No, I believe the article stated that Yahoo! was getting the bandwidth for "free". That is, Yahoo! is its own national network with POP's in all the big cities. Yahoo! is like an ISP, but unlike an ISP, Yahoo! did not sell transit. The only point of their network was to peer with large ISP's. They would drop in a router and get as many ISP's to connect their POP's to their router for free.
The difference today is that Netflix has a lot more data. A LOT more. Gone are the days of simple web sites. Depending on the size of the ISP that router and interface port might cost a heck of a lot of money. They might even have to upgrade the routers within their network. As demand for things like Netflix grows, the cost of that equipment grows. For what? Just so their customers can get Netflix? They think to themselves, "Why upgrade that port?" Customer start complaining to Netflix. The solution? Let Netflix (or Cogent) pay for the router/port. Seems fair to me. In the mean time, customers have to complain loud enough to get something done.
Not all content providers have this kind of network. Netflix is not Yahoo! or Google. They used Cogent to do all the work for them. In some ways that is better. If I was a small start up that was going to launch a new streaming service, I know where I would place my servers for good connectivity to Comcast. I'd place them in a Cogent colo!
Since the beginning of peering, the rules have always been that if you have roughly the same amount of traffic inbound and outbound, peering has no charge.
That must have been *very* early on. I remember reading an article in the late 90's that stated that Yahoo! only payed for half of their total bandwidth requirements. Transit was costing them too much money. So they peered with large ISP's to cut their transit costs. They were connecting eyeballs to content. Both sides of the equation won because ISP's would take traffic off of their transit connection and so did Yahoo!. Yes, it does cost money to peer, but for Yahoo! it saved them money. How is this any different than Netflix? Same deal, eyeballs and content. The difference is that Netflix sends a lot more data. Even more reason that ISP's should want the traffic off of their transit connections.
The scenario with Netflix and ISP's is exactly what I've been describing for years. That is, use congestion on links to beat net neutrality. I would point this out and people would still focus on filtering and shaping. Who needs to filter when an ISP can just peer with a preferred VoIP provider? The link would have plenty of extra capacity and get very good quality of service. No neutrality rules have been broken because the ISP isn't shaping or filtering. They are using the inherit capability of the Internet to route traffic. So did the net neutrality people always see this issue or do they just not understand? Was the goal, all along, to control peering and they just hid their motives?
I've been skeptical of net neutrality because as soon as it was implemented, it wouldn't be "good enough" and they'd move on to more and more control. We all should be very skeptical of the government stepping in to regulate peering.
Peering agreements have been the same forever. As long as there is nearly a 1:1 ratio between the providers, everything is fine. The issue comes up when one side is using more bandwidth than they are giving in return.
Not entirely true. I remember reading an article years and years ago that Yahoo was only paying for half of their total bandwidth usage. At the time Yahoo was generating a lot of traffic. It helped Yahoo and the larger ISP's to bypass their expensive transit links, bypass the backbone, and connect eyeballs to content directly.
Netflix is breaking the long standing status quo. Last I checked, they accounted for ~30% of ALL of the traffic on the internet. Obviously that is going to skew the metrics, and that is why Netflix is trying to push their own CDN. I do not know the particulars there. IMO, if Netflix expects ISPs to pay for their CDN, they are on drugs.
It is a little bit more complicated than this. Netflix uses Cogent. Cogent has pissed off other backbone providers over the years. Netflix is suffering with Verizon because of the relationship with Cogent. Netflix should see if Verizon would be interested in peering with them "directly".
What they should do is run the numbers and figure out what costs more; "overage" charges from Cogent, or eating the cost of paying to deploy their CDN hardware and network links to the other Tier1 ISPs.
Are you suggesting that net neutrality should address situations like this? Are you saying that it is a good idea to have the government force a business to eat the cost of supporting someone else's business model? To me, that sounds like a big fat subsidy for Netflix at the expense of everyone else.
I DO NOT want the government to have any say in this stuff. I would rather the market figure out the details. Yeah, there might be bumps along the road, but I would rather have that than the long arm of government regulation causing stagnation.
Cogent likes to think of themselves as a pure bandwidth company. No frills bandwidth for a great price. No content, no VoIP, nothing. They have colocation data centers, but that came when they purchased a company for their network.
I've been saying this for ages! Even mentioned this here on slashdot. Peering is peering. They are not degrading performance by configuration, they just let the link get congested. How do any of the proposed net neutrality laws address this issue? Answer is, they don't. To me that means that Net Neutrality laws are about something different than neutrality. More likely with government regulation, it becomes Net Control. With that, increased stiffing and limiting reaction to market dynamics, not improving it.
Why would it be illegal to have a saturated peering link? Are you saying that the government would control to whom and what the link speed for each peering link should be?
I'm not saying that the Verizon to AWS link is saturated for this reason. I'm just pointing out that Verizon could handle all traffic in a neutral way to the letter of the law and still have an issue with traffic going to AWS/Netflix. It would be the responsibility of Netflix and Verizon to work out a mutually beneficial agreement that would carry the traffic without congestion between their respective networks. That is exactly how this all works right now.
Yes, it is confusing. It is a reflection of the sad state of affairs with American churches. They should have nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Ayn Rand. Unfortunately people think Ayn Rand aligns with their thinking. Yes, there is *some* overlap. But it is not at all Christian thought. I certainly hope that a majority Christians don't adopt Ayn Rand thinking. Ayn Rand was against charity. Christianity is *for* charity as has been for hundreds of years. Charity without government. True charity, not "charity" with the force of the government. That is what is wrong with charity these days. People expect the government to be the agent of charity when it is incapable of true charity.
I think this is only true because the government has stepped in. If it was only the church's responsibility to take care of the poor then you would see more action. Traditionally, the church is one of the few organizations to take care of the poor... all over the world. Just look at the larger charities, they all have their roots with churches or Christians.
Yes, I know what is happening. Even James Dobson admitted it was a bad approach. Dobson admitted that the gospel took a back seat to the gospel. He is right. The Bible is right. Politics is not above the gospel. I really, really, really hope that some big denominations get this. Politics is rendering to Ceasar. Let the church be the church and take care of the poor and needy. The government does a terrible job at that task.
People take what happened in Israel and try to apply it to the US. That is incorrect. The US is not Israel. The Bible doesn't tell Christians to create a government and force people to live as Christians. It is silent on the issue. It just tells them to go into the world and preach the gospel. No matter what the government is.
BTW, The communal living described in Acts was in the church, not the government.
So as Jesus said (Matthew 22:20-22):
and he asked them, “Whose image is this? And whose inscription?” “Caesar’s,” they replied. Then he said to them, “So give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.”When they heard this, they were amazed. So they left him and went away.
not dying in DevOps
on
Is Ruby Dying?
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
Chef and Puppet are huge in DevOps. It seems Ruby has found its niche.
Isn't it LOW pressure sodium? The low pressure ones have that orange look. They are extremely power efficient, but they give off a narrow spectrum of light. I have heard cops and paramedics hate them because it is hard to tell what is blood, oil, or water spilled on a street.
I'm a Linux systems admin... specifically the hot word these days is "DevOps". I code Ruby/Chef all day. So I flip desktops from web/terminals/email/irc all day. A lot of terminal/ssh stuff. A lot of editing files. I run about 3-5 KVM machines on my desktop box for testing (using virt-manager).
I understand some of the complaints. It get it. But, wow, Gnome is looking really good! It will be interesting to see how this new menu layout works. So far I haven't had any complaints in Gnome 3. I've been using Gnome everyday since it was initially released in the RedHat/Fedora distros. I've had more complaints with the bumps in the road with Fedora over the years than Gnome itself.
I just starting playing with Arch. It's okay, but it is not a solution for serious work. RHEL/CentOS the way to go for serious tasks. RedHat has done a great job writing real management tools that allow an admin to control and manage hundreds of machines. The FreeIPA/RH IDM project itself has be long overdue in the land of Linux. For me, I stick with Fedora on my notebook and RHEL/CentOS on the server. Fedora keeps me up to date with that is on the horizon of RHEL. Fedora has the management tools that other distros lack. I have tons of respect for RedHat. Keep up the good work!
Don't get me wrong, I do like my middle-click paste. If this is due to Wayland, I'm okay with it. I would not be surprised that Wayland removes this most basic function because it is redundant to have more than one type of copy buffer. One of the main reasons for Wayland is to get rid of the crud in X that has built up over the yeas. If that means loosing one of the past buffers, fine with me. People, get over it!
Coal plants have already been shutting down due the fact that natural gas is cheaper. Since we've been building natural gas plants, our carbon emissions are down to 1990's levels. Funny thing, we didn't even sign Kyoto, yet we did better than most (all?) countries in reducing carbon.
I think it is likely placebo. This is the first I've ever heard that people complain about LED lights. On the other hand I *still* hear people complain about fluorescent lights despite the fact that it is pretty rare to find ones driven by magnetic ballasts anymore.
I still hear people complaining about fluorescent lighting despite the fact that CLF's have electronic ballasts that use extremely high frequencies. I could understand the old, old lights that used magnetic ballasts, but CLF's? Really? Seriously? People can see 40,000Hz on a properly working tube bulb? It is not like a monitor with tiny phosphors where I could see the scanning. LED's flicker way more than I ever noticed fluorescent lights. To make matters worse, LEDs are used in many more places! I noticed the flickering from the taillights in newer cars, gadgets, LED equivalent bulbs that dim, etc.
oVirt is part of the RHEV product. RHEV is compared to VMWare. OpenStack is something different, but they both use KVM for virtualization. OpenStack is for computing on demand. RHEV, like VMWare is designed to manage the full life cycle of a OS and application deployment.
Slashdot Mirror
Yup! It is a business problem. I really don't want to see government get involved.
No, I believe the article stated that Yahoo! was getting the bandwidth for "free". That is, Yahoo! is its own national network with POP's in all the big cities. Yahoo! is like an ISP, but unlike an ISP, Yahoo! did not sell transit. The only point of their network was to peer with large ISP's. They would drop in a router and get as many ISP's to connect their POP's to their router for free.
The difference today is that Netflix has a lot more data. A LOT more. Gone are the days of simple web sites. Depending on the size of the ISP that router and interface port might cost a heck of a lot of money. They might even have to upgrade the routers within their network. As demand for things like Netflix grows, the cost of that equipment grows. For what? Just so their customers can get Netflix? They think to themselves, "Why upgrade that port?" Customer start complaining to Netflix. The solution? Let Netflix (or Cogent) pay for the router/port. Seems fair to me. In the mean time, customers have to complain loud enough to get something done.
Not all content providers have this kind of network. Netflix is not Yahoo! or Google. They used Cogent to do all the work for them. In some ways that is better. If I was a small start up that was going to launch a new streaming service, I know where I would place my servers for good connectivity to Comcast. I'd place them in a Cogent colo!
Since the beginning of peering, the rules have always been that if you have roughly the same amount of traffic inbound and outbound, peering has no charge.
That must have been *very* early on. I remember reading an article in the late 90's that stated that Yahoo! only payed for half of their total bandwidth requirements. Transit was costing them too much money. So they peered with large ISP's to cut their transit costs. They were connecting eyeballs to content. Both sides of the equation won because ISP's would take traffic off of their transit connection and so did Yahoo!. Yes, it does cost money to peer, but for Yahoo! it saved them money. How is this any different than Netflix? Same deal, eyeballs and content. The difference is that Netflix sends a lot more data. Even more reason that ISP's should want the traffic off of their transit connections.
The scenario with Netflix and ISP's is exactly what I've been describing for years. That is, use congestion on links to beat net neutrality. I would point this out and people would still focus on filtering and shaping. Who needs to filter when an ISP can just peer with a preferred VoIP provider? The link would have plenty of extra capacity and get very good quality of service. No neutrality rules have been broken because the ISP isn't shaping or filtering. They are using the inherit capability of the Internet to route traffic. So did the net neutrality people always see this issue or do they just not understand? Was the goal, all along, to control peering and they just hid their motives?
I've been skeptical of net neutrality because as soon as it was implemented, it wouldn't be "good enough" and they'd move on to more and more control. We all should be very skeptical of the government stepping in to regulate peering.
You are mixing apples and oranges.
Peering agreements have been the same forever. As long as there is nearly a 1:1 ratio between the providers, everything is fine. The issue comes up when one side is using more bandwidth than they are giving in return.
Not entirely true. I remember reading an article years and years ago that Yahoo was only paying for half of their total bandwidth usage. At the time Yahoo was generating a lot of traffic. It helped Yahoo and the larger ISP's to bypass their expensive transit links, bypass the backbone, and connect eyeballs to content directly.
Netflix is breaking the long standing status quo. Last I checked, they accounted for ~30% of ALL of the traffic on the internet. Obviously that is going to skew the metrics, and that is why Netflix is trying to push their own CDN. I do not know the particulars there. IMO, if Netflix expects ISPs to pay for their CDN, they are on drugs.
It is a little bit more complicated than this. Netflix uses Cogent. Cogent has pissed off other backbone providers over the years. Netflix is suffering with Verizon because of the relationship with Cogent. Netflix should see if Verizon would be interested in peering with them "directly".
What they should do is run the numbers and figure out what costs more; "overage" charges from Cogent, or eating the cost of paying to deploy their CDN hardware and network links to the other Tier1 ISPs.
Are you suggesting that net neutrality should address situations like this? Are you saying that it is a good idea to have the government force a business to eat the cost of supporting someone else's business model? To me, that sounds like a big fat subsidy for Netflix at the expense of everyone else.
I DO NOT want the government to have any say in this stuff. I would rather the market figure out the details. Yeah, there might be bumps along the road, but I would rather have that than the long arm of government regulation causing stagnation.
Cogent likes to think of themselves as a pure bandwidth company. No frills bandwidth for a great price. No content, no VoIP, nothing. They have colocation data centers, but that came when they purchased a company for their network.
I've been saying this for ages! Even mentioned this here on slashdot. Peering is peering. They are not degrading performance by configuration, they just let the link get congested. How do any of the proposed net neutrality laws address this issue? Answer is, they don't. To me that means that Net Neutrality laws are about something different than neutrality. More likely with government regulation, it becomes Net Control. With that, increased stiffing and limiting reaction to market dynamics, not improving it.
Why would it be illegal to have a saturated peering link? Are you saying that the government would control to whom and what the link speed for each peering link should be?
I'm not saying that the Verizon to AWS link is saturated for this reason. I'm just pointing out that Verizon could handle all traffic in a neutral way to the letter of the law and still have an issue with traffic going to AWS/Netflix. It would be the responsibility of Netflix and Verizon to work out a mutually beneficial agreement that would carry the traffic without congestion between their respective networks. That is exactly how this all works right now.
Yes, it is confusing. It is a reflection of the sad state of affairs with American churches. They should have nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Ayn Rand. Unfortunately people think Ayn Rand aligns with their thinking. Yes, there is *some* overlap. But it is not at all Christian thought. I certainly hope that a majority Christians don't adopt Ayn Rand thinking. Ayn Rand was against charity. Christianity is *for* charity as has been for hundreds of years. Charity without government. True charity, not "charity" with the force of the government. That is what is wrong with charity these days. People expect the government to be the agent of charity when it is incapable of true charity.
I think this is only true because the government has stepped in. If it was only the church's responsibility to take care of the poor then you would see more action. Traditionally, the church is one of the few organizations to take care of the poor... all over the world. Just look at the larger charities, they all have their roots with churches or Christians.
Yes, I know what is happening. Even James Dobson admitted it was a bad approach. Dobson admitted that the gospel took a back seat to the gospel. He is right. The Bible is right. Politics is not above the gospel. I really, really, really hope that some big denominations get this. Politics is rendering to Ceasar. Let the church be the church and take care of the poor and needy. The government does a terrible job at that task.
People take what happened in Israel and try to apply it to the US. That is incorrect. The US is not Israel. The Bible doesn't tell Christians to create a government and force people to live as Christians. It is silent on the issue. It just tells them to go into the world and preach the gospel. No matter what the government is.
BTW, The communal living described in Acts was in the church, not the government.
So as Jesus said (Matthew 22:20-22):
and he asked them, “Whose image is this? And whose inscription?” “Caesar’s,” they replied. Then he said to them, “So give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.”When they heard this, they were amazed. So they left him and went away.
Chef and Puppet are huge in DevOps. It seems Ruby has found its niche.
Isn't it LOW pressure sodium? The low pressure ones have that orange look. They are extremely power efficient, but they give off a narrow spectrum of light. I have heard cops and paramedics hate them because it is hard to tell what is blood, oil, or water spilled on a street.
I'm a Linux systems admin... specifically the hot word these days is "DevOps". I code Ruby/Chef all day. So I flip desktops from web/terminals/email/irc all day. A lot of terminal/ssh stuff. A lot of editing files. I run about 3-5 KVM machines on my desktop box for testing (using virt-manager).
I understand some of the complaints. It get it. But, wow, Gnome is looking really good! It will be interesting to see how this new menu layout works. So far I haven't had any complaints in Gnome 3. I've been using Gnome everyday since it was initially released in the RedHat/Fedora distros. I've had more complaints with the bumps in the road with Fedora over the years than Gnome itself.
I just starting playing with Arch. It's okay, but it is not a solution for serious work. RHEL/CentOS the way to go for serious tasks. RedHat has done a great job writing real management tools that allow an admin to control and manage hundreds of machines. The FreeIPA/RH IDM project itself has be long overdue in the land of Linux. For me, I stick with Fedora on my notebook and RHEL/CentOS on the server. Fedora keeps me up to date with that is on the horizon of RHEL. Fedora has the management tools that other distros lack. I have tons of respect for RedHat. Keep up the good work!
Don't get me wrong, I do like my middle-click paste. If this is due to Wayland, I'm okay with it. I would not be surprised that Wayland removes this most basic function because it is redundant to have more than one type of copy buffer. One of the main reasons for Wayland is to get rid of the crud in X that has built up over the yeas. If that means loosing one of the past buffers, fine with me. People, get over it!
Coal plants have already been shutting down due the fact that natural gas is cheaper. Since we've been building natural gas plants, our carbon emissions are down to 1990's levels. Funny thing, we didn't even sign Kyoto, yet we did better than most (all?) countries in reducing carbon.
I think it is likely placebo. This is the first I've ever heard that people complain about LED lights. On the other hand I *still* hear people complain about fluorescent lights despite the fact that it is pretty rare to find ones driven by magnetic ballasts anymore.
I still hear people complaining about fluorescent lighting despite the fact that CLF's have electronic ballasts that use extremely high frequencies. I could understand the old, old lights that used magnetic ballasts, but CLF's? Really? Seriously? People can see 40,000Hz on a properly working tube bulb? It is not like a monitor with tiny phosphors where I could see the scanning. LED's flicker way more than I ever noticed fluorescent lights. To make matters worse, LEDs are used in many more places! I noticed the flickering from the taillights in newer cars, gadgets, LED equivalent bulbs that dim, etc.
"Hey, we're not throttling. It is just that our peering is maxed out. Use this other service, it works better for our customers."
Totally legit way of doing this. I haven't seen any Net Neutrality discussions cover this possibility.
I thought Rackspace works closely with RedHat. So Rackspace probably gets a pretty good deal if they run RHEL.
oVirt is part of the RHEV product. RHEV is compared to VMWare. OpenStack is something different, but they both use KVM for virtualization. OpenStack is for computing on demand. RHEV, like VMWare is designed to manage the full life cycle of a OS and application deployment.
OpenStack in cloud. Cloud is more than VM's. VMWare is about VM's. RedHat's answer to VM's is RHEV. RHEV is not as complicated as OpenStack.
People, please do NOT use OpenStack as a replacement for VMWare, you will be burned!