Slashdot Mirror

http://packages.ubuntu.com/oneiric/amd64/firefox/download

"Debian" was trademarked in 1999, long before Canonical came along anyway. While Canonical and Mint must use the term "Debian" in compliance with the Debian licensing policy, Canonical gets to determine Ubuntu trademark policy. Whether "Koha" can be trademarked seems a similar question to whether "Ubuntu" can, since it's also a generic word in several languages.

Show me a single major PC manufacturer who ships a machine that dual-boots Windows and any non-Microsoft OS.

No, really. Go ahead, I'll wait.

Read what i wrote, i didn't say 'dual-boots', I said 'Linux-based PCs', I also said that they canned the project as in it is no longer running, it's not that hard to read and it's not at all obfuscated so you shouldn't have that much trouble with it. The Dell Ubuntu PCs could dual boot but weren't sold in that configuration, they were sold with just Linux until Dell realized that relatively no-one wanted to buy a PC with Ubuntu pre-installed.

Dell did ship PCs with Ubuntu but dropped it due to it's poor sales performance but they are reportedly bringing it back in the chinese market.

Asus are shipping PCs with Ubuntu Linux as well.

And although they aren't yet, HP have announced plans to include webOS as a boot option on their PCs.

If you are new to Linux, or just interested, there are a lot of Free and Open Source alternatives to common 'payware' applications on Microsoft and Apple platforms (sorry, no Photoshop, though.) See the sites listed at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WindowsApplicationsEquivalents. Like many Ubuntu or Gentoo or Redhat forums, the information contained is actually relevant to other distributions like openSuSE.

One thing openSuSE has going for it is that the default browsers come with support for YaST's on-click install. So one way to get much of the stuff that you might want is to first check the search website. If someone else has already packaged the software and made it available on that site, then installing it is literally one click away in the search results.

Yes, to fit with what most people expect, the service could use an 'app store' UI with little application review pages, comments and pretty icons. But it certainly beats hunting out each dependency on rpmseek or rpm.pbone.net. (If you are lucky to find packaged software at all.)

If you want a true FOSS mobile phone OS, just wait until Kubuntu Mobile is released. (From memory, Meego, like Maemo, has some closed binaries.)

Like many people, I initially despised the new Unity interface.

• "Where's the taskbar?"
• "Why are my maximize- and close-window buttons moved?"
• "What is this weird thing on the left side of the screen???"

So I went to http://www.ubuntu.com/tour and gave it a shot (a demo runs in the browser). I installed it on a VM (I used VirtualBox, but VMWare would be fine too). After seeing how skype and everything else I use everyday *just works* - it was easy to let go of the taskbar, and to accept the new position of the maximize/close window buttons.

Don't throw out the baby with the bath water. Give it a shot. Yes, it's different. Yes, it's better.

Or like Ubuntu One.

>Ubuntu should make this clearer, but people commenting on Ubuntu stories on Slashdot should have understood by now non-LTS releases are testbeds for developments that culminate in the next LTS.

And where were they supposed to get that information? ubuntu.com, maybe? Wrong.

Let's have a look: Go to ubuntu.com. Probably the first thing most people are going to do is click "Get Ubuntu Now". That goes to the Download page. There's huge "Start Download" button. That'll get you the latest (11.10) bundle of bugs.

OK, let's try again. Let's say we're running a business, and want something stable. So we click on the Ubuntu for Business link. (ubuntu.com/business). It says "Perfect for business use, Ubuntu is safe, intuitive and stable." Stable? Haha. Anyway, click on Desktop, then on Download. You're on the same Download page as above, getting you 11.10.

At no point are you told that you should prefer an LTS for stability, rather you're told Ubuntu *is* stable. Neither are you told what an Ell-Tee-Ess is.

So, I don't think Ubuntu gets to totally mess everything up, and then make the excuse "it's not an LTS."

You should look into adding the Firefox Stable PPA. It currently has Firefox 7.0.1. With Firefox 8 having just been released, I would say this is pretty up to date, especially for Ubuntu LTS. If you want to get brave, you can even add the Firefox Beta PPA.

In my experience, about 18 months into the LTS cycle, it starts to become a pain using up to date programs. Being able to update a few key apps takes away the temptation to go for the regular (6 month) releases. Other options to stay up to date while only relying on Ubuntu packages include using Ubuntu Backports and Prevu.

--
Andy

You should look into adding the Firefox Stable PPA. It currently has Firefox 7.0.1. With Firefox 8 having just been released, I would say this is pretty up to date, especially for Ubuntu LTS. If you want to get brave, you can even add the Firefox Beta PPA.

In my experience, about 18 months into the LTS cycle, it starts to become a pain using up to date programs. Being able to update a few key apps takes away the temptation to go for the regular (6 month) releases. Other options to stay up to date while only relying on Ubuntu packages include using Ubuntu Backports and Prevu.

--
Andy

Since you haven't selected any specific distributions I've googled for guides and selected OpenSUSE, Ubuntu, Fedora. Seems like there are typically more steps involved in both building the kernel and installing it for these systems compared to FreeBSD. I didn't spend a lot of time googling examples, I searched for "%distro% installing custom kernel guide" and selected the most relevant results returned from the first page.

FreeBSD:
Pre-requisites is having the source installed. The easiest way to install the full source tree is to run sysinstall as root, and then choosing Configure, then Distributions, then src, and finally All. sysinstall is FreeBSD's terminal based installer.

Already have a kernel configured? Skip to step 4.
1 # cd /usr/src/sys/i386/conf
2 # cp GENERIC CUSTOMKERNEL //duplicate default generic kernel as a starting point
3 # ee CUSTOMKERNEL // load kernel file into easyedit (you could use vi, pico etc.) and modify kernel
4 # cd /usr/src
5 # make buildkernel KERNCONF=CUSTOMKERNEL
6 # make installkernel KERNCONF=CUSTOMKERNEL

It runs on ARM with caveats and bugs. In particular, apparently it only supports single-core ARM systems - if you try and use Mono on a dual-core ARM, it will crash because the code it generates is SMP-unsafe. It also sounds like it's incredibly buggy even without this problem.

From the thread linked in the article, it appears that the problems with Banshee were due to bugs in mono that have now been fixed.

Meh. Just torrrent it and be done. Alternately, order a DVD from cheapbytes who have been around forever.

This is like complaining about not being able to install Debian from floppies. Anyone geeky enough to be interested in Linux can route around the problem in many different ways.

For example, grab the appropriate flavor minimal CD below. Install then update. Problem solved. If 12.04 doesn't have a minimal image for some reason, install then upgrade!

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD

Why did this article make slashdot? Who cares that a distro with all the default packages enabled won't fit on a CD? Does Windows Vista fit on a CD if you include all the default packages and a word processor? Does OS X?

If you have an old system, you can use the https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD and download packages off the net.

As long as they continue to support PXE boot, USB boot and other minimal bootstrap images that require network support, I'm fine. Heck, you can put your harddrive in another system and debootstrap ubuntu onto it if you are in a bind with a bad net connection and no DVD drive.

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD
FWIW, the minimal Debian installer was a hell of a lot more polished last time I checked.

I've never used it but usually for servers you would use the server version: http://www.ubuntu.com/business/server/overview

Here is Shuttleworth's blog talking about Ubuntu on tablets.. he wants to add tablets, not move to them:

By 14.04 LTS Ubuntu will power tablets, phones, TVs and smart screens from the car to the office kitchen, and it will connect those devices cleanly and seamlessly to the desktop, the server and the cloud.

Unity, the desktop interface in today’s Ubuntu 11.10, was designed with this specific vision in mind. While the interface for each form factor is shaped appropriately, Unity’s core elements are arranged in exactly the way we need to create coherence across all of those devices. This was the origin of the name Unity – a single core interface framework, that scales across all screens, and supports all toolkits. from: http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/820

Mirrors carry *A LOT* more than just the standard desktop install CD.
Apart from all the other kind of CDs there's also all the binary & source packages, and all that for 2 or 3 versions (at least LTS + current).
That is to say the network already copes with BluRays...see debmirror

This is not however strictly true, because Canonical *does* provide a minimal ISO ( here ) which contains the kernel, userland and ethernet related stuff, after which you can do a netinstall of whatever you want.

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD

I just checked my system (Debian testing, amd64). The /lib64 directory is not linked to /lib. It only has one entry inside it, though, which is a link to the 64 bit loader: /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 -> /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ld-2.13.so .

The /lib directory contains a link to the 32 bit loader: /lib/ld-linux.so.2 -> /lib32/ld-linux.so.2 . The rest of the files in the /lib directory are all 64 bit libraries, though.

I just looked up the FHS v2.3 standard. You're right, it does specify that on an amd64 platform, 32 bit libraries should go in /lib. So Debian does break the FHS in this regard.

Found a document which describes the Debian/Ubuntu approach to multiarch support: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiarchSpec#Design . It talks about the shortcomings of both the FHS and the previous 64 bit Debian system, and how the new multiarch system solves this.

This is how you install Openbsd. You can download a small iso for your usb/cd, and that will download anything needed thru the net.

Back in the version 3 days, you needed only a floppy or two to start such an install, nowdays is the same, but ppl mostly use usb sticks now (the floppy image still exists).

Going for randomly made iso images on bittorrent was a very stupid idea. The only reason i could see someone needing a whole iso is if they lack connectivity.

You can compare this install method to Debian netinstall, or Ubuntu minimal iso images.

TIP: The installation and configuration guide is called "FAQ" for some reason.

Yea, sorry but if the Ubuntu website (and the wiki) itself calls it an OS, then at best you're just being overly picky.

http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-ubuntu

I upgraded from Ubuntu 10.04 to 11.10 and was very unhappy with Unity. Fortunately I found out about Lubuntu, which is "a variant of Ubuntu that is lighter, less resource hungry and more energy-efficient by using lightweight applications and LXDE, The Lightweight X11 Desktop Environment, as its default GUI." It is wonderful, fast and efficient! Get it here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Get_Lubuntu

CentOS is fine if you just need an office file-server or print-server.
If you are running an e-commerce website, then you need to be PCI compliant and up-to-date with the latest security patches *QUICKLY*.
CentOS updates can be unpredictable as to when they will be released. Look at Wikipedia's "Delay" column for CentOS releases.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CentOS
Due to extremely slow 2011 updates and releases, I switched to an alternative OS out of fear a CentOS update might never arrive. It did release eventually.

Does your IT staff have the time and knowledge to create their own RPM files for updating CentOS, when the closed group of CentOS volunteers fail to deliver?
If not, I would suggest either pay for RHEL updates or use current free releases of Fedora, OpenSuse, Ubuntu LTS, or Debian instead.

au contraire mon frere: http://www.ubuntu.com/business/server/overview

• Protects your privacy and doesn’t track you.. donttrack.us
• Gives back to free and open source software. http://www.gabrielweinberg.com/blog/2010/11/help-me-start-a-foss-tithing-movement.html
• Is partially open source... https://github.com/duckduckgo
• Gives really awesome results... https://duck.co/topic/wow-queries-that-showcase-ddg

Why not put Linux on a MacBook? I have.

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MacBook

"I listen to Fela Kuti and I Vote!"

He specified wanting Applecare. Linux isn't on their script.

If you want an easy solution, Ubuntu certified hardware might be a good choice:

http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/

Thinkpads and Dells seem to be well supported.

Yes.

https://help.ubuntu.com/11.10/installation-guide/powerpc/index.html

I did this on a 17" PowerBook for several years, when Quartz+Flash made Leopard unusable.

Why not put Linux on a MacBook? I have.

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MacBook

"I listen to Fela Kuti and I Vote!"

Ubuntu has a list of Certified Hardware for ya. But I have yet to get a Thinkpad at least 90% running. I don't have the fingerprint reader on my X200s working with Fedora but everything else works, including the dock. The boss's Thinkpad T520 runs Ubuntu and has everything working except audio through the dock, but dual DVI displays on the dock do work.

Of course once you get a laptop working expect updates to constantly break things until you just get tired of rolling back failed updates and just stop, only taking critical security updates you can't live without.

It is worse with Linux because almost no OEMs are involved in keeping it working, most aren't even involved in initially getting it going so folks have to guess. But raise your hand if you haven't had to roll back a driver or update on that 'other' popular OS. Last week I had to roll back a mouse driver on a Dell laptop to get the pointer working.

Would it be possibly to port Ubuntu's NotifyOSD to OSX? Would anyone want to?
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#Bubble_appearance_and_layout

Step 1: Choose the basic command line install on the Ubuntu "alternate" ISO.

Step 2: Add your favorite packages.

Step 3: Go to: http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/
and grab the latest Ubuntu kernel (v3.1-rc9-oneiric).

My setup based on 11.10 packages are sweeter than the one based on Debian 6.0. Ubuntu packages are more recent than Debian ones. Debian Testing and Unstable has never worked well for me, but this always has. Even when I run the beta stuff.

You don't have to use Unity. Mark Shuttleworth will never know.

He will if you install popcon.

Lubuntu has been developing nicely. If you liked old Gnome set up in classic 'windows' start-menu style, then Lubuntu understands that. Here's your 'Ubuntu'-backed distro with that GUI.

Don't write-off Lubuntu as yet another "lightweight", which has meant a heavily stripped-out interface with repeated visits to the CLI for setup and configurations. They've been doing an excellent job of supplying all the expected dialogs.

Only caveat is this is their first release in the regular Ubuntu distro stream. Keep your eyes open. But I like 11.04 a whole lot. This is the classic GUI - simple, but not feature free. Lubuntu really does seem to be the happy, carefree way forward for those of us who don't want Unity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubuntu#Lubuntu_11.10
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu

Ubuntu has given up on its users, and is turning into an interface for the elderly, the disabled and netbook people.

I'd rather have my advanced UI that lets me do whatever I want with my workstation, thank you very much.

Um ... did anyone on /. try reading the release notes?? More specifically, the bit that says:

"GNOME 3.2 is included and is a major upgrade from GNOME 2.32 included in Ubuntu 11.04. GNOME Classic is no longer installed by default, but can be enabled after installation completes by installing gnome-panel." (my emphasis)

Honestly, this site is turning into one giant PEBKAC-fest. Read and think, people! Besides, it's linux ... you can install whatever GUI you want. You don't have to use Unity. Mark Shuttleworth will never know.

You should always read the release notes before upgrading. For instance, anyone that has a Sandybridge laptop should not upgrade without looking at the Kernel section. There's currently a bug that causes 30% more power consumption in laptops and desktops with that platform.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricOcelot/ReleaseNotes

I'm just waiting for Apple to run out of "cool" large cat names and start releasing versions like "OS X Ocelot"

That'd be the day...

I like how people think that Windows is the only fallible OS. Linux fanboyism will never die.

The grandparent post never mentioned anything about Linux, yet suddenly we have a load of AC roaches crawling out from behind the cupboard accusing him of being a Linux fanboy. Has it ever occured to you that neither Windows nor Ubuntu are suitable for this task since they are consumer targeted low security operating systems. A hardened install of RedHat or a Trusted Solaris install might begin to be suitable with additional measures, however for a weapon system use they should be using a proper secure operating system.

This use, as with many other Windows installs, was a wrong use of Windows, and you people should just give it up and say so. The people who put Windows into this position without adequate mitigating protection should be fired.

You can actually run a proper VPN with ssh and not just tunnel individual ports:

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSH_VPN

This creates a point-to-point layer 2 or 3 tunnel between 2 hosts. This is great for proxying TCP, UDP, ethernet frames...

Agreed.

Security in Windows XP was really an afterthought -- it wasn't until SP2 seven years ago that it was reasonable to install. Before that, it would get rooted WHILE installing. In Win7, that is built in, not merely tacked on or recompiled. But it still includes IE6 by default, which US-CERT said was not fixable in its security model in 2004, and is the biggest danger of installing it.

Of course, I don't know what kind of masochist would voluntarily install an OS from 2001 that still considers SATA to be exotic hardware and can only be cloned across the same hardware, but that's another issue.

Windows 7 boxes are still exploitable, but only if they're grossly unpatched. The ones that get infected are usually have no Service Pack, much less have ever had Windows Update run, and are using an expired version of Norton Antivirus. Windows Update kills common malware rather well, and Security Essentials is free and actually quite nice (beats AVG).

The same would apply to someone who has ignored 2 years of Ubuntu Security Notices and patches. There are quite a few: http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/

As far as Flash and Java goes, I've been putting Chrome on home systems for browsing. It blocks usage of versions of Flash, Java, Quicktime, and other plugins that are exploitable. The malware blocker is also excellent on it, although Firefox and IE9 are catching up on doing that well.

I'm a long-time RedHat distro family user (since '99 with Red Hat Linux 5.2).

For the non-technical, I would not recommend Fedora. Fedora installs systems go End of Life (EOL) every 13 months, and that's if you install right after a release. Current supported Fedora 14 will EOL ~Dec, 2011. Latest Fedora 15 release will EOL ~June, 2012. Fine for a desktop user who likes to do fresh installs once or twice a year and play with the latest thing. Not wise for a server install (unless you want to reinstall every year and troubleshoot breakage/incompatibilities each time).

RHEL self-support Server is $349/year, but you want this so you get all the security updates in a timely fashion (hours, worst case within the day). I would recommend this method. Ask folks to chip in $5/year. Most won't, some will (you just need 70), bank the extra for the next year subscription renewal. The advantage is that if you install RHEL6 now, you're good on support until at least 2016 with support.

The free version of RHEL, CentOS, is constantly out of date with Security updates. The team works for free, but it's a closed development process ("" CentOS is a Community distribution for download and install, not community for development processes). I would not recommend CentOS to anyone who can't manually chase down security fixes.

Frankly, assuming you're on a free-lunch budget, I would find a LTS version of Ubuntu or something where you can install it and follow some best-practice hardening guides and basically forget it for 5 years. I'm tempted to go that direction as well for my personal stuff, but as I maintain RHEL at work, not sure I want to have to learn/maintain two different knowledge sets of "how to do things."

I feel like i made linux from scratch every time i have a working installation that is 100% working with harddisks, dvd, colors, high res, 3d, sounds, and working keyboard + mouse!

I'm afraid that's what you get when you install Linux from here. Try getting it from here or here instead!

Or why not just use Wubi and have a full functional Linux and call it a day? Either Wubi or CoLinux would give him the full Linux bash CLI, all the latest and greatest, and if he has permissions to install SUA then he can install CoLinux or Wubi.

I can see why MSFT is killing it, because in this age of even Sempron CPUs have virtualization support, and you having the choice of Wubi, CoLinux, or the VM of your choice, why would you use the ancient SUA? i bet to the user base for SUA can be counted in the dozens, it just wasn't popular to start with and certainly hasn't gotten more popular as its gotten outdated.

Just let it die already and use one of the modern Linux choices I listed above friend.

So this is basically a script that restarts dead daemons, right?

What's the difference between this and Upstart?

http://upstart.ubuntu.com/faq.html

Others have mentioned virtualisation as a means of running Linux on Windows, but if your computer doesn't have a hypervisor this can be dog slow. Other alternatives are trying out a coLinux based distro such as TopologiLinux or andLinux, coLinux is a modified Linux kernel that runs as a process under Windows, so it is just like running an application on Windows. Another option is using Ubuntu's Wubi installer, the installer runs under Windows, installs to a loopback filesystem (a filesystem stored within a file) and uses the Windows bootloader, so no repartitioning required, and it makes installing and uninstalling Linux as easy as any other program on Windows, this will run a little slower than a regular install due to the loopback filesystem, but for trying Ubuntu it is a good option.

So there's no scrutiny of apps that go into the repo?

Yes there is. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/CodeReviews#Guideline_Criteria_for_New_Package_Inclusion

I had not experienced those bugs with thunar. I use it quite often because it loads much faster than nautilus, which i keep around just in case. I use thunar mostly with local files and removable media, haven't tried much its gvfs abilities.

Note also i trimmed some fat by using this psychocats apt-get remove line as a guide to remove many packages, it might have helped. Maybe just installing ubuntu minimal (at boot press f4 to choose "command-line system") and then just sudo apt-get install xfce4 afterwards could be better.

Do I have the guarantee with Debian backports? Does it get as much "love" as the main branch? I sincerely doubt it.

Did you realize that we moved from backports.org to backports.debian.org about 9 to 12 months ago (sorry, I can't remember the exact date)? Did you understand that it means that backports are now an official channel, on which you can submit bugs? That also mean that now, we consider security issues in backports as well. That's a lot of a difference compared to one year ago.

Turned out it was a PDF with a form and the built in PDF reader (evince, I think) didn't handle that. At least, I could remotely login and install Adobe Reader from the repository. I know Ubuntu has it. Debian might in the non-free section, but I'm not sure.

You didn't install Adobe PDF reader from the Ubuntu repository, because it's simply not there. You can make a search on http://packages.ubuntu.com/ if you don't trust me. What you did, I am guessing, is that you used the "software center" which shows some non-Ubuntu repositories. But anyway, even in Debian, you could have download it directly from Adobe: http://get.adobe.com/reader/

Still, for me, lacking compiz[...]

We do have Compiz, simply it's not there by default because not everyone runs with a fancy 3D card. About the "polished themes", frankly, I agree. The graphics in Debian just sux. We did some kind of competition, and there were not so many contributors, so finally, the space-fun theme won. It's funny, but not exactly very pretty, and this really is crap. Many Debian Developer regret this, but we simply don't have skilled enough people that want to contribute. I wish we had some very good designers... :/ About windows 7, frankly, when I need windows (which isn't often, mostly for my stupid bank here), I use XP, and it is running the win2k theme, because I hate the new ones which are anyway slowing down the system.

As for the language, well, I've setup some Debian system fully in Chinese, and I didn't have any issue doing that. So I don't get what the problem is, really. Even in Ubuntu, I had to spend some time to install the needed fonts which were not there by default, add a correct input method (namely, sunpinyin, because otherwise, it sux).

I've ran Ubuntu in few desktops, liked it for a while, after let's say 2008/2009, it started to have issues. During that same time, Debian got better, and especially since Squeeze, where the multimedia system now is rock solid, thanks to the huge effort of the multimedia team. There's still couples of issues (like it took me a long time to figure out I needed to add snd-seq-virmidi / snd-seq-midi-event / snd-seq-midi-emul in my /etc/modules.conf to be able to use jackd correctly), but that's only when you do advanced things (I don't think lots of people need jackd). All together, I'd advise people to try AGAIN Debian, since it got a way better on the desktop since Squeeze. I've also seen the latest LXDE, and frankly, I'm tempted to switch to it, since frankly, Gnome sux (it's incredible to have to wait few seconds when you double click on a folder when I have a multi-gigahertz processor).