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AOL/Transmeta/Gateway Internet Appliance Launch
A reader writes "America Online and Gateway are launching their Linux/Transmeta internet appliance today. The webcast can be seen here." The webcast is in Real Audio - you can also find our original coverage of this, back in late May 2000.
After getting some cheap 802.11 2 meg wireless cards for my laptop I don't EVER want to go back to dragging that 50 ft ethernet cable around anymore. :-) It is so nice to be able to kick back on the couch without any wireless dangling around for someone to trip on (taking your $2500 laptop along with them right out of your hand! :-).
If your "business" is getting interrupted by telemarketers, then it's not your problem if you wind up producing disgusting noises that cause them to want to end the call early...
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
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Why can't I moderate something "Wrong" or at least "Grossly Misinformed"?
Read the AP article that someone linked.
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What I want to know, is, if it has optional ethernet, how about a wireless WaveLAN card? Then you could haul it around the house and make sure you get first post on /.
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I mean, somebody has to pay the bills, and it's usually some consumer or taxpayer.
try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
Also, will this be a good test of transmeta's performance finally?
Doubtful. Web surfing doesn't stress the processor much. What it'll probably be stressing is Netscape plugin code efficiency, when it stresses anything at all.
I don't want to hear about it! I want to see it, read about it, find out how it works and ultimately -- take it apart, change the ISP it connects to and add a hard drive. Is that too much to ask?
Who says they're doing any kernel mods?
Even if they are, they could write a really clever EULA that says, in essence, "We own the box. You do not. We own the software. You do not." This would mean that they are not legally distributing any binaries, and are thus not required to release their source code.
Info world and
all net devices
Uses transmetta processor , is basically a web pad.
that AOL users don't care about a shell, they don't know what a root password is, and thus don't care if it has one, that Gateway is too cheap to spend extra money to make it less attractive, and that AOL didn't take the time to even set permissions, much less restrict them.
Remember, you're not the target audience...
1. Unlimited Karma whoring. Imagine using a webpad in the bathroom to write comments. You'd be the most brilliant poster on slashdot.
2. Infinite access to porn. Its just the right size to replace holding a playboy in one hand. How perfect is that?
3. Ultimate connectivity. No more running back to the bedroom during midnight snacking. There is another computer in the kitchen
4. Look mom, linux is EASIER than windows!
5. Read #4 again, out loud, and beam with joy.
6. Proclaim "ITS ALIVE" as you mix the hottest geek processor, the hottest geek OS, and the WORST online community.
7. FINALLY prove that there CAN be 31337 AOL users.
Okay, so I made #7 up..
GPL'd web-based tradewars themed space game
I'd expect Gateway/AOL to follow Compaq's pricing structure for their iPaq Home Internet Appliance , in which they offer a $400 rebate for a 36-month committment to the MSN Companion Service.
It was hacked? Got a pointer to the info?
-Vercingetorix
-Vercingetorix
"Necessitas non habet legem." -St. Augustine
There will be three devices. the First will be the wired device you see now. the last (and not in production yet) will be an 802.11 version.
expect it after january .
Not a Linux guru, but it strikes me that if it has a hard drive, and that hard drive can be extracted and returned to the system unharmed, it can be cracked. Other writable filesystems like compactflash could have the same vulnerabilities.
Mount it on YOUR Linux system as /gizmo, and use YOUR shell (with YOUR root) to do whatever you want to do to that filesystem. Replace /gizmo/etc/passwd, dump a few things in /gizmo/usr/bin and /gizmo/etc/config. Reinstall the hard drive in their hardware, and it's your hardware.
[
...AOL will be able to market this thing, especially if they do the rebate thing in exchange for 2 or 3 years of agreed AOL membership. They've already got 30 million people gladly accepting advertising at every online move they make. All they have to do is show some beautiful, acne-free teenagers in Limp Bizkit shirts posting to MTV's Total Request Live chat rooms on these things.
At least the touch screens will get them ready for a career of ringing up meals at fast food restaurants.
Bush is a cylon.
My question is, would AOL/Gateway/Transmeta/Whoever else is involved have any legal legs to stand on when (notice I say WHEN and not IF) these devices are hacked to work with other ISP's? AFAIK they are currently $599, which seems to me that they are for purchase. Could we have another I-Opener type "hot potato" on our hands here? IANAL, BTW.
"Dancing is the vertical expression of a horizontal desire" --Robert Frost
According to gateway.com, there will be an optional ethernet port. Which bumps this little device up from "who cares" to "cool, could be interesting". Of course, that's just assuming the smarter-than-me folk will figure out how to customize the OS. Blah, blah, I'd like to see it as an Xterm...
jred
www.cautioninc.com
caution, inc.
jred
I'm not a mechanic but I play one in my garage...
A related RealPlayer stream (that works) is available on AOL's corporate site. Here are links to the broadband and narrowband versions of the stream.
The presentation, by representatives of Gateway, AOL, Transmeta, and Broadcom, talks about Gateway's vision - the 'Wired Home' - HPNA and 802.11-based home device integration. Play MP3s from your PC, stream DVDs to your TV, get AIM in your kitchen, etc... It has a general introduction to the webpad, too, but it's targeted more at the stockholders and press.
Gateway points out that their Select and Performance series PCs already have HPNA cards integrated.
Of course, being Gateway, they have stated that the whole thing won't work with anything but Gateway PCs. They will have cards and software for other PCs 'sometime in the future'. Personally, I find it hard to believe that their stuff will only work on Gateway PCs. I bet that doesn't leave much oppertunity for open-source clients and servers either.
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Keep NOSPAM to reply
Oooo! I've got mail! ;)
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Isn't the entire point of using the Transmeta chips to save on power consumption?
If the thing's plugged in, who cares how much power it uses!
Just use an uber cheap celeron or something.
Apple has been providing 802.11 connectivity in most of their machines for approximately a year and a half. The only machine that they currently sell that you can't add 802.11 to is the cheapest iMac.
Although Apple calls it Airport, it is just an 802.11 card and base station, and works transparently with Lucent hardware. And, Apple sells it cheap. Add a card, plug-n-play, to any Airport capable machine for $99; the base station is $299. Compare those prices to Bluetooth, and since the range is 150 feet rather than 30, I think you've got a pretty good deal.
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$tar -xvf
it's relatively easy to set up a machine to be a ppp dialup server so that the xterm box "thinks it calling" an isp; whereas it's actually just using a twisted pair telco line into a linux ppp server. the linux ppp server is using isdn (or other highspeed) to connect to the net. not terribly difficult.
Don't think that a small group of dedicated individuals can't change the world. It's the only thing that ever has.
The pic from an old New York Times article:
/graphics.nytimes.com/library/tech/00/05/biztech/a rticles/30chip.1.jpg
:)
htt p:/
its wee - but you get a rough idea of the shape... though its probably changed by now
Ad in classifieds: Pandora's Box (no box) $5
Like so many politically correct (ie Linux-based) hi-tech schemes, this one seeks to provide a one-size fits all appliance that can't be easily hacked.
Microsoft takes proprietary technologies and extends/improves them to suck people in.
These guys are taking "open" technologies and closing them up in little boxes that can't be easily extended or improved.
We've tried giving away hardware/software in exchange for ads -- that doesn't work.
We've tried giving away software in exchange for service -- VA Linux and the like don't seem to be fairing well with that model.
What else is left but subscription-based services and cheesy closed "linux" appliances?
Oh well, guess I'm just OVERWHELMED by U.S.-style democracy this week.
Is this sig nificant?
# rm -f YouveGotMail.wav
Fire and Meat. Yummy.
This thing is doomed to failure. An untested, unproven processor with an operating system not known for its quickness.
Oh, puh-lease.
Even if everything you say were technically true, you forget the target market.
AOL's advertising catch line is, "So Easy to Use, No Wonder it's #1".
AOL users like their "IRC" client to be full of tacky sound effects like doors opening and closing.
The user interface looks like it was designed by simplifying a preschooler's story book.
And finally, there's the stupid "You've Got Mail" wav that they *love* to throw around everywhere.
I've *never* had an AOL account, and that sound is forever burned into my mind, along with the horrible login ?chimes?.
Bottom line? AOL users like that crap. They're simple enough that it's necessary for their computing experience. They won't notice if the machine happens to be sluggish.
So, on the contrary, this is probably a great place to whet the Transmeta's teeth, since it's really not a demanding appliation, and it certainly isn't as mission critical as a new desktop or notebook. (Imagine, if you will, that the Transmeta is a Pentium 60 with the FDIV fault. It would never be noticed in an internet appliance, though a good spreadsheet would expose it.)
If this thing were to take off, I think you'd find that within a few months there'd be a lot of complaints that it doesn't work as well as promised.I think you overestimate AOL users.
Fire and Meat. Yummy.
Quoted from subject line:
Go away, micro$hit troll!Moi? A troll? But of course!
But I take the Microsoft crack personally.
I'm in league with many entities, but I'll have you know that the devil is not one of them.
Fire and Meat. Yummy.
Even if it's not totally portable, it's still cool as heck. If it weren't for the obvious AOL lock-in strategy, I'd be all about auctioning off my laptop to help fund the purchase of one of these bad boys. I've been wanting touch screen action for quite a while. As it is, there is no way AOL is getting me to sign up for their service. They'd have trouble giving me a device this cool, just extract their $21.95 a month from me.
I do not have a signature
According to both candidates of the aborted presidental election, it is now clear that all older people in this country are eating dog food and can't even afford the medicine they need to stay alive.
Oh well!
Lord knows every other internet appliance has failed miserably.
It's a real stretch to call the crap that's been released so far an 'internet appliance.' More like network computers.
Let me know when the high-speed, wireless webpads with touch LCD screens and instant-on capabilities show up! These real internet appliances will be rolling out in 2001. Let the games begin!
-thomas
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence."
"And like that
Okay, the Gateway site for it is http://www.gateway.com/consumer/connectedhome/prom otedcosmos/kepler/intro.shtml
Anyway, it seems to be aimed at somebody who already has a PC, and wants an Internet access device elsewhere in the house. It'll be cool to see how it gets hacked...
There's no "we" in team, only "me"
Sure, but you don't have a touchscreen or wireless keyboard, and the PC takes up much more space.
Apparently this is targeted not as a PC replacement, but a PC supplement; think of it as a limited terminal instead of a PC. What will be neat is to see if it can be hacked to work as an X terminal.
There's no "we" in team, only "me"
Well, the Gateway info page suggests this one iss being marketed as a supplement for homes that already have PCs, not as a device for people without PCs. "No muss, no fuss, let you kids surf the Internet while you run Quicken on the computer."
So, it's aimed at a different market segment. Whether that will help or not remains to be seen...
There's no "we" in team, only "me"
I think I read somewhere that it was intended to retail for $599! I don't know about the rest of you but I can buy a full PC for less. The only way this is going to take off is if this baby is in the VCR price range. It should be simple but also CHEAP! It will be hard for parents to swallow when kids say "I want Santa to get me a XYZ" when that XYZ is $599. If they can make a profit selling it for $100, they should... and no more than $200 or forget about the product. It will only appeal to slashdot readers if the price is any higher.
I miss the Karma Whores.
Hmmmm....so it really is AOL after all!
> "...works only with Internet service provided by America Online..."
According to the AP story you posted:
"The device"..."can use either a traditional dial-up connection or, when networked with a PC, a high-speed Internet connection."
I was thinking: if it really could 'only' be used with an AOL connection, it should be trivial to see how this linux box connects to AOL, and therefore give us the ability to connect to AOL via linux (thus allowing for grandmother to use a nice OS and her favorite Online Service).
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If Bill Gates had a nickel for every time Windows crashed...
I don't understand any of the excitement -- apart from perhaps the Transmeta chip under the hood. There's very little difference between this toy and Compaq's new iPaq web appliance. They're both desktop/tabletop devices and they both have wires (although fewer than your standard PC.
I think what most of us would like would be a "web tablet"; something about the form factor of a tablet of paper with 802.11 connectivity to a base station of some sort.
If it weren't for the ridiculous expense of 802.11 (as Lucent is the sole provider I know of these days), I'd turn my iPaq PocketPC into a small version of what I describe above.
802.11 is too damned expensive.
I wonder if this is a genuine effort, or just an attempt to dumb down these cool technologies for the average AOL brain-dead users...
Ñ'
The true question is, how long will it take to figure out what they did, and re-code the little bugger to do what we want it to do?
:)
Also, will this be a good test of transmeta's performance finally?
What ability will there be for people to upgrade the software (netscape 6 anyone?)?
Is winamp included?
But most importantly of all (I just COULDNT resist) -- I wonder what a beowolf cluster of these would do for Seti@home?
:)
GPL'd web-based tradewars themed space game
And unless you have an rj-11 jack and power source near the toilet, you won't be flaming with this device either. This device is not a portable device like the much-touted wireless WebPads will be, this is a table-top device with a footprint that allows you to use it in places besides the typical office desk. You don't be carrying this into the kitchen to do a grocery list unless you want to power the unit down, unplug it, carrry it into the kitchen, plug it in, power it up, etc.
Lord knows every other internet appliance has failed miserably. Netpliance an nounced that they will be getting out of the business, Virgin has bailed out (and yes Virginia, the bios password was hacked within 24 hours of that announcement), WebPods had all of 300 subscribers, etc. Somehow, the lack of local hard storage to store stuff plus (frequently) a poor isp service, doomed these guys. I wonder if this guy will be any different?
AOL is using Linux in their latest attempt to take over the world. We must stop developing Linux immediately, or else we'll be doing their dirty work for them!
WARNING: there is a trojan on your
Gateway
Sure, it doesn't have any local storage, etc. but this is exactly what most older or less technically inclined people are looking for. I can already see Grandmas lining up to get at these things. Knowing that their trusty grandson/daughter geek won't have to come over and set anything up like they would with a pesky computer. They also won't have to worry about any of those annoying worms/trojan horse/MS macro or script viruses. For the ignorant internet user this is the ideal solution. The people who will flock to these are either already AOL users or have many friends/relatives who are. With two well known (to the common person) companies behind it these have a lot more going for them than any of the others. All of the failures so far have either been a) unheard of start-ups or b) well known for other things and people just weren't sure anout this new venture.
Of course, this is all just in theory.
It's LINUX! IT RULES!!
what? It's AOL?!?
It's AOL! IT SUCKS!
Did you say Transmeta?
OH GOD! WHAT DO I DO?!?!
According to the page here: on Gateway's site, it has built in home-phoneline networking. This is rather useful for many people, although lots of /. readers probably have cat-5 strung around (and /. readers probably wouldn't want to use this unless it could be hacked to not use AOL. although if it was just aol's browser, and not their service, it wouldn't be that bad for a device to give to family members to keep them off your PC).
In addition, it has optional ethernet, and dial up (V90). So I don't think you're too limited here for connectivity.
BTW, lots of PC's come with home phone line networking built in. My brother's Presario 7597 has a combo v90 modem/home phone line networking card plus ethernet built in. In any case, a lot of people will be able to plug these devices into their pc's pretty easily to share a broadband connection.
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The reason why the unit is priced at $600 is that it costs a fair bit of money to put together:
Consider the pricing on PDAs; this unit potentially does a lot more than the Compaq iPAQ units that are priced at around $500.
I don't disagree that the price is pretty painful; the point is that Portability Costs. You can't take that $500 AMD K6-based system into the bathroom and flame people on Slashdot whilst "on the throne." You can't carry it into the kitchen and write up a list of groceries to get. Lots of can'ts there.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
Hey, now when script kiddies break in, they'll hear "You've got root!"..
-Kris
...that it doesn't come with a shell, they don't give the root password, the whole thing resembles a Linux box even less than a Tivo, they might not even HAVE a root password, the board is sealed with all the pins covered in opaque hard plastic, and the permissions are set very strictly to avoid any kind of circumvention. It's possible to make a box extremely difficult to crack in software, and with a little forward thinking, make it useless if cracked in hardware.
WARNING: there is a trojan on your
For those who don't feel like watching the webcast, Here's the AP story
"...works only with Internet service provided by America Online..."
Give me 5 minutes. =)
end communication