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Sun Announces Java Executive Committee Members
Sun Microsystems today announced the members of their Executive Committee which will oversee the Java Community Process (JCP) program, the community-based process for developing Java technology specifications, reference implementations and associated compatibility test suites. These ECs will serve in full capacity in guiding the JCP program until the first general EC election. Of particular note is the inclusion of various Open Source leaders, including Caldera and The Apache Software Foundation.
Despite the fact that in my courses I program in Java, I haven't kept all that close an eye on the standards process. I remember awhile back though there was some flap about sun withdrawing Java from the standards process. Have they changed their position, or is this just a media trick?
It's interesting that although IBM is on the Committee, they aren't amongst the many companies quoted in Sun's press release.
Considering how much muscle IBM are putting behind Java at the moment (porting it to AS/400 and AIX, producing their own v1.3 JDK's for those platforms, plus Linux and NT, moving most of their e-business software over to Servlets and EJB's, and so on), you'd think Big Blue would have a few nice things to say about the Executive Committee.
Yet more evidence of bad blood between the two biggest players, I guess.
Perl is a good example of something completely open that anyone could run away with
... perl scripts run on more platforms than java does
Anyone *could* run away with perl, but they haven't. Nobody other than Larry makes a version of Perl, and that's why it's successful.
It gives me the impression that Sun wants to maintain that 'Brand' recognition (i.e. Sun's Java). Such is the way of corporations. You would think that that would have learned. Totally unfair, what Sun is rightfully afraid of is that Java will go the way of Unix - 57 different flavors, each of which requires a modifications to a Makefile to even compile, much less run. The fact that Microsoft has already attempted to pollute Java is more than enough justification to keep the language centrally managed.
The only argument I could see for decentralizing the standard is if the managing body were too slow to update it to meet new needs, which would result in proprietary (and incompatible) vendor extensions to meet user demands, but so far that's not even close to being a problem.
Java's development process ain't broke.
-- Sigs are for losers
Caldera and Apache were probably not included for their open-sourceness (is that a word?), but more as major players in the current landscape of computing. I don't think we'll see Java open-sourced under the GPL anytime soon just because the Apache Software Foundation has a seat on the Executive Committee. That aside, this can only mean good things: namely, a colaborative effort ensuring that the whole "write once run anywhere" mantra applies (and continues to apply) to Linux and Apache.
Interesting Note: It is still nice to see Apache and Caldera (or other Linux vendors) listed among other big players in the industry, as they are in the complete list of the Committee: Apache Software Foundation, Apple, BEA, Caldera, Compaq, Fujitsu, HP, IBM, IONA, Inprise, Insignia, Matsushita, Motorola, Nokia, Novell, Oracle, Palm, Philips, Siemens, Sony, Sun Microsystems, and Wind River.
Also, since this is only a press release (Sun's website also has it available.), I wonder when we can get some comments from Caldera and Apache on what their gameplan/goals are for this committee. (other than the quick blurb in the press release)
Portable versions of Firefox, GIMP, LibreOffice, etc
We live on a planet that is, as planets often are, shaped roughly as a round ball-like thingy. Not only that, but it tends to whirl around, giving us our praised days and nights. Think about it: I live in Eastern European Timezone. I wake up like, what, seven long hours before U.S. citizens. Not to mention Indian
We from the other side of the globe would very much like to see news posted before we have to get to sleep
I think, therefore thoughts exist. Ego is just an impression.
MS's stated motto of "Write Once, Crash Everywhere".
You know, I think it was more, "Crash Once, Write Everywhere". Have you ever looked at what Windows does to memory after a BSOD?
On the other hand, Tolkien springs to mind, a little melodramatically: "only one hand can bear the ring" , and if they do, "another dark lord will appear"
Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.
Probably their comments just didn't arrive in time for press. I can't see how a "yippee! we'er so happy to be here we're at risk of spontaneous combustion!" comment would be important
Why Apache probably is too busy to comment at the moment (from their web site): "The Apache Software Foundation has just begun its reorganization from the Apache Group to a not-for-profit corporation."
I think, therefore thoughts exist. Ego is just an impression.
Sun walked away from the ISO several months ago because the ISO would not let them retain complete control, including imposing a licensing scheme, on the proposed ISO Java Standard. Sun merely did not want Java established as a standard, but they wanted to supercede the ISO when it came to formulating, monitoring, and enforcing the standard. This would have included huge licensing fees for anyone who used the ``standard''. It was little more than an attempt to get the ISO to become the licensing enforcement arm of Sun. When the ISO said no, Sun walked away.
So they tried to make an end run around the ISO through the ECMA (until Sun realized that Microsoft was and ECMA member), and now they are apparently forming an Executive Committee, (comprised primarily of corporations, as opposed to developers). If this is supposed to be the Java community-based Process program, where are the real members of the community, the developers!
Mr. McNealy, you cannot have your cake, and eat it too! Either Java is a copyrighted product, which you are free to license to third parties, or it is a standard. NOT BOTH! This is nothing more than another uncommitted publicity stunt by Sun that will accomplish nothing. Java will remain without standardization.
| Ceci n'est pas une pipe.
Obligatory Transmeta comment
Certainly, if we have a processor that can be modified to run any processor's code, it could be made to run the JVM "processor's" code. And since it does run-time optimization, it would run the applications faster.
Sun has been pushing its Java processors, but I haven't heard anything of them for years.
I think, therefore thoughts exist. Ego is just an impression.
The not in dot com
They believe Java's open
Creep silently, strike
Rational is not taking over J++, they're just producing a Java compiler that will run inside the next Visual Studio, along with, as their press release even mentioned, "Visual Basic, Visual C++, and Visual J++." (Yet another reason not to rely on Slashdot headlines for your information, although at least they didn't claim that Rational was also taking over VB and VC++.) You should know that ActiveSt ate is doing the same thing, joining the VS Integration Program so that Perl and Python will be integrated with the next version of Visual Studio. (Oh, and it's kinda silly to say that J++ isn't in widespread use.)
Cheers,
ZicoKnows@hotmail.com
Sure, you can add Java features to C++. You can also add C++ features to Java (like the template work that Sun is doing), but that misses the point.
I want to be able to write simple applications that work on a variety of operating systems. Stability, development speed and flexibility are more important to me than raw execution speed, so I'd rather develop in Java. Having a huge standard library is a great help, but it's not the only reason I choose Java over C++.
Sun has drawn a lot of fire for its stance towards open source. But I believe they have a (valid) reason for what they do. Remember Joy was one of the original BSD guys. He understands free software. While Java is very powerful and used in many places for many things, it is still in the "proving grounds" stage of its development to many (witness a new version every 8 months or so). It is not ready to be decentralized and exposed to the world at large yet. There are still some rather big sharks out there that would like nothing more than to take all of Sun's work (which has been for the most part just "given away" - specs, implementations, documentation, etc.) and run with it...branch it, assimilate it, extinguish it. Java is not ready for the possibility of being branched into many flavors. For a while more I think Sun is correct in keeping Java under central control while it's in its nascent stage. I don't know much about ISO, but couldn't ISO decide that we just needed /this/ little feature or /that/ little feature in Java? There are major features currently in development - like genericity/parameterized types. These things haven't crystallized yet. Sun already has published specs which are enough (AFAIK) to make your own implementation, and nobody is stopping you. Sun is forming this committee from companies it trusts and has worked with closely. I don't see what's wrong with that. I think sometimes we doth protest too much.
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
But remember, they also have released stuff as true open source, like http://jakarta.apache.org which they donated to the Apache Software Foundation. There are quite a few projects springing up on there, actually, but the orginal ones they donated were jakarta-tomcat (implementation of the servlet spec), jakarta-tools, and Ant (cool build tool, much easier to use than Make!). That alone deserves some kudos IMO.
Female Prison Rape in NY
are major features currently in development - like genericity/parameterized types. These things haven't crystallized yet. Sun already has published specs which are enough (AFAIK) to make your own implementation, and nobody is stopping you.
Can you point me to those specs? I can't find anything on Sun's Java site.
The authorities in British Columbia have offered to do a deal with Microsoft.
:)
Well folks, there you have it. Any last doubt of the B.C. government having a deal with the devil should be completely eliminated.
Coming from the B.C. lower mainland myself, where could they move? Burnaby? Richmond? (As the building is destroyed in th eearthquake and the soil liquifies). Chilliwack? Victoria?
My personal vote: Fort Saint John... (about 1000 miles NE of Vancouver..
Worst possible scenario: Stanley Park.
Reading further...
Gordon Wilson!?! Attracting Microsoft to B.C. That does it. We're all doomed...
;)
Trevor, from B.C., Canada
No, I was interested in genericity and how it is supposed to be integrated in Java. Maybe I misunderstood the original poster.
http://java.sun.com/aboutJava/communityprocess/jsr /jsr_014_gener.html
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?