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HP DVD+R Writers Examined
tedgyz writes "CDR-Info has an article on the new DVD-writer lineup from HP - the dvd200i and dvd200e. Both of these models include support for DVD+R. In light of the recent review by "The Tech Report" noted in a recent slashdot article, this is a very important step in the evolution of recordable DVD." I've got a USB HP external burner which works great - I'm strongly considering buying one of these.
Has the format won been won or is it still going on?
/. effect...
How about a burner that can write in multiple formats, just in case DVD-R becomes the standard, not DVD+R
P.S. I couldn't read the article, cursed
--
Some weasel took the cork out of my lunch.
I've been searching via google for a while now and trying to find information on burning dvds with linux. There's cdrecord-PRO but its only for data. I've got a bunch of stuff on DV-tape that I'd like to make DVD playable DVD-Rs with. Is there any possibility for this using linux right now?
Chris Kuivenhoven is a thief, beware
It would have gone perfect with the article.
That's the question I have, when will it be affordable? DVD writers currently cost around $500, there's a few standards, and the disks cost $30. I'll stick with my CDrw for the time being.
"And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the World"
1 John 4:14
This site was /.'d VERY quickly! They must be running it off of a 56K voice line. Wouldn't it be nice to have an automatic google cached link for articles if it is available?
30% off web hosting. Coupon code "SLASHDOT".
I can just see Hemos holding his USB burner in his hands. Kind of reminiscent of Gwen Stefani on the cover of Tragic Kingdom?
Seriously, that "I'm seriously considering buying one of these" statement sounds like it's straight from a talking points memo from HP.
HP launches easy-to-use DVD writers Monday, 11 March 2002
Hewlett-Packard Compan today announced it will ship its latest super combination DVD writers, which allow customers to create and share custom CDs and DVDs using video, digital images, music and data. The HP DVD Writer dvd200i, a powerful internal drive, and the HP DVD Writer dvd200e, HP's first external DVD writer, include features making them very easy for consumers to use and enabling the creation of DVDs by notebook PC owners. Now, consumers can safely save their cherished memories -- everything from photos to custom-made home movies(1) -- with the confidence that they can't be erased or copied over. This new protection is made possible by the drives' support for the new DVD+R format. Additionally, DVD+R discs offer increased compatibility with most existing and future DVD-ROM drives and DVD video players.
According to a recent IDC report,(2) DVD writer shipments are expected to grow from 3.9 million units this year to 35 million in 2005. While consumers use rewritable DVD for a variety of applications, a primary benefit of HP's new products will be simplifying the transfer and editing of home video. In fact, in a recent HP consumer survey, 66 percent of respondents indicated video applications were the primary appeal of DVD writers.
``The idea of sending video highlights of a child's soccer game to Grandma on a personalized DVD really arouses consumer passion for DVD writers,'' said Dean Sanderson, product portfolio manager, HP Customer Business Organization, North America. ``As such, we are bundling with our DVD writers software that gives customers a quick and simple way to edit movie clips and allows anyone to produce great video.''
Also included with the drive is the latest MyDVD software by Sonic Solutions that offers powerful Edit-on-DVD technology, making it simple to change content already on a DVD+RW disc without going through the time-consuming process of rewriting an entire disc.
To support the variety of ways consumers use DVD writers, these new drives can write to several different media formats, including DVD+RW/+R and CD-R/RW. And, with the industry's fastest write speeds, the HP DVD Writer 200 series burns those discs quickly -- allowing consumers to write three hours of video to a DVD in less than 30 minutes.(3) The drives offer speeds of 2.4x (write), 2.4x (rewrite) and 8x (read). In addition, CD recording is simple and fast with 12x CD-R (write), 10x CD-RW (rewrite) and 32x CD (read) speeds.
Furthermore, the HP DVD Writer dvd200e drive allows customers to choose a connection type -- either IEEE 1394 or USB 2.0 -- with the flip of a switch, making it easy to install and share the drive on a desktop or notebook PC.
Pricing and Availability
The HP DVD Writer dvd200i drive is expected to be available at major retail outlets in the United States by mid-April at an estimated U.S. street price of $499.(4)
The HP DVD Writer dvd200e drive is expected to be available at major U.S. computer retail outlets in May at an estimated U.S. street price of $599.(4)
HP DVD+RW discs are currently available nationwide at an estimated U.S. street price of $10.99. HP DVD+R discs are expected to be available in April at an estimated street price of $5.99. At the same time, HP also will release a three-pack of DVD+RW discs at an estimated U.S. street price of $25.99 and a five-pack of DVD+R discs at an estimated U.S. street price of $27.99.
I notice HP is one of the sponsors that can be seen in the new ads. === I could have sworn we just had an article recently that talked about the state of DVD recording. Are we going to get a story everytime HP releases a new product?
for an article about writers, this one isn't getting as many posts as an article posted about listening... ;)
can u imagine a beowulf cluster of these?
I've got a USB HP external burner which works great
Hang on to it. You got the only one.
The poor RMA guys at HP know most of my coworkers by voice since we bought some of those.
--saint
I'd wager money whether that the site didn't change a single word from the press release at all.
Actually, here's the press release from HP directly. Yep, exactly the same as the article.
Pioneer DVR-AO3 can be found at pricewatch for under $380; DVD-RW media can be purchased for $4 each, again found through pricewatch. These prices reflect a drive that writes CD-R/CD-RW/dvd-rw/and dvd-r... (Note that for video compatibility, dvd-r runs around 95% with current players, while dvd-rw and dvd+rw both work with around 30% of current dvd players...) At any rate, I do highly recommend the Pioneer model mentioned above... I purchased it from MicroPro.Com ($379) 2 weeks ago, and media from QTCCDR.Com ($4/each). To put the cost of media in proper perspective, at this price, you would only pay 50 cents more for a 4.7 GB of mp3's on DVD-RW vs the same on 80min CD-R's (assuming 50 cents each...)
... or any other manufacturer (Philips, for example) that put out a 1st generation DVD+RW drive and refused to honor their promise to support DVD+R on those drives.
To make a long story short, HP, Philips, and others marketed their 1st gen drives as being DVD+RW, with DVD+R supported by a to-be-released firmware upgrade. Now, six months later, they (quietly) claim that the drives are physically unable to write to +R media, and are being elusive in making good on their promise to support that cheaper, more compatible media.
dvdplusrw.org is a great place to get more information on the media and current state of the community. It will also give you updates on what these manufacturers are doing to support their early-adopter customers.
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/020311/110222_1.html
------
Random, useless fact: I type in startx entirely with my left hand.
I bought a HP dvd100i dvd+rw about 2 months ago. I havent had any problems with it yet. My only gripe is the lack of decent dvd authoring tools. Granted, Ulead's dvd studio is available, but the menuing (is that a word?) leaves much to be desired. nevertheless its good to see that dvd burners are becoming more and more mainstream.
serously, does he LIKE slow burning? USB isnt very zippy. Would Hemos like to use the line printer port, or maybe COM1 for his DVD burner instead? =P
... i would have checked the article but im pretty sure that i can't get it cause it's been /.'d - but can you wrtie more than 4.8gb's yet? dont dvd's currently support 2 sides 2 layers per side making them capable of hold up to 18gb of info (roughly anyways). I'm all for the dvd writters when i know that they will do the full disc and not just one side one layer...
oh... just got the article - but damn is it slow comming... here's what it says....
Hewlett-Packard Compan today announced it will ship its latest super combination DVD writers, which allow customers to create and share custom CDs and DVDs using video, digital images, music and data. The HP DVD Writer dvd200i, a powerful internal drive, and the HP DVD Writer dvd200e, HP's first external DVD writer, include features making them very easy for consumers to use and enabling the creation of DVDs by notebook PC owners.
Now, consumers can safely save their cherished memories -- everything from photos to custom-made home movies(1) -- with the confidence that they can't be erased or copied over. This new protection is made possible by the drives' support for the new DVD+R format. Additionally, DVD+R discs offer increased compatibility with most existing and future DVD-ROM drives and DVD video players.
According to a recent IDC report,(2) DVD writer shipments are expected to grow from 3.9 million units this year to 35 million in 2005. While consumers use rewritable DVD for a variety of applications, a primary benefit of HP's new products will be simplifying the transfer and editing of home video. In fact, in a recent HP consumer survey, 66 percent of respondents indicated video applications were the primary appeal of DVD writers.
``The idea of sending video highlights of a child's soccer game to Grandma on a personalized DVD really arouses consumer passion for DVD writers,'' said Dean Sanderson, product portfolio manager, HP Customer Business Organization, North America. ``As such, we are bundling with our DVD writers software that gives customers a quick and simple way to edit movie clips and allows anyone to produce great video.''
Also included with the drive is the latest MyDVD software by Sonic Solutions that offers powerful Edit-on-DVD technology, making it simple to change content already on a DVD+RW disc without going through the time-consuming process of rewriting an entire disc.
To support the variety of ways consumers use DVD writers, these new drives can write to several different media formats, including DVD+RW/+R and CD-R/RW. And, with the industry's fastest write speeds, the HP DVD Writer 200 series burns those discs quickly -- allowing consumers to write three hours of video to a DVD in less than 30 minutes.(3) The drives offer speeds of 2.4x (write), 2.4x (rewrite) and 8x (read). In addition, CD recording is simple and fast with 12x CD-R (write), 10x CD-RW (rewrite) and 32x CD (read) speeds.
Furthermore, the HP DVD Writer dvd200e drive allows customers to choose a connection type -- either IEEE 1394 or USB 2.0 -- with the flip of a switch, making it easy to install and share the drive on a desktop or notebook PC.
Pricing and Availability
The HP DVD Writer dvd200i drive is expected to be available at major retail outlets in the United States by mid-April at an estimated U.S. street price of $499.(4)
The HP DVD Writer dvd200e drive is expected to be available at major U.S. computer retail outlets in May at an estimated U.S. street price of $599.(4)
HP DVD+RW discs are currently available nationwide at an estimated U.S. street price of $10.99. HP DVD+R discs are expected to be available in April at an estimated street price of $5.99. At the same time, HP also will release a three-pack of DVD+RW discs at an estimated U.S. street price of $25.99 and a five-pack of DVD+R discs at an estimated U.S. street price of $27.99.
and look, nothing that I can see about recordable sizes... anyone else got any info about this?
This is not news. this is just a verbatim copy of the HP press release.
Watch the Teaser Trailer for "The Lightning Thief" Her
They're going to call it Super-Duper Drive.
I've been searching via google for a while now and trying to find information on burning dvds with linux. There's cdrecord-PRO but its only for data.
... the color space limitatino of DV (4:1:1) coupled with the MPEG2 artifacts of DVD make the two in combination somewhat undesirable for me. I'd rather burn a half hour of good quality video onto a DVD and be required to use a computer to watch it (hell, my computer IS my television, anyway), at better resolutions and without the ugly artifacts, than accept the compromises of both DV and DVD just so I can play it in grandma's region-coded, MPAA crippled DVD player. Far better to build her a small computer with the appropriate software on it, instead.
It is also impossible to get any information out of the author on how to actually go about paying the $100 he wants for cdrecord-PROdvd, as I and many others who wanted to buy the product discovered. The author didn't answer any of the three separate emails (on three different occasions) I sent, nor any of the questions posted in public forums (USENET in particular) by numerous people. One guy who asked he flamed into oblivion, others he told "email me", and still others, myself included, were simply ignored.
This delayed my purchase of a Pioneer DVR-A03 DVD-RW burner by about a year. However, three days after the Free Software Foundations fork of cdrtools, entitled dvdrtoos, made its appearance I purchased a Pioneer drive (since that is what the software fork's author has) and have been burning data DVDs ever since.
The author's goal is to support the burning of video DVDs, but the software isn't there yet. However, I'm still waiting for a better CODEC was well
So here's to holding out for ogg-tarkin!
In the meantime, at least I have a place to burn my high-bitrate MPEG4 recordings of Star Trek Enterprise to (two episodes a disk and far better quality than videotape will allow, though still with enough annoying artifacts that I don't want to use it for my own work).
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
I bought my first HP 2X cd reader for $999 at J&R Muci in NYC. It came with Compton's Encylopedia, which listed for $400 at the time. Sheesh. Still have that drive on a shelf.
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain with all your metadata.
"I've got a USB HP external burner which works great - I'm strongly considering buying one of these."
As opposed to the stolen one from Mexico you're currently using ??
On pricewatch.com you can find CD'rs for 13cents in bulk. So a Gig cost 20cts. A gig of DVD-RW is 85cents and a gig of DVD-R (at 2 bucks each) is 42cents. Im thinking of switching anyways, but dont feel like spending $300 for a writer just now.
I took a look at the DVD-player compatibility chart in the Tech Report article mentioned yesterday. A couple of years ago, I snagged an Apex AD600A. The one Apex model in their list didn't fare so well (neither did most of the others), but most of the DVD-ROM drives took anything you threw at them. If I were to get a DVD burner and my DVD player were to have trouble with the type of media produced by the burner, what are the odds that the problem would be solved by swapping out the DVD-ROM mechanism in the player with a newer one? (It would be nice if they had tested the different media against an AD600A, given how many of them got snapped up back when.)
20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
I'm assuming it's a CD-RW you guys are talking about, otherwise 4.8G of data at 1.1MBps == >> 4000s --> 3600sph == >> 1hour per DVD ;.;
GPL Deconstructed
This is no more than PR propaganda from HP. This was copied word for word from HP's press release on Yahoo.
Doesn't Slashdot read the stuff people submit?
Looks like we're closer than I thought to being able to burn our home videos to DVD, all with free(dom) software!
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
USB 2.0 is very zippy.
So is Firewire.
Double layer discs are very unlikely. It wouldn't be easy to burn to the underneath layer.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
Check the packaging of a DVD+R/RW sometime... what? No DVD logo?
maybe that is because DVD+* is not endorsed by DVD forum (creators and licensors of DVD)!
Get a DVD-R/RW drive. It IS the standard, not some B.S. that some computer manufacturers invented.
It might look like a duck, walk like a duck, but it ain't a friggin duck!
I guess you havn't heard of USB 2.0? It was slow in the 1.0-1.1 specs, but it has been GREATLY improved upon with the 2.0 specs...
USB 2.0 extends the speed of the peripheral-to-PC connection from 12 Mbits/s on USB 1.1 to 480 Mbits/s -- 40 times more than current capabilities.
Brush up on your specs before posting something like this, even if you are anonymous.
Unless you have really expensive equipment I don't see how you could make a decent DVD at home. OTOH, you can make a VCD with modest equipment and cheap or even free software.
...and DoS-ing them.
/.ed.
For god's sake, when are you going to add article caching to Slashdot? Unless it's a Yahoo or CNN article, the thing is always
You're just jealous.
So DVD+RW is so good for movies, and DVD-R is so darn compatible, and DVD+RW obviously has little to do with DVD+R (otherwise they would have come out at the same time).
Why don't those stupid corps give up their turf wars and do a DVD+RW + DVD-R drive?
What exactly IS the diff btwn DVD-R vs DVD+R if they both read on normal DVD players?
Looks like my Apex doesn't like the DVD-R or DVD-RW. So much for the DVD standards. Whereas the DVD+RW of my HP pavilion 780n does work in it. :)
My personal experience with almost every leading-edge HP product has been *completely* without joy. With the constantly shifting version numbers of many MS products with which I am forced to deal, HP compounds almost everything they touch with late-to-market drivers, poor functionality and outright inexplicably user-hostile attitudes towards distributing things when they DO come out.
Let 'em get their money from someone else.
I found a great Pioneer DVD burner, it comes in a package deal. It just has this unsightly iMac dealy attached to it, but comes with the software to burn data and movies to the discs. I figure $1800 for an entire computer that can run BSD and burn DVD's is a better deal than a $650 burner by itself anyway...oh...and that price included the software.
USB 2.0 is still better suited for low end hardware due to the design of the bus itself. I'm going to look for the white paper Adaptec put out on bus technologies including USB and Firewire as well as ATA and SCSI. I couldn't find the White paper, but here is a nice article on the subject of Firewire 1.x, USB 1.x-2 and has a little about FIrewire 2.0.
. ht ml
http://www.zepa.net/hypermail/elug/2001/04/0089
Guys, this is nothing new. As someone who has had a DVD-RAM drive, working in Linux since 1998, I've followed Sony/Philip's "non-standards" since 1995.
They "broke off" from the DVD consortium and introduced a 3.0GB DVD-R/W "standard" that never shipped back in 1999. They have broken promise after promise after promise, again and again and again. I figured DVD+R would be more of the same -- and we've yet to see the "compatibility" tests to see if it is "as good" as DVD-R(G).
Meanwhile, both Panasonic DVD-RAM (3rd gen, 2001) and Pioneer DVD-RW (2000) drives write DVD-R(G), a near-100% compatible standard. Not only are 3rd gen DVD-RAM drives sub-$300, but the DVD-R(G) disks are sub-$3/each! And the cdrecord 1.11 test releases support DVD-R(G) recording.
If you just need backup, DVD-RAM works great in Linux now as a "packet writer" (i.e. like a generic, random access disk -- has for 4 years!) and has a longer shelf-life (especially in the 2-sided, cartridged version) with 100x the rewritability of either DVD-RW or DVD+RW (100,000x v. 1,000x). Unfortunately, it's not player compatible (because they don't have the added logic and laser wavelength required) because it was designed as the new, universal, optical archiving format (and not a consuemr one). Hence why it's for archiving, not consumer use.
-- Bryan "TheBS" Smith
Independent Author, Consultant and Trainer
Nice journalism, Slashdot. Can I buy a front-page mention, too?
See my other post. While the DVD consortium standardized on DVD-R and DVD-RAM back in the early '90s, Sony/Philips saw an opportunity to break away from the consortium. One reason was that Pioneer's DVD-R, DVD-R(A) at the time, was expensive ($10K+!), and Panasonic's $500 DVD-RAM was designed for optical archiving (long story, but its not designed for consumers), and could only hold 2.6GB/side at the time. Sony/Philips had a 3GB design that could also record/rewrite CD-R/RW as well. They called this "standard" DVD-R+W
But Sony/Philips soon "woke up" to the reality of their design took too long to build -- over 3 years! By the time their 3GB drive was ready to "hit the market" in 2000, Panasonic had delievered its sub-$500 2nd-gen 4.7GB/side DVD-RAM drive and Pioneer released sub-$1K DVD-R(G) drive. So the 3GB DVD-R+W drive never saw the light of day, and S/P went "back to work" on an "improved" DVD-R+W drive. This would become DVD+RW
Well, even before DVD+RW finally hit in 2001, Panasonic had released a 3rd gen DVD-RAM which was a 2nd gen DVD-RAM + DVD-R(G), and Pioneer had come out with its consumer DVD-RW drive, which also did CD-R/RW as well as DVD-R(G). So basically DVD-R(G) _is_ the standard for recordable DVD, and DVD-RW is the consumer rewritable, and DVD-RAM is the optical archiving rewritable.
Now you've got the requirement of a second gen DVD+RW drive just to get DVD+R. And I haven't seen any compatibility testing to show its as good as DVD-R. If DVD+R is only as compatible as DVD+RW, then it's only around 70%. Although that is the same as DVD-RW, and much better than DVD-RAM), it's still not as good as the 99.9% compatibility of DVD-R(G), which is now done by _all_ competiting drives. Worse yet, you can get the 3rd gen Panasonic drive for less than $300 and the rewrite capability it has been working in Linux for years (and cdrecord/DVD-R(G) is in beta testing).
Sony/Philips has proven they are consistently "behind the times" and they flat out make promises they canNOT keep! As such, this whole DVD+R announcement does NOT shock me at all.
-- Bryan "TheBS" Smith
Independent Author, Consultant and Trainer
Basicly they could very well exist, but you'd have to turn them manually, no place to write anything at all. Likewise with cds, have you seen any push for double-sided CDs? They just don't provide much value over 2 normal DVDs/CDs. Now double layer would be nice but the laser power needs to go *way* up to burn a second level, so don't expect it in any prosumer/consumer device anytime soon.
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
DVD+R uses a similar dye-based, write-once medium, like DVD-R, giving it an equal chance of compatibility. In fact, basd on my research, the DVD+R might even be more compatible. It shares the same characteristics of DVD+RW in terms of how the writer identifies a disc and aligns itself for writing.
When you look at DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD+R, and DVD+RW, they can be categorized along two axes:
1) R vs RW
The key difference here is in the physical recording medium. Write-once media uses dyes, which have relatively high reflectivity and thus play well with DVD-ROM/DVD-Players. Rewriteable media uses organic phase-change compounds that have low reflectivity, and hence confuse many DVD-ROM/DVD-Players.
2) + vs -
The DVD+R(W) vs DVD-R(W) discs differ in how they "communicate" to the writer. Essentially, writable discs have extra info not seen on stamped discs and ignored by readers. This info tells the writer what type of disc it is, and how to align itself for writing. DVD-R(W) uses groove recording with address info in the land areas. DVD+R(W) uses high-frequency wobbled grooves, which the writer uses to align to the disc.
Of course, Jim Taylor explains it better than I can in his DVD FAQ. I highly recommend his book "DVD Demystified Second Edition". Although it doesn't cover DVD+R, the updated FAQ does. This book really should be called "Home Audio and Video Demystified". The explanation of aspect ratios for 4:3 and 16:9 TVs is worth the cost of the book!
"No matter where you go, there you are." -- Buckaroo Banzai
The fact remains that on Pricewatch 70% of the items are incorrectly listed, another 20% are sold from 'questionable' stores, either with no security license or with no actual way of ordering online, and the rest are priced, well, 'normally'.
Suffice it to say that Pricewatch isn't exactly the best gauging tool for actual prices.
[insert witty comment here]