Bokks Linux Based AV Component

Here is an article about a new linux based AV stereo componenent. This one is from Bokks and it has a lot going for it: Plays your MP3s, MPEGs, VOBs, and soon Divx. Has standard audio and video ports, a sleek form factor, and what looks to be a sexxy interface. Its ethernet interface can take input from NFS or Samba, or the net. The only downside I see is that it has no DVD drive for built in ripping, and it has only a 20G drive. But at $400, this is pushing the line of reasonable for this type of device. Should be available in Feb.

Comments

Why a hard drive?

[Stiletto]

This would be perfect without the hard drive. If the box has network access, why do you need it? It's just an extra component that could fail.

A Start

[90XDoubleSide]

This product is, IMO, not something worth buying, but it is a step in the direction of a cool new concept for a set-top box that archives nearly all your media in one place. One major problem I see is that DIVX is not a useable technology for archiving your movies in the way that high quality MP3s are. MP3s, along with bigger and cheaper storage, have reached the point where they are the only format 99.5% of people need: a good VBR MP3 (averaging 200-240kbps) sounds extremely close to the uncompressed song, but even an extremely large DIVX looks downright crappy compared to the original, and a good Sorenson 3 encoded movie would be huge, require processing power in excess of what a cheap set-top box would use to decode, still have some quality problems in high-motion scenes, and will not receive the kind of adoption as MP3 due licensing costs.

There is also less need to keep all your 1.5-3 hour movies in one device that can play them all without switching media as there is for your 2-15 minute songs; I see DIVX more as the result of the fact that most computers don't have DVD burners.

Q: Why is the hard drive only 20 gig?

[OblongPlatypus]

A: They thought it would be a nice middle ground between nothing and more.

Re:not reasonable

[FallLine]

So that's about 288 USD parts, if we accept your quoted prices as being market. But you're ignoring ethernet and probably a few other things (e.g., wireless remote). Plus labor to assemble it and install software. Plus support. Plus software development for their UI. Plus profit (god forbid anyone take a little risk and expect that). Sounds like a pretty good deal to me.

Re:Data permanence

[90XDoubleSide]

DVDs, which, while they don't suffer from hard-drive style crashes, still get scratches and also deteriorate over time

A scratch does not damage the information on a piece of optical media, only the clear plastic that is protcting the information; that is why the plastic is there, you can get a scratch kit to fix it. If you need to record something for extremely long term archival, you can get silver, gold, or platinum CDs. Most commercial DVDs are burned on silver or gold, so unlike your VHSs, they should be usable many generations from now.

When he says hard drives are not a permanent medium he is referring more to the fact that they have moving parts and are prone to data corruption than their archival value. Overall, I think we should be glad we are moving from extremely short lived products, i.e. magnetic tape, and short lived products, i.e. film, to store our multimedia art on.

Re:not reasonable

[milkmandan9]

It's reasonable if you factor in:

• The small VCResque formfactor
• The fact that it's designed to work out-of-the-box right from the start--no incompatibilities or driver problems
• The amount of time it would take you to set up all your hardware and software to get this thing running

It is unreasonable if you're willing to spend the time to put something like this together--but that's how it goes for pretty much everything these days. If you do it yourself, then you're going to save cash.

The point is that not everybody has the tools (remember, Joe Average is the target audience and he's not going to know how to assemble said box or even come close to getting all the required software running--even with Ye Olde Simple MS Product) nor the time (Joe Average again--even if he had the tools to get this job done, I'd sure he'd rather spend it at his kids' T-ball game) to assemble this thing.

True--it doesn't make sense for your the "technical elite," but that's not who it's marketed to. This is a product just like a Dell computer or an internet appliance--it's got some cool technology bits but it's sold as a package so that Mr. and Mrs. Average don't have to get their hands dirty with the details. I'm sure there are a fair number of geeks that will be interested in this product based solely on its technical merits, but the intended audience is not someone who could do this on their own--that person has already done it, and for half the price.

Legality

[DaSyonic]

This is a great product, Don't get me wrong, I want one.

But the marketing/advertising they are receiving, at least from that review, aims directly towards illegal uses. Take the following examples:

The first step is to download and install your favorite P2P program that offers a Linux version. Once you have that, you can begin trading movies direct from the box.

This implies you will TRADE the movies, not just watch them for your own personal fair use.

For those without a broadband connection at home, the Bokks can utilize the T1 connection at work this way where movies and music can be saved and watched at home later.

Here it suggests hooking up external equipment to your companies LAN and use their bandwidth for your own (likely) illegal use. Not good either.

If this product hopes to succeed, it must be presented in fair use. The Rio almost got nailed by the RIAA, but the Rio presented itself as legal fair use, and set a good precedent. This could set a NEGATIVE precedent if done incorrectly. They need to improve their image quick.

Re:Legality

[Matthew Weigel]

The company itself unfortunately agrees with the tone of that review:

Connect it to your TV and view movies youve downloaded from the Internet.

I don't want one for a variety of reasons. Part is that I don't want moving components, part is that I don't want an electrically noisy PC (face it, that's what this is) with unknown sound output doing the conversion; part is that I'm not going to use something like this for copyright infringement and I don't care to have the seller saying "nudge nudge, wink wink" when I say that.

There is a legitimate market for archiving libraries of music and movies; there is a legitimate market for wanting to easily listen to a CD you own in the car, at your computer, and at your stereo.

Great

[rjkm]

I see that many people here are complaining about the capabilities and price of the box. For me it is just the kind of STB I was looking for.

Sure, you can build a PC with MPEG2 playback, networking etc. cheaper or for about the same price. But thats not what this device tries to replace, at least I would not buy it for doing this. When I saw the older TV Bokks (you can see it on their web page) I thought this would be great as an STB to stream files and live DVB streams from a server in the basement to other TVs here at home. But, although we have one of those at work to play with, I never saw it being offered for sale anywhere.

The old Bokks has a Geode chip as processor/graphics chip/etc. and a Sigma Designs EM8400 for decoding. I guess the new Bokks is based on the same design. They only added some hardware (like the hard drive) and changed the shape to a brick. The EM8400 is a nice decoder chip. We developed our own driver which is API compatible to our DVB drivers. So, I would not mind playing with one of those Bokkses. Also, if you consider the price of an EM8400 card (e.g. the Netstream 2000), the Bokks does not seem that expensive anymore.

Sure, I would also not mind if the Bokks were a little cheaper. With VAT (AFAIK 25% in Sweden which I guess I will have to pay when ordering from Germany) its over 1100 German Marks + shipping. Maybe they decide to also sell the old version for a lower price. I at least would be interested in it. On the other hand, the disk and nice brick shape makes the new system really portable. And I think the specs mention only 10W power usage. No noise, little heat, sounds good.

Now please everybody buy it so that the price goes down and I can get one :-)

I've got something better

[leereyno]

Imagine this.....

1) 1.2 Ghz athlon with 512 megs of memory

2) ATI all in wonder radeon that provides not only a TV tuner but svideo/composite A/V inputs and outputs and the ability to do audio/video capture at 720x384 at 30 fps on any of the inputs

3) Sound blaster Live platinum 5.1 for surround sound playback of DVD's etc.

4) four 100 gig hard drives on an IDE raid controller. Total capacity of 400 gigs

5) DVD-R burner, preferably SCSI

6) CD burner, preferably SCSI

7) It will be connected to the internet via a switched 100base-T network connected to a NAT gateway that is itself connected through DSL.

This is the system I'm building right now. Its purpose is much the same as the Bokks device. With it I will be able to play DVD's, vobs, mp3, avi's, mpegs, vcd, divx, etc all on my TV thanks to the all in wonder. Additionally I'll be able to do tivo style recording thanks to that all in wonder. I can rip all my DVD's, encode them to divx, and store them on the raid array or burn them to CD. Or I can just rip them and burn them back to DVD in regionless format with no macrovision. I've got friends overseas that might appreciate that.

By the time this Bokks device becomes available I'll have this system up and running. I haven't decided whether to use Linux or Windows2000 yet. Which one I use will greatly depend upon device support for the all in wonder and SB Live. We've got an HK A/V reciever with dolby surround sound support. If the SB Live drivers for linux support all the features, and the support for the All in wonder is there, then I'd rather use Linux. But if this is not the case I'll use windows instead.

Unfortunately this system is going to cost me a fair bit more than $400. I've already got the MB, CPU, and memory. All I'll need is a good case/PS, the hard drives, the video card, the sound card, and of course the SCSI adapter and burners. Total cost will be upwards of $2000 dollars US.

Lee

Video output not compatible for North America?

[Jobe_br]

Those who are electrical engineers correct me if I'm wrong, but this device appears to be centric to Europe in its video output. Its listed as having SCART, S-Video, and Composite (PAL) output. From what I know, the Composite signal isn't the only thing that is PAL/NTSC specific - S-Video is as well! If that is in fact the case, I don't believe any North American television will be of much use with this device. Too bad, in my opinion.