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The Astronaut's New Clothes
Metox writes: "An article posted on www.sciam.com gives a glimpse into the future of space clothing for use in hostile environments, Earth orbit, Mars, etc. Of all the facts in the article, the one I found most interesting is that the current EVA (Extra Vehicular Activity) suit is an astonishing 24 years old. However, the article gives a good reason for this. As the EVA suit is used in a microgravity environment, mobility isn't as important, and dexterity can be enhanced by simple changes to the arms and hands. The article highlights the current tests of two new EVA/Mars contenders, the I-Suit and the H-Suit."
space is not going to be really conqurable until we can get skin tight style suits going. Even with the fact that in space weight becomes less of a problems (it is not gone, it returns as inertia force). Range of mobility in an enviroment that can kill you will be key. I would hope that they are spending more research in this area. Polarizing suits and cermic wire heaters would seem to be the way to go. The real trick is keeping what is on the inside from leaking to the ourside. Non-porus plastics are available, I would think you could layer those with light sensitice polarizing compunds, beef up the style of artic survival suits heaters and give it a go. If we can free ourselves from the bulkyness of the suits we have now anything in space will be possible.
Papa Legba come and open the gate
Sounds like a good idea. I am all for it.
Would it be possible for an astronaut stranded in space in one of these suits (or any suit) to manuever themselves to the space station at all, or would they be pretty fucked? I know it sounds highly unlikely, but it could happen, couldn't it?
From the article:
The Hamilton Sundstrand team is considering a technology that would project information onto the helmet's visor or onto the astronaut's retina. They are also looking into small wrist-worn devices.
This is why I love seemingly pointless scientific endeavors. Why should we go to Mars? I guess it's cool, maybe we'll find some cool microrganisms to study, etc, but cool new gadgets are what I'm into.
I want this display info on my glasses system. Forget PDAs, all your info could be on your glasses. Even better, maybe on your contacts. No more forgetting my PDA in my backpack. This is freakin cool!
F-bacher
James Tiberius Kirk: "Spock, the women on your planet are logical. No other planet in the galaxy can make that claim."
In nearly all sci-fi, people in space wear skin-tight suits. Since space is a vacuum, I can understand why a suit would tend to billow out, but does anybody know if it is possible to make a non-bulky skinsuit? Maybe something like the G suits pilots wear? Maybe something related to scuba diving (though I know the pressure difference there is the opposite)? I dunno, but if I'm not going to get my hovercar anytime soon, I at least want my spacesuit.
> In fact, it should be incredibly obvious that
> the concept of a 110-story building even being
> built, much less two, is a clear and obvious
> fraud. No documentation of these "twin towers"
> existed before a "terrorist attack" occured on
> the previously-nonexistent pair of skyscrapers
> on September the 11th.
I guess it's too early for any sort of sense of humor on the subject.
When we go to Mars, best case right now, you would be in transit for six months," Hodgson says. Once the spacecraft reached the planet, it could stay for only a few days.
A couple days seem a bad return on billions of dollars. Mars base on the other hand....
This is one of the weirdest trolls I've seen.. Is it somebody working under the idea that adding even the smallest amount of confusion to someone's day counts? Or a groundswell gimmick for some new Stephen King book?
Stephen King is not dead and has not been for the few weeks that this message has been repeatedly posted.
A planet where apes evolved from men? Long live the apes.
I dont think any suit short of multiple layers of Kevlar (heh, like a hundred) is going to protect an astronaut from being killed by a fleck of paint going 20,000 MPH..Thats the main problem I think should be addressed. I'd be more concerned about physical safety than I would be about mobility.
Cheers,
Bowie J. Poag
Imagine 38 of D in zero-G.
Maybe this could mean the US and Russians will finally standardize on one space suit, instead of having to spend millions on an airlock because god forbid we cooperate...
end communication
Spacesuits are special clothes that are made in order to protect the bodies of astronauts in the space. Astronauts may keep being alive by wearing spacesuits in the space at all times. Human beings are not able to keep their lives in the space by wearing clothes as those on the earth. For this
reason, astronauts wear specially manufactured spacesuits so that they can endure the vaccuum, radiation, and temperatures.
Mars is a different environment from that of the earth on which we live. It is a space in which there is practically no atmospheric pressure nor significant oxygen, and the extremely hot and cold environments are repeated by the solar energy. Also, astronauts are threatened by the space dust
flying around at a fast speed, various electronic waves, radiation, etc. Therefore, in order for an astronaut to come out of a spaceship and to move around freely, and to urinate.
This post was first marked -1 troll, then mismoderated to offtopic. Clearly the most on topic post in the thread at this moment is the following post.
It regards the main artwork of the story and discusses the problem of LONG TERM space suit usage.
The drawing in the story shows a sight hard to believe, a biological female comfortable on mars.
As you may know, extended stay in a suit in the airforce is miserable for females once the primary diaper padding (for females) is soiled.
catheterizing may help, but self catheterizing is difficult and prone to problems over multiple usage. Even worse, extgended catheterization of female urethra weakens an already very weak structure.
The male urethra has a strong ring of circular bands (including "fundus ring") to prevent not only urine output, but to prevent massive retrograde ejaculation. A backup sphincter of striated, not smooth, muscle assists in male continence as well.
Basically thick viscous ejaculate matter can go only forward, not backward through the sphincter into the bladder.
Females, unfortunately, lack a solid ring and as can be seen in anatomical photo cross sections, possess two bulbous muscular clumps to serve as a partial seal.
That is one reason many females are more incontinent than men, and why many more females urinate while giggling than men.
Elderly men with prostate problems are a different problem.
But without penii, it is aparent that these space suits are miserable eternal wet diapers for females.
This is asuming that females are going to be needed in space for critical work in the first place.
Did the moderator even LOOK at the story before slamming this to -1?
Am I the only one who thinks it looks like something out of an ould sci-fi movie. I'm a bit young but the first thing that poped into my head was "Danger Danger"
It was me, I did it, I moved your cheese
the problem is that it cannot be sleeved (sheathed) to collect waste in a leg bag with a oneway valve, allowing 5 days of steady collection before desuiting.
vaccuum prevents, or hinders, desuiting. In fact , using a dual seal method, the waste can be portted out a vent after sealing a clasp before the bag.
This "urine dump" results in a spectacular shower of crystalized sparking urine.
Current suits do not have urine dump features or multiday collection.
And suits for females NEVER will.
This evidently requires the moderator to make this -1 perpetually.
strange.
Am I the only one who sees this and wonders if it will come in nifty translucent colors?
Those who can't do, teach. Those who can't teach either, do tech support.
As a Sci-Fi Geek, I won't be happy until everyone in space has a set of Power Armor with weapons and jump jets fully integrated!! :)
Can someone please mod this down or remove this post.
/., despite what's happened this week.
Let's try to be civil here at
that was about fucking bizarre
I'd think, in space and such, with a proper insulative suit, the problem isn't generating heat, because the human body does that okay... it's shedding excess heat!
The human body, unfortunately, doesn't cool down by radiating in the IR range; it cools down via evaporation of sweat.
So in a skintight suit, the sweat would pool and collect into a thin puddle under the suit and heat would start to build up pretty quickly, I think.
I have no idea how the Dune stillsuits conquered that problem...
GPL Deconstructed
Where are you going to find flecks of paint traveling 20kmph on the surface of Mars?
I would have to hazard the existence of an EVA suit and a ''Planetary Descent Hazard' suit. At least it'd be something more comfortable and utilitarian than the short if cute yeoman's miniskirts in Star Trek.
GPL Deconstructed
I still don't think it was ever discussed how they shed heat in a stillsuit, especially if they recycled and collected all the sweat... no evaporation means no heat loss, right?
GPL Deconstructed
Yeah, but what proof do I have that you exist? I think _you_ are the hoax.
P.S. You can't quote "I think therefore I am" as an argument. You aren't demonstrating anthing remotely like thought.
"Of all the facts in the article, the one I found most interesting is that the current EVA (Extra Vehicular Activity) suit is an astonishing 24 years old"
Yeah. I wish I had some beta XP style suit with many new features so that I could die in cold space all alone.
What damn reason do we need new space suits for. The arguments here sound cosmetic. The object of wearing a space suit is to keep alive and do work in the worst environment ever known to man.
And if you want a skin tight suit that will withstand a crack from a washer going 20,000 miles an hour forget it. The heat dissapation alone would vaporize a human.
It is arrogant for a bunch of computer jocks to think you could engineer everthing much better than it is now. I understand it, I even hope our generation whips some serious smack down on the engineering world. But, there are people who DO this.
AS if computers run for shit now as it is. They have a hell of long road before they are another ma bell or eiffel tower or autobahn or municipal electric service or even cable tv.
Go back to work on computers, at least then you stand a shot at changing the world for the better.
Ok, I'm breaking my tradition of not replying to crap like this to ask the simple question, why do so many people bother to respond to idiotic postings? We could save a little time and bandwidth by simply ignoring people when they shout out how stupid they are. Go ahead and moderate this off-topic. I know it is, but it's aimed at an audience who will read it.
Seems very mad to me. The problem with the journey to Mars is a human problem. There should be no issue with sending a continual supply of food and materials. Leave them in orbit round mars till needed. Then either dock with the mother ship when it arrives or drop through the atmosphere for delivery on planet as needed.
Deleted
She comes in colours.
This comment is not lame. I promise. Maybe.
Bitchslapped. Neat.
I don't know that much about Mars atmosphere, pressure, and so on, so this might be a silly question, but...
Do they need suits at all? Is running around the surface of Mars that much different than being halfway up Mt Everest? If it's too cold for extended trips, then a suit would be great, but if it's warm enough to go outside for a while, imagine how an astronaut would feel with the wind against his/her bare skin - knowing that it's the wind of a different planet...
Last post!
What we have here is someone new to trolling. See how lame a comment he makes? Now, he'll crawl back into his hole and think about this for a while before emerging and trying again elsewhere.
This has been brought to you by Mutual of Omaha's Wild Troll Kingdom.
-- www.globaltics.net
Political discussion for a new world
Did the moderator even LOOK at the story before slamming this to -1?
i'm willing to bet that choice phrases like "What about suits for Dickless Wonders" and "What about space suits for the penis challenged" were among the reasons for the post's demise.
irb(main):001:0>
Menstration is not really a problem. If needed, there are drugs available that will all but halt the menstration process. Also, although they make up a relatively small percentage of EVAs, women hold some of the longest duration space walks ever. And we aren't talking about just floating in space, we are talking about rigorous work such as assembling parts of the ISS. The reasoning behind this has generally been that women have a lower repseratory rate than most men, and are typically smaller, which gives them a center of mass more suitable for work in a weightless environment.
Of course, the disadvantage of this is that the suits have to be that much smaller, and currently there is an awefull lot packed into each suit. It used to be that each suit was designed for an individual. Now they come in sizes. Currently work is being done on an extra small suit, with the target astronaut being Japanees females.
the one I found most interesting is that the current EVA (Extra Vehicular Activity) suit is an astonishing 24 years old
On the other hand, nobody has died or been injured in the last 24 years because of their suit. There's something to be said for that kind of reliability.
Do you have ESP?
Why can't they just use those metal and leather thongs with the metal bras and fur trim and big ass spears, spike heel thigh high boots. The men can dress like gladiators. At least that's how it is in the movies.
Don't knock retrograde ejaculation until you try it.
But seriously, you wonder why your post was moderated as offtopic? You could have summed up 3/4 of it with - "Current spacesuits were designed without proper consideration of the female anatomy." Instead you ramble on about "bulbous muscular clumps" and whatnot for nearly 10 paragraphs.
As usual, it's not NASA that is doing the major research in this area, it's private companies. Same as the research being done at Devon Island, etc. NASA has no intrest in sending humans to Mars any time soon. It will be private companies, or orginizaions like the Mars Society that will send humans to Mars, not NASA.
(The Mars society actually has a cool new project underway, they are planning to launch some mice into orbit & simulate Mars gravity, so they can test the effects on mammals, & their offspring. Slightly more important and practical research than most of what NASA is doing)
The (Hopefully) Great Slashdot Blackout Apr 21-27
Notice the molding on the "H-Suit" worn by the male model. Will the female version have a bust molded into it, and be missing that raised portion on the cod-piece?
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
Specifically, see this link for an explanation of the "SAFER" system - basically, nitrogen jets.
. ht ml
http://www.sciam.com/2000/0600issue/0600working
testing my posting abilities...
The real question is will the H-suit be hacked and get all the porn channels??
They make retinal displays.
http://www.mvis.com/retscandisp.htm
Good stuff. The cell phone gizmo is at the bottom, that's your PDA.
Full Disclosure: I've lost a good deal of money on their stock.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
Oh, and maybe name every astronaut "Gordon Freeman" :P
We really do need new space suits for the ISS. I suspect that they primarily got hit with budget cutting to reduce the cost of the station to something that won't cause it to be canned for being too expensive.
The main annoyance with the current suits is that they operate at pure oxygen at a reduced pressure. This can very easily cause "The Bends", so you need to have an overnight pre-breathe.
Jerry Pournelle argues that we need a zero-pre-breathe suit that is easy to deal with. Why? Because that way, you could assemble structures in space. For the long truss structure for the ISS, we are sending up integrated chunks. If EVA planning was easier and we send up ironworkers instead of scientists, we could send up components of a space structure in any booster, large or small, and assemble them into a completed structure. This makes more sense when you consider that it is far easier to create a reusable launch vehicle that has a quarter of the cargo-carying capacity of the shuttle than one that has the cargo-carying capacity of the shuttle.
It's also good because you can have your final product as lightly constructed as a butterfly.
I only half agree with Jerry Pournelle, instead figuring that what we need more is a large inflatable hangar. That way, you don't need to deal with your parts floating into orbit and becomming part of the space debris problem, you don't need any sort of space suit, and you don't need to deal with maintaining the space suits.
I really would love it if somebody could reference some real research about skintight spacesuits for my reference files. I mean, if we ever want more people in space, an inexpensive skintight spacesuit would be great so that every room could have a few ready in case of depresurization.
Gentoo Sucks
Damn right! I especially hope that his racist ass comes down first! Give him a special bullet!
The flexibility (ability of a suited astronaut to move without restriction) is of vital importance to any space endeavor. Just ask any of the spacewalkers from the apollo testing program. A vast majority of energy expended in space is due to the inability to hold positions other than "normal" (pressurized shape of the suit.) In one of Cernan's first spacewalks, the primary mission was scrubbed because he fatigued too rapidly. Overheating and exhaustion are the primary dangers. Cernan had so much difficulty getting back into the capsule in a pressurized suit that he went through almost bone breaking contortions to squeeze into the pilots chair enough to close the hatch. The first Societ spacewalker had to depressurize his suit to operate the airlock system. Don't get me wrong, suits have gotten better, but until we have a suit that can allow full freedom of motion with almost zero strength needed to hold position, we will be severely limited in our space construction abilities.