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Heart Surgery By Robot
zebidee writes: "I've always been pretty amazed at the advances they continue to make in the field of medical science but this one really does take top prize. The BBC is reporting that the clever boffins at St. Mary's Hospital in London are preparing to use a new robotic arm to carry out heart bypass surgery using the da Vinci system developed by Intuitive Surgical. Read more about on the BBC News page. This really is the 21st century!"
> Yeah, I'd rather be operated by a robot running Windows 2004 than by a human ...
You mean Whistler? Eeek.
I don't remember that part. Must be some uncorrectable memory errors.
Before I read the article, I was thinking along the lines of the scene in `Logan's Run' when the laser cosmetic surgery machine goes berserk.
In response to those who say they'd rather trust a human holding a scalpel: I think I'd prefer to stay healthy so I don't need the bypass surgery.
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Yep. You're right. But, I'll still avoid robotic surgery.
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Open source can have bugs too. It is more important that the thing is properly tested. And as far as I know the rules are pretty strict for medical software.
And as for windows, It wouldn't surprise me if they did use it for parts of the system. Probably the actual control software runs on some real-time OS, but there's more to complex systems like that than control software alone.
And you'd be wrong to assume that because of that the quality suffers. Using of the shelf components like MS windows in medical software greatly improves functionality of the system. I've heard of several examples where a windows based front-end complements control software written for some real time OS.
Jilles
I would guess that the surgeon has to take their job as seriously as if they were in the operating room hacking away directly on the patient (i.e., try and avoid random muscle spasms which might cause the scalpel to cut through important stuff).
If they're using haptic feedback (sense of touch & force feedback) then they probably are trying to set up some kind of proper hand/eye interface so that the surgeon can perform the normal types of movements that they are used to, and the robot will perform those same movements remotely (while transmitting back through the interface the same kinds of feelings that the surgeon would get if operating directly).
As for your last issue, there's no reason why the robot has to operate on a 1-to-1 scale of movement - in fact, with the proper feedback, going through the robot could increase the surgeon's margin of error quite a bit. (On the other hand, surgeons might start thinking that they'll be able to operate even after a 24-hour bender and they're shaking with the DTs - "just make those movements REAL slow, Bettie!").
I thought that had happened because the main computer had given instructions to the surgeon that he was supposed to kill Logan, so the surgeon programmed his laser-surgery machine to not perform the healing-part of the operation?
On the other hand, that one robot which was capturing people who tried to get to Sanctuary & turning them into food...
I can see the benefit of this in terms of comfort from the surgeons point of view during lengthy operations, and in reducing incision sizes, therefore reducing patient recovery times.
But, as this is still a device controlled by a human, are patients still susceptible to human error? For example, what happens if the surgeon slips and knocks the joystick while the robot arm is holding a scalpel? I haven't read the whole Da Vinci website so maybe I missed something, but are there any kind of built-in mechanisms to prevent sudden/eratic movements as opposed to slow/controlled movements?
This could pose a problem if surgeons are dealing with smaller incisions as there could be less margin for error.
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Moderator's essentials
Nurse: "Dr. Steele! He having an allergic reaction to the anesthesia! His blood vessels are dialiating! We're going to lose him!"
Dr. Steele:"Nurse Ratchet, do be a dear and give me some of that WD40... my back is killing me"
NR:"But Doctor..."
DS:"*puke*Your operation has caused a general protection fault at 0x12314324214..."
No thanks... I'll stick to the meat puppets, thank you.
The emacs religion: to be saved, control excess.
IMHO if we develop a faster (than light, presumably) means of communication through space, we will no longer have problems going to Mars or anywhere else in the Universe instantaneously, so the health problem would not exist.
...of possible heart surgery by a tin man.
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Good judgment comes from experience.
Experience comes from bad judgment.
I recall a few years ago watching a video of the first prototype Protate Gland removal robot in action (in the company of an aging robotician who was due into hospital a couple of dfays later to have the said operation done, but in a more conventional fashion). Excruciating. Plently of eye-watering links from google
I'd love to see someone combine a couple foot pedals, a throttle, and two cyberman 3-D mice to come up with a joystick that works the same way. Of course, I'd also love to see two lemurs doing Vaudeville numbers on the 21st floor of the CSFB building in NYC. I guess I'm just weird like that.
--- Heeeeeeeeeere, FIDONet.... heeeeeeeeeer, FIDONet. Hey... where'd FIDO go?
I cannot beleive that they are using Royal's DaVinci PDA to run the thing.
- "Watch me frag this guy!"
- "The MP3 server is skipping again -- can you bump up its realtime priority?"
- "Oh shit! We're getting slashdotted!"
- "That pesky 'ph3ar me Y00 l8m3r' dialog box keeps popping up."
- "Fuck all these warnings, I'm taking '-Wall' out of the Makefile".
- "These Celerons are so great for overclocking."
- "Check it out -- that hot radiologist says she loves me! I better read this e-mail right now!"
- "Yeah, I'm running 2.5.3-pre7-ac12-dontuse. Why do you ask?"
And the #1 thing you don't want to hear in a bot-enhanced operating room:RoboSurgeons, from the Nov/Dec 2000 issue. Complete with pictures and links.
This reminds me the novel by Arthur C. Clarke: Rama; where a robot surgeon cuts the spaceship personnel into peaces because it is not programmed to stop when anything unexpected happens (like the ship bumping into something)...
Donate free food to the hungry at The Hunger site.
Here are a few things I found while reading about this a few months ago. What's interesting is this stuff is already in prototype in China and some other medical institutions. enjoy!
s urgery.ap/
s ia/china-15-11-00_01.htm
_ 7252000.html
0 7/24/newscolumn1.html
t ml
http://www.cnn.com/2000/HEALTH/10/24/robot.heart.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/regionalnews/easta
http://www.abcnews.go.com/local/wabc/oncall/40340
http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_69581.html
http://www.bizjournals.com/portland/stories/2000/
http://www.office.com/global/0,2724,61-17731,FF.h
http://dross38040.users2.50megs.com/page28.html
Two infinite things: your stupidity and mine. But I'm not sure about the latter. If my sig offends you, I'm sorry.
Robot Surgery by Heart?
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"I would say that 99 per cent of what my father has written about his own life is false." - L. Ron Hubbard Jr.
My girlfriend is a PHD student, and she is currently doing research in medical technology. Recently she's had a demonstration of this device. After that demonstration, they were allowed to handle the machine and try some manipulations.
From what I understood:
1. This is not an intelligent robot, but a tool for the surgeon. Sensors are connected to the surgeons hands and arms, and they are transmitted to the operational device. It still is the surgeon which does the operation.
2. Resistance, which I saw mentioned in one of the other responses, is simulated to the surgeon doing the operation. Thus, a more 'natural' feel is created.
3. This device and devices like it are great tools for Minimal Invasive Surgery (MIS). Because the opening doesn't have to be large at all, and devices can be sterilized, this greatly reduces the risk of infection.
4. If developments continue along this line, and there is no reason to believe they won't, operation rooms may become obsolete for many operations: a closed sterile device is pressed against the area where the opening has to come. All that has to be sterile is the insides of the operation device.
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the pun is mightier than the sword