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KDE 3.0 Beta 2 is out
Subject says all - the next beta of KDE 3.0 is out, after a short delay. You can find the downloads at this announcement. Click below to read more details about this version.
One of the most important things that the Konqueror teams wants from people are test cases of your regulary visited pages, where Konqueror either fails to render or render things incorrectly, and submit it using KDE's Bug Tracking system. URL's will not be helpful as it takes lots of time to strip a page from all the HTML code in order to find the actual problematic part of the web page.
Just to save the search for some people: Mandrake, SuSE, Slackware and Tru-64 binary packages are available now. Others will be available soon. Source code is of course available also.
Ive tried the KDE Beta 2. And I must say... Its a very very very stable pre-release. Hats off to the KDE developres.
The only problem is that some of the older KDE apps wont run correctly with the new KDE and they must be upgraded to work with the new QT packages.
Everyone should D/L it and check it out.
I want proof that Konqueror cannot be removed from KDE without causing severe damage to the OS!
It turns out that a large silent number of
people are running KDE (and GNOME) desktops
under not *linux, but under FreeBSD. It would
be nice if more FreeBSD binary packages were
built.
Hurrah, they've provided slakpacks!
Ive been using it today, its very nice. I wasnt a fan of KDE2, and at first glance this is just kde2 with bells and whistles. However, there are subtle changes and integrations that make it much nicer to work with on a daily basis.
Konquerer is a little buggy though (crashes every time i press the Back button)
Cant wait for the final release!
"You get what you pay for after all."
-Rob Malda
How useful can KDE be?
I was pretty happy with KDE 1 and remain happy with KDE 2.0
I'm sure to get Troll -1'd into oblivion for this, but
"Provided by the management for your protection."
Anywho, the feature that I've been most looking forward to is tabbed browsing in Konqueror, due to appear in KDE 3.1. Galeon is the one constantly used app that isn't a part of KDE, and I use it because a.) it has tabbed support and b.) a smart bookmarks toolbar. Plus, it's a web browser. Nothing more, nothing less. Konqueror has various view settings (such as "file manager", "web browser", and whatnot, but in my experience, the different view settings don't always play nice. But since tabs are at the top of my wishlist, I will definitely reconsider Konqueror in the near future.
So, what are all you other KDE fans looking forward to?
Oh wait, that's the Olympics. Still true about KDE 3, though.
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I know a lot of people who were scared away from KDE2.0's unstability and bugs.
It's a marketing-thing. People tend to only try out .0 releases, so a 3.0 release that is in reality a 2.3 is the best thing that can happen to KDE :-)
The second-best feature of KDE 3.0 is the configuration of animated pics, BTW ;-)
Sad sad, they never had redhat packages, even beta 1 *still* doesn't have them... oh well, (the reason i am not installing the tarballs is because its beta, i dont want to clutter my FS if it doesnt work right. anyways, thats my 2 cents =)
I SURVIVED THE GREAT SLASHDOT BLACKOUT OF 2002!
This applies to KDE as well as Gnome.
...).
These two environments tend to come with huge packages (e.g. gnome-applets, kdenetwork, kdemultimedia, kdegraphics, koffice,
Sometimes, you just need one or two in the packages, and you are forced to install the whole jumbo packages. Why? Why can't we pick and choose?
E.g. I use Kword sometimes for simple word processing, but I never use the spreadsheet and the presentation app. Same for kdenetwork. I use KMail and KNode, but I don't need korn,ktalkd,ksirc,.... And kdemultimedia, I don't do MIDI stuff, and I don't want to waste 10MB for timidity++ and other junks.
Oh yeah, same for Gnome. Why do I need to install the whole gnome-applet package if I only need one applet? Same for other jumbo packages.
I'm on RPM-based distro. How about apt-get-based?
I don't know the internal details of the code, but isn't there a way to separate them out?
The suse packages have a few minor installation conflicts. Make sure you have the prereqs installed and just --force and it will work. They use a separate .kde dir (.kde3-testing) so that you don't lose your old kde2 environment. However they don't migrate up your old settings. You can do this by copying the .kde2/share/config and .kde2/share/apps directories into .kde3-testing/share before your launch kde after you update. kconf_update will migrate your settings forward.
/opt/kde3 and you have to log in with the kde3 session entry in kdm if you use that.
I was unable to get the lisa package or kdevelop to install due to dependency problems, and I didn't try. Make sure you install the mesaglut-devel package. It's needed.
The packages install into
Known bugs so far:
- Browser identification doesn't always work correctly.
- Greek keyboard setting is giving me Russian characters instead for some reason. (this may or may not be a bug)
Just make sure you keep KDE2 libraries around and your old KDE2 apps will still work. They just won't directly interoperate with KDE3 apps. For instance, you can't embed old modules/plugins into new applications.
Just curious how much human factors goes into the development of open source desktop packages? Are there members of the KDE or QT or Gnome teams whose sole job/interest is to further the usability of the interfaces? Or are the developers just happening to "place this here" or "place this there? Are the beta testers assuming the role of Usability testing?
-Webwiz.....
Good point.
But that actually raises another concern. Why didnt they make KDE3 backward compatible with KDE2? KDE2 is compatible with KDE.
I have alot of KDE2 applications running and I know it will be difficult to maintain both sets and remember which works with which set of libraries. Its sort of like the whoel GLIB problem (e.g., 2.2)
I'm really looking forward to KDE 3.
No, not because of the move to QT3.
No, not because of the improvements in Konq, KFM, or any of those - not even the multi-key shortcuts.
I just want to be able to use KMail for my Maildir mailboxes. I know there are hacks, workarounds, all that - but I don't want those. I just want to be able to plug in and go. Right now I use Mutt, but sometime in the future I'd like to be able to do some of the things it doesn't - like inline HTML viewing. KMail won't be for regular use, I guarantee it, but it will certainly be a nice complement to mutt.
A very close second is the switching of desktops when dragging a window - that's on the "KDE 3 List" and it's definitely something I miss from E. I don't know if it's going to be in 3, but I also really miss the ability to "walk off the edges" of the desktop and switch to a different virtual desktop. I've got the keyboard shortcuts set up, but it just isn't the same.
KDE1 was not even close to binary compatible with KDE2. Anyways, KDE3 broken binary compatibility because Qt broke it with Qt3 so it was a good opportunity. The transition shouldn't take too long before you have all KDE 3.0 applications though. Don't worry, it won't be that painful.
Part of the job of the beta is to get people porting their apps to KDE3 too.
I haven't had any luck getting the 2.x family of KDE to build on an OpenBSD box, whether the hardware was x86 or PPC. Which sucks, because I really want to use Konq, and Mozilla won't build at all under Open.
Urg.
Anyhow, has anyone managed to build one of the 3.0 betas under OpenBSD?
--saint
Shame there's no tabbed browsing in Konqueror. Also I was quite surprised at the number of changes listed for console! That made me chuckle; it's like saying this is the program that most people use so it's the most important. :P
As a side note, how much obsolete and legacy code is in KDE right now? I mean, Windows contains lots of legacy code for DOS support. Any thoughts?
Apparently they are making the cut-copy functionality more configurable so that you can have windows style (Ctrl-C) or unix style (highlight). It sounds like it will also integrate with other apps (gpm?) better.
I can't find it now, but I swear that I've read it.
Or maybe you are just a troll.
I suppose I'm not too threatening, presently, but wait till I start Nautilus
Try the Font Deuglification HOWTO.
You might find a more recent copy on linuxdoc.org, but they seem to be down at the moment.
Alan
Your wish is granted - the default behavior of the clipboard has changed in KDE3 (much to MY annoyance, I LIKE being able to highlight to copy).
Fortunately, this is configurable. If you want the old copy-on-highlight behavior, click the "synchronise clipboard on highlight" option in the preferences...
Hacker Public Radio is our Friend
I see theres no programmers here
Better programs is why you should use 3.0
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
Since noone else has.
Here is the secret link to the new
KDE 3.0 Beta2 screenshots
I'm downloading and compiling the beta as I type this...
I've been playing with CVS snapshots off and on recently, and I must say they're looking promising. The appearance is similar to 2.2, but with a bit more 'beautification' and eye-candy effects available, and certainly, Javascript support is MUCH improved (though I still haven't been able to view things on Atomfilms for some time in Konqueror...). The ONE complaint I have that keeps driving me back to 2.2 is the apparently broken focus handling in KDE3...
I haven't been able to tab between fields in a form, for example, though this isn't a BIG problem. The BIG problem is that while entering text in textareas (such as this form right here on slashdot), hitting 'enter' to drop to a new line will frequently...do something. Not actually submit the form, but the page seems to re(?)load. The back button brings the form back up, sans all the text that was entered in these cases. I haven't been able to figure out EXACTLY what it's doing yet.
This is the only problem I've run into, but I spend enough time on web forums that it kills me...anybody already tried the beta out know whether or not this has been fixed yet? I DO recall reading that the focus problem, in general, was due to be fixed before the final release...
Hacker Public Radio is our Friend
I have to problems with this post.
(1) This is by no means a bug and has been standard Unix behavior for some time. Just because it doesn't work the same in Windows, doesn't mean it's a bug.
(2) If your programming, why the hell would you be using the mouse to copy stuff??? Wouldn't you be using C-k or C-xrk like a normal person? Sheesh, my only compliant about KDE is that it encourages people to use lesser tools (KDeveloper) when better tools exist (Emacs). One would think that FS projects would borrow code from each other...
Even if your not using Emacs, if your a programmer and your stuck to a mouse, your productivity has to be hurting... Even on Windows, I still use the keyboard to copy and paste.
int func(int a);
func((b += 3, b));
shot 1
shot 2
shot 3
shot 4
Celebrate the finer things in life
Open a Linux/Unix book and learn - libraries can be installed alongside quite nicely...
You can have KDE-1, KDE 2.X & KDE 3.x - all on the same machine, all of them running on the same X without a single problem...
Try the same thing with Windows 9x - they "fixed" this problem on XP if I'm not mistaken..
Hetz (Heunique)
The problem is that the xim patch is vital for people who need Japanese in KDE, so simply removing it is replacing one problem with another (arguably bigger) one, which isn't an option.
It's fixed for real in the current tree (qt3/kde3), the fix can't be backported easily, and I don't have more than 24 hours a day, so this simply has to wait until I have a lot of spare time (getting this right isn't exactly easy for someone like myself who doesn't have the slightest clue about Japanese input methods), or until someone else attaches a patch that fixes both.
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Bear in mind I'm quoting this option from memory, so the exact phrase may be a little different. You're right, though, the phrase they used was slightly cryptic, though since it's exactly what I was looking for, I recognized it when I saw it...
Why not "Copy text to clipboard when highlighted"?Good question...except maybe that didn't sound as 'cool' as "synchronise" :-). Perhaps this (the text of the option) would make a good patch for some non-programmer who wants to help to submit...
Hacker Public Radio is our Friend
qt, well, just sucks.
On the contrary. KDE wouldn't be anywhere near where it is now if it were using anything else.
The default look of Qt may be boring in some people's tastes, but its programming interface beats all other toolkits out there by far.
Try it for yourself: Read the tutorials for, say, Qt, GTK, Motif and Win32. Then implement a simple application in each of them. You'll almost certainly notice you can do it much quicker with Qt.
And Qt 3.0 adds the possibility to load styles as plugins, so you can change the look much better than earlier.
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About your sig, did that come from the song "Totally Wired" by the Fall?
You had me at "dicks fuck assholes".
Please note that some of the planned items still might not make it and that it is very likely that several items are not yet planned but will pop up in time for the 3.1 freeze which is several months away.
It's not THAT bad. ,c to get the
I regularily use German characters (if only to get the weird ä character in my last name right), and it works.
The problem is just using deadkeys, which isn't that widely used,
and AFAIK can easily be worked around using Compose
(e.g. Try pressing Alt Gr+Shift, then
French c character, or Alt Gr+Shift, then "a to get ä).
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You can't compare with dos - it's a completely different OS (well, program launcher) than win2k, heck even win9x and winNT/win2k are completely different OSes. Linux has always been Linux.
an ancient dos tool *might* wont run on win2000 but that's usually because it's hitting the metal - which I find is a *very* good reasong for win2k not to let it run. dos runs on old 8088/8086 CPU's, Linux wont run on anything less than a 386.
True though you can run old KDE apps with th eold libs - mind you aint that fussed about upgrading - since all apps I got are free anyway it wont cost me a penny, plus it gives me a good excuse to sit down and tinker with my boxen!
if (!signature) { throw std::runtime_error("No sig!"); }
Why didnt they make KDE3 backward compatible with KDE2?
As I recall from earlier stories (PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong here, it's been a while) the KDE folks were looking at binary incompatibility no matter what due to a new gcc that was due out. I don't pretend to understand the mechanics, but apparently everything was going to require a recompile anyway.
Probably mentioned in some mailing list archive someplace. They figgered that if ever there was a good time to break compatibility, now was that time. The long term game plan is to have the underlying architecture of KDE 3.0 support new versions for the next 3 years or so.
I've seen it mentioned a number of times exactly how aware the KDE crew is to this breakage. Heck, there's still KDE 1.2 apps that haven't been bumped up yet! Hopefully, this will be the last of these kinds of upgrades for a while... assuming the game plan works out that is. 3 years is a darn long time for KDE.
The line must be drawn here. This far. No further.
From Hunter S. Thompson, author of "Fear and Loathing..." I'm not sure which of his writings it's from.
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Coolamundo. I wasn't criticizing KDE 3.0, just pointing out a few issues that existed when the beta was first released. Fast work, nice work. I may give it a shot now - but first will have to inventory my software to make sure nothing will crap out because of the incompatibility between kde 2.2.x apps and kde 3.0 apps (due to QT 3.0 yes?).
In Bushworld, they struggle to keep church and state separate in Iraq as they increasingly merge the two in America.
To answer my own question a few posts down - the focus handling in KDE3 is still broken as of this release...
This is the one quirk left that, for me, ruins usability of KDE3 (though thankfully it IS slated to be fixed before release).
The problem is, evidently, the fact that when you select something it's not necessarily what has 'focus' - if you click on a textarea field and start typing, what really has 'focus' is the first link on the page. Hit 'enter' in the textarea and Konqueror loads whatever is on that first link...
Double-clicking URL's in Konqueror's location toolbar and hitting 'delete' to clear out the bar no longer works either, which I assume is related to the focus bugs.
Looking forward to the final release, though - all in all, KDE3 is VERY nice. Spiffier looking, and konqueror works even better...
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and SHIFT+INS assigned to "Paste" operation. You know, those years on Winsuck wannabe-operating-system did their damage
on my personality.
If this is true, this is a disease that has been on Unix UI design since the first days. The problem is programming that says "what key does this?" rather than "what does this key do?". The main result is that only one key can do each action. Ever wonder why the terminal can't take *both* backspace and delete as erase? This stupidity has been around forever (it is also in lots of Windows programs that are configurable as well...)
However I am under the impression that KDE was pretty much fixed in it's key assignments, like Windows, and they have certainly copied Windows slavishly, so I am suprised if this is not working (it works on my Qt programs). If KDE 3.0 has botched it in some misguided attempt to allow the users to "configure" the key bindings, well, that is their mistake, and a bad one at that.