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In other news, house builders worldwide use Apple backed white instead of the greens and blues of WinXP another victory for Apple. Get real, H.264 is part of the MPEG-4 AVC profile. MPEG as in MPEG-2 (you might know it from DVDs, digital satellite, cable and terrestial TV) or mp3. Apple's embraced MPEG-4 and had some influence in writing the specification (especially the file format) but it was a small fish in a big pond.

The Microsoft supported DVD+R spec did not trump the Apple backed DVD-R format and now combo drives are the norm.

Oh, you should tell the DVD+RW Alliance that they've forgotten Microsoft on their homepage. DVD-R had a number of troubles in the beginning and didn't get off the ground so half its backers jumped ship; there were other reasons of course. I don't remember Microsoft favoring + or -.

And Apple's iPod/iTunes support of Dolby's AAC audio codec has seriously frakked up Microsoft's WMA format dominating the MP3 player market.

Cool, instead of listening to their mp3s on an mp3-player that also plays wmv they listen to their mp3s on an mp3-player that also plays aac. I know there is a difference if you buy music online because mp3 lacks a working drm framework but while AAC may be a standard, Apple's drm isn't. Score one for the good guys.

If Corporate America ever is successfully persuaded to switch to Linux or OS X and open source application suite software, Microsoft will be toast

If 90% of the supporters of the GOP are successfully persuaded to become Democrats, the GOP will be toast...

So what your saying is that if Microsoft loses its most important business segment (without specifying why that should happen) they're in trouble? Insightful.

I don't think he was completely full of shit, since I agree with the DVD Forum being the standardizing body when it comes to DVD discs, and not a random group of companies deciding to form an alliance and push their format. Although I can understand if they wish to call their format a standard.

I could compare the DVD Forum to the W3C, where the DVD+RW Alliance could be Microsoft and any henchmen that follows their path. Not that I dislike any companies behind the DVD+RW Alliance; just picked Microsoft for the sake of the web standard comparison since they have a lot of own "standards" in this field.

I don't think it's a coincidence that your PS2 and XBOX happen to like DVD-R mostly too.

Having said that, I agree that you should stick to what works as well. If DVD+R worked everywhere, and DVD-R not really everywhere, I would've went for DVD+R instead.

As the other poster stated, the difference between the two formats is almost nothing. I believe the -R format is 1 - 2 percent more compatible with standalone DVD players.

It's more of a personal thing. The -R format was developed by the DVD Forum and the +R format was developed by the DVD+RW Alliance. -R was the standard and +R was created by companies not willing to pay to use it. Personally, I use -R for that reason.

because

here are some links for you doubters of the
dvd+r superiority:

http://www.dvdrw.com/press/duallayer.htm
http://news.designtechnica.com/article1883.html
Phillips shows Dual Layer is possible
and quite nicely backward compatibility
with dvd+r readers.

http://www.dvdrw.com/press/16x_dvdplusr.htm
Phillips is able to burn at 16 speed
a dvd+r media... We already have 8x +r
burners... Where is -R? oh, you like to wait?

http://www.cdfreaks.com/news/8742
Sony to release dual layer burner in April

http://www.cdfreaks.com/article/129
Another article about Dual Layer and
dvd-r and dvd+r... Sure, dvd-r team announced
dual layer media, but so far, only announced.
Phillips and Sony and Verbatim are delivering.

here are some links for you doubters of the
dvd+r superiority:

http://www.dvdrw.com/press/duallayer.htm
http://news.designtechnica.com/article1883.html
Phillips shows Dual Layer is possible
and quite nicely backward compatibility
with dvd+r readers.

http://www.dvdrw.com/press/16x_dvdplusr.htm
Phillips is able to burn at 16 speed
a dvd+r media... We already have 8x +r
burners... Where is -R? oh, you like to wait?

http://www.cdfreaks.com/news/8742
Sony to release dual layer burner in April

http://www.cdfreaks.com/article/129
Another article about Dual Layer and
dvd-r and dvd+r... Sure, dvd-r team announced
dual layer media, but so far, only announced.
Phillips and Sony and Verbatim are delivering.

Close, but not quite 9.4 GB. Here's a press release for Dual Layer DVD+Rs, for what its worth. 2004, they say.

Microsoft backs DVD+R take it as you will.

Considering DVD+R/+RW touts itself as being "the most compatible format." This is mentioned all over their website, especially in the FAQ. They claim a 95% compatibility rate with all DVD players and drives. Who wants to be the bad guy and tell them they're wrong?

"Technically, DVD+RW aren't even DVDs, since, in order to be a DVD, it must be approved by the DVD Forum. The +RW alliance, will have you believe otherwise; that they don't have to follow any standards and that the DVD Forum means nothing." Actually on the physical disk DVD-R/W is more like a CDR/W than a DVD. DVD+R/+RW is much more like a DVD-ROM than DVD-R/W. And to call it +R/RW it needs to follow the specs from the dvd+rw alliance" It may only have 85% compatablity buts thats because 15% of players when they come up against a booktype they don't know (DVD+R/W) they'll not even try to play it. if you're burning +R/W's on linux and using growisofs and the other dvd+r tools try using dvd+rw-booktype to set you dvd+r/rw's booktyep to DVD-ROM. You'd be surprised how effective it is. Take it easy.

DVD+R/W has some big supporters behind it, although the discs are about twice the costs of -R/W discs. If you're curious if it will work in your player, you might check out the Compatibility List at dvdrhelp.com. It's also a good place to find out which player to buy.

My votes go to the Koss KD305 available for $49.99 at Sears (plus option $7 service plan, unlike $30 at Best Buy) or the Norcent DP300 which is $39.99 at Amazon ($49.99 at Walmart). Both play darn near anything you can throw at them, and they're CHEAP!

I own the Koss 305 and simply love it.

DVD+R is backward compatible with consumer dvd players while DVD-R is not. www.dvdrw.com has a good faq. No idea on the blue types though.

Try some of these:

• dvdrw.com - Official DVD+RW Site
• dvdrhelp - lists some differences
• dvdplusrw.org - has some info on dvd+r plus some comparisons
• DVD FAQ
• Pioneer's Info
• DVD Forum - consortium supporting DVD and DVD-R, but not DVD+R

Info about DVD+R/W compatibility is here, and it's not nearly as bad as you make it out to be.

My DVD player reads DVD+R and DVD+RW just fine, and it's more than a year old.

It's actually called the DVD Forum, but so what? The same people tried to tell us that DVD-RAM discs were DVDs too - try playing one of those discs (or cartridges!) in your player and see how far you get. Clearly, the support of the DVD Forum doesn't count for much as far as compatibility goes. In my books, the greater industry weight on the side of the DVD Alliance counts for more.

It's true that the rollout of the 1st-gen DVD+RW drives was a joke. Thankfully, Philips and other manufactures did stand by their customers & offered refunds & exchanges - the notable exception was HP, who were eventually pressured into offering a paid "upgrade" to the 2nd-gen drives after much consumer backlash.

As for DVD+RW home entertainment devices, I count 8 different models on this list. They've been available for some time.

There's an awful lot of FUD surrounding the DVD+R/RW format, but why? It's just as compatible (2nd-gen drives at least), it's faster, it's more flexible, and it's almost the same price. I've seen more misinformation in this slashdot article than I have in the past 3 months of slashdot put together, which is saying something. Is someone spreading this doubt deliberately?

So? DVD+R is the officially supported standard of the DVD Alliance. They use a different logo, but IMHO the DVD Alliance members (HP, Phillips, Ricoh, Sony, Mitsubishi, Dell, Thomson, Yamaha, Verbatim etc) have at least as much industry clout. Certainly the approval of the DVD Forum means nothing as far as compatibility goes, or they wouldn't be putting the "offical" DVD logo on DVD-RAM drives (try reading a DVD-RAM disc [or cartrige!] in your home player sometime).

I just ordered a DVR-A04 for $299 I've seen the OEM for $249.

I've seen DVD+R discs for $3 from Meritline, and the Ricoh 5125A DVD+R/RW drive for $284 from Elegantshopping.com.

DVD-R discs are cheaper, true, since they have a year or two head start in scale, but the + discs have been dropping extremely fast considering they've only been on the market since April. Same with the drives. They are rapidly reaching price parity.

I myself paid more than that for my HP dvd200i 4 months ago (though it was the same price as the DVR-A04 at the place I bought it), and I've been very happy with it too. I would have been willing to pay a premium, since the 200i burned discs faster (more than twice as fast, in the case of rewritable discs) and it allows me to append video without having to reformat & rewrite the lot. There are other advantages too.

The reality is, DVD-R got there first and has had time to build a good-sized market base, but DVD+R is a better standard - equally compatible yet more flexible - and has been rapidly catching up in terms of price. I put my money on DVD+R and haven't regretted it since.

Ok, yes, as stated, DVD-R and DVD+R are not compatible (by compatible i mean that you can't burn '-R' discs in a '+R' burner and vice versa. However, a DVD+R is a DVD+RW minus the rewriteable aspect. DVD+RW was released first, and then they released DVD+Rs, which are cheaper than the DVD+RW discs. However, not all DVD+RWs can burn DVD+Rs. Only the newer ones can.

Info on DVD+R/+RWs

I am not quite sure I understand where Sony is coming from including a DVD-RW drive. From what I have read, they are completely DVD+RW driven, to the point of being a member of the alliance. The thing that irks me here is that this does not help the already splintered standard battle going on out there. On one hand you have Phillips, HP, Yamaha and Sony supporting DVD+RW, and on the other, you have Pioneer, Apple, and ..... Sony supporting DVD-RW. How can this be good for the end user?!

I agree. DVD+RW may not use the DVD standard, but it's being supported by a whole slew of big manufacturers. Since you're using it for special purpose data storage, maximum compatibility isn't important.

Many modern DVD players already support DVD+RW, and I'm sure support will only grow.

DVD-RAM seems to be pretty much incompatible with anything else.

The others are a mix of "it might work, depending on your player or DVD-ROM drive".

Check out VCDHelp for a nice, concise summary. (Despite several typos and grammatical errors.) In particular they make the DVDForum vs. DVD+RW Alliance division clear.

From your "FAQ," it appears that you have some kind of bias against the DVD+RW Alliance, who it should be noted, consists of Dell, Hewlett-Packard Company, MCC/Verbatim, Philips Electronics, Ricoh Company Ltd., Sony Corporation, Thomson multimedia and Yamaha Corporation. It's not some cobbled together group of fly-by-night companies.

Furthermore, I believe you are factually incorrect in stating that DVD+RW can't "legally" be called DVD. The DVD+RW Alliance seem to do so with impunity on their site. What is true is that their format is not licensed by the "DVD Forum" nor can it use their logo. But, big deal. The Alliance has its own logo which is just as pretty, and it seems to me that they are a fairly reliable manufacturing bunch. And who's the DVD Forum, anyway? Just another, larger group of companies. Interestingly, it would appear that all the members of the DVD+RW Alliance are also members of the DVD Forum, although not vice-versa, of course. Anyway, these two formats will duke it out on their respective merits and the marketing savvy of their proponents, and not on whether some licensing agency nobody cares about issues a logo. (I mean, DVD-RAM, how the hell does that get to be called DVD-anything? It's not even the same recording material as a regular DVD. I'll be nice and not discuss the "RAM" portion of the name. Let's just say Panasonic's been trying to mainstream this product line for many years and I wish them the best of luck.)

And as for confusion, how confused can people be? If slashdotters can wrap their heads around SIMM, DIMM, SODIMM, SDRAM, RDRAM, HTML, XML, XHTML, MathML, XSL, and so on, what's so hard about researching a couple of recordable DVD formats?

Of course, it's all a moot issue. Recordable blue-laser discs will be out in a couple of years and by that time, these two formats will have caught on about as much as the Sony HiFD and Imation LS120 did.