Posted by
timothy
on from the they-bought-all-the-blue-leds dept.
msolnik writes: "The U.S. version of Playstation 2 Linux is getting ready to hit the streets. Here is an review of the first public beta. It really looks sweet and comes with a lot of nice hardware. I can't wait for it to start selling -- finally I will have a legit reason to buy a PS2."
If you're going to use the built in networking on the PS2, why use USB? The thing comes with firewire ports! Thats more bandwidth then 100baseT ethernet:)
Is it possible to do n-way (n>2) networking with fire wire? I was intending to use USB because each unit has two USB ports - so each unit can be daisy chained to two others (granted, I suppose they'd have to be set up as routers).
I'm not actually sure you can daisy chain USB right out of the box like that. Maybe with some extra software.
On the other hand, you can plug as many boxes in with Firewire if you get a hub. Gran Tourismo 3 actually allows you to link up 6 PS2s (the most number of cars on the road in the game) via Firewire/iLink if you get a hub.
But yeh, people are probably just going to use the Ethernet that comes with the Linux kit:P
USB networking is impossible because each USB port is either a host or device, and there can only be one host on the bus. Since the PS2 is hardwired as a host, you can't connect two PS2s using USB. Also, you'd need a USB A to USB A cable, which doesn't exist (because it would create an invalid bus topology).
I have seen devices that have two device ports and proxy traffic between them to create a USB network, but they're much slower and more expensive than just daisy-chaining with 1394 cables.
There is an extension in the works for USB 2.0 that will allow multiple hosts to network over USB, but by the time it is delivered I suspect 1394 will be pretty entrenched.
wouldn't that be more likely to have Linux ported to it? then again, x-box just came out.
The PS2 has been out a lot longer, Had a Linux based development kit, has had a Linux port out in Japan for a while now, oh, and it isn't controlled by a corporation that considers Linux the "number 1 threat".
Sony has been on the Linux bandwagon with the PS2 for a while. Remember they ported this themselves, it's not a hack.
-- autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Review contents - site /.'ed
by
michael.creasy
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
A Trolltech employee once said he wouldn't consider Linux a success until his mother was running it. I don't think the Mom Test is necessarily a fair one, but I get his point: When Linux penetrates the average user's home or office, it will have passed a significant milestone. Well until Linux is ready to beat out Microsoft in the desktop, where else can Linux be a useful alternative operating enviornment for the user who is not an expert? The answer is simple - on embedded devices. So you can imagine how cool it is that Sony finally got on the CLUE bus and decided to offer a Linux Kit to the world for its Playstation 2 console unit. Previously it was only available in beta form, for japanese models. The official announcement came via cnn, you can read the article by clicking here. So what does this mean for your typical console gamer or linux enthusiast exactly? In a nutshell it means your Video Game console will also be a valid bonafied NC/AC (Network Computer/Appliance Computer) unit.
The kit consists of:
DVD-ROM containing a Linux Release specifically designed by Sony to boot the PS2
40 GByte Hard Drive
10Base-T/100 Base-TX Ethernet Interface
USB Keyboard
USB Mouse
VGA AV Connector/w HD 15 plus Stereo Audio
PS2 Linux Kit
The DVD that contains linux will ship with many packages you've grown up with linux like:
Linux Kernel
XFree86 (which means practically every single GUI application you can run from a desktop linux machine)
gcc
glibc
XFree86 on PS2
Here are a couple more images of linux running a ps2. On your left is Xscreensaver (not sure which one) and on your right is "gv" running inside WindowMaker.
I didn't list the versions of these packages because simply put, nobody but sony knows what they will decide on at release time. But expect the packages to be up-to-date. Below is the output of dmesg from the Linux Kit running off a japanese version of the playstation 2. How cool is that..
---- begin snippet from/var/log/dmesg ----
Loading R5900 MMU routines.
CPU revision is: 00002e14
Primary instruction cache 16kb, linesize 64 bytes
Primary data cache 8kb, linesize 64 bytes
Branch Prediction : on
Double Issue : on
Linux version 2.2.1 (master@linux) (gcc version 2.95.2 19991024 (release)) #94 Thu Apr 19 12:13:01 JST 2001
no initrd found
Console: colour dummy device 80x25
Calibrating delay loop... 392.40 BogoMIPS
Estimated CPU clock: 294.240 MHz
Memory: 30724k/32760k available (1216k kernel code, 752k data)
Checking for 'wait' instruction... unavailable.
POSIX conformance testing by UNIFIX
PlayStation 2 SIF BIOS: 0200
Linux NET4.0 for Linux 2.2
Based upon Swansea University Computer Society NET3.039
NET4: Unix domain sockets 1.0 for Linux NET4.0.
NET4: Linux TCP/IP 1.0 for NET4.0
IP Protocols: ICMP, UDP, TCP, IGMP
Linux IP multicast router 0.06 plus PIM-SM
Starting kswapd v 1.5
PlayStation 2 device support: GIF, VIF, GS, VU, IPU, SPR
Graphics Synthesizer revision: 00005508
Console: switching to colour PlayStation 2 Graphics Synthesizer 80x28
pty: 256 Unix98 ptys configured
Real Time Clock Driver v1.09
rtc: Digital UNIX epoch (1952) detected
usb.c: registered new driver usbdevfs
usb.c: registered new driver hub
usb.c: registered new driver usb_mouse
usb.c: registered new driver keyboard
usb-ohci.c: USB OHCI at membase 0x1f801600, IRQ 42
usb-ohci.c: GrowLocalMem 64K bytes
usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 1
hub.c: USB hub found
hub.c: 2 ports detected
RAM disk driver initialized: 1 RAM disks of 10240K size
loop: registered device at major 7
PlayStation 2 IDE DMA driver
hda: ST340823A, ATA DISK drive
ide0 at 0xb4000040-0xb4000047,0xb400005c on irq 41
hda: ST340823A, 38166MB w/1024kB Cache, CHS=4865/255/63, (U)DMA
LVM version 0.8i by Heinz Mauelshagen (02/10/1999)
lvm -- Driver successfully initialized
scsi : 0 hosts.
scsi : detected total.
Partition check:
hda: hda1 hda2
VFS: Mounted root (ext2 filesystem) readonly.
Freeing unused kernel memory: 48k freed
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 2
hub.c: USB hub found
hub.c: 2 ports detected
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 3
keybdev.c: Adding keyboard: input0
input0: USB HIDBP keyboard
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 4
input1: USB HIDBP mouse
PlayStation 2 Sound driver
Adding Swap: 136516k swap-space (priority -1)
eth0: MAC address 00:04:1f:ff:fa:bc
eth0: Auto-negotiation complete. 100Mbps Full duplex mode.
PlayStation 2 SMAP(Ethernet) device driver is loaded.
---- end snippet from/var/log/dmesg ----
Now with all this one has to think of what you can't do with a ps2 running linux. Well a couple things actually. Don't expect you can pop in any of your self-made CD's into it. This isn't an OSI issue as much as it is a hardware-level one. The Playstation2's CD-ROM drive is unable to read normal data CD-ROMs. Special Playstation2-CDs can be created so that PCs can read them, but not vice versa, simliar to the GD-ROMs for the Dreamcast that can't be created on a CD-R.
Another common question is how will Linux boot on the Playstation2? All the software in the world, regardless if it's runnable object code or source code with the most advanced compiler, is worthless if it can't be loaded into memory on the target machine and made to execute on the CPU. The perfect Linux system for the Playstation2 wouldn't make any sense at all, if it couldn't be booted.
The boot process is one of the crown jewels of copy-protection in the game console business. Since only the console manufacturer knows how to manufacture bootable media, and probably is the only one with the manufacturing technology, game creators must license the technology. The console manufacturer earns from the royalties for this licensing, not thesale of the hardware. Actually it's very common that the console manufacturer is losing money each and every time one of their consoles is sold. This is how the traditional game business works. Don't expect Sony to give away the secret of how the Playstation2 boot.
Linux will likely not boot directly off a self-made CD-ROM, nor from the optional harddrive unit, since no technical details about the port are currently known except a couple rumors, I'm going to speculate here and list some of the possibilities:
depend on the boot loader (like LILO or grub) stored on a memory card, similar to the DVD player driver updates they distributed early on
require a CD/DVD-ROM sold by Sony as an "authentication" mechanism
require some special hardware so it could be booted from an external source (think of disk-less machines with root over NFS)
only boot from the "official" CD that Sony sells. eg. Custom kernels unsupported. (The freedom to compile a custom kernel and freely boot it is very important. I honestly hope that Sony makes a decision which would be acceptable by the community as well as not risk their business model)
In anycase, any "boot loader" would most likely be proprietary closed-source. We just have to accept this. The BIOS of any common PC that boots the operating system is proprietary, too.
In short, I bought a Sony Playstation 2 unit with no intention of running any OS off it. I purchased it simply because its the coolest console video game unit I've ever seen and the game developement for it will be long-standing. The fact it also acts as a DVD player was a plus for sure. But when they tossed up the idea of throwing Linux on it, obviously because Microsoft's Xbox is going to bridge the gap between PC/console, I see endless possibilities now. Keep in mind this linux kit isn't a 'developers-only' package. This is going to be the interface that every ps2 user who wants to get online or treat his ps2 like a PC, will be using. Alot of wincentric folks are going to see linux for the first time, in all its glory and I wouldn't be suprised if some people will forever associate linux as "that video game OS." Any attention is better than none:-)
Re:Review contents - site /.'ed
by
dasunt
·
· Score: 5, Insightful
The boot process is one of the crown jewels of copy-protection in the game console business. Since only the console manufacturer knows how to manufacture bootable media, and probably is the only one with the manufacturing technology, game creators must license the technology. The console manufacturer earns from the royalties for this licensing, not thesale of the hardware. Actually it's very common that the console manufacturer is losing money each and every time one of their consoles is sold. This is how the traditional game business works. Don't expect Sony to give away the secret of how the Playstation2 boot.
Those who don't know their video game legal history are doomed to make stupid comments about it, it seems. In the US, its legal to reverse engineer booting protocols for game consoles, even up to, and including the point, of the console displaying "Licensed Playstation Game", or anything to that effect, as long as it isn't shown that there is a way to make a bootable cartredge/CD that doesn't display that message. I believe the case that determined this was one of the Nintendo-era consoles, the SMS or Genesis, maybe (been a long time since I looked at the cases).
Reverse engineering a console can save a company millions of dollars in licensing fees. There have been several notable legal battles that have determined how far a company can go to make compatible games.
A CD doesn't hide its data well. Even assuming encryption on most of the CD, its probably a relatively simple task to tell where the PS2 is reading from the CD at boot. Moreso, for the information on the CD to be useful, it has to be decrypted somewhere in the PS2 itself. Its very crackable.
Just my (educated) $.02
This is really cool
by
alsta
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
And to the people out there thinking that this is stupid, I have but one thing to say. Linux being able to run on such a vast multitude of platforms and different architectures should indeed bear testimony to a truly portable and well designed operating system. It's not about why, but how.
On a more on topic note, I wonder what kind of benefits this would provide to the people with mod chips in their PS2s. Could it possibly put the knowledge about how the PS2 works out in the public domain? And if so, did Sony think about this?
Oh the possibilities... Check out Flight Gear (http://www.flightgear.org) and wonder if that could be made to favorably run on a PS2/Linux machine. GNU PS2 games... Mmmm. And foremost, could this allow for developers to make PS2/Linux a better gaming platform than XBox/WinXB[sic]?
-- Wealth is the product of man's capacity to think. -Ayn Rand
Check out the full system, including Sony's PS2 Flatscreen monitor here. Damn, it's really slick.
Anyone also notice how smart of a move this is for R&D at Sony? They just sit back, sell units, and wait for someone to code/port the perfect office suit/browser/etc that fully integrates the PS2 into the home office, and then they sell more units! I'd say this puts them at least a step ahead of Microsoft.
One question... why?
by
Black+Pete
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
I am seriously not trying to troll. This is a real question that I'd like to know the answer to. I'm not bashing Linux (hell, I have a Linux box which I love playing with). I know I'll get flamed anyways.. but here goes...
Why would I want a Linux PS2? When playing games on the PS2, I just put a CD/DVD in, boot up, and play. Why should the average Joe Customer care what OS it's running?
I can certainly see how it'd be cool as a hacking plaything to mess around with. I wouldn't mind getting a Linux PS2 just for that very reason. But beyond that, I don't see much point... either for myself, or for the average Joe Customer.
I'd really appreciate it if anyone could enlighten me on this point?
Re:One question... why?
by
Randy+Rathbun
·
· Score: 5, Informative
I want it so I can be watching TV and check my email without having to get off my ass and walk the 20 steps to the computer room. Plus, how often are you sitting at the TV and think to yourself, "I really need to remember to look this up on the web when I get a chance.." then go off and forget about it. Hell, I do it all the time.
To me this is gonna be cool.
Re:One question... why?
by
dark_panda
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
The system is going to need some kind of OS when it comes time for Sony to launch their Internet platform for it. Why not use something that's already available with tons of applications rather than re-writing everything? When it comes time for people to connect to the Internet through their PS2 (which Sony has always envisioned as an all-on-one-DVD/games/networkable box), they're already going to have good browsers, mail programes, office suites, hell, even ftp and web servers.
No use recreating the wheel. It's not just cool, it's somewhat practical for them.
J
Re:One question... why?
by
VFVTHUNTER
·
· Score: 5, Funny
Price of a PS2: $300
Price of a PS2 Linux Kit: $200
Not having to get up from the TV to get porn off the net: Priceless
You mean besides....
by
moniker_21
·
· Score: 5, Informative
"...finally I will have a legit reason to buy a PS2."
And many more... You just can't beat the PS2 right now simply because it has so many amazing games available for it. Sorry it's offtopic, but it's true.
-- I posted to/. and all I got was this stupid sig
Crippled or no?
by
autopr0n
·
· Score: 5, Insightful
I've already got a PS2, and I can pretty much say that I'll get this... assuming I have the money for it. But does anyone know how crippled its going to be? I mean is Sony going to release the components and software you'll need to turn it into a 'true' Linux system right out of the box? I mean the thing does have a nice little CPU, it's cheap, and it's got a small form factor. I'd bet they would make for a nice server array, if they didn't put out to much heat.
And what about access to the PS2's internal hardware? Are we going to be able to program games/demos/etc. How much codeability are we going to be able to get out of the thing?
Oh, and that fire wire port makes me wonder. Sony has been pushing the video editing market with their Vaio PCs, and the PS2 does have a fire wire jack. Are we going to be able to edit video? Or would Sony not want to cut into it's PC sales by giving the machine to much power
This thing has the potential to be like the Amiga/C64/etc of our generation. A cheap TV computer that's fully programmable, hack able, whatever. Except with fire wire DVD support and all sorts of other modern goodies. The only thing holding it back really is how much Sony is willing to allow it to possibly cut into their profits.
I would assume the preview mentions these things, but it seems to be slashdotted...
-- autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Re:Crippled or no?
by
mikeee
·
· Score: 3, Informative
RDRAM is well and good, but the fact that that RAM is 100% faster than mine isn't going to matter when it starts swapping, 'cause my RAM is about 1000000% faster than that IDE hard drive. (No, really, it is. Do the math.)
OTOH, my previous PC ran Blackbox tolerably with 28 MB, so maybe...
I just flipped my self-burned CD-R into my $50 Dreamcast, just to reply to this. You can do this today, for about as much money as a PS2 game and a keyboard. Granted, no hard disk, but the idea was to mess with embedded Linux.
Don't miss the point here. Run to "Toys R us", and scoop up the Dreamcast (read the manufacture date through the hole in the back to make sure it was made before Sept. 2000). Go to fivemouse.com and grab the image. Burn it with DiscJuggler, and start playing with embedded Linux tonight!
Wow... I just thought of something. Does anyone realize what would happen if Sony started pre-loading Linux onto PS2's? Does anyone realize how many users would learn to use (and love) Linux? Consider this - the original Playstation sold close to 100 million units (maybe more?), and the overwhelming majority were sold in latter years of its life.
I'd say this is a fairly likely scenario, actually. Once the price comes down enough, Sony would be smart to start bundling PS2's with harddrives - and so it really wouldn't be a big stretch to throw in the keyboard/mouse combo as well. And if they do that, consumers are going to expect additional functionality. Why pay extra for a harddrive when all it does is store saved games? In comes Linux. By that point, there will already be a browser, a word processor, and a useable GUI developed especially for the PS2. Thus the sub-$300 gaming AND browsing PC becomes a reality - and it runs Linux.
Only in the beginning
by
autopr0n
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
Eventually, the price of producing the unit comes down to the point where they do make a profit. Sony today makes money on every ps1 sold. They can just wait until they start making profit before they sell the Linux kit.
Also, Sony can charge whatever they want for their Linux kit. If they loose $150 on every PS2 sold, and sell the kit for $200, they'll make 50 for every PS2+linux kit sold (not counting the cost of the Linux kit, witch with the 40gig HD might not be that cheap)
And Sony's strategy certainly isn't to sell few PS2s, they want to sell a lot. What they want is to have a high ratio of games to systems.
-- autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Will we still be able to rent ps2 games?
by
yerricde
·
· Score: 5, Funny
Sony has released its distribution of the GNU/Linux OS for PlayStation 2 in the USA.
17 USC 109(b)(1)(A) prohibits rental of computer software in the United States. Section 109(b)(1)(B), on the other hand, makes an exception for software designed to run on video game consoles. But does the release of PS2 Linux make the PS2 into a "computer" under the law, and thus ineligible for software rental without explicit contracts between each video game publisher and each rental shop?
Re:Will we still be able to rent ps2 games?
by
VFVTHUNTER
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
The PS2 is by default a video game console; since authorities would have to violate the Fourth Amendment just to see if you had installed Linux on it, this point is kind of moot.
Way to think outside of the box tho:)
Mozilla's Classic theme looks like 4.7
by
yerricde
·
· Score: 3, Informative
One of the pictures shows Netscape being run on the PS2. It looks to be 4.7x
If your computer contains a Netscape Communicator 4.x profile when you install Mozilla, Mozilla defaults to the Classic theme, which looks like Netscape Communicator 4.7.
Last time I checked netscape was closed source.
Mozilla is free software licensed under the Mozilla Public License and the GNU { |Lesser} General Public License. Netscape 6.x is mostly MPL/LGPL free software with some minor proprietary things linked in (AIM client, spell checker, etc) but the Mozilla team is working on replacing those.
This is the exact reason the XBOX was conceived and released - to counter all of those CPU cycles being "wasted" in game consoles on a non-Wintel platform. I'd bet Microsoft has been terrified for many years that every kid who has a game console actually has a computer, and someone somewhere would make the consoles behave like real computers. XBOX is supposed to beat them to the punch.
It's classic Microsoft strategy.
if { Game_Console == Computer and Game_Console == Pervasive_penetration_into_homes and Game Console != Requires_Windows}
then
{ Game_Console == Threat_to_Monopoly_Windows_Position};
else
{Threat_to_Monopoly_Windows_Position==0};
End if;
do
{ Attack_Compeditors_base_market (undercut_price, add_proprietary_tech);
Delflect_Competition_from_Windows(FUD_FUD_FUD, De-comodotize);
}
until {Threat_to_Monopoly_Windows_Position==0};
The PS/2 is no C64 - and Microsoft knows it. This has been brewing for some time - you could tell Microsoft felt threatened by all those game consoles that didn't need them (Except Sega, IIRC, and we know what happened to them). So, Microsoft attacked Sony's bread and butter with the XBOX. This is the shot Sony is firing back. This is going to be fun to watch. Heh - I know whose side I'm on - the consumers.
BTW - those of you with Sony VAIOs running Windows should keep tabs on your machine's stability for a while *grin*.
-- "Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm." - Anonymous
Despite the fact that Microsoft will be very against it, what can they do to hackers porting Linux to it (if you can call it a "port")
Well, that's the reason it won't be. I mean, there were demo communities around the Dreamcast and N64(using a hacked Hong Kong IDE bridge (Z64), a very sweet device and twice as expensive as the game system. It was intended to be used to pirate games).
The thing is, they never really got 'big' because the companies didn't support them. You had to do all kinds of weird things, or pay out the ass, to the system to get it to work. And most importantly you needed a separate PC to code on.
Sure, someone might get Linux on the Xbox, but it wouldn't be much different then what happened with the DC. Not very big.
With support from Sony, there's a chance for something really interesting to come out of all of this.
-- autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
This is no beta. We've been tricked!
by
Nemith
·
· Score: 5, Informative
After reading this article it dawned on me that this isn't a beta of the US version of linux for the PS2. It is just a english site on the Japan version.
The X11 screen shot on that site is exactly the same as on the Japan site. Furthermore the kit showing is also right off the Japaneese site. Check out this dmesg on the site. Look familiar?!?. Ya I though so.
From my understanding the US version will have an internal harddrive/network card to fit in that big hole in the back of the PS2.
Now I am a little dissapointed. This casts no forshadow to release of the US version and we still have to wait. Why this even made Slashdot I am not sure, but dont be fooled with this trickery.
OpenGL?
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
A lot of people are slavering at the possibility of porting a bunch of Linux games onto the PS-2, perhaps getting a cheaper/better Quake for PS-2 that way.
However, we need to be realistic about this. None of those things are possible until/unless there is a good hardware-accellerated OpenGL port for the beast.
As far as I can tell, there isn't such a thing in existance - and whilst we can certainly port Mesa onto it, we won't get hardware accelleration and it'll run S-L-O-W.
Even with a good OpenGL port, you still wouldn't see stellar performance because the PS-2's 3D processor isn't optimised for running OpenGL - it takes a lot of wierd programming tricks to get speed out of the PS-2 and without free access to the hardware details, there is little or no chance of getting good 3D games running on it.
Of course, all of this changes if Sony announce an OpenGL implementation or release the hardware details - but I'm not holding my breath.
Um, take another look at dmesg
by
jmorris42
·
· Score: 5, Informative
Notice anything missing from the dmesg output?
Yup, just the hard drive! No access to the closed hardware in the CD/DVD player. No CD/MP3/DVD/VCD/Divx;) players for us until some outsiders reverse engineer things and distribute a loadable module.
Bummer. I'd have bought one in an instant as a play everything console.
Anybody know if it has one or two PC Card slots? It needs one for the HDD/ethernet but since ethenet to my TV would be a bitch I'd prefer to slam a Orinoco into it.
-- Democrat delenda est
post nov 20000 anti-piracy Dreamcast workaround
by
mastagee
·
· Score: 5, Informative
The bioses in US dreamcasts manufactured after November 2000 will not boot audio/data multi-session cds. This was done because major piracy groups (Echelon mainly) were using this as their primary self-booting game format. The workaround is to convert the audio/data cd to a data/data cd.
Re:This is no beta. We've been tricked!
by
Hal-9001
·
· Score: 3, Informative
Well, there is this article (hyperlink from the original posted link, where Shin'ichi Okamoto, senior vice president and chief technical officer of Sony Computer Entertainment, said that although he couldn't provide a U.S. release date for the PS2 Linux Kit yet, "we'll be able to announce it soon."
The Linux Kit is designed exclusively for the Japanese model of "PS2", SCPH-10000,SCPH-15000 and SCPH-18000. Since these models are for domestic use in Japan, the Linux Kit is only available in Japan.
At this point, there is no plan to release the Linux Kit for non-Japanese model of "PS2".
Overseas delivery is not available.
I for one hope this if for real, because for me, like for timothy, this would be the straw that breaks the camel's back and convinces me to purchase a PS2.
-- "It take 9 months to bear a child, no matter how many women you assign to the job."
Slashdot Mirror
If you're going to use the built in networking on the PS2, why use USB? The thing comes with firewire ports! Thats more bandwidth then 100baseT ethernet :)
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
wouldn't that be more likely to have Linux ported to it? then again, x-box just came out.
The PS2 has been out a lot longer, Had a Linux based development kit, has had a Linux port out in Japan for a while now, oh, and it isn't controlled by a corporation that considers Linux the "number 1 threat".
Sony has been on the Linux bandwagon with the PS2 for a while. Remember they ported this themselves, it's not a hack.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
A Trolltech employee once said he wouldn't consider Linux a success until his mother was running it. I don't think the Mom Test is necessarily a fair one, but I get his point: When Linux penetrates the average user's home or office, it will have passed a significant milestone. Well until Linux is ready to beat out Microsoft in the desktop, where else can Linux be a useful alternative operating enviornment for the user who is not an expert? The answer is simple - on embedded devices. So you can imagine how cool it is that Sony finally got on the CLUE bus and decided to offer a Linux Kit to the world for its Playstation 2 console unit. Previously it was only available in beta form, for japanese models. The official announcement came via cnn, you can read the article by clicking here. So what does this mean for your typical console gamer or linux enthusiast exactly? In a nutshell it means your Video Game console will also be a valid bonafied NC/AC (Network Computer/Appliance Computer) unit.
/w HD 15 plus Stereo Audio
/var/log/dmesg ----
/var/log/dmesg ----
:-)
The kit consists of:
DVD-ROM containing a Linux Release specifically designed by Sony to boot the PS2
40 GByte Hard Drive
10Base-T/100 Base-TX Ethernet Interface
USB Keyboard
USB Mouse
VGA AV Connector
PS2 Linux Kit
The DVD that contains linux will ship with many packages you've grown up with linux like:
Linux Kernel
XFree86 (which means practically every single GUI application you can run from a desktop linux machine)
gcc
glibc
XFree86 on PS2
Here are a couple more images of linux running a ps2. On your left is Xscreensaver (not sure which one) and on your right is "gv" running inside WindowMaker.
I didn't list the versions of these packages because simply put, nobody but sony knows what they will decide on at release time. But expect the packages to be up-to-date. Below is the output of dmesg from the Linux Kit running off a japanese version of the playstation 2. How cool is that..
---- begin snippet from
Loading R5900 MMU routines.
CPU revision is: 00002e14
Primary instruction cache 16kb, linesize 64 bytes
Primary data cache 8kb, linesize 64 bytes
Branch Prediction : on
Double Issue : on
Linux version 2.2.1 (master@linux) (gcc version 2.95.2 19991024 (release)) #94 Thu Apr 19 12:13:01 JST 2001
no initrd found
Console: colour dummy device 80x25
Calibrating delay loop... 392.40 BogoMIPS
Estimated CPU clock: 294.240 MHz
Memory: 30724k/32760k available (1216k kernel code, 752k data)
Checking for 'wait' instruction... unavailable.
POSIX conformance testing by UNIFIX
PlayStation 2 SIF BIOS: 0200
Linux NET4.0 for Linux 2.2
Based upon Swansea University Computer Society NET3.039
NET4: Unix domain sockets 1.0 for Linux NET4.0.
NET4: Linux TCP/IP 1.0 for NET4.0
IP Protocols: ICMP, UDP, TCP, IGMP
Linux IP multicast router 0.06 plus PIM-SM
Starting kswapd v 1.5
PlayStation 2 device support: GIF, VIF, GS, VU, IPU, SPR
Graphics Synthesizer revision: 00005508
Console: switching to colour PlayStation 2 Graphics Synthesizer 80x28
pty: 256 Unix98 ptys configured
Real Time Clock Driver v1.09
rtc: Digital UNIX epoch (1952) detected
usb.c: registered new driver usbdevfs
usb.c: registered new driver hub
usb.c: registered new driver usb_mouse
usb.c: registered new driver keyboard
usb-ohci.c: USB OHCI at membase 0x1f801600, IRQ 42
usb-ohci.c: GrowLocalMem 64K bytes
usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 1
hub.c: USB hub found
hub.c: 2 ports detected
RAM disk driver initialized: 1 RAM disks of 10240K size
loop: registered device at major 7
PlayStation 2 IDE DMA driver
hda: ST340823A, ATA DISK drive
ide0 at 0xb4000040-0xb4000047,0xb400005c on irq 41
hda: ST340823A, 38166MB w/1024kB Cache, CHS=4865/255/63, (U)DMA
LVM version 0.8i by Heinz Mauelshagen (02/10/1999)
lvm -- Driver successfully initialized
scsi : 0 hosts.
scsi : detected total.
Partition check:
hda: hda1 hda2
VFS: Mounted root (ext2 filesystem) readonly.
Freeing unused kernel memory: 48k freed
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 2
hub.c: USB hub found
hub.c: 2 ports detected
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 3
keybdev.c: Adding keyboard: input0
input0: USB HIDBP keyboard
usb.c: USB new device connect, assigned device number 4
input1: USB HIDBP mouse
PlayStation 2 Sound driver
Adding Swap: 136516k swap-space (priority -1)
eth0: MAC address 00:04:1f:ff:fa:bc
eth0: Auto-negotiation complete. 100Mbps Full duplex mode.
PlayStation 2 SMAP(Ethernet) device driver is loaded.
---- end snippet from
Now with all this one has to think of what you can't do with a ps2 running linux. Well a couple things actually. Don't expect you can pop in any of your self-made CD's into it. This isn't an OSI issue as much as it is a hardware-level one. The Playstation2's CD-ROM drive is unable to read normal data CD-ROMs. Special Playstation2-CDs can be created so that PCs can read them, but not vice versa, simliar to the GD-ROMs for the Dreamcast that can't be created on a CD-R.
Another common question is how will Linux boot on the Playstation2? All the software in the world, regardless if it's runnable object code or source code with the most advanced compiler, is worthless if it can't be loaded into memory on the target machine and made to execute on the CPU. The perfect Linux system for the Playstation2 wouldn't make any sense at all, if it couldn't be booted.
The boot process is one of the crown jewels of copy-protection in the game console business. Since only the console manufacturer knows how to manufacture bootable media, and probably is the only one with the manufacturing technology, game creators must license the technology. The console manufacturer earns from the royalties for this licensing, not thesale of the hardware. Actually it's very common that the console manufacturer is losing money each and every time one of their consoles is sold. This is how the traditional game business works. Don't expect Sony to give away the secret of how the Playstation2 boot.
Linux will likely not boot directly off a self-made CD-ROM, nor from the optional harddrive unit, since no technical details about the port are currently known except a couple rumors, I'm going to speculate here and list some of the possibilities:
depend on the boot loader (like LILO or grub) stored on a memory card, similar to the DVD player driver updates they distributed early on
require a CD/DVD-ROM sold by Sony as an "authentication" mechanism
require some special hardware so it could be booted from an external source (think of disk-less machines with root over NFS)
only boot from the "official" CD that Sony sells. eg. Custom kernels unsupported. (The freedom to compile a custom kernel and freely boot it is very important. I honestly hope that Sony makes a decision which would be acceptable by the community as well as not risk their business model)
In anycase, any "boot loader" would most likely be proprietary closed-source. We just have to accept this. The BIOS of any common PC that boots the operating system is proprietary, too.
In short, I bought a Sony Playstation 2 unit with no intention of running any OS off it. I purchased it simply because its the coolest console video game unit I've ever seen and the game developement for it will be long-standing. The fact it also acts as a DVD player was a plus for sure. But when they tossed up the idea of throwing Linux on it, obviously because Microsoft's Xbox is going to bridge the gap between PC/console, I see endless possibilities now. Keep in mind this linux kit isn't a 'developers-only' package. This is going to be the interface that every ps2 user who wants to get online or treat his ps2 like a PC, will be using. Alot of wincentric folks are going to see linux for the first time, in all its glory and I wouldn't be suprised if some people will forever associate linux as "that video game OS." Any attention is better than none
And to the people out there thinking that this is stupid, I have but one thing to say. Linux being able to run on such a vast multitude of platforms and different architectures should indeed bear testimony to a truly portable and well designed operating system. It's not about why, but how.
On a more on topic note, I wonder what kind of benefits this would provide to the people with mod chips in their PS2s. Could it possibly put the knowledge about how the PS2 works out in the public domain? And if so, did Sony think about this?
Oh the possibilities... Check out Flight Gear (http://www.flightgear.org) and wonder if that could be made to favorably run on a PS2/Linux machine. GNU PS2 games... Mmmm. And foremost, could this allow for developers to make PS2/Linux a better gaming platform than XBox/WinXB[sic]?
Wealth is the product of man's capacity to think. -Ayn Rand
Check out the full system, including Sony's PS2 Flatscreen monitor here. Damn, it's really slick.
Anyone also notice how smart of a move this is for R&D at Sony? They just sit back, sell units, and wait for someone to code/port the perfect office suit/browser/etc that fully integrates the PS2 into the home office, and then they sell more units! I'd say this puts them at least a step ahead of Microsoft.
I am seriously not trying to troll. This is a real question that I'd like to know the answer to. I'm not bashing Linux (hell, I have a Linux box which I love playing with). I know I'll get flamed anyways.. but here goes...
Why would I want a Linux PS2? When playing games on the PS2, I just put a CD/DVD in, boot up, and play. Why should the average Joe Customer care what OS it's running?
I can certainly see how it'd be cool as a hacking plaything to mess around with. I wouldn't mind getting a Linux PS2 just for that very reason. But beyond that, I don't see much point... either for myself, or for the average Joe Customer.
I'd really appreciate it if anyone could enlighten me on this point?
You mean besides,
All
the
really
really
great
games
?
And many more... You just can't beat the PS2 right now simply because it has so many amazing games available for it. Sorry it's offtopic, but it's true.
I posted to
I've already got a PS2, and I can pretty much say that I'll get this... assuming I have the money for it. But does anyone know how crippled its going to be? I mean is Sony going to release the components and software you'll need to turn it into a 'true' Linux system right out of the box? I mean the thing does have a nice little CPU, it's cheap, and it's got a small form factor. I'd bet they would make for a nice server array, if they didn't put out to much heat.
And what about access to the PS2's internal hardware? Are we going to be able to program games/demos/etc. How much codeability are we going to be able to get out of the thing?
Oh, and that fire wire port makes me wonder. Sony has been pushing the video editing market with their Vaio PCs, and the PS2 does have a fire wire jack. Are we going to be able to edit video? Or would Sony not want to cut into it's PC sales by giving the machine to much power
This thing has the potential to be like the Amiga/C64/etc of our generation. A cheap TV computer that's fully programmable, hack able, whatever. Except with fire wire DVD support and all sorts of other modern goodies. The only thing holding it back really is how much Sony is willing to allow it to possibly cut into their profits.
I would assume the preview mentions these things, but it seems to be slashdotted...
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
I just flipped my self-burned CD-R into my $50 Dreamcast, just to reply to this. You can do this today, for about as much money as a PS2 game and a keyboard. Granted, no hard disk, but the idea was to mess with embedded Linux.
Don't miss the point here. Run to "Toys R us", and scoop up the Dreamcast (read the manufacture date through the hole in the back to make sure it was made before Sept. 2000). Go to fivemouse.com and grab the image. Burn it with DiscJuggler, and start playing with embedded Linux tonight!
-Spackler
Wow... I just thought of something. Does anyone realize what would happen if Sony started pre-loading Linux onto PS2's? Does anyone realize how many users would learn to use (and love) Linux? Consider this - the original Playstation sold close to 100 million units (maybe more?), and the overwhelming majority were sold in latter years of its life.
I'd say this is a fairly likely scenario, actually. Once the price comes down enough, Sony would be smart to start bundling PS2's with harddrives - and so it really wouldn't be a big stretch to throw in the keyboard/mouse combo as well. And if they do that, consumers are going to expect additional functionality. Why pay extra for a harddrive when all it does is store saved games? In comes Linux. By that point, there will already be a browser, a word processor, and a useable GUI developed especially for the PS2. Thus the sub-$300 gaming AND browsing PC becomes a reality - and it runs Linux.
Eventually, the price of producing the unit comes down to the point where they do make a profit. Sony today makes money on every ps1 sold. They can just wait until they start making profit before they sell the Linux kit.
Also, Sony can charge whatever they want for their Linux kit. If they loose $150 on every PS2 sold, and sell the kit for $200, they'll make 50 for every PS2+linux kit sold (not counting the cost of the Linux kit, witch with the 40gig HD might not be that cheap)
And Sony's strategy certainly isn't to sell few PS2s, they want to sell a lot. What they want is to have a high ratio of games to systems.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Sony has released its distribution of the GNU/Linux OS for PlayStation 2 in the USA.
17 USC 109(b)(1)(A) prohibits rental of computer software in the United States. Section 109(b)(1)(B), on the other hand, makes an exception for software designed to run on video game consoles. But does the release of PS2 Linux make the PS2 into a "computer" under the law, and thus ineligible for software rental without explicit contracts between each video game publisher and each rental shop?
Will I retire or break 10K?
One of the pictures shows Netscape being run on the PS2. It looks to be 4.7x
If your computer contains a Netscape Communicator 4.x profile when you install Mozilla, Mozilla defaults to the Classic theme, which looks like Netscape Communicator 4.7.
Last time I checked netscape was closed source.
Mozilla is free software licensed under the Mozilla Public License and the GNU { |Lesser} General Public License. Netscape 6.x is mostly MPL/LGPL free software with some minor proprietary things linked in (AIM client, spell checker, etc) but the Mozilla team is working on replacing those.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Oh boy. Here we go.
This is the exact reason the XBOX was conceived and released - to counter all of those CPU cycles being "wasted" in game consoles on a non-Wintel platform. I'd bet Microsoft has been terrified for many years that every kid who has a game console actually has a computer, and someone somewhere would make the consoles behave like real computers. XBOX is supposed to beat them to the punch.
It's classic Microsoft strategy.
if { Game_Console == Computer and Game_Console == Pervasive_penetration_into_homes and Game Console != Requires_Windows}
then
{ Game_Console == Threat_to_Monopoly_Windows_Position};
else
{Threat_to_Monopoly_Windows_Position==0};
End if;
do
{ Attack_Compeditors_base_market (undercut_price, add_proprietary_tech);
Delflect_Competition_from_Windows(FUD_FUD_FUD, De-comodotize);
}
until {Threat_to_Monopoly_Windows_Position==0};
The PS/2 is no C64 - and Microsoft knows it. This has been brewing for some time - you could tell Microsoft felt threatened by all those game consoles that didn't need them (Except Sega, IIRC, and we know what happened to them). So, Microsoft attacked Sony's bread and butter with the XBOX. This is the shot Sony is firing back. This is going to be fun to watch. Heh - I know whose side I'm on - the consumers.
BTW - those of you with Sony VAIOs running Windows should keep tabs on your machine's stability for a while *grin*.
"Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm." - Anonymous
Despite the fact that Microsoft will be very against it, what can they do to hackers porting Linux to it (if you can call it a "port")
Well, that's the reason it won't be. I mean, there were demo communities around the Dreamcast and N64(using a hacked Hong Kong IDE bridge (Z64), a very sweet device and twice as expensive as the game system. It was intended to be used to pirate games).
The thing is, they never really got 'big' because the companies didn't support them. You had to do all kinds of weird things, or pay out the ass, to the system to get it to work. And most importantly you needed a separate PC to code on.
Sure, someone might get Linux on the Xbox, but it wouldn't be much different then what happened with the DC. Not very big.
With support from Sony, there's a chance for something really interesting to come out of all of this.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
After reading this article it dawned on me that this isn't a beta of the US version of linux for the PS2. It is just a english site on the Japan version.
The X11 screen shot on that site is exactly the same as on the Japan site. Furthermore the kit showing is also right off the Japaneese site. Check out this dmesg on the site. Look familiar?!?. Ya I though so.
From my understanding the US version will have an internal harddrive/network card to fit in that big hole in the back of the PS2. Now I am a little dissapointed. This casts no forshadow to release of the US version and we still have to wait. Why this even made Slashdot I am not sure, but dont be fooled with this trickery.
A lot of people are slavering at the possibility of porting a bunch of Linux games onto the PS-2, perhaps getting a cheaper/better Quake for PS-2 that way.
However, we need to be realistic about this. None of those things are possible until/unless there is a good hardware-accellerated OpenGL port for the beast.
As far as I can tell, there isn't such a thing in existance - and whilst we can certainly port Mesa onto it, we won't get hardware accelleration and it'll run S-L-O-W.
Even with a good OpenGL port, you still wouldn't see stellar performance because the PS-2's 3D processor isn't optimised for running OpenGL - it takes a lot of wierd programming tricks to get speed out of the PS-2 and without free access to the hardware details, there is little or no chance of getting good 3D games running on it.
Of course, all of this changes if Sony announce an OpenGL implementation or release the hardware details - but I'm not holding my breath.
Notice anything missing from the dmesg output?
Yup, just the hard drive! No access to the closed hardware in the CD/DVD player. No CD/MP3/DVD/VCD/Divx;) players for us until some outsiders reverse engineer things and distribute a loadable module.
Bummer. I'd have bought one in an instant as a play everything console.
Anybody know if it has one or two PC Card slots? It needs one for the HDD/ethernet but since ethenet to my TV would be a bitch I'd prefer to slam a Orinoco into it.
Democrat delenda est
The bioses in US dreamcasts manufactured after November 2000 will not boot audio/data multi-session cds. This was done because major piracy groups (Echelon mainly) were using this as their primary self-booting game format. The workaround is to convert the audio/data cd to a data/data cd.
That article is dated October 24th, 2001, so the question is whether that pre- or postdates the disclaimer on the PS2 Linux Kit website stating that
I for one hope this if for real, because for me, like for timothy, this would be the straw that breaks the camel's back and convinces me to purchase a PS2.
"It take 9 months to bear a child, no matter how many women you assign to the job."