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Although I suppose that this goes back to ESR & RMS's ongoing debate about open source v. free software, last year's aborted X11R6.4 licence change makes me somewhat sceptical of The Open Group as any kind of reputable open source (nevermind free software) developer. Although they seem to have recanted, (see www.xfree86.org) I think a suggestion to developers that they go and clear all their ideas via the The Open Group and try to get them to initiate X12 to integrate them in; is going to leave a bad taste in many people's mouths.

As for the suggestion that using Motif is a good path for open software development (even with Lesstif coming on apace), try telling that to the Mozilla developers.

However I do agree that as a mature standard X11 has a lot to offer and further would respectfully suggest that many of the more vocal "let's get rid of X" proponents don't understand exactly what they are proposing to chuck out (as opposed to the developers etc. who are doing less talking and more coding).

It's kinda sad how short the XFree team is on developers when more or less 99.999% of Linux users use X and 100% of distributions package it. It could really use some more commercial support from RedHat and SUSE, though they have helped a little bit in the past (RHat donated NeoMagic code once...).

For information on becoming an XFree86 developer, please visit the XFree86 developer page.

Also, you non-programmers that use X can do your part by knowing that RedHat and other commercial Linux vendors have ears for their customers and showing concern for the frequency of XFree86 release cycles is a good way to let them know that support for X development is very important to the success of Linux.

XFree86, the X Window System port for PCs, will use a modularised design in version 4, which is due for release later this year. This will allow tuning the X server to low memory environments as well as providing other neat features like run-time patching.

I've spent a few hours this week perusing the Imlib source code (I want to add my own image format, like the multigradients in WindowMaker, for use in GTK themes)

Image compression, etc. is only of importance when an image is first being loaded - after that point all the image data is cached, essentially in 24bit color uncompressed.

If you're on a slow system, there might be some lag when pixmaps have to be resized - basically, when GTK needs a pixmap for a button or window of a size that hasn't been requested before, Imlib won't have a cached pixmap of that size and will have to rescale one on the fly. The default rescaling algorithms are pretty nice quality, too; I think you can set Imlib to use cpu-cheaper ones.

If the lag is really Imlib's fault, try running imlib_config, increasing cache size if you have the RAM to spare, and tweaking things like that.

There are more likely possibilities, though:

GTK+ is supposed to be a fairly lightweight toolkit, but I don't know how optimized it is with themes to consider. When I hot-key flicker between desktops running GTK+ apps, for example, all the pixmap backgrounds come up instantly, but there's a perceptible delay for text to be written on top of them.

XFree86 is the second most inefficient piece of software (next to Netscape) on a typical Linux system. This is in no way an attack on the XFree developers; they're coding a system that is at the same level of complexity as the kernel, with a lot less publicity and thanks. Short of avoiding poorly accelerated video cards or waiting for XFree86 4.0 (with DLL-based hardware support, revamped XAA, and lots of other goodies) I don't know what you could do about this one.

I wish the XFree86 people would provide anonymous CVS access. They bemoan a parcity of developers, but they're hardly doing much to attract new blood when all the cool new work is being done behind closed doors. Most latecomer developers to a project don't suddenly wake up one morning and think, "Gee, I want to pledge a massive contribution of time and effort to project X," (pun intended), they instead start by downloading code as bleeding edge as possible to make a few little hacks and tweaks on while getting to know the system. Having to wait months at a time between software releases, with nothing but rumors publicly available inbetween, isn't conducive to this kind of tenative engagement.

They have their reasons, of course; I just think those reasons are outweighed by the benefits of more public development.

Wow, that was a nice rant. Hope I get more "Interesting" than "Offtopic" votes; both probably apply.

The answer to your question is: file format loading times only matter to Imlib once, when the file is loaded. Efficiency while Imlib is actually rendering pixmaps is file format independent.

What is the video chipset ? (Amptron used to have boards with the SiS 6326 which is supported under the XSVGA driver, and these have been used successfully with X) Compare the manual with the cardlist Can't tell da players widout a program.

A related piece of good news for the Linux 3D community is the news from XFree86 that a pre-4.0 build will be available in July 1999. Check it out over at xfree86.org.

-jwb

It wouldn't have to be GPL'd as such, just GPL-compatible - examples of such include the LGPL and the Xfree86 copyright.

IANAL so don't bet your house on this. l-)

I'm sure there are lots of companies who would like to have their hands in MS's pockets, but I don't think anyone does.

Compaq, HP and Sun are hardly MS minions. This just looks like paranoia to me.

And don't give me that, "you can add it to xfree86" crap :) PC's running Linux or *BSD* aren't the only machines on the planet running X.

Xfree86 doesn't just run on PCs, and it doesn't just run on Linux and *bsd*. It should be possible to port it to anything Berlin can be ported to and probably more.

As far as I can see what this all means is that TOG have admitted they are not the right group to run X, so they have made a new organisation for the purpose. It might work better, it might not, but it seems like a good move. And if it fails, the magic of an Open Source license coupled with the strength of Xfree86 will help us keep going.

> Whether you like to have your program possibly being turned closed source is a matter of personal
> belief, but do NOT tolerate this obnoxious advertising clause! If you decide to use the BSD
> license, do the community a service and remove that clause from your license, or consider another
> license.

Examples are the XFree86-style license or the Modified BSD license.

See for more information about this topic the BSD License Problem article.

XFree 4.0 is going to be a quantum leap. Modular design, plug-in drivers for different video cards, native TrueType font rendering, accelerated 3D in a window, etc. check www.Xfree86.org/releaseplans.html for the whole list.

anyone know when I will actually be able to have X working on a tnt2?

I love my 2400x1600@32bpp virtual displays on my current TNT; the TNT2 promises to be even better!

anyone know when I will actually be able to have X working on a tnt2?

I love my 2400x1600@32bpp virtual displays on my current TNT; the TNT2 promises to be even better!

As an aside, I'd like to get this code that detects my sexual orientation, because I don't know what it is. Also, exactly what encoding is that? Base65536? IEEE floating-point?

BTW, we released XFree86 4.0 today. It's got antialiasing, ability to switch client windows between displays, and true 3-D support with both OpenGL and Pex for over a dozen 3-D accelerator cards. Go to the XFree86 project webserver and check it out.

Cheers,
Joshua.

You can't use Windows video drivers on Linux systems. Check the XFree86 FAQ to see which server you need, preferably before you buy a video card. Then download the server (where to get this depends upon which Linux distribution you're using). Email me if you get stuck.

HIBT...?

No, because it is the only license that perpetuates the FSF concept of freedom at the expense of a concept of freedom held by many other people.

"Freedom" is too important a word to allow it to be exclusively defined by one person or organization.

Craig

I have an eTower 333c and it runs linux fine. Here's a list of possible gotchas, depending on your perspective on things.

1. Need a new modem to replace the LoseModem.

2. It only has 1 serial port, so with an external modem, that's it.

3. It only has 3 slots (1 ISA, 1 PCI, and 1 ISA/PCI), so it's a touch cramped.

4. I didn't try 4Front Tech's OSS, though the list says they support the Crystal CS4235 chip. I just plugged in an old SB16, taking up the ISA slot.

5. It has only 1 5.25" drive bay, though thankfully it's externally accessible.

6. RedHat 5.1 (and I understand 5.2) ship with XFree86 3.3.2 which doesn't support the ATI Rage IIc onboard. You need XFree86 3.3.1 (or maybe a commercial X server) to support it.

Lest I seem completely down on the box, here's the good I have to say about it:

1. It's up. I have it running the SVGA driver, and it works fine, and fast.

2. It's cheap. Figure $20 for the SB16, another $20 for a 33.6, and $50 for a monitor, and we're still talking under $600 for a great box.

3. It's good enough. 32MB of RAM is fine for me. So is 2GB of HD (I decided to dedicate the other 1GB to some other OS when I heard that eMachines was only refunding $25 for it.) Anyhow, there's still that free drive bay, and HD prices have hit rock bottom and started digging.

Do I recommend it unconditionally? No. Do I think I got my money's worth? Hell, yeah. Will it work for you? YMMV.

I have an eTower 333c and it runs linux fine. Here's a list of possible gotchas, depending on your perspective on things.

1. Need a new modem to replace the LoseModem.

2. It only has 1 serial port, so with an external modem, that's it.

3. It only has 3 slots (1 ISA, 1 PCI, and 1 ISA/PCI), so it's a touch cramped.

4. I didn't try 4Front Tech's OSS, though the list says they support the Crystal CS4235 chip. I just plugged in an old SB16, taking up the ISA slot.

5. It has only 1 5.25" drive bay, though thankfully it's externally accessible.

6. RedHat 5.1 (and I understand 5.2) ship with XFree86 3.3.2 which doesn't support the ATI Rage IIc onboard. You need XFree86 3.3.1 (or maybe a commercial X server) to support it.

Lest I seem completely down on the box, here's the good I have to say about it:

1. It's up. I have it running the SVGA driver, and it works fine, and fast.

2. It's cheap. Figure $20 for the SB16, another $20 for a 33.6, and $50 for a monitor, and we're still talking under $600 for a great box.

3. It's good enough. 32MB of RAM is fine for me. So is 2GB of HD (I decided to dedicate the other 1GB to some other OS when I heard that eMachines was only refunding $25 for it.) Anyhow, there's still that free drive bay, and HD prices have hit rock bottom and started digging.

Do I recommend it unconditionally? No. Do I think I got my money's worth? Hell, yeah. Will it work for you? YMMV.

Should software authors be required to sign their software and patches as a condition of acceptance onto FTP sites? Signing your software is a vital protection against malicious modifications by third parties and is less onerous than writing it. For those unfamiliar with the signing process, there is an excellent HOWTO document describing the process.

Surely contributors to the FSF should set an example and insist on software signing? Unfortunately, despite the risks of unsigned software, eloquently explained at Linux World, most of the software available by FTP around the world has not been signed. For example, on the alpha GNU it appears that none of the software is signed. Major FTP sites like SunSITE and XFree86 have mostly unsigned software.

This driver supports good acceleration for both the NV1/STG2000 as well as the Riva128. It is known to work on PCI and AGP versions of the Riva128. The Riva TNT was added to this driver and is not yet as well accelerated as it could be. Still, the server is very usable.

See this Obviously, not everything is free (applies to Suse too).