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China Ahead in Stem-Cell Research
Andrew writes: "New Scientist is reporting (for free) on the WSJ's China clones human embryos story: "Chinese scientists are claiming a great leap forward in human cloning - the creation of dozens of cloned embryos advanced enough to harvest embryonic stem cells."" The lengthy Wall Street Journal story is also on MSNBC.
While the American Congress debares the legality cloning the Chineese forge boldly onward.
Need a new liver? Need a new kidney? How about a heart? Go to China cause you won't be able to get them in America.
...and you better bring cash cause I don't think they're going to take credit cards.
Sucks to lose, huh?
I always thought that it was interesting how the United States can allow abortion (the killing of an unborn embryo) but not embryo cloning/harvesting (the killing of an unborn embryo), especially since embryo cloning can bring some good. While I remain pro-life myself, I could never quite understand this hypocrisy.
Actually its the "pro-life" lobby that has been working hardest for the current US anti-stem cell research policy. In fact the pro-lifers would love to ban stem cell research entirely: a URL courtesy of Google here. Don't blame the US for the policies forced on us by a group you aligned yourself with.
I find it also interesting how the one main country with whom the United States has mixed in civil rights with trade agreements is the country that may end up further along in this line of research. Of course, one could say that Hitler had learned a lot through research as well. How far can we allow our morality to stretch to further the advancement of the human race?
I assume you mean to say your morality. Please don't presume to speak for anyone but yourself. There are plenty of people with different viewpoints than your own. These people are just as "moral" as you.
Sailing over the event horizon
No, it's only when research might legitimize abortion that it's ImmoralTM.
It would be funny, if it weren't so very important. Personally I want the doubled lifespan that fully realized stem-cell research may give us. Get your foot off the brake there, Mr. God-Fearin' Man!
when you aren't bogged down by morals..
Indie rock lives! b-side!
Maybe, at the time when a constitutional decision about abortion was needed, the right-wing religious and morality zealots, the same funny nutty guys who think their religion should be used to brainwash every children disguised as Science, the same terrorists who bomb legal abortion clinics, the same lunatics that blame September 11 on "lesbians and queers", maybe at that time these people couldn't organize in time to prevent the Courts to give this kind of freedom to American women.
Maybe when a decision about cloning/harvesting was needed, those same maniacs that feel they have the right to impose their misguided views upon everybody had enough power to obtain such a decision from a simpathetic right wing Presidency.
It takes hundreds of years for a Government to form, Many Capitalists governments fell apart, the USA was horrible back when it was founded, there was no real freedom, witches being stoned for not being proper religion, minories were enslaved for not being the proper color, etc etc
If you look at all of American history and not the last 100 years, you'll see that the USA was at one time as bad if not worse than China, as bad as Russia at one point, It takes hundreds of years and generations for a government to mature.People learn from their mistakes.
China may actually be a successful communist nation, if they manage to do it right.
Theres nothing wrong with socialism either, theres many european countries which are socialist countries which are doing better than the USA such as NZ.I admit theres alot less people in places like NZ, but theres less people in the USA than in China.
Capitalism is not the answer to everything, its one possible solution out of many other possible solutions.
Capitalism can work, Communism can work, Socialism can work, each one of them have their flaws and limitations.
Capitalism currently in the USA is decreasing our freedom and giving freedom to big business.
Communism in China is decreasing the freedom of the Chinese, these problems arent problems with the style of government, but the people actually in office who make the laws.
Corruption exsists in capitalism and in communism and currently we arent controlling our own government, chinese arent controlling their government, so both Capitalism and Communism have problems and no we do not have a Democracy and never really had one to begin with.
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Theres alternatives to abortion too.
Funny how millions of people have abortions when they could just do adoption.
Fact is, if we can do something technology wise, we will do it, theres no point in even making laws to restrict technology.
What I believe is right or wrong has nothing to do with the freedom of the scientist, the freedom to save lifes. Also the scientists created the life in a lab anyhow.
I dont know if stem cell research should bee legal or not, but alot of debateable things are legal, and alot of things are illegal which are debateable.
Theres one thing i know for sure. The law isnt about whats right and whats wrong, the law was set up to protect the citizens of the USA, the country, and to protect the rights of the people of the USA.
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The president of the republic of the united states of america decided on his own that stem cell research should be limited.
This man was / is a christian and has a very biased point of view, but he desided for the you, you didnt vote.
In fact you didnt even vote him into office, gore won the popular vote, the Democracy ruled in favor of Gore, the Republic however ruled in favor of Bush.
We have a republic, the representatives in congress decide the laws not you, while you do vote to see who represents you, you do not control the government, the laws, or what these people do, these people are controlled by the Enrons of America.
Listen, unless you are CEO of a billion dollar company, you have no control, the top 10% control the USA and really hows that much diffrent than a communist government where 10 percent controls everyone there, or any other type of government.
A true Democracy which we have never really had, would mean each one of us would have the right to vote on every law, the DMCA would have had to get voted in by us and honestly theres no way that could have happened. Because we are a republic, all that has to be done to control our country is bribe the right people.
China or any country could easily control our government, its simple, Sonys of the world, Toshibas and Matsushitas who happen to influence certain political figures could easily hyjack our government if there were enough big powerful Asian Companies.
you see our government is like an open market,its controlled by Capitalism, anyone who has alot of $$ also has alot of control, and that is the flaw of Capitalism.
$$ = Power, not votes, not respect by peers, not intellignece, not wisdom,.
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I read the full article about human cloning in "The Wall Street Journal". The article is indeed shocking because the Chinese people have approached the issue of cloning in the usual fashion: total lack of ethics. The Chinese have not expressed any concern whatsoever for the moral implications of cloning.
By contrast, look at our American society in the West. We have debated the issue of cloning. We have expressed grave concern over its moral implications. Heck, even the Japanese have publically debated the issue of cloning and expressed grave concerns.
This Chinese behavior with regards to cloning is consistent with previous Chinese behavior. For example, immediately after the American nation froze or withdrew investments from mainland China just after the Tienanmen incident in 1989, the Chinese from Taiwan and Hong Kong immediately seized this market opportunity and poured billions of dollars of investment into mainland China. As another example, the Chinese on Taiwan use their constitution to declare that Tibet is part of mainland China while the Chinese People's Liberation Army torture and kill Tibetan nuns.
I really wish that people in the West would wake up. We should stop thinking that, somehow, the Chinese people are like us in the West. They are not. They are very different from us. We foolishly extol the Chinese values that we shallowly see among Chinese immigrants in the West.
We should look deeper. The Chinese are over-represented in our engineering and business schools at our elite universities. Yet, the Chinese are under-represented at meetings of Amnesty International at those very same universities. Why?
This observation is consistent with the story about cloning in China. The Chinese will use this cloning technology to achieve whatever unethical goals that they can envision. The Chinese have no ethics. The Chinese can understand engineering (in this case, genetic engineering), but they refuse to understand the basic tenets behind Amnesty International.
What follows is some observations, backed by verifiable sources, about the Chinese.
1. Most Chinese in Hong Kong support the return of Hong Kong to mainland China. A CNN/Time survey showed, in fact, that 60% of the Chinese in Hong Kong support the return of Hong Kong to mainland China. (reference: "Poll: Hong Kong residents optimistic" ) While East Timorese fought and died for independence from the oppressive Indonesian government, the Chinese in Hong Kong cheered the mainland Chinese government.
2. The constitution of the Chinese living in Taiwan supports the integration of both Tibet and Mongolia into mainland China. While Tibetans suffer and die at the hands of the Chinese People's Liberation Army, the Chinese in Taiwan support integrating Tibet into "One China".
3. The Chinese son of the chairman of a powerful conglomerate in Taiwan has joined with the son of Jiang Zemin, the butcher of Tibet, to build an advanced silicon-wafer factory in Shanghai. (reference: "Sons of prominent Chinese team up on chip venture")
4. Senior Chinese military officials retired from the Taiwanese military have gone to mainland China and given military secrets about the American F-16 fighter jet to the Beijing government. (reference: "Military secrets on sale to China")
5. Most Chinese, including those living in the United States of America, support the territorial ambitions of mainland China. Most Chinese support integrating Tibet into mainland China. Most Chinese support integrating the Spratleys into mainland China. Most Chinese support integrating the Senkaku islands into mainland China.
6. Most Chinese support Beijing's attempt to use torture and murder to crush the Falun Gong. Indeed, the Beijing government has funded anti-Falun-Gong meetings within the United States itself. These meetings within the United States are attended by the very same Chinese who fight with tooth and nail to stay permanently in the United States of America.
7. The Chinese from "poor, little, scared" Taiwan have invested more than $50 billion into more than 50,000 businesses in mainland China. How did this phenomenon happen? Immediately, after the Tienanman Square incident back in June 4, 1989, the American government and businesses curtailed investments in mainland China. The Taiwanese (and the other Chinese in Hong Kong) seized this window of opportunity and accelerated investments into mainland China. The rate of investments from Taiwan into China has skyrocketed to the present levels; investments continue to grow at double-digit rates. (In 1999, the "Wall Street Journal" reported that of all the Chinese arrested and convicted of stealing American military technology to give to Beijing, the majority of these Chinese came from Taiwan.)
8. These observations are not an exaggeration of any kind. At your university, attend your local meeting of Amnesty International. The engineering and business schools will have plenty of Chinese people, but there will be virtually _NO_ Chinese faces in a meeting of Amnesty International. Chinese (and other Orientals) are over-represented in engineering and business schools, but they are under-represented in meetings of Amnesty International. Why?
So few Americans really know anything about Chinese society. We Americans are kind-hearted and naive. We simply assume that the Chinese are "just like us" and that the Chinese are simply (financially) poorer versions of ourselves. In reality, the Chinese are not like us. They are poor, but they are _NOT_ like us.