its not that they are better and more capable. its just that law enforcement is at the hands of governments which are lackeys of corporations. they just are not prosecuting the filthy.
surely, if you look at the face of it, you will see pimpled teens going about with sql injection scripts grabbed off the net.
but, see, the group which was dubbed as pimpled teens, staged a 'social engineering' attack, and grabbed email history of a filthy outfit, deleted their backups, and posted it online.
it doesnt take too much brain to see that the skill level of this group is as not low as you propose.
"A group of AGGRESSIVE hackers known as 'Anonymous' illegally broke into blah blah..... blah blah and stole proprietary and 'confidential' information which was STOLEN by us by using ROOTKITS and VIRUSES and 0 DAY EXPLOITS from private citizens' computers....."
corporate lack of shame. you produce rootkits, viruses, 0 day exploits, malware to spy on people, steal their confidential, legally private information to SELL them, and then you dub that information 'proprietary' information belonging to you....
i wonder what will they say in their defense in front of senate committee. what's more, i wonder what will the senate committee say to them, in regard to their dealings with this filthy outfit.
whats the slogan of hbgary anyway ? "hey - we produce viruses, rootkits, 0 day exploits and malware to steal your private information to sell to corporations and government !!!" ?
i told you that, going after anonymous would cause more hardcore circles, which are in constant rebellion to anything that is establishment, to take up the cause of the anonymous.
Anyone spending a few years in the early stages of internet, in which those underground circles were not so underground like today, would be able to know and tell the same. Its the rebel net culture. That underground is multitudes over the level of what the private lackey corps or govts. can afford to hire or educate. They are of a sort that grows/breeds on its own.
Despite their roads have diverged with most of us the early netizens like me, i indeed learned to develop a deep respect for their kind. For, even if they do a lot of shady stuff, they do have a very strong attachment to some principles. and that's something to be respected.
Anyway. see, what they have done. good luck to govt and their lackeys in finding who did it. they may even be inside hbgary itself. you'll never know. once a rebel, always a rebel.
eventually anonymous would become a V for vendetta mask behind which vigilantes would do things that needed to be done, like this. Where are the people who were foaming at the mouth against Anonymous just a few weeks ago huh ? Here is anonymous justice, packed up and ready to go. The justice which was in no way delivered by the normal means you were speaking about that people should follow.
of course good guys, indifferent guys, and bad guys will do things by hiding behind such a mask. but, that doesnt make the presence of that mask, something bad.
drupal is a coding mess; it was started by hobbyists, developed and added to by hobbyists with hobby purposes. and its now expected to do serious stuff. hence the mess. it wasnt created with development in mind. its an app specific issue.
People nested in corporate environments have little info on this, but linux servers pretty much dominate the server scene for shared web hosting, small to medium businesses. In the last 5 years, big corporations have also increasingly moved into linux platform, due to the immediate availability of all kinds of implements, infrastructure, modules, software available in linux for pretty much everything in regard to web hosting and service providing.
and this is mainly due to LAMP. linux, apache, mysql, php. these have come a long way, a very very long way, and they are on enterprise level for the last few years, without any denial. and most of this is due to php and mysql being exclusively used on linux and apache to develop websites. you know a lot of these - it started from personal homepage tools, moved to postnuke, phpbb, drupal, then moved on to enterprise level stuff in the last few years. ( see an example http://silverstripe.com/?v=b - there are a lot like this these days )
as a result of this, the server market is HUGE. you can get a quite powerful dedicated server for $60-70 with a lamp stack, and just sit pretty with a no cost web app, modified slightly to your needs by a random php developer you hire from the abundant crowd.
so you can guess what this does to microsoft in regard to servers. they cant sell anything to these people. they even tried having major domain registrar/shared hosting provider godaddy to have its domain parking pages park on iis servers, so that it would skew the net statistics in regard to servers - all domains appearing from iis servers as if separate sites. despite the hosting godaddy gives is predominantly on linux stacks. this was a few years ago. apparently it didnt avail, since i didnt hear it being practiced anymore.
so apparently, they couldnt sell anything on server business, and hence they are trying to - in their rather twisted mindset - to strategically reverse the situation - 'be friendly to php, so that php people will move their apps to microsoft platform' -> ending up all the small, medium businesses and people being obligated to microsoft....
as you can understand, this is a doomed move from the start. the market is WAY too big now and way too established in lamp stacks, for microsoft to be able to do anything.
php wins all of them. it doesnt win even, it bulldozes.
php is part of lamp stack. and on lamp stacks, php flat out leaves behind net et al in speed. in regard to features and libraries, there isnt a few programming languages that can cope up with it on the face of the planet. we are little short of starting having modules for php in apache or libraries in php to do physical interface programming to boil eggs in the morning or make our tea.
available modules from 3rd party devs ? oh boy. there are ENDLESS amount of modules, libraries and so on available for php. just pear would send net crying to its corner. this totally leaves out zend et al, and other libraries. think of something - there is a php module or an apache module for php for it.
i dont think you are trolling or not. only someone who is utterly ignorant about internet, or totally locked into his/her corporate culture/environment, or someone who is trolling could attempt to compare php documentation and guides and tutorials to net. net is nonexistent, compared to php in that regard. newbies dont even learn php through any books or anything - any question, they ask google, and they get all kinds of concise or extensive answers step by step. one step further than that, is someone randomly knocking at your door in physical reality and offering you to teach how to fetch your mail from your mailbox with php.
ides ? zend ide ? eclipse ? endless amount of other free or proprietary ides available for php, some made only for php, that you cant even start to choose from ?
please. you are either locked in your corporate shell for too long, or trolling outright.
Microsoft is evil, blah blah blah, but if people really want open source alternatives to make any progress with regular people, they need to gain mindshare.
open source alternatives dont need to make progress with regular people in web development scene - that scene is already OWNED by open source. the amount and variety of apps on lamp stack (linux apache mysql php - insert postgres sometimes), and their usage is so huge and so varied. this is what causing microsoft to try to bring all those small and medium businesses (and recently big ones) that got out of their hands in regard to web presence, back to microsoft platforms.
the summary is - all this is pointless. there is no reason for anyone, developers and clients alike, to move to microsoft's platforms. everything is free on lamp stack. even if you go VERY big, and start to cluster servers and then have to employ server farms. all you need to pay for is development of your app. no licenses, no other shit. and, development is quite cheap, because the php dev scene is big.
there is nothing microsoft can offer to open source community in this field.
php developers already make reasonable amounts of money in php development scene. they dont need the restrictions microsoft will bring upon them.
in the last 10 years, small businesses increasingly moved to having their web presences developed and maintained in lamp stacks. (naturally with php, the p at the end of the acronym).
microsoft was trying to push windows, iis, asp or asp.net (later) with mssql to businesses, locking them into their stuff. but, lamp made them undone. this is why they are trying to pull the now huge php development scene into windows.
the php development scene is big, with enterprise-level apps being around for 3-4 years now, leave aside totally dominating small to medium business and personal web development. the names that can be named for apps are endless. their functions also. this is why they are trying to pull all those apps into ms platform, and hence retain control.
however the stupidity is that, php developers pretty much see php as a part of linux, apache by now. EVEN if you push it too hard to argue about oracle and the situation of mysql, and take mysql out of the situation and put any mysql fork or postgressql, php is pretty much served on linux, apache. mod_rewrite, for example, is a daily facet of web development with php. same goes for A LOT of modules that can be compiled with apache. moreover, entirety of the scripts/software which create the php development scene, commercial or noncommercial, run exclusively on lamp. i used the world entirety, because its a situation that far out. actually that is the scene that caused php development to get this big in the first place.
no php developer will ditch lamp and start working on 'wimp'. this at most can cause an infiltration of php developers into windows/iis scene, and cause microsoft to lose on that front too. because due to the synergy in lamp, and the immense software scene of php apps on lamp, php devs will gravitate towards lamp and they will take ex-microsoft clients with them too - 'this requires this, that and that paid infrastructure in ms, but, see, its free on lamp' -> whoops - another client moved to lamp. because, its free into the future - even if you expand, expand expand, cluster, cluster and set up farms.
Random php user group in random country lauds some particular act of microsoft, and this ends up being 'microsoft's successful partnership with PHP developers' ?
what about asp, asp.net,.net.,.whatever, silverlight et al ?
Either toughest ass award, because one needs to have the toughest ass on the planet in order to brave going against all the established dirty dealers of the world, or, a heart as big as a mountain.
Regardless of how you look at it, they perfectly embody the definition of 'berserker'.
actually i may or may not have just Tolkiened. But im not so sure after leaving the Tolkien and coming to the living room. I stopped by the kitchen to Tolkien my Tolkies, but the Tolkien setting was not on par with the Tolkiness of the situation.
So i think i Tolkiened my Tolkies.....
Or, 'imaginary property' rights may have hit rock bottom, and the heirs of a person who tried to share positive and enlightened principles through fiction may have foaming at the mouth out of their base, despicable greed.
something SO unnatural, uniform, coated with finely grained sand in general, being produced out of a random collision (the results of which are statistically unlikely to produce something like that in the first place), without any atmospheric or natural conditions acting on its surface...
the moon is quite unnatural as it is. there is no object flying in solar system that is even remotely similar, even asteroids. there is no need to try to invent far out theories in order to make its statistical absurdity more absurd.
the devices and applications have already matured way past the needs of the everyday user. and even gamers.
even in gaming, the leading edge of computing devices with its excessive demand for processing power and memory, the point which a normal person would notice any difference is long past. we are getting great realism with great visuals and in high framerates. most cards and games already offer framerates past a person's visual detection ability already. and the ones who are still pushing for more generally seem to be performance enthusiasts. people who aim for 120 fps and on.
so, if even in gaming we have reached a saturation point in regard to devices - imagine how it is like for ordinary internet usage, office usage, and casual usage.
we just dont need to replace what we have.
Only microsoft and the like could think of getting 30% off of what you do in your spare time. I mean.... normally rational people would think that what someone does in their SPARE time, belongs to them alone. But it turns out, microsoft has 30% stake in that too...
some here still dont get it. something being made open, but owned by someone and can be reverted back is NOT open. it only means it is 'open to look inside',in manner of speaking.
open should mean what u.k. govt., in an unexpected streak of common sense, explains above.
Slashdot Mirror
Also increases the urine that's not taken out of your bloodstream.
....
and, if you keep it too much, the urine in your bladder may even get pushed back into your bloodstream and outright poison you.
great researches come out, from the fine institutions of our scientific establishment, sometimes
they were foaming against anonymous. ranging from debasing them as pimpled wannabee kids to outlaws, illegals that violate society and whatnot.
its not that they are better and more capable. its just that law enforcement is at the hands of governments which are lackeys of corporations. they just are not prosecuting the filthy.
your analysis is off target.
surely, if you look at the face of it, you will see pimpled teens going about with sql injection scripts grabbed off the net.
but, see, the group which was dubbed as pimpled teens, staged a 'social engineering' attack, and grabbed email history of a filthy outfit, deleted their backups, and posted it online.
it doesnt take too much brain to see that the skill level of this group is as not low as you propose.
http://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2011/02/16/lessons-to-learn-from-the-hbgary-federal-hack/
..... blah blah and stole proprietary and 'confidential' information which was STOLEN by us by using ROOTKITS and VIRUSES and 0 DAY EXPLOITS from private citizens' computers ....."
....
down below.
http://sophosnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/hbgary-rsa-sign.jpg?w=640
"A group of AGGRESSIVE hackers known as 'Anonymous' illegally broke into blah blah
corporate lack of shame. you produce rootkits, viruses, 0 day exploits, malware to spy on people, steal their confidential, legally private information to SELL them, and then you dub that information 'proprietary' information belonging to you
i wonder what will they say in their defense in front of senate committee. what's more, i wonder what will the senate committee say to them, in regard to their dealings with this filthy outfit.
whats the slogan of hbgary anyway ? "hey - we produce viruses, rootkits, 0 day exploits and malware to steal your private information to sell to corporations and government !!!" ?
i told you that, going after anonymous would cause more hardcore circles, which are in constant rebellion to anything that is establishment, to take up the cause of the anonymous.
Anyone spending a few years in the early stages of internet, in which those underground circles were not so underground like today, would be able to know and tell the same. Its the rebel net culture. That underground is multitudes over the level of what the private lackey corps or govts. can afford to hire or educate. They are of a sort that grows/breeds on its own.
Despite their roads have diverged with most of us the early netizens like me, i indeed learned to develop a deep respect for their kind. For, even if they do a lot of shady stuff, they do have a very strong attachment to some principles. and that's something to be respected.
Anyway. see, what they have done. good luck to govt and their lackeys in finding who did it. they may even be inside hbgary itself. you'll never know. once a rebel, always a rebel.
eventually anonymous would become a V for vendetta mask behind which vigilantes would do things that needed to be done, like this. Where are the people who were foaming at the mouth against Anonymous just a few weeks ago huh ? Here is anonymous justice, packed up and ready to go. The justice which was in no way delivered by the normal means you were speaking about that people should follow.
of course good guys, indifferent guys, and bad guys will do things by hiding behind such a mask. but, that doesnt make the presence of that mask, something bad.
write a small essay on what COMPARED TO in "net is nonexistent, COMPARED TO php in that regard" means.
so, documentation for .net exists eh ? wow. that was a surprise. too bad that i didnt say 'no documentation'. i said it gets trampled by php.
yeah. fixing of latest php vulnerability didnt take half a day.
please, keep your opinions to yourself if you are uninformed. or, dont talk out of your ass.
drupal is a coding mess; it was started by hobbyists, developed and added to by hobbyists with hobby purposes. and its now expected to do serious stuff. hence the mess. it wasnt created with development in mind. its an app specific issue.
here's your cms fix :
http://silverstripe.com/?v=b
and there are many like these.
People nested in corporate environments have little info on this, but linux servers pretty much dominate the server scene for shared web hosting, small to medium businesses. In the last 5 years, big corporations have also increasingly moved into linux platform, due to the immediate availability of all kinds of implements, infrastructure, modules, software available in linux for pretty much everything in regard to web hosting and service providing.
....
and this is mainly due to LAMP. linux, apache, mysql, php. these have come a long way, a very very long way, and they are on enterprise level for the last few years, without any denial. and most of this is due to php and mysql being exclusively used on linux and apache to develop websites. you know a lot of these - it started from personal homepage tools, moved to postnuke, phpbb, drupal, then moved on to enterprise level stuff in the last few years. ( see an example http://silverstripe.com/?v=b - there are a lot like this these days )
as a result of this, the server market is HUGE. you can get a quite powerful dedicated server for $60-70 with a lamp stack, and just sit pretty with a no cost web app, modified slightly to your needs by a random php developer you hire from the abundant crowd.
so you can guess what this does to microsoft in regard to servers. they cant sell anything to these people. they even tried having major domain registrar/shared hosting provider godaddy to have its domain parking pages park on iis servers, so that it would skew the net statistics in regard to servers - all domains appearing from iis servers as if separate sites. despite the hosting godaddy gives is predominantly on linux stacks. this was a few years ago. apparently it didnt avail, since i didnt hear it being practiced anymore.
so apparently, they couldnt sell anything on server business, and hence they are trying to - in their rather twisted mindset - to strategically reverse the situation - 'be friendly to php, so that php people will move their apps to microsoft platform' -> ending up all the small, medium businesses and people being obligated to microsoft
as you can understand, this is a doomed move from the start. the market is WAY too big now and way too established in lamp stacks, for microsoft to be able to do anything.
php wins all of them. it doesnt win even, it bulldozes.
php is part of lamp stack. and on lamp stacks, php flat out leaves behind net et al in speed. in regard to features and libraries, there isnt a few programming languages that can cope up with it on the face of the planet. we are little short of starting having modules for php in apache or libraries in php to do physical interface programming to boil eggs in the morning or make our tea.
available modules from 3rd party devs ? oh boy. there are ENDLESS amount of modules, libraries and so on available for php. just pear would send net crying to its corner. this totally leaves out zend et al, and other libraries. think of something - there is a php module or an apache module for php for it.
i dont think you are trolling or not. only someone who is utterly ignorant about internet, or totally locked into his/her corporate culture/environment, or someone who is trolling could attempt to compare php documentation and guides and tutorials to net. net is nonexistent, compared to php in that regard. newbies dont even learn php through any books or anything - any question, they ask google, and they get all kinds of concise or extensive answers step by step. one step further than that, is someone randomly knocking at your door in physical reality and offering you to teach how to fetch your mail from your mailbox with php.
ides ? zend ide ? eclipse ? endless amount of other free or proprietary ides available for php, some made only for php, that you cant even start to choose from ?
please. you are either locked in your corporate shell for too long, or trolling outright.
you can write good code in any language. php is one of them. dont talk shit without knowing enough about a subject. here is an example from ibm "
http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/opensource/library/os-php-7oohabits/
and that article was from the times in which oop wasnt well developed in php too.
Microsoft is evil, blah blah blah, but if people really want open source alternatives to make any progress with regular people, they need to gain mindshare.
open source alternatives dont need to make progress with regular people in web development scene - that scene is already OWNED by open source. the amount and variety of apps on lamp stack (linux apache mysql php - insert postgres sometimes), and their usage is so huge and so varied. this is what causing microsoft to try to bring all those small and medium businesses (and recently big ones) that got out of their hands in regard to web presence, back to microsoft platforms.
the summary is - all this is pointless. there is no reason for anyone, developers and clients alike, to move to microsoft's platforms. everything is free on lamp stack. even if you go VERY big, and start to cluster servers and then have to employ server farms. all you need to pay for is development of your app. no licenses, no other shit. and, development is quite cheap, because the php dev scene is big.
there is nothing microsoft can offer to open source community in this field.
php developers already make reasonable amounts of money in php development scene. they dont need the restrictions microsoft will bring upon them.
in the last 10 years, small businesses increasingly moved to having their web presences developed and maintained in lamp stacks. (naturally with php, the p at the end of the acronym).
microsoft was trying to push windows, iis, asp or asp.net (later) with mssql to businesses, locking them into their stuff. but, lamp made them undone. this is why they are trying to pull the now huge php development scene into windows.
the php development scene is big, with enterprise-level apps being around for 3-4 years now, leave aside totally dominating small to medium business and personal web development. the names that can be named for apps are endless. their functions also. this is why they are trying to pull all those apps into ms platform, and hence retain control.
its pretty stupid.
I've heard they're actually useful (or at least not harmful) in the PHP circles -- good for the PHP folks.
they practically dont exist in php circles.
however the stupidity is that, php developers pretty much see php as a part of linux, apache by now. EVEN if you push it too hard to argue about oracle and the situation of mysql, and take mysql out of the situation and put any mysql fork or postgressql, php is pretty much served on linux, apache. mod_rewrite, for example, is a daily facet of web development with php. same goes for A LOT of modules that can be compiled with apache. moreover, entirety of the scripts/software which create the php development scene, commercial or noncommercial, run exclusively on lamp. i used the world entirety, because its a situation that far out. actually that is the scene that caused php development to get this big in the first place.
no php developer will ditch lamp and start working on 'wimp'. this at most can cause an infiltration of php developers into windows/iis scene, and cause microsoft to lose on that front too. because due to the synergy in lamp, and the immense software scene of php apps on lamp, php devs will gravitate towards lamp and they will take ex-microsoft clients with them too - 'this requires this, that and that paid infrastructure in ms, but, see, its free on lamp' -> whoops - another client moved to lamp. because, its free into the future - even if you expand, expand expand, cluster, cluster and set up farms.
their effort is pretty much pointless.
Random php user group in random country lauds some particular act of microsoft, and this ends up being 'microsoft's successful partnership with PHP developers' ?
.net., .whatever, silverlight et al ?
what about asp, asp.net,
and really, what 'partnership' anyway ?
Either toughest ass award, because one needs to have the toughest ass on the planet in order to brave going against all the established dirty dealers of the world, or, a heart as big as a mountain.
Regardless of how you look at it, they perfectly embody the definition of 'berserker'.
actually i may or may not have just Tolkiened. But im not so sure after leaving the Tolkien and coming to the living room. I stopped by the kitchen to Tolkien my Tolkies, but the Tolkien setting was not on par with the Tolkiness of the situation.
.....
So i think i Tolkiened my Tolkies
Or, 'imaginary property' rights may have hit rock bottom, and the heirs of a person who tried to share positive and enlightened principles through fiction may have foaming at the mouth out of their base, despicable greed.
something SO unnatural, uniform, coated with finely grained sand in general, being produced out of a random collision (the results of which are statistically unlikely to produce something like that in the first place), without any atmospheric or natural conditions acting on its surface ...
the moon is quite unnatural as it is. there is no object flying in solar system that is even remotely similar, even asteroids. there is no need to try to invent far out theories in order to make its statistical absurdity more absurd.
the devices and applications have already matured way past the needs of the everyday user. and even gamers. even in gaming, the leading edge of computing devices with its excessive demand for processing power and memory, the point which a normal person would notice any difference is long past. we are getting great realism with great visuals and in high framerates. most cards and games already offer framerates past a person's visual detection ability already. and the ones who are still pushing for more generally seem to be performance enthusiasts. people who aim for 120 fps and on. so, if even in gaming we have reached a saturation point in regard to devices - imagine how it is like for ordinary internet usage, office usage, and casual usage. we just dont need to replace what we have.
Only microsoft and the like could think of getting 30% off of what you do in your spare time. I mean .... normally rational people would think that what someone does in their SPARE time, belongs to them alone. But it turns out, microsoft has 30% stake in that too ...
some here still dont get it. something being made open, but owned by someone and can be reverted back is NOT open. it only means it is 'open to look inside',in manner of speaking.
open should mean what u.k. govt., in an unexpected streak of common sense, explains above.