Vectors aren't used in Rock and Roll, perhaps, but if a student actually spends a few semesters studying music theory, and post-tonal theory, they will discover that mathematical concepts such as vectors are commonplace. In post-tonal theory, Interval Vectors are used as representations of clusters of tones.
I'll be rude, if you're easily offended please don't read any further.
FOR FUCK'S SAKE DON'T TURN THE LAST REMNANTS OF WHAT IS ART LEFT, INTO FUCKING SCIENCE.
I think the brain of a great composer does a lot of a better job than learning vectors to analyze music does.
wow... You paid 200 dollars more than I did for crappy play time (I get 10-12 hours per charge, you have to carry extra batteries and change them out) and crappy capacity (1 GB? I got 60...)
Think about, did I really pay $880 for a 1 GB capacity? I paid $80, it was a typo as I noted *3* times in replies to this post, this is the 4-th time.
Not my fault slashdot doesn't support editing comments.
And whether a GB is a crappy capacity is really objectionable. I probably can't carry all of your pirated MP3 in one GB, but for me having more than 16hr of unique music is sufficient.
By excluding users of *BSD, Linux, OS X and other OSs, they are dramatically reducing the size of their network, which seems like would only negatively impact the entire project.
Don't flatter yourself. While network experts may be likely to use a non-Windows OS, a plenty of other expert types (medical, phylosophical, cameras, movies, music, appliances etc.) actually use Windows.
Actually 90% of computer users do. Thus negating the argument about "dramatical decrease" in the network size.
I bet if they have success with Windows, they will consider Mac and *nix version too.
Again, it depends on the teacher. If your "mold" includes things like "Question everything", your stated limitation does not apply.
Open the student's books or the program voted by the appropriate institutions for the education framework. Does it have stuff like "question everything"? Unless you plant a clones of that idealistic sample of a teacher in every school, this pathetic thought is just that: a pathetic thought.
What's described in the documents is just a set of facts and sphere's of science and knowledge to go through, and most teachers don't give a damn to go beyond this.
I could waste time reacting to your statement that "maybe my brain has limited capacity", but the deal is: I can't win, you can keep on ranting forever, so I'll pass.
People complain about its power and cooling needs, but they are rather below 200 kW! We sometimes forget just how amazing the developments in computing have been over the last three decades.
Why compare it with Cray-1, compare it with the steam-powered calculators of the past that take minutes to multiply two simple numbers and the results are sometimes kinda off.
People always demand more, this is why they develop more, so to get more. If people become suddenly satisfied with whatever state they're in, they'll never move on.
Oh, except for science curicula where memorizing physical laws and their names are very important to learning the language.
That's the problem. You don't give someone a list of laws and says "they're useful, learn them". That doesn't work, it's wrong, and encourages the wrong idea on students.
Instead give them a nicely layed out booklet or a page with the formulas, explain how they work, and ask them, using this booklet to solve problems.
The learning of the laws by heart will come naturally as they use this in practise.
When you were a little kid, did your parents hand you a bulky dictionary and said "learn it by heart, so you can speak"? Yet, a mere baby you've started learning to talk naturally and organically, and now know a lot of words...
Anything that makes a student think critically about how to solve problems is good for them and directly applicable in the real world. Science and Mathematics may not be directly useful, but the critical thinking and problem solving skills make them an asset. You may not realise this, but after you finish Calculus you will have studied a new method for looking at and breaking down the world. This is completely independant of and yet built on geometry and algebra.
This is the regular excuse, but it doesn't really work this way. Students aren't thought to apply critical thinking. They are thought to learn facts and formulas by heart, and to fit a specific mold the educational material has created.
It's not a coincidence that some of the greatest mathematicians of the 20-th century never were good at math in school. Actually Einstein was pretty bad at physics and math in school too.
Our brain has limited capacity for coming up with new "models" of the world. If all brains of our children are trained into the same model of the world, this limits their capacity to "think outside the box" (to use a cliche).
In other words, the more you learn based on a "mold" applied to all students, the more limited you become in your views.
Instead we should be given our options and let us learn organically, based on what we're interested in and what makes sense in the context of each individual. This is how we're built to work. Apparently though some people think they're smarter and want to force their "wisdom" on the people around them.
Please read and re-read that. It is this kind of motivation that is missing in a GOOD CHUNK of our K-12 education and I think it has a A LOT to do with why a lot of kids are not interested in "core" courses.
Same here. But better give it up, educators world-wide believe you gotta stuff "knowledge" in the kids head against their will, or they will turn into little vegetables.
A lot of the stuff you learn in school isn't even useful, a lot isn't useful for the particular student (for example vectors are a must for 3D graphics, but quite not for a music composer), and a lot isn't given enough context to be seen why it's useful.
Only advice is: let your kids know they are not worth their brain storage in bytes mechanically copying information from school, and help them learn the right stuff.
If I say that in their low res demo movies it's obvious that the avatars use pretty low res billboard textures will make me suck won't it:P
I'll get modded down, I'll get replies asking "if I don't have better games, I better shut my mouth" or how bashing is nor productive and how many work went into this game.
But this is why the gaming industry is so tough nowadays. While all developers are small teams of talented boys and girls fascinated with technology, big budgets quickly up the ante and spoil it for everyone.
Indie games have to differentiate and separate themselves from the general games market and stress on different values, like gameplay, originality and fun (is Wii the Indie dev dream console?).
If they fight within the big market, too many people will stare at the low res textures on the avatars and sigh.
That's a typical manipulation move: announce a problem we all know exists, ask "why does not solution X exist that solves it" and then push for solution x to happen.
Somewhere in between the hype surrounding the issue, noone stops to ask themselves "wait, this solution doesn't even prevent this problem".
Liability is one thing, regulation before manifacturing: another. Given how much success government institutions have with software patents, how could we trust our software's security to them?
First thing they'll do is "regulate" the existence of a backdoor for the police/CIA/FBI into everything that resembles software technology with access control.
BTW, I remember talks and tests of quad-layer and dual-side DVD-R designed to go mainstream when DVD was a new standard. Those could hold up to 32GB (16GB per side).
There is a great desire among slashdotters to see Sony fail. They can't really fault the hardware
How could you fault something that doesn't exist yet. When it comes out and we have the first batches with faulty Blue-Ray players, burning cables, overheating PS3-s... you'll see that coming too.
And it happens with every console in the last few years, there are always hardware problems in first batches.
With PS3 having brand-spanking-new and not as well tested components like Core and Blue-Ray, you can expect the hardware problems to multiply.
Re:Pasting for the PS3 because it invents not copi
on
How the PS3 Hit $600
·
· Score: 1
People who don't want to buy two? Students? No idea, I just know that we coped for several years with a PS2 as the DVD player.
I think PS2 didn't cost $600, nor did DVD discs cost $40-$50, nor did they require a special $3000 TV so they look better than a VCR.
Re:Pasting for the PS3 because it invents not copi
on
How the PS3 Hit $600
·
· Score: 1
Its a sad state of affairs when Slashdot articles don't even celebrate the invention and the investment, but bitch just about the price and want LESS gadgets in the box
Welcome to the free market. People will always bitch about the price and having less useless features in the products they may buy.
Even if you earn millions yearly, a bad value/price ratio is still a bad value/price ratio when you go to the shop to pick a new shiny console.
Who wouldn't want a single disc that can store up to 200GB of data (which, according to WikiPedia [wikipedia.org] is the current maximum achieved thus far -- whether or not such discs will be available to the general public anytime soon at a reasonable price is anyones guess)?
It's likely anything over the single-media recordable will cost arm and leg, and I don't agree that reasonable price doesn't matter.
A DVD-R / RW is around a buck ($1). That's single layer. I use them for backup and passing data around a lot of the time. To double that size to 8.5 GB (well, almost double..), you gotta pay at least $10. Does it make sense to you? I've never bought dual layer DVD-R in my life, I've recorded hundreds if not a thousand of single-layer ones.
If in 3 years a 25 GB BR-R costs $2, but a 200GB costs $100, would price really not matter to you?
Not matter that 200GB is just a promise yet, there's an experimental media recording at 200GB, but no word of when it'll be approved, sold, even less when *recorders* will be available for it.
Your English is better than my Bulgarian, although I am not entirely unfamiliar with the Balkan linguistic union. I would have greater chance of success with Greek.
I have not quoted Latin at you. I have quoted a bit of Latinate English. Ironically, had I known you were Bulgarian I might well have used a more formally Latin grammar, since I would expect you to have a greater chance of understanding an international "Lingua Franca" than my own native tongue.
No offend but, that's exactly how I've always imagined a conversation with a protocol droid.
You got a golden finish or we'll wait until Episode 3?:)
If your MP3 play takes a single AAA battery, it is already bigger than an iPod shuffle which is approximately the size and weight of a small pack of Wrigley's gum or any other USB memory stick.
It's thicker, and round (to fit AAA), but smaller in height and width that a shuffle. I've compared them actually with an actual Shuffle.
There are smaller sticks than a pack of gum btw, so no idea what was that comparison about (I've seen a pack of gum too...).
$880 is more than the cost of ANY iPod.
Typo.. sorry, it's... $80.
All iPods also work as removable storage devices. Plug into USB and copy files from your hard disk.
With a cable and driver. How convenient.
And yes, all iPods play MP3 files and several other non-DRM formats
There are far better mp3 players out there, but they are harder to use, or their knobs are too small, or they have too many functions, or they are not well advertised...
What you gotta understand, and since we're kinda "geeks" here, I guess you already do, is that iPod is far from the best mp3 player out there, let alone with best value/price ratio (mentioning value/price ratio and Apple in one sentence makes me laugh).
Case in point, my shitty mp3 player:
$880 mp3/wma player with FM radio. It's smaller than iPod shuffle, but has a screen with song selections, doubles as a mass storate USB stick (1GB), it has rubber grip & it doesn't scratch at all, even if I put it in my pocket with my keys. Oh and it uses one AAA battery, so you never have to charge it, since you charge the other batteries while you're out listening to the player (and they are so tiny, you can carry 2-3 as a backup in your pocket for more than 16h total play time).
The brand? Canyon or something. Popularity: none. The manual is written in poorly written English, never seen ads or posters for it.
Since I am aware that the average person these days cannot be bothered to look up things they do not understand
If I encode my posts with a 128 key and give you the key, would you bother to look up the algorithm I'll refer you to and decode it?
You don't care enough? Well imagine some people care even less, so that looking up phrases on the web is not something they wanna do.
I cannot help it if the modern American mind is incapable of grasping the concept that price does not equal quality/correctness.
I'm not an American, I'm a Bulgarian (look that up..;), hint, it's not in Afrika). I grasp the concept very well, but I'm slightly childish at times, and I couldn't resist acting inane at your serious reaction to what was a sarcastic remark in my original post (and not to be taken so deeply and even quote Latin to me).
Sorry for wasting your & my time with this nonsense of a discussion we're having:)
Slashdot Mirror
Vectors aren't used in Rock and Roll, perhaps, but if a student actually spends a few semesters studying music theory, and post-tonal theory, they will discover that mathematical concepts such as vectors are commonplace. In post-tonal theory, Interval Vectors are used as representations of clusters of tones.
I'll be rude, if you're easily offended please don't read any further.
FOR FUCK'S SAKE DON'T TURN THE LAST REMNANTS OF WHAT IS ART LEFT, INTO FUCKING SCIENCE.
I think the brain of a great composer does a lot of a better job than learning vectors to analyze music does.
wow... You paid 200 dollars more than I did for crappy play time (I get 10-12 hours per charge, you have to carry extra batteries and change them out) and crappy capacity (1 GB? I got 60...)
Think about, did I really pay $880 for a 1 GB capacity? I paid $80, it was a typo as I noted *3* times in replies to this post, this is the 4-th time.
Not my fault slashdot doesn't support editing comments.
And whether a GB is a crappy capacity is really objectionable. I probably can't carry all of your pirated MP3 in one GB, but for me having more than 16hr of unique music is sufficient.
By excluding users of *BSD, Linux, OS X and other OSs, they are dramatically reducing the size of their network, which seems like would only negatively impact the entire project.
Don't flatter yourself. While network experts may be likely to use a non-Windows OS, a plenty of other expert types (medical, phylosophical, cameras, movies, music, appliances etc.) actually use Windows.
Actually 90% of computer users do. Thus negating the argument about "dramatical decrease" in the network size.
I bet if they have success with Windows, they will consider Mac and *nix version too.
wow. that sounds exactly like the regents (NYS standardized public school test)
Good for NYS. I keep fooling myself that other stuff than NYS or even USA exists, but that could be just my imagination.
Again, it depends on the teacher. If your "mold" includes things like "Question everything", your stated limitation does not apply.
Open the student's books or the program voted by the appropriate institutions for the education framework. Does it have stuff like "question everything"?
Unless you plant a clones of that idealistic sample of a teacher in every school, this pathetic thought is just that: a pathetic thought.
What's described in the documents is just a set of facts and sphere's of science and knowledge to go through, and most teachers don't give a damn to go beyond this.
I could waste time reacting to your statement that "maybe my brain has limited capacity", but the deal is: I can't win, you can keep on ranting forever, so I'll pass.
People complain about its power and cooling needs, but they are rather below 200 kW! We sometimes forget just how amazing the developments in computing have been over the last three decades.
Why compare it with Cray-1, compare it with the steam-powered calculators of the past that take minutes to multiply two simple numbers and the results are sometimes kinda off.
People always demand more, this is why they develop more, so to get more. If people become suddenly satisfied with whatever state they're in, they'll never move on.
Thing about it.
:)
Aaand... ignore the typo/s/ (not a native speaker)
One more point:
Oh, except for science curicula where memorizing physical laws and their names are very important to learning the language.
That's the problem. You don't give someone a list of laws and says "they're useful, learn them". That doesn't work, it's wrong, and encourages the wrong idea on students.
Instead give them a nicely layed out booklet or a page with the formulas, explain how they work, and ask them, using this booklet to solve problems.
The learning of the laws by heart will come naturally as they use this in practise.
When you were a little kid, did your parents hand you a bulky dictionary and said "learn it by heart, so you can speak"? Yet, a mere baby you've started learning to talk naturally and organically, and now know a lot of words...
Thing about it.
Anything that makes a student think critically about how to solve problems is good for them and directly applicable in the real world. Science and Mathematics may not be directly useful, but the critical thinking and problem solving skills make them an asset. You may not realise this, but after you finish Calculus you will have studied a new method for looking at and breaking down the world. This is completely independant of and yet built on geometry and algebra.
This is the regular excuse, but it doesn't really work this way. Students aren't thought to apply critical thinking. They are thought to learn facts and formulas by heart, and to fit a specific mold the educational material has created.
It's not a coincidence that some of the greatest mathematicians of the 20-th century never were good at math in school. Actually Einstein was pretty bad at physics and math in school too.
Our brain has limited capacity for coming up with new "models" of the world. If all brains of our children are trained into the same model of the world, this limits their capacity to "think outside the box" (to use a cliche).
In other words, the more you learn based on a "mold" applied to all students, the more limited you become in your views.
Instead we should be given our options and let us learn organically, based on what we're interested in and what makes sense in the context of each individual. This is how we're built to work. Apparently though some people think they're smarter and want to force their "wisdom" on the people around them.
Please read and re-read that. It is this kind of motivation that is missing in a GOOD CHUNK of our K-12 education and I think it has a A LOT to do with why a lot of kids are not interested in "core" courses.
Same here. But better give it up, educators world-wide believe you gotta stuff "knowledge" in the kids head against their will, or they will turn into little vegetables.
A lot of the stuff you learn in school isn't even useful, a lot isn't useful for the particular student (for example vectors are a must for 3D graphics, but quite not for a music composer), and a lot isn't given enough context to be seen why it's useful.
Only advice is: let your kids know they are not worth their brain storage in bytes mechanically copying information from school, and help them learn the right stuff.
If I say that in their low res demo movies it's obvious that the avatars use pretty low res billboard textures will make me suck won't it :P
I'll get modded down, I'll get replies asking "if I don't have better games, I better shut my mouth" or how bashing is nor productive and how many work went into this game.
But this is why the gaming industry is so tough nowadays. While all developers are small teams of talented boys and girls fascinated with technology, big budgets quickly up the ante and spoil it for everyone.
Indie games have to differentiate and separate themselves from the general games market and stress on different values, like gameplay, originality and fun (is Wii the Indie dev dream console?).
If they fight within the big market, too many people will stare at the low res textures on the avatars and sigh.
Microsoft is desperate...
That's a typical manipulation move: announce a problem we all know exists, ask "why does not solution X exist that solves it" and then push for solution x to happen.
Somewhere in between the hype surrounding the issue, noone stops to ask themselves "wait, this solution doesn't even prevent this problem".
Liability is one thing, regulation before manifacturing: another. Given how much success government institutions have with software patents, how could we trust our software's security to them?
First thing they'll do is "regulate" the existence of a backdoor for the police/CIA/FBI into everything that resembles software technology with access control.
I think you misread what I said
:P Hehe.
Pardon me
BTW, I remember talks and tests of quad-layer and dual-side DVD-R designed to go mainstream when DVD was a new standard. Those could hold up to 32GB (16GB per side).
I wonder what happened with this.
There is a great desire among slashdotters to see Sony fail. They can't really fault the hardware
How could you fault something that doesn't exist yet. When it comes out and we have the first batches with faulty Blue-Ray players, burning cables, overheating PS3-s... you'll see that coming too.
And it happens with every console in the last few years, there are always hardware problems in first batches.
With PS3 having brand-spanking-new and not as well tested components like Core and Blue-Ray, you can expect the hardware problems to multiply.
People who don't want to buy two? Students? No idea, I just know that we coped for several years with a PS2 as the DVD player.
I think PS2 didn't cost $600, nor did DVD discs cost $40-$50, nor did they require a special $3000 TV so they look better than a VCR.
Its a sad state of affairs when Slashdot articles don't even celebrate the invention and the investment, but bitch just about the price and want LESS gadgets in the box
Welcome to the free market. People will always bitch about the price and having less useless features in the products they may buy.
Even if you earn millions yearly, a bad value/price ratio is still a bad value/price ratio when you go to the shop to pick a new shiny console.
. I'd have to imagine the market for other person-to-person micropayments outside of online auctions isn't very large.
Yup, no micropayments outside eBay, no other countries than USA, no other language than English.
Who wouldn't want a single disc that can store up to 200GB of data (which, according to WikiPedia [wikipedia.org] is the current maximum achieved thus far -- whether or not such discs will be available to the general public anytime soon at a reasonable price is anyones guess)?
It's likely anything over the single-media recordable will cost arm and leg, and I don't agree that reasonable price doesn't matter.
A DVD-R / RW is around a buck ($1). That's single layer. I use them for backup and passing data around a lot of the time.
To double that size to 8.5 GB (well, almost double..), you gotta pay at least $10. Does it make sense to you? I've never bought dual layer DVD-R in my life, I've recorded hundreds if not a thousand of single-layer ones.
If in 3 years a 25 GB BR-R costs $2, but a 200GB costs $100, would price really not matter to you?
Not matter that 200GB is just a promise yet, there's an experimental media recording at 200GB, but no word of when it'll be approved, sold, even less when *recorders* will be available for it.
I am not responsible for the things you imagine.
:(
Damn it, with this disclaimer in place I can't even sue you now
Your English is better than my Bulgarian, although I am not entirely unfamiliar with the Balkan linguistic union. I would have greater chance of success with Greek.
:)
I have not quoted Latin at you. I have quoted a bit of Latinate English. Ironically, had I known you were Bulgarian I might well have used a more formally Latin grammar, since I would expect you to have a greater chance of understanding an international "Lingua Franca" than my own native tongue.
No offend but, that's exactly how I've always imagined a conversation with a protocol droid.
You got a golden finish or we'll wait until Episode 3?
If your MP3 play takes a single AAA battery, it is already bigger than an iPod shuffle which is approximately the size and weight of a small pack of Wrigley's gum or any other USB memory stick.
It's thicker, and round (to fit AAA), but smaller in height and width that a shuffle. I've compared them actually with an actual Shuffle.
There are smaller sticks than a pack of gum btw, so no idea what was that comparison about (I've seen a pack of gum too...).
$880 is more than the cost of ANY iPod.
Typo.. sorry, it's... $80.
All iPods also work as removable storage devices. Plug into USB and copy files from your hard disk.
With a cable and driver. How convenient.
And yes, all iPods play MP3 files and several other non-DRM formats
But... I never said they don't play MP3 (?)
Damn ... I mean $80 not $880 :D
Simplicity, hype, marketing.
There are far better mp3 players out there, but they are harder to use, or their knobs are too small, or they have too many functions, or they are not well advertised...
What you gotta understand, and since we're kinda "geeks" here, I guess you already do, is that iPod is far from the best mp3 player out there, let alone with best value/price ratio (mentioning value/price ratio and Apple in one sentence makes me laugh).
Case in point, my shitty mp3 player:
$880 mp3/wma player with FM radio. It's smaller than iPod shuffle, but has a screen with song selections, doubles as a mass storate USB stick (1GB), it has rubber grip & it doesn't scratch at all, even if I put it in my pocket with my keys. Oh and it uses one AAA battery, so you never have to charge it, since you charge the other batteries while you're out listening to the player (and they are so tiny, you can carry 2-3 as a backup in your pocket for more than 16h total play time).
The brand? Canyon or something. Popularity: none. The manual is written in poorly written English, never seen ads or posters for it.
But iPod sucks compared to this thing.
Since I am aware that the average person these days cannot be bothered to look up things they do not understand
;), hint, it's not in Afrika). I grasp the concept very well, but I'm slightly childish at times, and I couldn't resist acting inane at your serious reaction to what was a sarcastic remark in my original post (and not to be taken so deeply and even quote Latin to me).
:)
If I encode my posts with a 128 key and give you the key, would you bother to look up the algorithm I'll refer you to and decode it?
You don't care enough? Well imagine some people care even less, so that looking up phrases on the web is not something they wanna do.
I cannot help it if the modern American mind is incapable of grasping the concept that price does not equal quality/correctness.
I'm not an American, I'm a Bulgarian (look that up..
Sorry for wasting your & my time with this nonsense of a discussion we're having