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Wrong bogeyman - It's all good (as in a "progressive worsening of civil and human rights/Censorship") because they are paying their international debt owed, at the expense of civil and human rights. Venezuela is the only petro-state with a debt over 50% of the GDP.

If the Venezuelans kicked out the corrupt, started nationalizing anything owned by foreign companies and/or stopped paying any odious international debts and started putting the inerests of common Venezuelans before their debt obligations, then suddenly civil and human rights and censorship would become an "issue" for the world to "label Maduro a dictator or demanding the OAS' Democratic Charter be activated.". A sad, hypocritical reality, really...

You must be new... to Venezula. They used to have private TV broadcasters (Score:5, Informative)

If you'll look up this thread, you'll see I got into it by telling that guy about all the other stations that were not closed and expropriated. My information, which was correcting his disinformation, was modded down.

What about his claim that Chavez has already closed down and expropriated them?

While it is true that Chavez only closed and expropriated one TV station, he also gained complete control of the rest (except one, but he is already working on that). At the same time he has launched countless TV, radio stations and newspapers for no other purpose than promoting his personal agenda.
Also note that "not renewing" a license is one thing, and expropriating equipment without proper compensation is a complete different one.

While looking up your thread, I found you posted:

So when it came time for their license to be renewed, years later, they were denied. They didn't close down, they're still on cable.

For your information, the channel went to cable, only to be closed again by Chavez.

By the way, Lucas Rincon was appointed by Chavez as Minister of Interior and Justice after the coup, and later on Ambassador to Portugal. So if Rincon's statement was a lie, how can you explain his current high ranking position in the government?

Didn't he change his mind in the middle of the coup and help Hugo in the end? Maybe he didn't care about the statement because he was very happy they kidnapped him instead of shooting him and saying a different lie.

But how can I explain that Hugo had him shipped out to another continent? Oh, I don't know, why do you think he'd want that guy to live comfortably far, far away? If I'd guess I would probably just think he owed him a favor, but he didn't trust him enough to have him around.

Who knows what was in Lucas Rincon's mind? Certainly not me let alone you.
Something you should know about Venezuela's politics is that the best positions are ambassadors. Its way better to live in any european country than in Venezuela, and besides its a fairly low profile job with high salary.

I don't know why you work so hard in defending a tyrant, but just FYI, I have lived all my life in Venezuela, am educated and read the news almost every day. I know what I'm talking about, and there are some things you will never understand about Venezuela unless you actually lived here before Chavez was in power.

Boy, that Chavez really must hate democracy. Imagine getting elected by 70 percent of the population in a ballot declared 'Free And Fair' by international observers, the nerve of that guy!

In fact, Chavez loves democracy, because when it doesn't work for him he can just twist it to his wishes.

See, at the beginning he was so popular that it was easy to win elections cleanly. But now that he lost support he rigs elections, politically persecutes his opponents, or simply disregards its outcome.

In Venezuela you can't get a job in any of the state controlled companies if you have voted against Chavez.
This is a serious problem in a country where the state controls the oil industry, electric companies, banks, telecommunications and most of the media, and where all the powers are subjugated to one man's desires. After such a precedent, how can anybody expect the people to participate freely in any elections against Chavez?

Now he's promoting Free And Fair elections in other countries too? Well, we just can't have that!

I don't think that sneaking suitcases with millions of dolars of Venezuelan money to his favorite candidates in Latin America counts as promoting Free And Fair elections.
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1654511,00.html
http://english.eluniversal.com/2009/11/26/en_pol_art_venezuelan-businessm_26A3120691.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maletinazo

I take it you approve of the military coup in Honduras then, with its sham elections conducted in complete violation of the country's constitution? Maybe we should just let the Pentagon decide who gets to be president of the Latin American countries again, like in Reagan's reign of error. Those people can't be trusted to elect someone who supports the interests of the multi-national mega-corps over their own citizenry like the Americans do.

I never even mentioned Honduras, in fact, I don't approve the coup, so try to keep your current job, cause mind reading is not your thing.

Boy, that Chavez really must hate democracy. Imagine getting elected by 70 percent of the population in a ballot declared 'Free And Fair' by international observers, the nerve of that guy!

In fact, Chavez loves democracy, because when it doesn't work for him he can just twist it to his wishes.

See, at the beginning he was so popular that it was easy to win elections cleanly. But now that he lost support he rigs elections, politically persecutes his opponents, or simply disregards its outcome.

In Venezuela you can't get a job in any of the state controlled companies if you have voted against Chavez.
This is a serious problem in a country where the state controls the oil industry, electric companies, banks, telecommunications and most of the media, and where all the powers are subjugated to one man's desires. After such a precedent, how can anybody expect the people to participate freely in any elections against Chavez?

Now he's promoting Free And Fair elections in other countries too? Well, we just can't have that!

I don't think that sneaking suitcases with millions of dolars of Venezuelan money to his favorite candidates in Latin America counts as promoting Free And Fair elections.
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1654511,00.html
http://english.eluniversal.com/2009/11/26/en_pol_art_venezuelan-businessm_26A3120691.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maletinazo

I take it you approve of the military coup in Honduras then, with its sham elections conducted in complete violation of the country's constitution? Maybe we should just let the Pentagon decide who gets to be president of the Latin American countries again, like in Reagan's reign of error. Those people can't be trusted to elect someone who supports the interests of the multi-national mega-corps over their own citizenry like the Americans do.

I never even mentioned Honduras, in fact, I don't approve the coup, so try to keep your current job, cause mind reading is not your thing.

I don't think the US should do anything outside their borders. We are fine as we are right now.

I assume you are not from Cuba or Venezuela, because they really are not fine right now.
I'm sure if there was any way to conduct a clean poll, completely secret and without any fears of repercussion, the majority in these countries would favor a government change.
Maybe not in the case of Cuba, because they have been brainwashed for so many years now. Sadly, this will also be the case in Venezuela if nobody does anything in the next few years.

Saying that Chavez can influence Argentina is an insult to Argentina as a regional power.

Chavez financed Argentina's president campaign using Venezuela's state owned oil company money:
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1654511,00.html
http://english.eluniversal.com/2009/11/26/en_pol_art_venezuelan-businessm_26A3120691.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maletinazo

About Honduras... I don't know what you think about Honduras, but Chavez is very much in line about that issue with Brazil and the rest of Mercosur.

What I think about Honduras is that the supreme court of Honduras wanted to spare the country the dark reality that the people of Cuba and Venezuela are living right now. I'm not justifying their actions, I don't think the end justifies the means, but at least they did it for the right reasons.

These three airships that Caracas town council has just bought from South Korea (and hope to begin using in late 2007) are essentially mobile cameras. They are not really any more or less disturbing than the proliferation of CCTV cameras in our cities.

As a civil libertarian, I am in favour of strict limits on the amount of video surveillance that we are subject to, but I do not wish to jump to conclusions regarding a city council who are no doubt making a good-faith attempt to reduce crime in a very dangerous area.

Above all, this should not be used as a vile pretext to demonise President Hugo Chávez, who, despite his myriad flaws, is the leader with the strongest democratic support anywhere in the New World. Bear in mind, in particular, that the argument "many dictators started off by being elected" can be used against any elected president in the entire world, and is therefore worthless.

(Additional information from this article in Spanish.)

Yes you can argue of a relationship between majority and dictatorship. A simple majority implies an active opposition. A majority of say 60% implies many people are for a particular issue. Chavez won with 68% of the vote. This is 68% of the popular vote and it is extremely difficult to get. This does imply a lack of opposition through intimidation, rampant populism, or some other ways and means.

I consider America, Canada, and most European countries as true democracies. Take a look at election results and you will rarely see a 2/3 victory. In most countries 2/3 of the vote is necessary to make constitutional changes because usually it is very very difficult to get 2/3 of the vote.

Since Chavez and his cronies have over 2/3 of the vote they can do whatever they please and do not have to ask anybody for permission. Up to this point Chavez was a populist leader, now he is becoming a populist dictator, and in four years when he suppresses the opposition he will have become an official dictator.

Here are the things Chavez is doing that can be construed as dictator:

Price Controls:

http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/index.ssf?/base/news -11/1175232470107850.xml&coll=1

- He used to take home $930 a month from his butcher shop at the Guacaipuro Market. But that ended when the Venezuelan government cracked down on butchers and grocers who were selling products above price controls.

Nationalization:

http://www.pslweb.org/site/News2?JServSessionIdr00 4=o9k4jttqk2.app7b&page=NewsArticle&id=6573&news_i v_ctrl=1261

- On Jan. 8, Venezuelan president Hugo Chávez sent tremors through the international capitalist market when he announced a new wave of nationalizations. These nationalizations would eliminate foreign control over the country's largest telecommunications and electricity companies.

Freedom of the press:

http://english.eluniversal.com/2007/03/23/en_ing_a rt_press-freedom-is-det_23A848043.shtml
http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/03/17/ap352649 9.html

- Venezuela is intensifying a campaign against the media criticizing President Hugo Chávez' attempts at seizing freedom of expression for his self-proclaimed socialist revolution, the Inter-American Press Association said on Monday.
- Press freedom watchdogs have accused Chavez of using the judiciary and new legislation restricting broadcast content to silence critics. Chavez denies threatening press freedoms and accuses Venezuela's privately owned media of conspiring to topple his government.

Yes Chavez is moving into dictatorship!

Disclaimer: i am venezuelan, and not a follower of Chavez.

This is partially true. Originally, the goverment was part-owner of Smarmatic. No wonder they got chosen to supply the hardware for elections here.

As soon as the public found out, they sold their percentage of ownership.

The hardware smartmatic sells is a model that was intended to be used in Lottery calculations (source: http://buscador.eluniversal.com/2004/06/14/pol_art _pol1.shtml/ )

http://www.eluniversal.com/2004/09/10/en_pol_art_1 0A491715.shtml

Tulio Alvarez: Cantv has confirmed vote fraud suspicions

Lawyer Tulio Alvarez Friday said a statement telephone company Cantv issued Thursday as to the communications voting machines were capable to establish with the National Electoral Council (CNE) vote counting center during the August 15 recall referendum on President Hugo Chávez did ratify the opposition's claims that a vote fraud took place during the election.

I was constantly watching the Venezuelan affair for personal reasons, and you must understand that the Carter Center and the OAS merely endorsed the initial count, and did not actually stay around to certify the actual paper count which was to take place later that Monday (the IHT article alludes to this). Furthermore, the opposition had not been allowed to be present at the official receipt counting, making it somewhat suspicious as well.

Lastly, the most suspicious activity was the refusal of the electoral council's refusal to allow any exit polls as well as refusing to do ANY on-the-spot monitored recounts even in select precincts (that would have double-checked that the machines were indeed recording the correct votes)

Here are some recent news articles claiming fraud, including a short English summary of a claim filed on possible fraud by El Universal.

More (admittedly anti-Chavez) links include Venezuela News and Views and vcrisis.com. Judge, based on this, and the news you can read elsewhere and make up your own mind.

I can't beleive the great Lina Ron is posting on Slashdot! I'm a great admiror of your work, I always follow your movements, like this and this.
</sarcasm>

The truth is that this country doesn't have a penny.
We have huge amounts of oil, and the oil price is just fine right now, but I don't know where the goverment is spending our money, oh wait, now I remember that new 65 million dollar toy the president bought.
And we are getting new taxes raises on moday.

By the way, I am venezuelan, and I am using linux in my PC.
I like KDE more than Gnome and use Emacs more often than VI.
Just thought this should be in slashdot's frontpage, I'll send in the story.