what kind of exaggeration is this ? it cant be that you are able to ignore the fact that open source applications for popular (like the ones you mentioned) applications are being constantly vetted at any given point in space/time (just like exactly now), by innumerable people. you dont need to vet all of the code at any point.
whereas on the other hand not even as many developers as who developed windows would be enough to vet the windows code in an acceptable time.
this is crowdsourcing difference.
and your beef with open source is, 'they worded a major security hole like it was a routine bug fix' ?
i recall gaming's history in between 1982-2010, and i dont remember a single case in which big corporations did good for gaming.
especially since ~1995, where gaming has started to become an industry and big players popped up. all that is being done has been producing mass produced, rehash titles, or buying small, innovative companies and fucking them up to produce mass produced, rehash titles.
To the net. Current dominant dog eat dog capitalist corporate culture makes corporations suppress and hush hush stuff rather than sparing the effort to fix.
you know quite a few software companies that have gotten sued for negligence, yet you havent ever seen microsoft getting sued. there was only one attempt 4-5 years earlier, and it still didnt move forth.
moreover 'damages' being paid after a damage is done is nothing. what matters is, the damage not being done. it doesnt matter shit if the company pays the damaged party a few billion dollars, after the company's databases are exposed to internet or their sensitive data gets out to wild.
with open source, you can make sure that you have minimum chance of that happening. with closed source, you have to trust the private company. and a few people in that company.
there will ALWAYS be price fixing, and there will NEVER be competition. realize these.
just like how the prices for CDs, mp3s have remained same for all major distributors' inventories despite there has been HUGE cost reductions in the last 10 years, just like how innumerable brands of manufactured products are being sold from overpriced levels despite having been produced in china for dimes.
companies just look at each other, and adjust their price accordingly. when the price stabilizes, there is no competition, despite huge profit margins. noone dare compete either, because they would be subdued by bigger competitors.
'competition' in free market is just like a lowly burgher becoming a duke - there is still the possibility, but it is bullshit. because the existing dukes' interests conflict with that, and serfs have no choice.
And how is this different from things like Samba, where one major developer leaves and the project's progress is thrown back years.
how is it any different than java ? how is it any different than cobol ?
there will always be software, open and closed, that are declining in popularity, and they will suffer. you shouldnt bring up windows xp on one side and samba on the other. you should compare software of similar popularity.
Not only that, how many times have we seen OSS projects completely go in a different direction, also at the whim of a few people. The whole Linux driver ABI was a constant moving target for years, and the kernel team would refuse to include patches for desktop acceleration (as they wanted to keep it geared for servers).
Hell, open source projects get thrown back by stupid open source license squablles all the time, like GPL2 vs. GPL3 vs. library license linking issues and whatnot.
not any more than how closed source software can be written off with the whim of a single manager. at least, with open source software, you have the chance of having forks, patches and plugins. with closed source, gone is gone.
What are you talking about? When did Microsoft announce they were going to drop any compatability? I can still call ancient Windows 2.0 functions like GetProfileString under Windows 7. Things like USER and GDI objects still use 16-bit descriptors so that 16-bit applications can access them. WDM drivers from Windows 98 can be compiled for Windows 7. Microsoft has maintained compatability to an extreme. You are just spouting zealotry without any facts to even back it up even.
they just said that after windows 7 they were going to drop backwards compatibility in further oses.
In my experience the open source projects are the ones that change their interfaces the most recklessly without any regard for backwords compatability. Everyone relies on the invisible hand of the open source community to release these patches for compatability, but rarely are there actually developers working on them.
because there is always a patch someone issues, or a fork someone does, or a plugin someone puts out to remedy such stuff.
Of course FireFox could also implement this functionality. It just would require some significant changes to the application's code to support the security model.
and how do you know someone is not doing it somewhere already ?
Even though the PHP4->5 change wasn't that horrible of a fix in terms of a break in backwards compatability, it's still worse than anything I've personally had to deal with in the Microsoft world.
so, it is worse than waking up one day to learn that the microsoft run ecommerce service is going to shut its doors down in one month, because microsoft thinks it doesnt bring enough profits, and you have one month to save your own ass, by finding a framework, migrating 2000+ products and tens of thousands of past orders to the new framework, setting it up and having it business worthy in the duration ?
or, developers who have been left in the open because microsoft decided that the framework wasnt delivering what they need ?
or, the people who were left baffled when microsoft shut their drm servers for their music service ? zune ?
millions of people and businesses, who was fooled into upgrading vista by spending insurmountable amounts of money, only to see that microsoft screwed it up, wrote it off, and was bringing a new o/s in 1-1.5 years ?
methinks you havent been following i.t. closely enough.
Generally, I feel like you've made your choice of ideology, and now facts are things to be accepted or discarded based on whether or not they match what your ideology says should be true, rather than whether they themselves are true or not.
population and exploited markets were two reasons. u.s. had huge population, hug einternal market (in 19th century standards) so basically propelled its economy by manufacturing for internal market) then expansion overseas began.
in the next few centuries, china and india will have gone 'beyond' what any level of immigration can do for united s.
Usually it's not, in no small part because most businesses aren't in the business of software development - hence the reason they let other companies who *are* in the business of software development (eg: Microsoft) do that work for them.
yes, and charge an arm and a leg, and then keep charging.
That's a pretty atrocious example for demonstrating why OSS is better, given the fact PHP is OSS was utterly irrelevant to the solution.
and how. php is a language which has become a framework for not only many open source (and closed) software but also higher level frameworks that run many different apps. that is not only itself open source, but also the foundation on which innumerable businesses and web presences (and sometimes offline applications - there are various suites for various tasks to automate offices on intranet) conduct their business.
under the guise of 'practicing our faith', innumerable religious sects and groups pump youth with bullshit.
this is just the opening stages though. just keep it that way for a few decades more, you may see even the most basic scientific rules and laws getting challenged.
tags. especially, it treats form closing tag just like a closing tag for td or di...v. in addition, it takes opening tag of form as the block level element to position any input tag relative to, even if you place the input tag in a di...v for relative positioning.
it seems like some people in ie8 team thought forms should be treated always as block level elements (with no way to turn them off as block level elements with display inline or any other tag), and all the form relevant tags also block level elements that are relative to the form opening tag if positioned relatively.
it gave me a whole day's hell and i ended up having to use ridiculous relative positions to align 3 form buttons.
And your responses are naive at best, flat-out false at worst.
your reading comprehension is even worse than mine, then:
It's not economically viable for most organisations to keep sufficient developer staff to not only maintain and support their own unique in-house software, but also their own (vendor unsupported) forks of whatever OSS software they might be using. Which is precisely why they don't do it, and instead do things like pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to companies like Oracle for support.
nowhere at any point neither the person i am discussing or me talked about 'building your own software in house'. it was about modifying/amending/adding modules to the open source software, in case you dont like something open source project's management did, forced upgrades, or missing features, or security fixes. you need only 1 at most 2 people to follow through with this. that also depends on your size, still its much much cheaper to try to whore off yourself to microsoft vendors.
a good example is register globals off change in php5. its now default off, because it is considered a security risk if a developer is not strict in using it. therefore it is turned off, supposedly breaking bazillions of websites along with innumerable ecommerce websites running on oscommerce and similar carts. however, actually, none of those sites had experienced any issues with that. they didnt have to hire developers to amend php code in order to refuse the upgrade either. they just hired people to amend their software for token amounts of money, therefore fixing their issue in the manner they like - some went compatible, some still retained register globals. and business went on without getting disrupted.
most of them dont know, and many of them dont have a choice. comcast, verizon, at&t have monopolies in entire swaths of america. they are the gatekeepers of internet and communication for tens of millions of americans outright.
excuse me, but moron is the one who confuses the phrase 'hunt down' with 'offering new data pricing plans'. you dont say 'we are going to track, hunt down and throttle/charge' while trying to say 'we are going to offer data pricing plans in future'.
i was around long before that, and the compatibility 'brokenness' didnt last even a few weeks.
almost all the apps that ran on php 4 and had to adapt to php5 issued compatibility patches in a very short while, and even php5 itself had functions to get around some of the more justified writeoffs like register globals being set to off from then on. they didnt even have to, for it was a security weakness to have it on, yet, they did.
it didnt take 2 weeks, and $100-200 for even the most established, high traffic estores (oscommerce was much afflicted with compatibility issues in between php4, 5 and mysql 4,5) didnt flinch or feel the trouble of upgrading, as opposed to what microsoft force upon their clients.
well, after a day's worth of trying to find acceptable means to get around ie8 screwup about block level treatment of and input tags, despite even ie6 does it properly, i disagree. all browsers cant read html.
you dont upgrade for 'nice'. you may upgrade for 'nice' as a home user, but for businesses, geting pushed to upgrade to a 'nicer' version is huge expense.
Slashdot Mirror
what kind of exaggeration is this ? it cant be that you are able to ignore the fact that open source applications for popular (like the ones you mentioned) applications are being constantly vetted at any given point in space/time (just like exactly now), by innumerable people. you dont need to vet all of the code at any point.
whereas on the other hand not even as many developers as who developed windows would be enough to vet the windows code in an acceptable time.
this is crowdsourcing difference.
and your beef with open source is, 'they worded a major security hole like it was a routine bug fix' ?
come on.
i recall gaming's history in between 1982-2010, and i dont remember a single case in which big corporations did good for gaming.
especially since ~1995, where gaming has started to become an industry and big players popped up. all that is being done has been producing mass produced, rehash titles, or buying small, innovative companies and fucking them up to produce mass produced, rehash titles.
To the net. Current dominant dog eat dog capitalist corporate culture makes corporations suppress and hush hush stuff rather than sparing the effort to fix.
yeaaaaa.
tell that to millions of americans who are sitting at the mercy of one provider that has taken the monopoly contract for their area.
(such as deleting the users /home folder).
it shoudlnt be capable of doing that in the first place anyway.
you know quite a few software companies that have gotten sued for negligence, yet you havent ever seen microsoft getting sued. there was only one attempt 4-5 years earlier, and it still didnt move forth.
moreover 'damages' being paid after a damage is done is nothing. what matters is, the damage not being done. it doesnt matter shit if the company pays the damaged party a few billion dollars, after the company's databases are exposed to internet or their sensitive data gets out to wild.
with open source, you can make sure that you have minimum chance of that happening. with closed source, you have to trust the private company. and a few people in that company.
yea. and you saw the doctype of the document, where ? in your ass ?
there will ALWAYS be price fixing, and there will NEVER be competition. realize these.
just like how the prices for CDs, mp3s have remained same for all major distributors' inventories despite there has been HUGE cost reductions in the last 10 years, just like how innumerable brands of manufactured products are being sold from overpriced levels despite having been produced in china for dimes.
companies just look at each other, and adjust their price accordingly. when the price stabilizes, there is no competition, despite huge profit margins. noone dare compete either, because they would be subdued by bigger competitors.
'competition' in free market is just like a lowly burgher becoming a duke - there is still the possibility, but it is bullshit. because the existing dukes' interests conflict with that, and serfs have no choice.
And how is this different from things like Samba, where one major developer leaves and the project's progress is thrown back years.
how is it any different than java ? how is it any different than cobol ?
there will always be software, open and closed, that are declining in popularity, and they will suffer. you shouldnt bring up windows xp on one side and samba on the other. you should compare software of similar popularity.
Not only that, how many times have we seen OSS projects completely go in a different direction, also at the whim of a few people. The whole Linux driver ABI was a constant moving target for years, and the kernel team would refuse to include patches for desktop acceleration (as they wanted to keep it geared for servers).
Hell, open source projects get thrown back by stupid open source license squablles all the time, like GPL2 vs. GPL3 vs. library license linking issues and whatnot.
not any more than how closed source software can be written off with the whim of a single manager. at least, with open source software, you have the chance of having forks, patches and plugins. with closed source, gone is gone.
What are you talking about? When did Microsoft announce they were going to drop any compatability? I can still call ancient Windows 2.0 functions like GetProfileString under Windows 7. Things like USER and GDI objects still use 16-bit descriptors so that 16-bit applications can access them. WDM drivers from Windows 98 can be compiled for Windows 7. Microsoft has maintained compatability to an extreme. You are just spouting zealotry without any facts to even back it up even.
they just said that after windows 7 they were going to drop backwards compatibility in further oses.
In my experience the open source projects are the ones that change their interfaces the most recklessly without any regard for backwords compatability. Everyone relies on the invisible hand of the open source community to release these patches for compatability, but rarely are there actually developers working on them.
because there is always a patch someone issues, or a fork someone does, or a plugin someone puts out to remedy such stuff.
Of course FireFox could also implement this functionality. It just would require some significant changes to the application's code to support the security model.
and how do you know someone is not doing it somewhere already ?
Even though the PHP4->5 change wasn't that horrible of a fix in terms of a break in backwards compatability, it's still worse than anything I've personally had to deal with in the Microsoft world.
so, it is worse than waking up one day to learn that the microsoft run ecommerce service is going to shut its doors down in one month, because microsoft thinks it doesnt bring enough profits, and you have one month to save your own ass, by finding a framework, migrating 2000+ products and tens of thousands of past orders to the new framework, setting it up and having it business worthy in the duration ?
or, developers who have been left in the open because microsoft decided that the framework wasnt delivering what they need ?
or, the people who were left baffled when microsoft shut their drm servers for their music service ? zune ?
millions of people and businesses, who was fooled into upgrading vista by spending insurmountable amounts of money, only to see that microsoft screwed it up, wrote it off, and was bringing a new o/s in 1-1.5 years ?
methinks you havent been following i.t. closely enough.
Generally, I feel like you've made your choice of ideology, and now facts are things to be accepted or discarded based on whether or not they match what your ideology says should be true, rather than whether they themselves are true or not.
population and exploited markets were two reasons. u.s. had huge population, hug einternal market (in 19th century standards) so basically propelled its economy by manufacturing for internal market) then expansion overseas began.
in the next few centuries, china and india will have gone 'beyond' what any level of immigration can do for united s.
Usually it's not, in no small part because most businesses aren't in the business of software development - hence the reason they let other companies who *are* in the business of software development (eg: Microsoft) do that work for them.
yes, and charge an arm and a leg, and then keep charging.
That's a pretty atrocious example for demonstrating why OSS is better, given the fact PHP is OSS was utterly irrelevant to the solution.
and how. php is a language which has become a framework for not only many open source (and closed) software but also higher level frameworks that run many different apps. that is not only itself open source, but also the foundation on which innumerable businesses and web presences (and sometimes offline applications - there are various suites for various tasks to automate offices on intranet) conduct their business.
Of course, nto that dev base will die. they will just code for other platforms.
education.
under the guise of 'practicing our faith', innumerable religious sects and groups pump youth with bullshit.
this is just the opening stages though. just keep it that way for a few decades more, you may see even the most basic scientific rules and laws getting challenged.
i couldnt find any proper escaping method :
tags are
di...v and td, in...put, for...m
tags. especially, it treats form closing tag just like a closing tag for td or di...v. in addition, it takes opening tag of form as the block level element to position any input tag relative to, even if you place the input tag in a di...v for relative positioning.
it seems like some people in ie8 team thought forms should be treated always as block level elements (with no way to turn them off as block level elements with display inline or any other tag), and all the form relevant tags also block level elements that are relative to the form opening tag if positioned relatively.
it gave me a whole day's hell and i ended up having to use ridiculous relative positions to align 3 form buttons.
And your responses are naive at best, flat-out false at worst.
your reading comprehension is even worse than mine, then :
It's not economically viable for most organisations to keep sufficient developer staff to not only maintain and support their own unique in-house software, but also their own (vendor unsupported) forks of whatever OSS software they might be using. Which is precisely why they don't do it, and instead do things like pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to companies like Oracle for support.
nowhere at any point neither the person i am discussing or me talked about 'building your own software in house'. it was about modifying/amending/adding modules to the open source software, in case you dont like something open source project's management did, forced upgrades, or missing features, or security fixes. you need only 1 at most 2 people to follow through with this. that also depends on your size, still its much much cheaper to try to whore off yourself to microsoft vendors.
a good example is register globals off change in php5. its now default off, because it is considered a security risk if a developer is not strict in using it. therefore it is turned off, supposedly breaking bazillions of websites along with innumerable ecommerce websites running on oscommerce and similar carts. however, actually, none of those sites had experienced any issues with that. they didnt have to hire developers to amend php code in order to refuse the upgrade either. they just hired people to amend their software for token amounts of money, therefore fixing their issue in the manner they like - some went compatible, some still retained register globals. and business went on without getting disrupted.
most of them dont know, and many of them dont have a choice. comcast, verizon, at&t have monopolies in entire swaths of america. they are the gatekeepers of internet and communication for tens of millions of americans outright.
excuse me, but moron is the one who confuses the phrase 'hunt down' with 'offering new data pricing plans'. you dont say 'we are going to track, hunt down and throttle/charge' while trying to say 'we are going to offer data pricing plans in future'.
so 32 bit apps in windows xp work in 64 bit windows 7 ?
i was around long before that, and the compatibility 'brokenness' didnt last even a few weeks.
almost all the apps that ran on php 4 and had to adapt to php5 issued compatibility patches in a very short while, and even php5 itself had functions to get around some of the more justified writeoffs like register globals being set to off from then on. they didnt even have to, for it was a security weakness to have it on, yet, they did.
it didnt take 2 weeks, and $100-200 for even the most established, high traffic estores (oscommerce was much afflicted with compatibility issues in between php4, 5 and mysql 4,5) didnt flinch or feel the trouble of upgrading, as opposed to what microsoft force upon their clients.
well, after a day's worth of trying to find acceptable means to get around ie8 screwup about block level treatment of and input tags, despite even ie6 does it properly, i disagree. all browsers cant read html.
you dont upgrade for 'nice'. you may upgrade for 'nice' as a home user, but for businesses, geting pushed to upgrade to a 'nicer' version is huge expense.
follow the thread below. someone asked the same question and provided arguments, and i responded.