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There is plenty of evidence.

genetically, a wide variety of dogs can come to exist, but a dog can never become anything other than a dog. It remains in its kind. It does not have the genetic ability to become anything more. Admitting this, evolutionists have tried to explain that natural selection happened in conjunction with mutations to the genetic code. This could not produce evolution, however, since mutations do not create new genetic potential, they just alter what is already there. Furthermore, mutations are small, random, and harmful alterations to the genetic code. This also makes evolution from mutations impossible.

Well, every theory ISN'T equally valid. First of all, there is ZERO -- ZERO -- evidence against evolution. ZERO

There is plenty of evidence. (http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/top.htm/).

However, I agree there is ZERO evidence that you or others will accept. This is because if you accept evidence against evolution you have to open yourselves to the possibility that there is a God. (Which by the way, there is and he is wonderful).

This world is so complex and so amazing. The more I learn about physics, chemistry, even Math, the more I am amazed with how there are so many things that work together on this planet. Science each year discovers more and more and disproves some of which used to be considered truth. I think it is interesting that some people's replies have compared creationism to "flat-earth" theories. However a better comparison would be evolution to flat-earth theories. At one point most people on earth believed that the earth was flat and that it explained many things. Now we know better. What if a few years from now we know better, that the theory of evolution was incorrect?

Please don't be a flat earth thinker. Consider all options and realize that just because there are several scientists that say evolution is correct, that doesn't mean it is. (Each year they change there mind on whether coffee is good for you.) Like I said, most people have their mind closed to options that include God before they even look at the subject. So, take a moment and consider the possibility.

Maybe I was just stupid and Naive to know any better, and Republicans were always fascists in disguise.

Funny that you said that.

Fascism is really government serving oligopolies. In that sense, we are moving toward fascism just as Russia is.

• ADMINISTRATION RECORDS SET
  - The only president ever impeached on grounds of personal malfeasance
  - Most number of convictions and guilty pleas by friends and associates
  - Most number of cabinet officials to come under criminal investigation
  - Most number of witnesses to flee country or refuse to testify
  - Most number of witnesses to die suddenly
  - First president sued for sexual harassment.
  - First president accused of rape.
  - First first lady to come under criminal investigation
  - Largest criminal plea agreement in an illegal campaign contribution case
  - First president to establish a legal defense fund.
  - Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions
  - Greatest amount of illegal campaign contributions from abroad

• STARR INVESTIGATION
  - Number of Starr-Ray investigation convictions or guilty pleas to date (including one governor, one associate attorney general and two Clinton business partners): 15
  - Number of Clinton Cabinet members who came under criminal investigation: 5
  - Number of Reagan cabinet members who came under criminal investigation: 4
  - Number of top officials jailed in the Teapot Dome Scandal: 3

"This quote you have certainly didn't come from Sagan, he would never call Secular Humanism a religion."

No, it did not... which is why I did not attribute the quoted material to him in my original post.

Here is the link... further google'ing reveals more of the same... its a mixed bag, but if you check the books he's written, he's very clear on his beliefs, including the original one I cited; Contact. Here's another source I just googled up with an even greater level of detail and diagnosis on Carl's "beliefs".

Granted, since he's dead we can't go and ask him, but his writings spell it out nicely enough.

when these people can/will run over our consitiution like this. Is this not the country founded on the principle of the protection from the "trynany or the majority"?

Here, have a look at some of their (creation science) web sites:
http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/
http://www.creationscience.com/onlinebook/

You simple can NOT argue with them. Here is an excerpt from the first site I listed:
Do You Believe that Evolution is True? If so, then provide an answer to the following questions. "Evolution" in this context is the idea that natural, undirected processes are sufficient to account for the existence of all natural things.

Lets disect this. "Natural" - okay, I can buy that. "Undirected" - absolutely NOT! They are right, using this terminology I can not defend evolution. However, evolution IS directed. Thus, the whole point of natural selection. That is, a particular allele is selected for dependent on its fitness for a specific environment.

So, where does this get us? There is simply no argument to be had. They will continually push for the abolishment of evolution until they get it.

Now for what should REALLY scare you. Listen to Christian talk radio every now and then. What is coming down the pike is scarier than what they are doing "publicly" now. The new thing seems to be to "push" women back into their rightful places. That is, barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen. Women should not have careers, but rather they should be "life-givers" and subordinate/respectful of their benevolent husbands. You think I am kidding??? I CHALLENEGE you to listen to the radio. Here, I'll save you some time:
http://www.reviveourhearts.com/nancy/

I prefer that my wife has a brain/career. We'll have kids when we're good and ready.

Oh f*$%, here goes: I, for one, welcome our new FUNDAMENTALIST christian overlords...

I found this collection of quotations from MANY pro-evolution scientists/believers to be quite interesting...

http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/bias.htm

It left me puzzled as to why there is even a debate.

There are about 4 or 5 persons quoted over and over on that page, and no quute is more than two sentences. This, against more than a century of research and millions of pages of papers, written by hundreds of thousands of scientists. All you offer is some quote mining from a handful of gadflys.

Well, if that subject didn't get your attention, nothing will.

I'm an inquisitive type. I could go either way on the whole creation/evolution thing. And actually the two aren't mutually exclusive, unless your a fundamentalist from either of the camps. If you're for complex design, who's to say it wasn't designed to evolve? hmm....

I found this collection of quotations from MANY pro-evolution scientists/believers to be quite interesting...

http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/bias.htm

It left me puzzled as to why there is even a debate. We've got one faith based opinion vs. another as far as I can tell.

Fire away oh feuding fundamentalists! I know I'm surrounded, but I've got asbestos underware on.

I didn't want to have positive karma anyway!

Evolution is a fact in that we know it occurs and it has been seen occur[r]ing.

What the hell are you going to church for?

Tell me you're more intelligent than that!

Science has NOT been able to explain everything. Evolution remains unproved and has mounting evidence against it. Read this article on evidence against Evolution for more on that.

In addition, there are many open problems to evolution. You can read about some of them here.

For a short summary of what Christians (who do not ignore science) believe, see this link.

What the hell are you going to church for?

Tell me you're more intelligent than that!

Science has NOT been able to explain everything. Evolution remains unproved and has mounting evidence against it. Read this article on evidence against Evolution for more on that.

In addition, there are many open problems to evolution. You can read about some of them here.

For a short summary of what Christians (who do not ignore science) believe, see this link.

What the hell are you going to church for?

Tell me you're more intelligent than that!

Science has NOT been able to explain everything. Evolution remains unproved and has mounting evidence against it. Read this article on evidence against Evolution for more on that.

In addition, there are many open problems to evolution. You can read about some of them here.

For a short summary of what Christians (who do not ignore science) believe, see this link.

In other news...

most materials react in unplesant ways when exposed to 4000 hours of consistant bright light.

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From Ape to Man: Evolution

What will the phone company think of you tinkering with their phone lines into people's condos...

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From Ape to Man: Evolution

If MS wouldn't include so much "junk data" to keep their proprietary data secret in patches, they wouldn't be so large. And, if there was a way to do a patch "rollback", then faulty patches wouldn't bring down a system until a new fix-patch was released. (One of the recent MS patches was found to cause some machines to stop booting)

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From Ape to Man: Evolution

Man, there's not even as much documentation on this as there is on Arkansas Sudden Death Syndrome. And here's another site on the same subject.

An as long as I'm posting, here's a nice statistical roundup of the Clinton Administration in gener.

If you're going to spout absurd conspiracy theories, it's nice to have at least some documentation for some of your claims...

Man, there's not even as much documentation on this as there is on Arkansas Sudden Death Syndrome. And here's another site on the same subject.

An as long as I'm posting, here's a nice statistical roundup of the Clinton Administration in gener.

If you're going to spout absurd conspiracy theories, it's nice to have at least some documentation for some of your claims...

I was just looking up Mirsky on the web the other day. It was cute, I found the Drunk Browsing Test. It's not the Worst of the Web or anything, but fairly amusing.

Dancin Santa

"The tree of liberty must be periodically watered with the blood of patriots" -Benjamin Franklin

Not to be picky or anything, but that was actually Thomas Jefferson. And he was right... and so are you. When a law is wrong, it MUST be challenged and destroyed; that's why they saw fit to include a little thing known as "Jury Nullification" in the founding laws of this nation. Basically, it means that a jury can find a defendant fully and completely guilty of a violation of law, but refuse to punish him for it because they don't think that law should BE a law. And you will NEVER hear it mentioned in a court of law, on TV, or anywhere except in a few books and movies (and, now, a few websites). Try to guess why. That's right: if We, the Sheeple, knew about it, why, we'd be chopping down laws all over the place! Can't have THAT, now can they? Undermining their hard-fought-for and bought-with-lobbyists laws like that would take away some of Their power, now wouldn't it?

So what better forum to spread knowledge of its existence than right here on good old slashdot?

JURY NULLIFICATION

JURY NULLIFICATION

JURY NULLIFICATION

JURY NULLIFICATION

JURY NULLIFICATION

There. Now go do some research on the topic, and shudder with anger when you realize how you've been lied to all these years by judges and lawyers...

The Fully Informed Jury Association's website
Read some more about it
A list of books on the subject
Even more
More
MORE
MORE MORE MORE

As you can see if you read the links above and fully understand them, the power of Jury Nullification is about the only power left to We the People. We don't have enormous wealth, we aren't in positions of political power, we don't have adequate representation in the legislative bodies of the government (meaning, of course, we can't be taxed either, but that's a whole 'nuther post), we don't have a stranglehold on any particular commodity or service (though think what would happen if we all suddenly configured our firewalls and BGP routers to stop letting packets through :)... Jury Nullification was GIVEN to us by the founding fathers because they knew in their wisdom that we would never have as much power as those who are so easily corrupted by it. It Is Our ONLY Weapon Against Them And Their Evil, People!! Do not let it fall by the wayside again. Tell everyone you know about it. Print out all the above webpages I linked to in 48-point Arial and paste them all up and down the streets of your cities. Don't Let THEM Win!!!

Thank you.

Seeing light from faraway stars: If you accept that God created the stars to provide some night-time lighting for the organisms that He would put on earth, then naturally light waves would *already* have been propogating between the stars and the earth. Otherwise the stars would have served no purpose.

I have no problem with the existence of dinosaurs. As a matter of fact, the great flood described in Genesis 7-8 is one explanation for their extinction.

The "ologists" arrive at long age estimates due to radiometric dating and geologic information. Radiometric dating processes are far less reliable (especially for long term dating) than is widely believed. Geologic records are often explained just as well by the great flood as they are by "old earth" science.

There is significant evidence supporting creation rather than evolution. Here are a couple of good links that give a (scientific) creation perspective on many issues:

Creation Science

Answers in Genesis -- You may be particularly interested in the FAQ's on radiometric dating and young age evidence.

I hope this gives you some idea how an educated person can believe something other than evolution. I admit, it's not always easy when evolution theory is treated as fact and shoveled into your head all the way through grade school, high school, and college.

I don't know if you'll see this or not, but I'll try to revisit the dead thread in a few days if you'd like to discuss further.

http://www.yahooka.com/
http://www.hightimes.com/
http://www.lycaeum.org/
http://marijuana.newscientist.com/
http://www.hemp.net/~ramus
http://www.druglibrary.org/ schaffer/History/whiteb1.htm
http://www.s ptimes.com/News/72699/TampaBay/Stakes_high_in_man_ s_.shtml
http://www.dqc.org/~james/
http://www.november.org/
http://www.pdfa.net/
http://mall.turnpike.net/~jnr/think.htm