the interface, anywhere else.
Weapons of Mass Analysis
If anyone actually can download BeOS, you'll probably want to find out more about it. I'm not affiliated with this site but www.benews.com is the place to find out the latest info about BeOS. It's inspired by slashdot and its a lot more useful than the www.be.com site.
Forget free.be.com, just click here.
I'm downloading a file called BeOS5-PersonalEdition.exe from one of the mirrors, but its only 11Mb. I thought it was supposed be 60Mb? What's going on?
Just a little tidbit:
From the FAQ section, tt looks like this version must be installed on your windows C: drive, and you must have at least 500 MB free on that drive for it.
Seems a little restrictive to me. I know i don't have 500MB free space laying around on my C: drive.
nt
.oO0Oo.
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
So what you are saying is the Windows users are idiots, and only idiots should use BeOS?
Maybe you are right, the free *nix community doesn't need idiots like that.
Lars -
It's missing some stuff that audio and video pros (or amateurs :) might want, but it's a pretty complete desktop OS. If you want more space, you can mount a FAT drive and store stuff there, or use the included DriveSetup tool to make a 'real' BFS partition. Then follow some of the links on the FreeBe desktop...
try the 'bootman' command this installs the BeOS boot manager, which will boot windows, linux, bsd, and of course BeOS
No, it can be installed on the root of any partition (FAT or ext2 or ntfs) in /beos/
I love open source Nazi's. Who the hell do you think you are telling anyone to do anything with their source code? You're as bad as the RIAA. If Be, doesn't wish to release their much sought after source, then it is their perogative. Let's not be overly naive here, all corporations utlimately care first and foremost about their financial report; they are after all businesses. RedHat might appear to display a noble support for the open source community but aren't they really just looking out for the interests of their customer base? Donating 10 gazillion dollars to the Mozilla project has much less to do with altruism and much more to do with plain old fashioned business sense when you are running a linux distribution eager to conquer the desktop market. -Paul
BeOS 5.0 Personal Edition is about to be launched to the public at the main site in a number of minutes from what I can gather. What's most intersting, is the file there named "BeOS4Linux.tar.gz". This would indicate that Be will be allowing BeOS 5 Personal Edition to not only be installed/run on top of Windows, but also on Linux systems, yet this was not announced in any of the pre-release information. Anyway, good luck to everyone trying to download it, and if you wish to read documentation such as hardware compatability lists and the like, you may want to try http://www.beeurope.com/ instead, to prevent the Be.com web servers getting hammered to the point where they are unaccessable.
If your machine uses an S3Trio chipset, don't bother downloading (at least for now). On this page of the "Be for Intel FAQ,"
7 .html
http://www.be.com/support/faqs/faqs/be_faq-0002
you will find that support for the Trio set has been dropped. The driver included with release 5 is unsupported and unstable.
I tried. Grey Screen of Death. Booting in Safe Video Mode only got me as far as the BSoD.
Oh, well. Guess I'll convert that brand new shiny partition over there into another Penguin Condo.
maker
itbwtcl
My Take. I downloaded BeOS. Freaking impressive for something Free. Free Development tools, Okay nothing new there we all have gcc on our Linux and BSD Boxen. The one thing I really tried that impressed me was opening about 20 Mp3's and the GUI Was massively responsive under like a million load. (Like NetBSD, which uses a hacked version of X I have seen a NetBSD machine load like 5 or 6 still responsive as ever :-). Anyways Awesome stuff. Worth playing with at least its free! :-)
the counter says zero and I tried a couple of hours ago from there and couldn't....
Do you? That's the definition of a kernel, not a microkernel. A microkernel is more like Mach, a truly generic, very very small kernel, upon which one or multiple servers run, either in kernel space or somewhere in between kernel and user, that provide standard services. In fact, Linus himself once stated that he doesn't like microkernels; then his OS probably doesn't use one...
Just started to dwl the BeOS4Linux from the sunet.se mirror-site, when the download canceled. The BeOS4Linux was removed!
Anywhere I can get my filthy hands on it now?
Bjarne
But then again, there is a lot of software available for BeOS, and more coming out each day. With it being available for free now, I'm sure we'll see a lot more coders stepping up and writing up faster/better software for this platform.
Then again, (I hate to compare such a great OS like BeOS to Windows, but..) how many of us who use Windows (grr) go through and remove all those extras?
I know I do. I like software choice, personally.
As I just read in the Readme.txt, Free BeOS has some really serious limitations:
- It's a 512 Mb file. No more, no less. No partitioning. Just a file.
- It doesn't support SMP. Just 1 processor. Not nice, since I run dual and want to know if they really are as multithreaded as they say.
I guess that's it then. No try-out for me.
That is all
My one question is that Be can be a stand-alone operating system, but can also be run on top of windows. This is where I start to get confused. Now I loaded winlinux2000 on my computer and it said it loaded on top of windows when in reality it's just a FAT32 install of what looks like redhat that requires loadlin to get it up and going.
So is BeOS a windows/mac shell or is it an operating system? ... BTW did Be announce source code release?
Ignore the "p2p is theft" trolls, they're just uninformed
Sure, reiserfs, ext3, XFS, and JFS all have journaling, but what does that have to do with attributes, queries, and node monitoring? (which, as far as I can tell, is what Brian was talking about)
when i got r5 from download.com and the counter said zero
lose != loose
i just d/l r5 and it is awsome and you cant beat the price
lose != loose
I don't know why, but xs4all, has a copy ftp://dl.xs4all.nl/pub/mirror/Beos/BeOS5-PersonalE dition.exe and it's downloadable! go get it!
Joe Soap doesn't want to have to fdisk his HDD or use a risky application like FIPs to get enough space to install the prorgam. Think about it: You're Joe Soap. You're running Windows 98. Now, you've heard about this Beos thing. But your HDD, say a 6gb for argument's sake, is full of Windows 98. What would be easier for Joe Soap? And note, I'm not saying easy as in idiot-proof etc, I'm talking about time. Despite what many of the people on this forum undoubtedly think about the average user, the average user isn't always clueless. In fact, the man on the street has probably, at some point, installed and run Linux. A few of the people on the street, myself included, have even tried FreeBSD and OpenBSD on their Intel boxen. But the man on the street is busy. He wants to try this thing, but he doesn't want to repartition his drive. Of course, in this respect I'm lucky. I have a few boxen always lying around that I can use for experimentation. What I figure I'll do if they ever do release this thing, is download the ISO, make a CD, and boot it on an empty box (ie, has a disk(s) with no defined partitions). And I'll take a look at it. Seriously. Because I believe in assessing all options. I won't just say: "Oh, French. Bleh." Or..."Oh. Microsoft. Bleh." Or..."Oh...BSD...Bleh." The point is, if you had a 6gb HDD with 3gb free, but all on one big partition, what would you do? backup everything, repartition, and reinstall Windows, Linux, etc, or install the darn thing using this method they've got of encapsulating a filesystem within a file? Exactly! Thanks:)
no sig
Cept for the fact that you can actually download various Linux distributions. Seems that the folks at Be haven't figured out the art of organisation. Some folks would say that makes them a disorganized company. Err - I dunno really. We'll have to see if they ever actually do release their OS. WHEN, I meant WHEN :)
no sig
As far as I can tell, every site that offers Be 5 or Be software is down or unreachable, despite there being an enormous amount of mirrors. Does this mean that everyone and their mom is downloading BeOS + Apps now? It would seem that way..which means that the chances of Linux gaining a stronghold on the desktop market have just been dealt a very strong blow. I managed to get Be up and running in 5 minutes, four of which where needed to unpack the archive, restart Windows (which really does feel like Windoze now). Soundcard detected, connected to the Internet (yup, I'm typing this in NetPositive) and all. The first time I installed Linux it took me more than five HOURS to get everything working. Actually, more like five days before I got the WinModem and SBLive to work. I guess as far as an end-user is concerned, Be is superior. I'm not talking about servers and such, for which Linux still can't be beat, but as far as desktop machines are concerned, Bill Gates needs to be very, Very afraid.
News and bla for computer musicians: http://lomechanik.net/
BeOS 5 Personal Edition can be downloaded from Download.com. I was the first person to download it from there based on the download counter.
BigCat79
"The dead have risen and are voting Republican!" --Bart Simpson
Guys, I don't think it's been released yet. The page is the same coming soon page that's been there for weeks.
Maybe Be will put it up later today, but as of 8:15 am, nothing's there.
The first, last, and only tech news site on the net
ftp://ftp.sunet.se/pub/os/BeOS/ - The file is only about 1.6 megs. I'm guessing its a broken file..or..BeOs lite maybe?
The first, last, and only tech news site on the net
I was able to create a bootable 5 Gig Personal Beos Installation! A) Boot BeOS Personal under Linux or Windows B) Create a new BeOS Partition of any size on yer hard disk somewhere. C) Mount the Beos4Linux image file via loopback. (mount image.be /someplace) D) Copy all the files in the image to your big partition. E) Reboot with floppy.img disk :) P.S. - I bet dual procs will work too! P.S.S - does anybody know how to make a BFS bootable? (ie. "belo" or something?)
Looks like we'll have to wait some more for a decent (Linux/XWindows) GUI...
I would look seriously into BeOS if I can use all those GNU stuff.
IIRC, Be says they consider every release since R3 to be a complete end-user version of the OS. They've just decided to use the terminology Release X.X rather than Version X.X - there will _never_ be a BeOS Version 1.0
The developer releases were _called_ developer releases. The preview releases were _called_ preview releases. It may be your opinion that later releases were not complete, but Be's naming scheme clearly indicates their position.
The reason I want BeOS for multimedia: http://www.n2it.net/finalscratch/index. html
FinalScratch for BeOS = DJ dream
Who on earth are not trying to download it. Damn, took me 2 hours to find it. I got it running and the rest.
What about the Pro version? No Java or Flash plug-in or even the final version of the Opera browser.
I already have switch from Windows to BeOS and Linux, I wonder if I wlll not finish my migration formating also my bfs partition
--- Bouh !!! ---
You are absolutely right! ...with youre comment. I cannot understand why they dumped of the good old dos into oblivion. In the 15 years of its existence they were not able to modernize it. Dont dare saying that Win95 is an improvement! Well, lets see... now i wanna go to this BeOS stuff and check it out. See ya
SO....How many of the parts of YOUR computer come from union or worker owned factories....Or even get paid a couple dollers a day.
Isn't interesting how so many of computer parts come from "the third world".
And IF you DO boycott them so they don't get any money how are they going to survive...and that leads to the situations that puts people like Hitler & Stalin in charge.
So no I do not belive in boycotts unless there is a viable alternitve...
S.
Yes I can not spell...Wait....for a second there I almost cared.
Doubtful for the 722c. It's a win-printer. Bah. Humbug.
I don't like fish. Reverse the fish to e-mail.
I've installed BeOS 5 on two different computers tonight and I've have Tracker lock-up on me three times. One time I could kill Tracker, the other two time I had to turn it completely off. This is first experiecne with Be. Other than the freezes, I really like it. Kindda like Mac Unix (as contradictory as it may sound).
Man oh man do I love the geniuses that post here.
Don't feer the trolls.
I found these rather fun constant definitions in BarApp.h (part of the open source deskbar). They are used for the hidden menu that allows one to select the style of the windows border.
:)
const uint32 msg_Win95 = 'Bill';
const uint32 msg_Amiga = 'Ncro';
const uint32 msg_Mac = 'WcOS';
const uint32 msg_Be = 'Tabs';
I've thrown a copy of the files on one of my machines at http://house.ofdoom.com/be/
Oops! Why did I keep mentioning LOADLIN when I quite blatantly meant LILO! Uggh! Flashback to 1995!
On another note, thanks for the personal email I received concerning GAG:
"You posted on Slashdot about the problems of booting all those operating
systems. Well, I use a graphical boot manager called GAG, which I found at
Freshmeat. In its readme it says:
GAG
GRAPHICAL BOOT MANAGER
GAG is a Boot Manager program, this is, a program that is loaded when the
computer is turned on and allows to choose the operating system you want
to use. Its main features are:
-Allows to boot up to 9 different operating systems.
-Can boot operating systems instaled in primary and extended
partitions. Them can be instaled in any hard disk too.
-GAG doesn't need its own partition. It installs itself in the
first track of the hard disk, wich is reserved for this kind of
programs. It can also be instaled in a floppy disk, without using
the hard disk.
-Has a timer to boot a default operating system (selectable by
the user).
-The configuration menu can be protected with a password. Also,
each operating system can be protected with its own password.
-The program works in graphic mode (needs a VGA or better graphic
card), and has a lot of icons.
-Hides the primary partitions, allowing the installation of more
than one DOS and/or Windows in the same hard disk.
-Can exchange disk drives, allowing to boot from the second, third...
hard disk operating systems such as MS-DOS.
-Has the SafeBoot system, that allows to boot your hard disk even if
GAG is accidentally overwrited.
I think this addresses some of your issues."
Okay, I'm running out of options. I currently have:
Disk 0:
WinNT - 4GB
Win98 - 3GB
+ Various other partitions at the end of the disk
Disk 1:
/boot (Linux) - 24MB
Win2K Advanced Server - 4GB
Win2K Professional - 4GB
+ Various other partitions at the end of the disk
Yes, I have lots of MS operating systems as I have to test the products I develop under various environments. For various reasons I can't add any more disks.
So the question is in the days of 40GB hard drives, do I have to put the boot stuff for an OS within the first 1024 cylinders? Or is that a LOADLIN problem and I should be looking for something different?
Linux is the only OS I don't have a problem with. I can put the kernel image where I want (i.e. in an partition that is a few blocks in size rather than with the GB of other data).
Is it possible to boot using LOADLIN from a logical/extended partition? That seemed a limitation when I looked about a year ago. Otherwise, I can only have 6 OSes installed before I'm forced into making them share a partition (which seems foolish to me, especially when it comes to Windows).
yeah? what'd you have for lunch? dead cow? chicken flesh?
disgusting creature, you.
You can find it here.
I've found that it works nicely with Linux. Just uncompress the archive to /beos, dd the floppy, and reboot.
To boot the image.be Personal Edition partition image, place it at in a directory called 'beos' at any root point on a ext2 partition. ex, /beos/image.be, or if you have /home on a seperate partition, it could be placed at /home/beos/image.be
Then create a boot floppy from floppy.img, and reboot! (try dd if=floppy.img of=/dev/fd0 bs=512 conv=sync; sync )
This configuration is provided for your enjoyment, and is NOT supported by Be, Inc. Please don't ask us for help and support on making this work
-rw-rw-rw- builder/users 538 2000-03-27 22:55:36 readme
-r--r--r-- builder/users 1474560 2000-03-29 02:23:56 floppy.img
-rw-rw-rw- builder/users 524288000 2000-03-28 11:17:18 image.be
Especialy the date on floppy.img is nice. BeOS the OS of the near feature.
This article on BeNews describes how to work around the "limitations" of the FreeBe package. I haven't yet looked to see if the CD image has been posted yet, but if you install from that, you can create a full-fledged BFS partition, without size limitations. And if you boot from it, or from a boot floppy, SMP will be enabled. It's only disabled in the Win9x-based bootloader. <sarcasm>Thanks, Microsoft, for disabling that "extraneous" processor!</sarcasm>
I've read through BeNews' preview, and the only thing that really stands out among missing features (compared to the boxed version) is the MP3 codec, because of licensing issues, naturally. Other than that, everything works. It just takes more work if you won't or can't run things from Win9x.
Every day we're standing in a wind tunnel
Facing down the future coming fast - Rush
This sig intentionally left blank.
True enough. When you get down to it, Linux is more or less a Unix lookalike.
:>
The only thing that is really 'leading edge' is that it is extremely open (beer and speech-wise), which means it actually has a chance to take over a lot of marketshare.
Even cooler, while Linux still has a ways to go, it has improved at a very rapid pace. Give it a couple years and we'll see some cool stuff - after everyone is done reimplementing stuff done by other operating systems, at least.
- Jeff A. Campbell
- VelociNews (http://www.velocinews.com)
- Jeff
-jwb
all they are making avalible is a trial version. it's full fetured as far as the OS goes, (AFAICT) but it doesnt have all teh extras. they are also relasing a full version, which they will charge for. (probably less than full price if you baught a prevoius version)
Any sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology
I should take that last remark back. Tanenbaum was regarded as arrogant and insular, but as far as I know, he never descended to accusing his rivals of academic dishonesty...
I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
Much of that improvement would require improving X. Like antialiasing and making color management *actually* work (X in theory supports color profiles, I've never seen it implemented). Good luck getting any of that in.
I just like BeOS because it puts the lie to Linus's uninformed and defamatory ranting about microkernels.
I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
http://www.linuxworld.com/linuxworld/lw-1999-03
This person calls the OS research community either intellectually dishonest or, and this just kills me, stupid or deluded. This from a guy who implemented SMP with a global kernel lock (that still exists, it's just masterfully hidden under several layers of macros)
Tanenbaum *would* be proud: Linus has become just like him.
I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
I've got it almost done, does anyone have a place to mirror it at? If so, I can give them a fast download, I just can't get slashdotted.
e-mail me: seth.bokelman@uni.edu
ICQ: 6497760
---
When in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout. --Robert A. Heinlein
I found a Tucows mirror out of Edmonton, Alberta, Canada (at least I think it's in Edmonton). I was getting 300-350 kbps download. And am currently running it. My network card was setup seemlessly. A click on a configure button, followed by use DHCP, and voila. My little scrolly wheel on the mouse worked right away, and it detected my Creative Voodoo Banshee perfectly (1280x1024x32 bit goodness). Everything seems to work perfectly.
I haven't downloaded the development stuff to check it out yet, but will soon. Everything looks very promising. The browser works flawlessly so far, and the text isn't too small.
BeOS is now available. Better get in quick...
Apparently, the connection from their offices to their servers has been cut.
New release time is marked for 9 AM EST (6 AM PST).
I find it funny that, althouth in their install README, and other documents they mention that BeOS 5 free edition can only install to a 500 meg container file, and that it is limited to single processor, and that you should upgrade to the pro version in order to support these things.
It appeared to support my dual processor box just fine (I did use a boot disk).
It also appears to allow you to migrate it to a different filesystem if you wish.. one that's bigger.
Now I could be wrong.. but the features not 'supported' in this version seem only to describethe installer behavior, and not the functions of the kernel itself.
Well. I just know lots of unix guru wannabes are going to scream about how "BE sux! Linux rules! Be doesn't do blah blah blah".
I must say, I was excited to get my hands on the free edition today. I've always wanted to have a good hard look at BE. I find a few things that threw me off though.
1) The installation notes indicate that SMP is not supported, but it appeard to work just fine on my SMP box (even showing both processors in Pulse).
2) The installation notes indicate it is limited to a 500 MB installation. This may be true of the installer, but is definately not true once it is installed. You could migrate it to a pure BE partition, or whatever, of whatever size you want.
Neither point #1 or point #2 seem to be actual restrictions in the software... just the way the installer works. If this is the case, it seems kind of sleazy to suggest that if you want to do either of these things, you should buy the Professional version. That's not how the crowd they need to attract works.
3) No GeForce support. Yes. I know. What do they say on the newsgroups? "Write it yourself then!". Well.. sorry guys, but if Be wants to get more mindshare by introducing this free distribution (which is cool! don't get me wrong), it would REALLY make sense if a 'multimedia' OS supported what may be the most common graphics chipset out there. And why is it that I can't even do 16 bit color by 1024x768? A reference SVGA card driver could even do this.. but for some reason the only thing available is 640x480, B&W.
I certainly won't go out and purchase another graphics card just to use BE.
You'll note that there's a .tgz with the filesystem image
and README for linux. Conveniently this image will also
act as an install cdrom, should you write it to a CDR using
your favorite cd burning tool (I'd suggest CD Burner in
BeOS 5, but that does present a bit of a chicken-and-egg
problem).
-- Brian
There are two dedicated news sites (like slashdot) dedicated to BeOS.
http://www.benews.com
http://www.beoscentral.com
They should keep a fairly up-to-date scene of what is going on w/the free-be.
In the Graphics card secion:
* These are the code names used for these products while they were under development. They are not actual product names or trademarks. We use them here because many people know the nicknames but not the actual product name. If Intel's lawyers saw us using them, they would start hopping around on one foot with all the pores of their bodies frowning, and then they'd probably make us stop...
-- IANAEG - I am not an elder god.
I'm on ftp.beos.com right now, and the file is there, but I can't download it due to the permissions... Can't even GET ReadMe.txt. Has anyone gotten it yet?
I strongly believe that trying to be clever is detrimental to your health. -- Linus Torvalds
Components of an interface do not a complete GUI make. . .
Getting the Tracker to run with nothing to support it would be like trying to use FVWM w/o X.
A lot of what makes Be's GUI so easy to use is the overall layout of the OS. If you want to rebuild a whole graphics server system and all the other accouterments of a GUI that need to interface with the OS and then place the Tracker on top of that, you might have something.
And notice the license - to distribute or sell your own software based on their source you have to get express permission from Be. They're not going to let the Linux/BSD community take one of the few things that keeps some Linux/BSD users buying their OS. With this recent i-opener situation, I'm sure Be knows that the Linux community has a penchant for screwing over corporations and is therefore making sure to cover their butts over this.
We want Open Backhoes! No more shall we let other people dictate when our fiber will be cut! The community should have the option to review and modify all backhoes to suit their individual needs.
--
Donald Roeber
Donald Roeber
Generating 2048 Bits of Randomness...
So I just got 5.0 installed, and being a 4.5 user, I am not too overly impressed with the "progress." NetPositive still doesnt seem to support Java, JavaScript, etc, and it is still limiting. The best hope is for Mozilla to catch up on BeOS to M14 or beyond. The OS at best should have been a point release, there doesn't seem to be much addition in the way of feature sets, no huge difference in UI, and it seems most of the applications are the same that came with 4.5.2. I don't consider the ability to run off a fat partition that impressive. It's still smoking as always. The OS is crisp and clean, but it's like moving into a nice new house with no way to move furniture in. It's beautiful and empty!
http://209.15.80.234/bekarma/mirror.html
http://www.be.com/products/freebeos/
---
How am I supposed to fit a pithy, relevant quote into 120 characters?
I managed to d/l freebe5 today from a german mirror, though I had to use gozilla to retry a few times. Once connected I got 60k/s. It's a 43mb file. It's compressed with winzip and barely compressed - kind of a waste. When you install it puts a few files at letter:/BeOs. One is a 512mb file called image.be. So prepare to have lots of room to unzip the installer and for the installer to run, then 500mb+ to install it. Once installed you just click it, it reboots to dos mode and loads - except it hung on me, so I had to make the boot floppy. Using that, it loaded in under one minute. Now let me tell you what amazed me right away. It came up in 640x480x8 and a welcome message telling you to set your time, video, and network. I set my network to hdcp and it came up right away, I tried netpositive and was able to browse, and boy it's FAST! With my cable modem, it was faster than linux/netscape or ie/netscape on win98 or win95, and even faster than opera/win95. I'm talking loading news.com about as fast as I can blink, under 1 second. And this wasn't even using a web proxy or increasing the # connections, which I suggest you do under preferences. The other thing you need to know is click the BEOS logo to get access to your apps and preferences (where network etc is). It doesn't tell you this in the welcome screen. Also right click and select mount and you can easily access your other hard drives. Next I tried playing mp3, avis, mpgs and was impressed, they all played even compressed avi's. But I found mpg's used 100% cpu on a celeron 300 ;( Try running the pulse application to see. Another thing I noticed - no disk activity. Everything loads lightening fast compared to win98, pretty well instant. Now I have to expand on the boot process being fast, because it installed and used all my drivers automatically, I didn't have to do a thing and it *worked* right away, unlike windows which takes forever to find and install drivers and asks you dumb questions along the way, and has to reboot 3 or 4 times. There basically was no installation for this OS! Just load and run. Everything worked, let me tell you what I have: ATI all in wonder pro, 4mb, I got this running in 1024x768x32 now. I tried the tv application but it didn't work, so I guess that's out. No video in devices were listed either. Diamond MX300 sound card based on vortex 2. I can hear sounds faintly, something weird going on here cause the mixer sliders work and have effect. Maybe it mixed up the out jacks and I have to use line out 1 (this card has 4 speakers). Yes! I just tested it and that's the problem. For the record use out 1, the far right connector. I have an adaptec 2902e scsi, a weird oem model based on aic-7850 chipset, which works fine. The scsi probe showed my teac 4x CDR. I was able to mount audio cd in my toshiba dvd. I can see my fat32 partitions in my win98 disks. My network card is a d-link 528ct which is ne2000 compatible I think. All my devices are pci. But my radio card and winmodem and hollywood plus don't work, which I didn't expect anyhow. There's not a whole lot of applications to play with, so you'll be downloading more. Overall I am very impressed with it, if I had all the applications I generally use for it (icq, web browsing, mp3, video, wordprocessing, some games and programming) I would use it all the time - given that it's incredibly fast, easy to use and stable. And I have 6 cards in my machine and no conflicts! It's a bx board, celeron 300a, 96mb ram, acer ax6bc brand board. 3 hard drives, scsi cd-r, ide dvd-rom. Haven't tried burning a disk yet but it's supposed to work. One more thing - not all websites work, I tried a secure site and it just failed, also had some complaints about javascript not enabled, but the failure could also be related to java as the secure site immediately loads a java applet. Obviously slashdot is working fine and I could post this message. Try www.tomshardware.com - it looks messed up at first but wait for it to download and it will correct itself.
Their OS with the database journaling filesystem, fast bootups and good multimedia support is a valid alternative OS especially for the desktop space that alot of Linux evangelists lust after right now.
It is not the fact that the OS is inferior. The company is finally slowly but surely waking up to the fact that making people pay for the OS is fool's way of making money.
If you had said that they did not go far enough I would sincerely agreed. However, you don't move mountains all at once. Corporations like mountains move slowly sometimes. One day soon I predict that you will see them open up the code of their product.
There have been some very good reviews of this OS in more than a few Alternative/Free OS type websites. I don't carry URLs like weapons around but do the searches. Once this thing is open sourced and the community can improve the code we will be the better for it. However, you do not insult a child for running after they made their first steps. That sort of zealotry marks our community and makes us all luck bad.
ACK
BeOSCentral is kinda only half-there these days.
BeGroovy has more-or-less taken over the niche of funky, chatty news site.
BeNews has a full review of R5 Pro and Free up now.
Yabel (Yet Another BeOS Link) has a nice RDF index of the top news from most of the major BeOS sites.
Huh? Linux is not a micro-kernel based OS. MacOS X, the Hurd, and NeXTOS are, but not Linux.
The question should be, how can they compete against a free as in source OS like Linux. Their answer is to make Be free as in beer. Time will tell if it works, but I'm really not sure that Be and Linux are competitors in the first place. Not many people would use Be as a server OS and, on the flip side, not many people would use Linux on a desktop. This may change, but I think Be needs to grab some market share on the desktop first before trying to attack Linux.
Therefore, I see this really as an attempt by Be to compete with Windows and MacOS. What better way to get people to try it than to give away a mostly functional version for free? If customers like it, they will come back for the professional version.
Right here...
o r.ftp.be.com/
/pub/beos/
ftp://ftp.be.com/pub/
ftp://ftp.beeurope.com/pub/
ftp://ftp.archive.de.uu.net/pub/systems/BeOS/mirr
ftp://ftp.gbnet.net/pub/be/
ftp://uiarchive.cso.uiuc.edu/pub/systems/be/
ftp://ftp.cdrom.com/pub/beos/
ftp://ftp.lab.kdd.co.jp/Be/
ftp://mirror.nucba.ac.jp/mirror/BeOS/
ftp://gd.tuwien.ac.at/opsys/BeOS/
ftp://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/beos/
BeOS5 Free edition can be found under
A particular cool file is named:
BeOS4Linux.tar.gz
Or we could look @ it figure out what it does well, and then improve our own product (Linux).
Just bycotting something because it does not agree with our poltical views, is pointless.
There is always something to learn.
My 2 cents anyways.
Yes I can not spell...Wait....for a second there I almost cared.
Ok. I normally defend the writers, of the stories, but this time I cannot. Why did you not read the freaking page at free.be.com. It will be available today, but they are on the West Coast of the US and probably wont have it up until this afternoon. Now their site will be down for most of the day as people try to get in to download.
Read the freaking links that you post!!!!!!!!!!
The site is at http://opentracker.org.
;)
The license is the Open Tracker license, but it looks to be almost a version of the BSD license (not familiar with the intimates of the latter, I can't say for sure).
DAMN! Maybe we'll finally get a decent GUI for Linux!
BeOS's got a new logo and the list of the new features is here. Still more detail in here (complete list actually).
God did not appoint us to suffer wrath but to receive salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ --1Thes5:9
Stuck my foot in my mouth, it does require windows to install, at least according to the readme, and is also limited to 512 meg partition for it's "root" though can mount other partitions to use.. The free version is much more crippled then Be had led everyone to believe. But I guess the wording of the FAQ could have gone either way. I'm still curious about the BeOS4Linux.tar.gz file, anyone tried it, I can't get in to download off of any mirror... In any case I wish they had/will release an ISO with fewer limitations.. I can understand leaving out the royalty-laden stuff and leaving out a few features, but if they want to claim a free, fully-functional O/S it should in no way depend on any other O/S for anything and should not be limited to 512 megs, such a restriction truly makes freebe "crippleware". In any case, BeOS itself is great, I still have 4.5.2, and looks like I'll have to stick with it for now.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
- You aren't limited to 500 megs! Yes, the Be-in-a-file can only be that big, but if you set aside a partition (say, 1.5 megs) and format it as BeFS using the Partition Magic version that came with R4, you can install onto that directly using the "Installer" program that comes with FreeBe 5. I'll bet you could format partitions as BeFS using the DriveSetup utility that comes with FreeBe5 too... Check BeNews for details
- You're not limited to one processor! This is a problem only if you launch BeOS 5 directly from Windows, as the second processor is disabled in hardware during the Windows boot sequence. Make a boot floppy and start from there, or install the BeOS Boot manager by running "bootman" in the BeOS shell (Be Menu -> Applications -> Terminal
... Bash, whee)
In fact, you can install BeOS 5 overtop of your existing 4.5.2 partition and it will boot without any problems... Or at least none that I've found yet while typing this post in the new NetPositive!Wah!
> Be are simply doing this for marketing reasons
> and not from any type of kindess or good-will.
Of course they are. BeOS is a commercial product, still fairly new on the scene. Most people only know of Microsoft. Be would certainly do anything to give them an edge over the crew at Redmond. And, in my opinion, they have done the best thing that they could do. By releasing a fully functional version of their OS as free for personal use, they are gaining a massive audience and potential customer base (that is, everyone in the world whose ears perk up at the prospect of getting something for free).
This, however, is only the beginning. Once people see the basic version in action, things will begin to happen. So-called "power users" will get curious about the bells and whistles available in the for-sale version... those who are really impressed will buy a copy to show their support (and to fund further development)... those steeped in the hyper-commercial eighties/nineties/naughties culture will buy a copy because the freebie "feels wrong to them", or some similar nonsense... and when the CEO, CIO, or CFO sees what h[is/er] kid has downloaded, starts playing with it, and likes it... BeOS might find its way onto quite a few desktops in the business space as well.
> They realise that their OS is regarded as an
> inferior product with little support and a very
> small user base, and as such are trying to
> increase their share of the OS market through
> this publicity stunt.
Who have you been talking to? By all accounts that I've heard, BeOS is a well-designed and well-implemented OS that has made astounding progress in such a short time. Of course its user base is small compared to, say, Microsoft's... but that is why Be is using this marketing tactic (or "publicity stunt", as you misjudge it).
> Until Be show that they are truly commited to
> the community by releasing the source code for
> BeOS then I think we should boycott this as we
> should any other closed-source product. If we
> blindly rush to download BeOS then you are
> tacitly supporting closed-source applications
> and OSes, and thus harming the open-source
> movement.
Be is NOT committed to the [open-source] community. They are committed to developing, producing, and marketing their product, as is any commercial venture. At least Be is choosing to do it by developing a quality product and increasing its visibility to as wide an audience as possible. Certain other companies take much easier ways out (e.g. leveraging monopoly power to push low-quality product).
Everything has its place, ye zealot. Supporting a quality product, even if it is closed-source, is not harming the Open Source movement.
Lighten up.
--LordEq
Americas: /freebe/ - BeForever, Omaha, NE
http://www.zdnet.com/ - Ziff-Davis, North America
http://download.cnet.com/ - CNET/Download.com, California
ftp://.beoscentral.com/pub/ - BeOS CentralJohnson City, TN
http://freebe.nerdygirls.com/ - Oak Ridge, TN
ftp://www.beforever.com/pub/beforever
ftp://mirrors.rochester.rr.com/pub/be/ - RoadRunner.Com, Rochester, NY
ftp://ftp.be.com/pub/beos/ - Be, Inc. San Jose, CA
Europe/Australia: /beos/ - ComputerChannel, Hamburg, Germany
ftp://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/beos/ - AARNet, Brisbane, Australia
ftp://ftp.beeurope.com/pub/ - BeEurope, Paris, France
ftp://ftp.worldonline.fr/ - World Online, Paris, France
ftp://ftp.gigabell.net/pub/beos/ - Gigabell.Net, Frankfurt, Germany
ftp://ftp.ph-freiburg.de/pub/m irrors/ftp.be.com/beos - P.H. Freiburg, Freiburg, Germany
http://www.computerchannel.de/download
ftp://ftp.xtdnet.com/pub/ - XTDNet, Karlsruhe, Germany
ftp://ftp.zdf.de/pub/ - Neues-3Sat Online, Mainz, Germany
http://pcteor1.mi.infn.it/beos/ - Univ. of Milan, Milan, Italy
ftp://dl.xs4all.nl/pub/ - XS4All, Amsterdam, Netherlands
ftp://ftp.sunet.se/pub/os/BeOS/ - SUNET, Uppsala, Sweden