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Comic Books And The Internet, Continued
A number of readers have
written in about the Salon story talking with Gary Groth's recation to Scott McCloud's pieces on the intersection of the comic and the Internet. Groth's feelings are much different then McCloud. I love the comic book format (am currently reading Cerebus, The Dreaming and Bone amongst others) and think is an interesting issue - 'specially considered within the greater question of "art" and digital media.
I really enjoy CRFH. It's one of my favorites. If there were no Internet comics, I would not be able to read it; it would not exist. The Salon article has a direct quote from the author of CRFH saying just that. Mr. Groth can rant tediously all he wishes, but he won't convince me that a world without CRFH is a better world.
Even if you think micropayments will never happen the way McCloud describes them, McCloud still deserves some credit. He cares about comics, and wants to see them survive and prosper. As he wrote in his book, market forces in the printed-comics world can crush new comics: you can't get sales unless stores stock your comic, stores won't stock your comic if it's not just another X-Men ripoff. With the web, anyone can put up a new comic, and the good ones can grow by word-of-mouth.
One last note: if you think Internet comics are all quick gag-a-day strips, you might want to check out the Zot graphic novel. It's very good!
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
Once again, x-thousand other webcomics got passed over, too... many of them better than Sluggy et al, but not so long-lived or well-hyped. Comics like Irritability and Zebra Girl are pretty much unheard-of, but are quality stuff. Unfortunately, they aren't as media-friendly as Sluggy or User Friendly.
So, with all due respect, quit yer complainin'. ;-) There are a lot of webcomics being "forgotten," not just your favourites.
JOSH.
Unfortunately, like everything else, they suffer from Sturgeons Law (states that 90% of everything is crap) just like everything else. And, with the prices they go at these days, its not worth keeping up with a series that looks like it has potential, and its a pain to play catch-up with a series that just got good but you don't have the first 9 issues. After realizing how much better I could spend $4 Canadian, I got out of that. Also, anyone else notice that the quality of a comic is inversely proportional to the length of its run?
How long does it take this guy to read the comics in the paper? Doesn't Goth realize the short attention-span comics in the paper created comic art (The Yellow Kid in The New York World started the whole chebang in 1894)?
Maus was, and still is, amazing. The CD-ROM version including audio interviews with Art's grandfather mixed with imagery from Auschwitz is extremely moving. I don't think people will confuse some of the comics that are being published on the net with works like Maus. Art, and others, will still be able to publish in places like The New Yorker where I'm happy to read it.
But writing off new forms of media for your art is always dangerous, because it never works. These guys need to remember comic art that tackles tough social and political issues faced the same criticisms they're making of the web as a comic art distribution method.
Which is the problem that Sluggy is having now. The Bug/Witch/Robot plot, while good, lasted for 2 months, and the current Microuniverse story is at least 2 months and still going with no sign of resolution, and as it continues, it's getting weaker as Pete's used up most of the pop culture references that he can. Take a look back at the first year or so of Sluggy and you'll see plots that lasted two or three weeks at most, or for extended plots, there were breaks that looked back at the other characters to see what they were up to.
It's not that Sluggy's terrible, but I can vouch that others that had read it regularly prior to 2001 have stopped reading it because of these super long plot lines. I'm still getting the odd laugh from the current line, and I know that at some point we'll have hit the 'reset' button to get Torg and Riff back.
"Pinky, you've left the lens cap of your mind on again." - P&TB
"I can see my house from here!" - ST:
I find it curious that the article was exclusively "comic books vs internet comics", and ignored any comparison to comic STRIPS. Are the newspaper comics strips simply not considered an art form? Or was it simply that they had comic book authors' opinions on file and wanted to show them venting about the new medium?
An important point that doesn't seem to have been addressed in this topic is the ability of the Internet to be used as a training/recruiting ground for new artists and writers.
Regardless of what is the "right answer", the Internet is a valuable tool for comic producers to develop their drawing/character styles and sharpen their ability to tell a story or a joke. At the same time, they can make a few bucks either from banner ads or in the form of micropayments (McCloud's concept).
For the publisher, it gives them a chance to see what the aspiring artist or writer can do along with seeing their ability to create for an extended period of time.
If there are forums for feedback, it gives both parties a chance to see what the ultimate customer thinks of it and where improvements have to be made.
So regardless of how the final product is produced, the Internet has a useful purpose in developing and testing talent.
myke
Mimetics Inc. Twitter
- Palooka-Ville - by Seth. Published by Drawn & Quarterly. Pick up the collected story arc, It's a Good Life, If You Don't Weaken. It's a semi-autobiographical account about the author's quest to find an obscure New Yorker artist (drawn in a New Yorker style).
- Ghost World, David Boring, or anything else by Daniel Clowes. This guy is one of the best writers in Indie comics. Sharp, dark humor. Published by Fantagraphics.
- Jimmy Corrigan: The Smartest Kid on Earth - By Chris Ware. This one is available at Barnes & Noble and Borders. Collected from the Acme Novelty Library series. A heart-wrenching story about a pathetic man who meets his father for the first time. The best series I read last year and Ware is the greatest hope for comics being taken as a serious medium. Also published by Fantagraphics.
- Optic Nerve - By Adrian Tomine. Published by Drawn & Quarterly. One of the most promising young talents in indie comics. Pick up Sleepwalk and other stories, which collects issues 1 - 4 of Optic Nerve. Short stories about real people. Brilliant work.
- From Hell - By Alan Moore and Eddie Campbell. Moore's analysis of Jack the Ripper is frightening, shocking, and enthralling. I've read this series three times and I still haven't absorbed everything. Available in a collected edition at B&N and Borders.
- Maus - By Art Spiegelman. Winner of the Pulitzer Prize. One of the most overlooked treasures in comics. This book stands in the shadow of Watchmen when people talk about the best comics produced in the 80's. A masterpiece narrative about the Holocaust. This is the torch-bearer for greatness in the comics medium.
- Anything by Brian Michael Bendis - This guy is reigniting the Marvel line with his work on Elektra and Ultimate Spider-Man but some of his best work was done at Image Comics. Pick up Jink and Torso, both available in TPB.
And a few other quick recommedations: Non by Jordan Crane, Jar of Fools and Berlin by Jason Lutes, the re-issued B&W TPB of Akira and Oh My Goddess! both published by Dark Horse, and Peter Milligan on X-Force. Phew! Any one who says that comics are dead isn't reading any. There are spectacular things going on in the medium at the moment. With sales down, publishers like Marvel and DC are taking more risks. The result? Some of the best comics from these companies in the last ten years. And like I've outlined, Indie comics are still churning out *great* books.For even more recommendations and some damn good thoughts on the comics industry as a whole, read Warren Ellis' series Come In Alone at Comic Book Resources. A collected, dead-tree version is also available (which I have and strongly recommend).
We want some answers and all that we get
Some kind of shit about a terrorist threat
- Ministry
I think the problem is that these super-long story lines make great reading in archived form... that is, when they're all strung together. When reading the old Bloom County collections (I never read the dailies), I used to get pissed if a storyline was less than a week long. Part of what Groth is whining about -- the short attention span of readers -- is part and parcel of the one-a-day thing. You're right... things do seem dull when you get them in dribs and drabs. I just wish Groth would try releasing some of his in a daily format, and see how well it does.....
AHHHHHHH! I'm burning with goodness again!
- Reakk, Sluggy Freelance
Paper is still a beautiful medium.
Got Rhinos?
I like Sluggy Freelance for two reasons:
1. Because it is self-published, it is not subject to potential censorship by editors at the distribution syndicate. Let's face it--many of the storylines in Sluggy Freelance would never pass muster with syndicate censors.
2. The comic has done several extremely long story arcs that distribution syndicates often frown upon. Remember in 1999 with the time machine that went haywire, which built up to the famous Stormbreaker Saga?
Sure, Sluggy Freelance may not be perfect all the time, but it's still vastly superior than most syndicated comics you read in the newspaper comics sections nowadays.