Slashdot Mirror

← Back to Domains

Domain: rsf.fr

Stories and comments across the archive that link to rsf.fr.

Comments · 24

  1. Re:"They hate us for our freedom!" by 10Ghz · · Score: 1 · on Indymedia Server Raided by FBI
    Leaving 10Ghz's childish ad-hominems aside


    Well, you were the one making those moronic "In USA we have life, liberty and property, unlike those in Europe"-comments.

    Its provisions for 'social security' aka welfare-rights are radically different in kind from the rights guaranteed in the US constitution.


    And, of couse, you automatically assume that the US Constitution is somehow superior?

    My right to free speech is the right to be free from government censorship/penalty for speaking my mind.


    Untill FBI comes along, that is?

    Welfare rights, OTOH, are rights to goods, not to freedom of action.


    "Welfare rights" are rights to certain set of services, no matter what your economic or social status might be. They do not say that "you have the right to a state-sponsored car". They do say something like "you have the right to educate yourself". So they ARE "freedom of action". Your means of educating yourself (for example) are not held back by your financial status.

    Where is this freedom for those doctors, other healthcare providers, and taxpayers footing the burden?


    Those doctors are free to work in private hospitals for example (and many of them do). They are not forced to work in some public hospitals in any shape or form. AFAIK Finland doesn't spend that much of it's GDP on healthcare when compared to other countries.

    Where is the freedom and equality for this minority?


    What freedoms are you referring to? There are plenty of achievers in Finland. Plenty of people start their own businesses and succeed.

    next time remind me to slam your Finlands 'national service' conscription thing. Freedom my ass.


    How is that different from (for example) paying taxes? You are required to pay taxes even in your beloved USA. Does that make you less free?

    And lets talk about military facts for a while, shall we? Let's assume Finland moved to all-volunteer professional army. Now, size of that army would be radically smaller than it is now (about 300.000). My guesstimate would be around 20.000 - 30.000. Now, the border between the Enemy (Russia) and Finland is about 1.340 kilometers long. How do you defend a border that long with just 30.000 men while having some kind of strategic reserve at your disposal? Answer: you don't. It's very easy to talk from USA and say "you should do things differently". You are not a tiny country living next to a behemoth that has tried to invade you several times during your history! Professional army would not work in a country like Finland. That is a fact.

    But, if you are too much of a pussy to serve, you are free to do civil service instead. But still, overwhelming majority of men serve willingly. And some women volunteer to serve as well.

    I find it rather surprising that you are trying to paint Finland as some kind of oppressive state. We don't have Patriot-act. Secret Police doesn't snoop what books we borrow from libraries. Secret Police doesn't confiscate hard-drives that contain "undesireable" info.

    In Freedom of the Press-ranking Finland is Nr. 1. USA is 17th. So, which is more free there?

    Freedom my ass.
  2. Re:FYI: Worldwide Press Freedom Index... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative · on North Korea Opens Official Website

    Here's 2003's.

    1: Finland, Iceland, Netherlands, Norway (tie)
    ...
    11: Latvia
    12: Estonia,Slovakia,Switzerland, Czech Republic (tie)
    16: Austria
    ...
    30: Timor Leste
    31: Greece, United States of America (tie)
    33: Poland
    ...
    42: Ecuador, Spain (tie)
    44: Japan, Israel (tie)
    46: Madagascar
    ...
    48: Ghana
    49: South Korea
    50: Australia
    51: Bolivia, Macedonia (tie)
    53: Panama, Italy (still worst EU country) (tie)
    55: Peru
    ...
    59: Fiji, Romania (tie)
    61: Republic of China (Taiwan)
    62: Botswana
    ...
    122: Jordan, United Arab Emirates (tie)
    124: Ethiopia, Swaziland, Iraq (under Saddam Hussein) (tie)
    127: Democratic Republic of Congo
    128: India, Pakistan (tie)
    130: Palestinian Authority (under Yasser Arafat)
    131: Morocco
    132: Liberia, Ukraine (tie)
    134: Afghanistan
    135: Iraq (under George W. Bush)
    136: Yemen
    ...
    145: Maldives
    146: Palestinian Authority (under Ariel Sharon)
    147: Colombia
    ...
    160: Iran
    161: People's Republic of China
    162: Eritrea
    ...
    165: Cuba
    166: North Korea (dead last again)

    Last year, the report combined Israel's actions in all its territories; this year, they separated pre-1967 Israel from the West Bank + Gaza Strip, and did the same for the US in Iraq. It's interesting to see how relatively free democracies can act in war zones compared to their own people's cities. Also, I'm surprised to see India and Pakistan in the same spot. I thought India had a freer press than Pakistan. In 2002, they were 80th to Pakistan's 119th.

  3. FYI: Worldwide Press Freedom Index... by plj · · Score: 4, Interesting · on North Korea Opens Official Website

    ...can be found here. Note: published at October 2002!

    Some countries of interest:

    1. Finland
    ...
    15. Switzerland & Costa Rica
    17. United States
    18. Hong Kong
    ...
    35. Taiwan
    ...
    38. Bulgaria
    39. South Korea
    40. Italy (the worst country of EU-15; hurrah, Berlusconi!)
    41. Czech Republic (back then not yet an EU member state)
    ...
    92. Israel (no Arab country performed in top 50, either)
    ...
    104. Afghanistan (year after collapse of the Taliban regime)
    ...
    130. Iraq (still Saddam's regime)
    ...
    138. People's Republic of China
    139. North Korea (the last one)

  4. Re:Here we go .... by Rei · · Score: 5, Informative · on PBS Feels FCC Chill On Censorship

    Well, to be fair, we're only#17 in terms of media freedom. Of course, that's out of 139. While I'd rather we be up there with Finland, I'm just glad we're not down there anywhere from Israel (#92) to North Korea (dead last at #139).

  5. Re:Dudley Hiibel's side by 10Ghz · · Score: 1 · on U.S. Supreme Court: Public Anonymity No Right
    No, since Finland (which is a country that enjoys a large amount of political freedom, similar to the US) has a high tax rate, it is arguably less free than the US.


    We have same-sex marriage, do you? No? That's what I thought. How about real religious freedom (not that "one nation, under God"-crap)? Freedom of education (even for the poor)? Right to healthcare (even for the poor)? There seems to be awfully lot of freedoms USA does not have, yet I have them right now.

    I find it rather interesting how USA is "more free" because it has lower tax-rate. But suddenly those other countries with even lower tax-rate are not as free since "Tax rate is not the only determinant of freedom.". So, how can you all of a sudden make the claim that Finland is "less free" than USA because it has higher tax-rate, when 5 seconds later you say that "Tax rate is not the only determinant of freedom"? To me, it seems like you are defining the word "freedom" in such way that it just conveniently places USA as the most free country in the world.

    But, I guess according to you, all the freedoms I have in Finland that Americans do not matter, since Finland has higher tax-rate and is therefore automatically "less free". But if some other country had the same freedoms as USA did with even lower tax-rate, it would not be more free than USA since "Tax rate is not the only determinant of freedom"?

    And what makes you think that USA has as much "freedom" as Finland does? I have already mentioned freedoms that I have, yet Americans do not have them. And lets look at some other facts: freedom of the press: Finland 1. in the world, USA 31.!. So what were you saying about "freedom" again? No, don't tell me: "That does not matter since Finland has higher tax-rate, and is therefore less free than USA is". Uh-huh.

    And what about political freedom? I find it interesting that the candidate that gets the most votes does not necessarily win in the USA (as happened in the previous presidental elections), like he would in Finland. So it seems to me that the actual votes matter more in Finland than they do in USA.
  6. Re:What about ads you can only see here? by Net_Wakker · · Score: 1 · on 10 Ads The US Won't See
    And where are you that you think you have more freedom of speech than the US?
    In Finland, Iceland, the Netherlands, Norway, Denmark, Trinidad and Tobago, Belgium, Germany, Sweden, Canada, Latvia, the Czech Republic, Estonia, Slovakia, Switzerland, Austria, Ireland, Lithuania, New Zealand, Slovenia, Hungary, Jamaica, South Africa, Costa Rica, Uruguay, France, United Kingdom, Portugal, Benin, Timor-Leste and Greece.
    See the second world press freedom ranking.
  7. Re:Aren't Buchanan and Limbaugh voices of dissent? by dipipanone · · Score: 1 · on Tennessee's Super-DMCA Rises From The Grave

    OK, so don't take my word for it, try this instead. Reporters without Borders have just issued their second league table of press freedoms.

    The Netherlands is in joint first place. The USA comes in in 31st place.

  8. Open Government since 1766 by SgtChaireBourne · · Score: 1 · on Secret Irish Data Repository Uncovered

    Within limits, government records in Sweden have been open to the public by default since 1766. It's part of the constitution. Had the E.U. had such safeguards, millions (billions?) of EUR would have been saved by avoiding the pay scandals a few years ago.

    The U.S. could use it as well. Strangely, the situation leading into the adoption of Offentlighetsprincipen bears some semblance to the current situation in the U.S. One party took power, blocked access to government records to political opponentds and started a war. It took decades to sort out, but the result was modifying the constitution. Few countries come close on freedom of information and, as a side effect, on the freedom of press index.

    </Gratuituous plug for Open Government>

  9. Worldwide Press Freedom Index by ke4roh · · Score: 1 · on Robin Gross and IP Justice
    Reporters Without Borders did either the study of which you speak or another one just like it. Read the press release here.

    Quick rundown: Finland, Iceland, Norway, and Netherlands tied for 1st place. Slovenia (14) and Costa Rica (15) also beat the United States (17). China (138) and North Korea (139) finish up the list.

  10. Worldwide Press Freedom Index by ke4roh · · Score: 1 · on Robin Gross and IP Justice
    Reporters Without Borders did either the study of which you speak or another one just like it. Read the press release here.

    Quick rundown: Finland, Iceland, Norway, and Netherlands tied for 1st place. Slovenia (14) and Costa Rica (15) also beat the United States (17). China (138) and North Korea (139) finish up the list.

  11. Re:American Press Is Far From Free by RobinH · · Score: 2, Insightful · on Publication Bans In A Borderless World

    Reporters Without Borders worldwide press freedom index

    Does anyone else notice that the scores seem to correlate with distance from the north pole? I've also noticed that the UN "best countries to live in" list often shows the same tendency.

  12. American Press Is Far From Free by Myriad · · Score: 1 · on Publication Bans In A Borderless World
    I can only be thankful that I live in the land of Freedom to the south. Such behavior would even make people like John Ashcroft blush.

    That's a pretty ignorant statement to be making my American friend.

    First off it's an issue regarding a fair trial and juries. But even aside from that:

    You claim that this behavior would make Americans blush? Well, start blushing:
    If you bother to check out the Reporters Without Borders worldwide press freedom index you would see that the United States ranks a paltry 17th with a score of 4,75. Meanwhile, Canda ranks 5th (while 1st through 4th are a tie at 0,50 so arguably Canada is 2nd) with a 0,75. And yes, lower is better.

    So, just how free is your press in the "land of Freedom to the South"? Apparently not as free as you thought.

  13. Or, The United States by Myriad · · Score: 1 · on Lindows' Heavy Hand Leads to Summit Dropouts
    And the press is free to call attention to it, and we're free to criticize it. You don't like it, move to North Korea.

    Or you could live in the United States. For a country that constantly screams about freedoms, their freedom of the press doesn't rate all that highly.

    Sorry to those who feel it is OT. I just really hate it when people make remarks like "move to North Korea". (especially as, I suspect, said person is an American. Though I could be wrong on that).

  14. Sensorship is not only a problem in China.. by joonasl · · Score: 2, Insightful · on Amnesty Calls Shenannigans on MS, Sun, Cisco
    Reporters Without Borders published a worldwide "press freedom index". Sadly, US was ranked 17th and was left behind by countries like Costa Rica and Slovenia.
    The poor ranking of US was explained:
    The poor ranking of the United States (17th) is mainly because of the number of journalists arrested or imprisoned there. Arrests are often because they refuse to reveal their sources in court.
  15. Sensorship is not only a problem in China.. by joonasl · · Score: 2, Insightful · on Amnesty Calls Shenannigans on MS, Sun, Cisco
    Reporters Without Borders published a worldwide "press freedom index". Sadly, US was ranked 17th and was left behind by countries like Costa Rica and Slovenia.
    The poor ranking of US was explained:
    The poor ranking of the United States (17th) is mainly because of the number of journalists arrested or imprisoned there. Arrests are often because they refuse to reveal their sources in court.
  16. Re:All Saddam's email are belong to us! by Leto2 · · Score: 2 · on Saddam's Inbox Hacked
    doesn't explicitly repress free speech

    Then why is the US so poorly ranked on the worldwide press freedom index ?

    Greetings from the Netherlands (proudly #1 on the worldwide press freedom index!)

  17. Pfft. by locoluis · · Score: 1 · on U.S. Ranks 17th in Freedom of the Press

    In the RSF.FR article, my country's name is correctly spelled as Chile.

    It's a widely known fact that french-speaking people spell it as "Chili", so personally I don't mind.

    Anyways, that coincidence of names is just that, a coincidence. The word 'Chile', refering to the country, probably comes from a quechuan expression that means "the last land". While 'chili', refering to the pepper (Capsicum sp.), comes from the nahuatl language.

    So don't be confused so easily. :) :p

  18. Re:Germanies Free Press by Rhubarb+Crumble · · Score: 4, Informative · on Google Complies with Law, Excludes 'controversial' Sites
    So German press reports [slashdot.org] that Germany has a freer press than USA. Then we get an article about their censorship.

    And if you read the original article (by a french, not german outfit BTW), you will read that:

    "The poor ranking of the United States (17th) is mainly because of the number of journalists arrested or imprisoned there. Arrests are often because they refuse to reveal their sources in court. Also, since the 11 September attacks, several journalists have been arrested for crossing security lines at some official buildings."

    No mention of actual censorship. Although the american media has a reputation for being good at self-censorship, i.e. 'don't criticise the president while we're "at war"' and all that.

  19. Re:17th... is that very bad or very good? by elandal · · Score: 3, Insightful · on U.S. Ranks 17th in Freedom of the Press
    Out of 139 countries, 17th means pretty good.
    Also, they apparently scored on a scale of 0-100, where the first 39 fit in 0-10, and the last 15 or so had scores of 50-100, median 23.50 ( Mozambique). US had a score of 4.75.

    They have a page about the criteria and methodology. Namely, they sent out questionaires to jouranlists.

    Note the last point in their criteria:
    Neither is it an indicator of the quality of a country's media. Reporters Without Borders defends press freedom without regard to the content of the media, so any ethical or professional departures from the norm have not been taken into account.
  20. Re:how scary is it ... by kampit · · Score: 1 · on U.S. Ranks 17th in Freedom of the Press
    As it says in the article

    The index was drawn up by asking journalists, researchers and legal experts to answer 50 questions about the whole range of press freedom violations (such as murders or arrests of journalists, censorship, pressure, state monopolies in various fields, punishment of press law offences and regulation of the media). The final list includes 139 countries. The others were not included in the absence of reliable information.
  21. Re:What's the rest of the ranking? by Dr+Caleb · · Score: 2 · on U.S. Ranks 17th in Freedom of the Press
    The link here was never /.ed and contains the information requested.

    If the first link is down, try the next. Again, RTFA, and the question would have been answered.

  22. More problems with index. . . . by forand · · Score: 2, Insightful · on U.S. Ranks 17th in Freedom of the Press
    The article states:
    Some countries with democratically-elected governments are way down in the index - such as Colombia (114th) and Bangladesh (118th). In these countries, armed rebel movements, militias or political parties constantly endanger the lives of journalists. The state fails to do all it could to protect them and fight the immunity very often enjoyed by those responsible for such violence.
    The quote seems to be suggesting that these countries don't have worse problems they should be spending money on. Yes the end result is that reporters lives are jepordized in these countries but it seems like freedom of the press is something that should be determined by the government in power, any other social issues, even those this extreme, are just that: social issues. Similar to the point that someone already brought up: in many European nations that are ranked high, there are many social concerns that make printing certain types of articles virtually impossible, why is this not just a far less extreme case of what is being cited in the quote above? Just another viewpoint.
  23. Re:What's the rest of the ranking? by Palos · · Score: 2, Informative · on U.S. Ranks 17th in Freedom of the Press

    Hrm, the entire listing is in one of the links there: "worldwide press freedom index" Nicely enough its in english :)
    Incase it gets /.'ed here are the top few:
    Rank Country 1 Finland - Iceland - Norway - Netherlands 5 Canada 6 Ireland 7 Germany - Portugal - Sweden 10 Denmark 11 France 12 Australia - Belgium 14 Slovenia 15 Costa Rica - Switzerland 17 United States 18 Hong Kong 19 Greece 20 Ecuador

  24. Get yer English here.... by nicedream · · Score: 3, Informative · on U.S. Ranks 17th in Freedom of the Press

    http://www.rsf.fr/article.php3?id_article=4116